Sept. 8, 2025

Betty and Dan Broderick - Part 3 of 3

Apple Podcasts podcast player iconSpotify podcast player iconYouTube podcast player icon
Apple Podcasts podcast player iconSpotify podcast player iconYouTube podcast player icon

Betty and Dan Broderick were a golden couple in San Diego, CA. He, a powerful attorney; she, a devoted, fun-loving wife and mother of four. But when Dan turned 40 he became a cliche. He bought a Corvette, fell for his much younger legal assistant, and left Betty after 16 years of marriage. Their bitter six-year divorce became the most contentious in San Diego County history, a battle over money, custody, and control. On November 5, 1989, it ended in shocking violence when Betty walked into the couple’s home and killed Dan and his new wife, Linda, as they slept, turning a local divorce drama into one of the most infamous true crime cases of the century.

Become a partner in crime

Today's snack: Chicken tenders and kiwi

WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:00.440
Hi.

2
00:00:00.560 --> 00:00:02.799
I'm Tina, and I'm Rich. If there's one thing we've

3
00:00:02.879 --> 00:00:05.080
learned in over twenty years of marriage.

4
00:00:04.679 --> 00:00:06.759
It's that some days you'll feel like killing.

5
00:00:06.480 --> 00:00:10.000
Your wife, and some days you'll feel like killing your husband.

6
00:00:10.320 --> 00:00:28.719
Welcome to Love Mary Kill, Hi Rich, Hi Tina.

7
00:00:28.920 --> 00:00:31.839
Welcome to part three of Betty and Dan Broderick.

8
00:00:32.000 --> 00:00:34.079
I am excited about this. I was just thinking, like,

9
00:00:34.280 --> 00:00:36.719
I don't know how this case turns out. I really don't,

10
00:00:36.759 --> 00:00:38.520
even though I know it's a very well known case.

11
00:00:38.560 --> 00:00:41.240
So I am really excited to hear the rest of it.

12
00:00:41.600 --> 00:00:44.759
We could have done ten parts on this case, so

13
00:00:44.920 --> 00:00:47.560
there's a lot to cover today, and I kind of

14
00:00:47.600 --> 00:00:50.320
tried to, you know, put it in a nice little

15
00:00:50.359 --> 00:00:51.399
bow and wrap it up.

16
00:00:51.560 --> 00:00:54.039
But you might be going a little long, you think.

17
00:00:54.240 --> 00:00:55.920
I think it might be a little long. There's a

18
00:00:55.920 --> 00:00:58.159
lot to say. All right, But how are you today?

19
00:00:58.560 --> 00:01:01.960
I am doing okay, dragging a little bit. Did our

20
00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:04.480
cat did you? Did you wake up at six am

21
00:01:04.519 --> 00:01:07.200
when she climbed up and jumped down onto the bed?

22
00:01:07.879 --> 00:01:12.439
Uh? No, I've tried really hard to ignore them at

23
00:01:12.519 --> 00:01:14.400
night and let them do as they'll do.

24
00:01:14.799 --> 00:01:16.519
And oh nice for you.

25
00:01:16.519 --> 00:01:20.719
No, I didn't go to bed till like two, she climbed.

26
00:01:20.480 --> 00:01:23.120
Up on our bed as she sometimes does, and jumped

27
00:01:23.159 --> 00:01:24.079
down and land.

28
00:01:23.879 --> 00:01:27.439
Down canopy bed. So she we have a chair. She

29
00:01:27.519 --> 00:01:29.359
goes from the floor to the chair, and then she

30
00:01:29.439 --> 00:01:32.439
jumps up on top of the canopy. It's a wood canopy,

31
00:01:32.560 --> 00:01:34.519
so you know her CLAWSTI get into it. So yeah,

32
00:01:34.560 --> 00:01:36.799
and then she can jump down upon.

33
00:01:36.680 --> 00:01:38.680
And if I don't know she's up there, and suddenly

34
00:01:38.719 --> 00:01:41.599
she jumps down and lands on my feet, it can.

35
00:01:41.480 --> 00:01:42.879
Freak you out, very scary.

36
00:01:42.920 --> 00:01:44.599
But this time at least I kind of heard. I

37
00:01:44.680 --> 00:01:47.159
knew she was there, so I wasn't completely shocked, but

38
00:01:47.560 --> 00:01:49.000
I couldn't get back to sleep after that.

39
00:01:49.400 --> 00:01:50.519
Did you try the eye trick?

40
00:01:51.040 --> 00:01:51.200
Oh?

41
00:01:51.519 --> 00:01:53.000
I always forget about the eye trick.

42
00:01:53.120 --> 00:01:55.560
We talked about the eye trick probably a month or

43
00:01:55.599 --> 00:01:58.359
two ago, and I really do think it works. So

44
00:01:58.400 --> 00:02:01.560
I'm just gonna mention it again because I wake up.

45
00:02:01.760 --> 00:02:03.400
You wake up, everyone wakes up in the middle of

46
00:02:03.439 --> 00:02:05.760
the night. Just keep your eyes closed and you just

47
00:02:05.799 --> 00:02:08.120
first you go. I don't think it matters what pattern

48
00:02:08.159 --> 00:02:10.560
you do. You're just back and forth, back and moving.

49
00:02:10.319 --> 00:02:12.599
Your eyes around with you with your eyelids.

50
00:02:12.840 --> 00:02:15.719
Yeah, you go back and forth, up and down. You can,

51
00:02:15.800 --> 00:02:19.159
you know, make them go in a circle counterclockwise and clockwise,

52
00:02:19.199 --> 00:02:21.919
and then sometimes I do like a figure eight type thing,

53
00:02:22.800 --> 00:02:25.479
and you you don't do it until you fall asleep,

54
00:02:25.520 --> 00:02:29.400
because inevitably you say, oh, this isn't working, and then

55
00:02:29.439 --> 00:02:30.919
you go on to thinking about what do I have

56
00:02:30.960 --> 00:02:33.560
to do tomorrow? And then and then I fall asleep.

57
00:02:33.639 --> 00:02:35.280
So I really do think it works.

58
00:02:35.360 --> 00:02:37.240
The problem with the eye trick is that you have

59
00:02:37.319 --> 00:02:39.719
to remember the eye trick when you wake up at

60
00:02:39.759 --> 00:02:41.280
four am. And I speak a.

61
00:02:41.479 --> 00:02:43.319
Little bit of a habit for me, So I'm gonna

62
00:02:43.360 --> 00:02:45.960
remind you next time you can't sleep, wake me up, okay,

63
00:02:46.000 --> 00:02:48.360
and just be like, hey, what's that? Bang it? I'll

64
00:02:48.400 --> 00:02:51.840
remind you, all right. Take So today I'm a little

65
00:02:51.879 --> 00:02:57.639
emotional and even just saying I'm a little emotional because

66
00:02:57.639 --> 00:02:59.919
our son is leaving tomorrow. Well, actually I think we

67
00:03:00.159 --> 00:03:04.159
like thirty six hours with him. Yeah, just feeling well,

68
00:03:04.199 --> 00:03:06.800
and what we don't say We've said it before, but

69
00:03:06.840 --> 00:03:08.879
we haven't said in a while. It's not like he

70
00:03:08.960 --> 00:03:11.919
goes to Michigan State, which is an hour away, or

71
00:03:12.080 --> 00:03:15.080
U of M, which is twenty minutes away. He goes

72
00:03:15.120 --> 00:03:20.360
to Northern Michigan University is really yeah, he looked. He

73
00:03:20.400 --> 00:03:23.199
said when he was picking his college, I want to

74
00:03:23.479 --> 00:03:25.639
have in state tuition, but I want to be as

75
00:03:26.199 --> 00:03:31.400
geographically far from my family as I can be. He succeeded. Actually,

76
00:03:31.400 --> 00:03:34.439
Michigan Tech is probably a little farther slightly, but still

77
00:03:34.719 --> 00:03:37.319
it's Marquette Michigan. It's a lovely place to.

78
00:03:37.280 --> 00:03:40.039
Be, but you can't just pop up there for a weekend.

79
00:03:40.560 --> 00:03:42.680
And if he needs something, he's not going to tell us.

80
00:03:42.680 --> 00:03:44.879
And that's the thing that's kind of hard. I just

81
00:03:44.879 --> 00:03:46.520
love him so much and we're so proud of him.

82
00:03:46.560 --> 00:03:50.000
He's had some challenges, as every young person today has.

83
00:03:51.199 --> 00:03:53.400
It's a really hard time to be any age, but

84
00:03:53.479 --> 00:03:56.360
to be a young person, you know. But anyway, we

85
00:03:56.400 --> 00:03:58.960
wish him well. If you are going back to school

86
00:03:58.960 --> 00:04:00.759
as a teacher, or you're kids are going back to

87
00:04:00.800 --> 00:04:04.080
school to college or whatever, we just wish everyone a

88
00:04:04.159 --> 00:04:08.319
good year, a great year. Marquette Michigan. If you don't know,

89
00:04:08.840 --> 00:04:12.240
if you're not from Michigan is attached to Wisconsin. It

90
00:04:12.319 --> 00:04:16.519
is not attached to Michigan. The Upper Peninsula that close.

91
00:04:16.279 --> 00:04:19.560
To Wisconsin, but the Upper Peninsula is attached to Wisconsin.

92
00:04:19.639 --> 00:04:22.279
So Michigan actually had to build a bridge called the

93
00:04:22.319 --> 00:04:27.120
Mecanow Bridge, which connects Lower Michigan to Upper Michigan. Right,

94
00:04:27.399 --> 00:04:30.279
And it always makes me laugh because it's like, Wisconsin,

95
00:04:30.839 --> 00:04:33.759
why didn't you fight for the Upper Peninsula? Do you

96
00:04:33.839 --> 00:04:36.399
know why the Upper Peninsula belongs to Michigan.

97
00:04:36.040 --> 00:04:38.800
Somehow related to a war for Toledo, right, which I

98
00:04:38.839 --> 00:04:42.160
don't understand the connection, but I know there's some Toledo connection.

99
00:04:42.279 --> 00:04:44.560
You're right. I wasn't sure if you knew this or not.

100
00:04:44.560 --> 00:04:47.680
But Michigan, before becoming a state, was fighting with Ohio

101
00:04:47.800 --> 00:04:50.480
over a strip of land along their border called the

102
00:04:50.480 --> 00:04:54.639
Toledo Strip. Both sides wanted it because of the Mammie River,

103
00:04:55.199 --> 00:04:58.279
which has been seen as economically valuable. The conflict never

104
00:04:58.319 --> 00:05:00.959
came became a real war, but it was heated enough

105
00:05:01.000 --> 00:05:05.319
that President Andrew Jackson intervened and said, hey, Michigan, why

106
00:05:05.319 --> 00:05:08.399
don't you just take this land up here? Oh so

107
00:05:08.680 --> 00:05:10.680
it's really hard to access.

108
00:05:10.360 --> 00:05:13.240
Okay, so the federal government. Okay, I didn't understand how

109
00:05:13.399 --> 00:05:15.680
Like I didn't know if Ohio owned the Upper Peninsula,

110
00:05:15.720 --> 00:05:18.040
but it was sort of the federal government stepped in

111
00:05:18.480 --> 00:05:19.720
to try to make peace.

112
00:05:19.879 --> 00:05:23.839
And Wisconsin wasn't a state at that. Okay, that's kind of.

113
00:05:24.000 --> 00:05:26.079
I think it was. I think it's a win for Michigan.

114
00:05:26.120 --> 00:05:29.600
I mean, obviously, Toledo's a fine place. I'm not saying

115
00:05:29.600 --> 00:05:30.680
anything against Toledo, but the.

116
00:05:31.399 --> 00:05:34.399
Actually is the best part of Ohio that I've been to.

117
00:05:34.519 --> 00:05:36.560
I think Toledo is a great town. They have a

118
00:05:36.600 --> 00:05:39.439
great zoo there, art museums great, they have some good restaurants.

119
00:05:39.439 --> 00:05:41.319
But the Upper Peninsula is amazing.

120
00:05:41.920 --> 00:05:44.399
It really is. Well, I did bring you a snap?

121
00:05:44.800 --> 00:05:45.920
Did you make me past ees?

122
00:05:46.600 --> 00:05:48.399
No, that would be a good tie in. But you know,

123
00:05:48.519 --> 00:05:52.199
Tina's been a little little tense this week usually I

124
00:05:52.240 --> 00:05:53.680
was going to ask you about that. Do you think

125
00:05:53.680 --> 00:05:55.279
I've been a little aggressive this week?

126
00:05:56.120 --> 00:05:58.399
Really? I know you've been stressed out a little bit,

127
00:05:58.439 --> 00:05:59.879
but no, You've been fine.

128
00:06:00.279 --> 00:06:03.360
I just feel like Betty brought like sometimes when I'm

129
00:06:03.639 --> 00:06:06.680
for writing cases like I feel like I became a

130
00:06:06.720 --> 00:06:10.480
little Betty like I was feeling a little unhinged at times.

131
00:06:10.560 --> 00:06:12.439
Yeah, I know what you mean, though that does happen.

132
00:06:12.519 --> 00:06:16.639
Okay, Well, I made you a chicken tender. We have

133
00:06:16.680 --> 00:06:20.680
some honey mustard, Rich's favorite sauce, mustard, and a Kiwi

134
00:06:21.519 --> 00:06:24.959
with the skin on. I've been obsessed with kiwis, like

135
00:06:25.040 --> 00:06:26.879
the skin. Have you tried it with the skin on?

136
00:06:26.920 --> 00:06:28.079
I think I tried it the other day and I

137
00:06:28.079 --> 00:06:28.680
spit it out.

138
00:06:29.800 --> 00:06:31.480
You got to eat it with the skin on. It's

139
00:06:31.519 --> 00:06:39.759
really good for you. All right, Okay, what did you

140
00:06:39.800 --> 00:06:40.839
think of today's staff?

141
00:06:41.160 --> 00:06:43.040
It was good. I didn't realize I was hungry. So

142
00:06:43.160 --> 00:06:45.720
that's nice that the chicken tender was a little more

143
00:06:45.800 --> 00:06:47.879
substantial than some snacks.

144
00:06:47.879 --> 00:06:50.560
So yeah, the chicken tenders are actually for dinner. I

145
00:06:50.600 --> 00:06:52.720
was trying sometimes when we record, we record in the

146
00:06:52.759 --> 00:06:55.360
afternoon and then we're done and we're like, what's for dinner?

147
00:06:55.480 --> 00:06:57.519
So and our son is still home and I wanted

148
00:06:57.600 --> 00:07:00.000
him to have a nice dinner. So yeah, the chicken turn.

149
00:07:00.920 --> 00:07:02.759
I'm going to give a thumbs down on the kiwi.

150
00:07:03.800 --> 00:07:05.839
The peel or whatever it's called.

151
00:07:05.720 --> 00:07:07.959
Well, it definitely takes some time getting used to it,

152
00:07:08.000 --> 00:07:11.279
but it doubles the fiber. There's vitamin C and vitamin

153
00:07:11.360 --> 00:07:14.079
E in the peel. You should wash obviously, you should

154
00:07:14.120 --> 00:07:16.560
wash it before you eat it, but it can be eaten.

155
00:07:16.639 --> 00:07:19.199
I used to always peel them, but you can be

156
00:07:19.319 --> 00:07:20.160
used to eating.

157
00:07:20.480 --> 00:07:22.360
No more though you can go with the peel.

158
00:07:22.519 --> 00:07:24.199
Yeah, I've been eating them for a couple of weeks

159
00:07:24.199 --> 00:07:25.879
and I'm, you know, kind of obsessed with them.

160
00:07:25.959 --> 00:07:26.519
Well, good for you.

161
00:07:27.399 --> 00:07:31.800
It's good for you too. There's not really a recipe

162
00:07:31.800 --> 00:07:35.800
for the chicken tenders. I marinated them in Greek yogurt. Oh,

163
00:07:35.879 --> 00:07:37.519
usually I use buttermilk, but it didn't have any, so

164
00:07:37.519 --> 00:07:40.199
I'm like, I'll just try this, and then you judge

165
00:07:40.240 --> 00:07:43.279
them in flour and then egg and then pincoa bread

166
00:07:43.279 --> 00:07:45.040
comes and then I put them in the air fire

167
00:07:45.199 --> 00:07:48.120
for three minutes at four hundred degrees, flip them and

168
00:07:48.160 --> 00:07:49.399
then another three minutes.

169
00:07:49.519 --> 00:07:51.920
Nice, they're very good. Well, you have to rate the

170
00:07:52.079 --> 00:07:55.600
naxt chicken tenders. I'll give a nine out of ten.

171
00:07:56.199 --> 00:07:59.160
Kiwi was great. The kiwi is really good. But if

172
00:07:59.160 --> 00:08:01.399
you're going to ask me to rate it with the peal,

173
00:08:01.480 --> 00:08:03.399
I'm going to get it five out of ten.

174
00:08:03.639 --> 00:08:04.879
Okay, that's not too bad.

175
00:08:05.360 --> 00:08:05.959
Could be worse.

176
00:08:06.639 --> 00:08:07.759
Can you give us a summary?

177
00:08:08.279 --> 00:08:11.240
Betty and Dan Broderick married in nineteen sixty five and

178
00:08:11.319 --> 00:08:13.879
went on to raise four children while Dan built his

179
00:08:14.000 --> 00:08:17.920
law career. Betty devoted herself to motherhood, but grew resentful

180
00:08:17.920 --> 00:08:21.720
of Dan's long hours and emotional distance. By the time

181
00:08:21.759 --> 00:08:24.959
they settled in La Jolla, the family was wealthy and respected,

182
00:08:25.279 --> 00:08:28.600
but their marriage was crumbling. After a three year affair

183
00:08:28.639 --> 00:08:32.799
with his assistant Linda Kolkina, Dan filed for divorce following

184
00:08:32.879 --> 00:08:37.879
years of gaslighting that left Betty emotionally wrecked. Devastated, Betty

185
00:08:37.960 --> 00:08:42.600
lashed out in impulsive, irrational, and sometimes dangerous ways, leaving

186
00:08:42.639 --> 00:08:45.559
her children caught in the middle and often neglected by

187
00:08:45.559 --> 00:08:49.320
both parents. What followed was a bitter five year legal

188
00:08:49.360 --> 00:08:53.919
war that ended with a financial settlement Betty considered devastatingly unfair.

189
00:08:54.919 --> 00:08:56.840
In Part one, we covered the early years of the

190
00:08:56.840 --> 00:09:00.440
Broderick's marriage. In Part two, we explored the divorce and

191
00:09:00.519 --> 00:09:03.799
its fallout, and today, in part three, we'll talk about

192
00:09:03.799 --> 00:09:05.799
the murders and the aftermath.

193
00:09:06.799 --> 00:09:09.200
I wanted to mention this next thought at the end

194
00:09:09.200 --> 00:09:12.159
of episode two, but I completely forgot. Wanted to talk

195
00:09:12.200 --> 00:09:16.120
about single mothers. A lot of divorced women, Betty included,

196
00:09:16.159 --> 00:09:19.600
call themselves single mothers, and technically that's true. They're no

197
00:09:19.639 --> 00:09:21.840
longer married and they're raising their kids without a partner.

198
00:09:21.879 --> 00:09:22.279
In the home.

199
00:09:22.799 --> 00:09:26.080
But there's an important distinction to make Betty had resources

200
00:09:26.080 --> 00:09:29.360
that many single mothers can only dream of, even in

201
00:09:29.399 --> 00:09:31.720
the midst of a bitter divorce. She had access to

202
00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:35.000
financial support, She lived in a comfortable home, and she

203
00:09:35.120 --> 00:09:37.480
was never in danger of not being able to feed

204
00:09:37.519 --> 00:09:40.159
her children or keep a group over their heads. For

205
00:09:40.360 --> 00:09:43.320
many women, being a single mother looks very different. It

206
00:09:43.360 --> 00:09:47.000
can mean working multiple jobs to cover rent, childcare, and groceries.

207
00:09:47.240 --> 00:09:49.600
It can mean choosing between paying the electric bill and

208
00:09:49.600 --> 00:09:51.960
buying new shoes for the kids. It can mean no

209
00:09:52.120 --> 00:09:54.840
safety in that at all, no college degree to fall

210
00:09:54.879 --> 00:09:57.559
back on, no savings account, no family able to step

211
00:09:57.600 --> 00:10:00.720
in and help. All wild the dear with the same

212
00:10:00.759 --> 00:10:03.639
feelings of loss and despair that Betty did, but they

213
00:10:03.639 --> 00:10:06.840
have no choice but to soldier on. So while Betty

214
00:10:06.879 --> 00:10:10.080
certainly struggled emotionally and financially compared to the life she'd

215
00:10:10.120 --> 00:10:13.120
known as missus Dan Broderick, it's important to recognize that

216
00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:15.759
her version of single motherhood was not the same as

217
00:10:15.799 --> 00:10:19.000
the harsh reality so many women face. For most, single

218
00:10:19.000 --> 00:10:23.679
motherhood isn't about losing status or identity. It's about pure survival.

219
00:10:24.360 --> 00:10:27.759
Very well said I wanted to mention that because people

220
00:10:27.799 --> 00:10:31.039
throw around the term single motherhood a lot, and you know,

221
00:10:31.080 --> 00:10:33.799
it looks differently for other people, and I just empathize

222
00:10:33.799 --> 00:10:36.679
with single mothers a lot, and I know I use

223
00:10:36.759 --> 00:10:41.080
the word single mother in the last script, and I

224
00:10:41.159 --> 00:10:43.679
just wanted to make that clarification that I understand that

225
00:10:44.159 --> 00:10:45.320
it's two different.

226
00:10:45.320 --> 00:10:48.240
Very situation, really different situation that she was in for sure.

227
00:10:49.279 --> 00:10:52.480
Last night I finished the book by Kim Broderick, Betty's Daughter,

228
00:10:53.240 --> 00:10:57.080
and the scene with Betty hitting Dan's house with the

229
00:10:57.080 --> 00:10:59.840
suburban do you remember that? So Kim put it in

230
00:10:59.840 --> 00:11:02.639
a different perspective for me, and I wanted to mention

231
00:11:02.759 --> 00:11:04.759
that because I think I kind of made it sound

232
00:11:04.799 --> 00:11:06.000
like she tapped the house.

233
00:11:06.360 --> 00:11:07.879
That's what she made it sound like when she.

234
00:11:08.600 --> 00:11:11.039
Didn't make it sound like that. But no, when Betty

235
00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:13.799
hit Dan's house, she didn't just tap the front door.

236
00:11:14.120 --> 00:11:16.759
There was a lot of damage. Kim said, it felt

237
00:11:16.759 --> 00:11:19.279
like that there was a major earthquake inside the house

238
00:11:19.320 --> 00:11:23.000
and it sounded like an airplane. The landscaping was demolished,

239
00:11:23.080 --> 00:11:26.200
windows broke, and the door was knocked right off its hinges.

240
00:11:26.759 --> 00:11:29.960
Betty put the car in rivers and repeatedly rammed the

241
00:11:30.000 --> 00:11:33.200
house with her suburban, and she did pull a butcher's

242
00:11:33.240 --> 00:11:36.600
knife on Dan. Kim and Lee were both terrified inside

243
00:11:36.639 --> 00:11:39.039
the house, and they thought that they could have been killed.

244
00:11:39.519 --> 00:11:42.480
As Betty drove away in the police car, she stuck

245
00:11:42.519 --> 00:11:44.639
out her tongue at Kim and gave her the finger

246
00:11:45.000 --> 00:11:47.759
and true Betty fashion. So Kim went on to say

247
00:11:47.799 --> 00:11:50.720
that she felt every important detail in her young life

248
00:11:50.879 --> 00:11:54.639
was overshadowed by Betty and her antics. All of the

249
00:11:54.720 --> 00:11:57.720
children engaged in at risk behaviors when they were very young,

250
00:11:57.799 --> 00:12:00.840
and their parents didn't seem to notice. She said, like

251
00:12:00.919 --> 00:12:04.320
even when like Rhett and Danny were like nine and

252
00:12:04.399 --> 00:12:07.240
ten years old, they were they weren't like drinking and

253
00:12:07.240 --> 00:12:10.840
smoking all the time, but they you know sometimes yeah,

254
00:12:10.919 --> 00:12:14.080
would go do that, and they just had all surprising

255
00:12:14.279 --> 00:12:16.559
They had a lot of destructive behaviors, and their parents

256
00:12:17.000 --> 00:12:20.120
either turned a blind eye or just didn't knowice.

257
00:12:20.440 --> 00:12:22.639
Yeah, they were just too busy dealing with their own stuff.

258
00:12:22.799 --> 00:12:27.240
Yeah. After the disappointing divorce settlement, Betty had no choice

259
00:12:27.240 --> 00:12:29.600
but to sell the once red infested house that she'd

260
00:12:29.600 --> 00:12:32.960
carefully remodeled over the years. It was now a showplace,

261
00:12:33.320 --> 00:12:35.200
and she was devastated to sell it, but it was

262
00:12:35.240 --> 00:12:37.519
the only way she could pay off the mountain of debt.

263
00:12:38.120 --> 00:12:40.799
She bought a modest, two bedroom condo for two hundred

264
00:12:40.840 --> 00:12:44.240
thousand dollars. That was really hard for her to let

265
00:12:44.279 --> 00:12:46.759
go of all the status of owning a billion dollar

266
00:12:46.840 --> 00:12:50.600
home for her. Yeah. While Dan lived in his mansion

267
00:12:50.679 --> 00:12:54.080
planning trips to the Amalfi Coast with his new wife,

268
00:12:54.159 --> 00:12:57.200
Betty sat alone in her crabby condo, all by herself

269
00:12:57.200 --> 00:13:00.399
with her pathetic excuse of a life. In the fall

270
00:13:00.440 --> 00:13:03.159
of nineteen eighty eight, Betty purchased a thirty eight Smith

271
00:13:03.200 --> 00:13:07.000
and Wesson five shot revolver, a small, snubnosed pistol she

272
00:13:07.120 --> 00:13:11.519
jokingly called her teeny weeny lady's gun. Betty carried it

273
00:13:11.559 --> 00:13:14.519
off and tucked in her pocket or capacious bag. She

274
00:13:14.759 --> 00:13:17.480
liked its weight, the way her fingers wrapped around the cool,

275
00:13:17.639 --> 00:13:20.440
solid barrel. It gave her comfort and a sense of

276
00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:24.679
controlling in a life otherwise unraveling. She mourned the life

277
00:13:24.720 --> 00:13:27.519
she once had. That Dan would toss it all away

278
00:13:27.519 --> 00:13:31.159
for Linda felt like the final insult, so painfully cliche.

279
00:13:32.159 --> 00:13:35.960
She had expected something more from her genius husband, some

280
00:13:36.120 --> 00:13:39.679
twist worthy of his intellect. Instead, he chose the secretary.

281
00:13:40.480 --> 00:13:43.120
Betty told herself, Linda could have him, but the children

282
00:13:43.159 --> 00:13:46.519
were different. They were her life, her identity. She drew

283
00:13:46.559 --> 00:13:49.960
the line there. In her mind. Dan had never truly

284
00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:52.559
been a father anyway. She had raised them alone.

285
00:13:52.879 --> 00:13:54.440
Didn't she drop the kids off?

286
00:13:54.480 --> 00:13:54.559
Like?

287
00:13:54.639 --> 00:13:57.240
Didn't she take it upon herself to take them over

288
00:13:57.279 --> 00:13:58.480
there and just leave them?

289
00:13:58.840 --> 00:14:00.960
She did, Yeah, so she saw.

290
00:14:01.000 --> 00:14:03.960
Obviously she regretted it later, but she did.

291
00:14:04.200 --> 00:14:06.720
And she didn't want full custody of them either. But

292
00:14:06.759 --> 00:14:08.639
I think she wanted the kind of life where she

293
00:14:08.679 --> 00:14:12.440
could drop in on them whenever she wanted, and she

294
00:14:12.519 --> 00:14:16.679
really couldn't do that. Two envelopes arrived in the mail

295
00:14:17.080 --> 00:14:21.000
more legal paperwork. One carried a thinly veiled threat of

296
00:14:21.080 --> 00:14:24.320
another jail sentence if she failed to comply with court orders,

297
00:14:24.720 --> 00:14:27.200
and cited a report from her doctor that described her

298
00:14:27.200 --> 00:14:32.240
emotional disturbance and mental disease as worsening rather than improving.

299
00:14:33.120 --> 00:14:36.440
The other letter flatly denied her most recent request to

300
00:14:36.480 --> 00:14:39.919
amend the custody arrangement of the boys. By this time,

301
00:14:39.919 --> 00:14:44.559
the girls were almost adults. I think Kim was eighteen

302
00:14:44.879 --> 00:14:49.320
and Lee was seventeen. The words on those pages ignited

303
00:14:49.360 --> 00:14:52.480
her fury, sending her into overdrive. She couldn't bear the

304
00:14:52.519 --> 00:14:56.399
thought of stepping into another courtroom, facing another judge, or

305
00:14:56.440 --> 00:14:59.639
hearing another lawyer dissect her life and tell her what

306
00:14:59.720 --> 00:15:03.840
was wrong with her. She was finished, done and dusted

307
00:15:04.679 --> 00:15:07.480
that weekend. The papers remained on her kitchen counter, but

308
00:15:07.600 --> 00:15:11.080
her mind never left them. She obsessed over every word,

309
00:15:11.240 --> 00:15:15.360
every sentence, every denial. She resolves not to allow Dian

310
00:15:15.440 --> 00:15:18.720
and Linda to torment her any further. She scrawled a

311
00:15:18.759 --> 00:15:21.240
note on the bottom of one of the letters, I

312
00:15:21.320 --> 00:15:25.320
can't take this anymore. I forgot to give a content warning.

313
00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:31.000
There's more bad language in this episode. One Linda Kulkina

314
00:15:31.159 --> 00:15:34.480
the khant, interfering with what little contact I have left

315
00:15:34.480 --> 00:15:37.679
with my children. She's been doing it for years. We've

316
00:15:37.759 --> 00:15:43.799
litigated it continually. Two constant threats of court, jail, contempt finds,

317
00:15:43.840 --> 00:15:46.559
et cetera, which is very scary to me. And no

318
00:15:46.600 --> 00:15:51.799
matter what the evidence, I always lose. Three them constantly

319
00:15:51.840 --> 00:15:56.559
insinuating that I'm crazy. Was this a suicide note, a

320
00:15:56.559 --> 00:16:01.120
concise manifesto or murder threat? I'll never know for sure.

321
00:16:02.440 --> 00:16:05.759
On Sunday, November fifth, nineteen eighty nine, Betty rose from

322
00:16:05.759 --> 00:16:09.559
her bed after another sleepless night. Ten year old Ratt

323
00:16:09.600 --> 00:16:13.080
had slept beside her. Danny was on the couch. Just

324
00:16:13.120 --> 00:16:16.000
before sunrise, Betty got into her car and drove fifteen

325
00:16:16.039 --> 00:16:18.039
minutes to the new mansion that Dan shared with his

326
00:16:18.159 --> 00:16:21.720
former mistress and now wife of six months, only twenty

327
00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:25.279
eight long limbs, flowing blonde hair, and the youth that

328
00:16:25.320 --> 00:16:28.559
Betty could no longer compete with. She slid him through

329
00:16:28.559 --> 00:16:31.519
the door using her daughter's key. She crept up the

330
00:16:31.519 --> 00:16:34.720
stairs and found them in bed sleeping. Betty knew that

331
00:16:34.799 --> 00:16:36.960
Dan wanted to start a new family with Linda, and

332
00:16:37.039 --> 00:16:39.960
the thought sickened her. She watched them sleep for a

333
00:16:39.960 --> 00:16:43.360
few moments before removing the pistol from her pocket. Five

334
00:16:43.440 --> 00:16:46.879
shots fired off in an instant. Two of them missed

335
00:16:46.960 --> 00:16:50.120
before a bullet struck Linda in her chest. As she turned,

336
00:16:50.200 --> 00:16:52.200
she took another bullet to the back of her neck

337
00:16:52.440 --> 00:16:57.120
that lodged in her brain stem. She was dead almost instantly. Later,

338
00:16:57.200 --> 00:17:00.320
Betty said that Linda yelled call the police today Anne

339
00:17:00.360 --> 00:17:03.480
before she was shot. A bullet hit Dan in the back,

340
00:17:03.679 --> 00:17:06.640
nicking a rib and perforating his lung, filling it with

341
00:17:06.720 --> 00:17:09.200
blood as he scrambled off the bed, reaching for the

342
00:17:09.240 --> 00:17:12.559
phone to call for help, before Betty heartlessly ripped the

343
00:17:12.720 --> 00:17:15.240
cord from the wall and took it with her so

344
00:17:15.319 --> 00:17:18.160
he couldn't call nine one one. She took the cord

345
00:17:18.200 --> 00:17:21.200
in her hands and ripped it in two Later, she

346
00:17:21.279 --> 00:17:24.559
told her daughter that his last words were okay, okay,

347
00:17:24.680 --> 00:17:28.000
you shot me. I'm dead. Betty claimed if there had

348
00:17:28.000 --> 00:17:30.000
been another bullet in the gun that she would have

349
00:17:30.119 --> 00:17:33.000
used it on herself, but she fled from the house.

350
00:17:33.960 --> 00:17:36.680
Betty panicked she didn't know what to do. She went

351
00:17:36.720 --> 00:17:39.400
to a payphone and made several calls, first to her

352
00:17:39.400 --> 00:17:43.920
friend Diane, I shot Dan, she blurted out. She swore

353
00:17:44.119 --> 00:17:46.920
that hadn't been her intent intention, She just wanted to

354
00:17:46.960 --> 00:17:50.839
talk to Danilnda about the custody agreement. Diane hung up

355
00:17:50.880 --> 00:17:54.519
and called Brad Wright, Betty's sometime boyfriend, who was still

356
00:17:54.559 --> 00:17:57.359
sleeping at her condo with the boys. Brad and a

357
00:17:57.440 --> 00:18:01.039
friend drove to Dan's house together, discovered the and then

358
00:18:01.079 --> 00:18:04.920
called the police. Betty called Lee and reportedly said, I

359
00:18:05.000 --> 00:18:07.119
shot your dad. I shot the son of a bitch

360
00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:10.559
and then the bitch is dead. She showed up at

361
00:18:10.559 --> 00:18:13.440
her apartment at about eight a m. Lee made a

362
00:18:13.480 --> 00:18:16.960
cup of tea, which Betty promptly vomited up. She later

363
00:18:17.039 --> 00:18:19.960
claimed that she had told her daughter that she'd shot

364
00:18:20.000 --> 00:18:22.279
the gun, but wasn't sure if she hid anyone or not.

365
00:18:23.039 --> 00:18:25.359
She gave her purse containing the gun to Lee. She

366
00:18:25.480 --> 00:18:28.279
called her dad, who was very confused as to what

367
00:18:28.319 --> 00:18:32.039
Betty was saying. Then she called Kim in Arizona. I

368
00:18:32.200 --> 00:18:35.599
finally fucking did it, she said. She again claimed she

369
00:18:35.640 --> 00:18:37.920
didn't know if she'd hit anyone, just that she'd fired

370
00:18:37.960 --> 00:18:40.720
the gun. After the call, a wave of nausea hit

371
00:18:40.799 --> 00:18:43.559
Kim as she remembered the week before when she'd been

372
00:18:43.640 --> 00:18:47.039
home and she'd misplaced her keys. Betty helped her look

373
00:18:47.039 --> 00:18:50.160
for the keys, but now Kim realized that truth her

374
00:18:50.200 --> 00:18:52.640
mother hadn't been helping at all. She had taken the

375
00:18:52.720 --> 00:18:55.920
keys and hid them from her. Here's Kim talking to

376
00:18:55.960 --> 00:18:57.279
Oprah about that day.

377
00:18:57.880 --> 00:18:59.440
Well, for a long time, she had to defend herself,

378
00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:02.799
pursue and understand that she had to tell this story

379
00:19:02.799 --> 00:19:04.720
over and over. But now it's all over with and

380
00:19:04.720 --> 00:19:07.599
I wish you could just tell us herself won't really happen.

381
00:19:07.640 --> 00:19:09.599
It doesn't make any sense to me. When you were

382
00:19:09.599 --> 00:19:12.079
talking to her, she says, I had this intention and

383
00:19:12.119 --> 00:19:15.519
then somewhere it changed. I just don't understand she had

384
00:19:15.519 --> 00:19:17.640
an intention of killing herself, not that I wanted her

385
00:19:17.680 --> 00:19:19.400
to kill herself, but where did that change to killing

386
00:19:19.440 --> 00:19:23.480
bad and Linda. I don't understand where that how that occurred.

387
00:19:24.000 --> 00:19:27.079
And I don't understand how she did tell me that

388
00:19:26.519 --> 00:19:28.640
she that she emptied the gun, so she knew she

389
00:19:28.680 --> 00:19:29.319
emptied the gun.

390
00:19:29.880 --> 00:19:32.240
I chose that clip because I agree with Kim, it's

391
00:19:32.279 --> 00:19:34.680
a very confusing story. She's like, I don't know how

392
00:19:34.680 --> 00:19:37.559
I got there. I ended up there, and there were

393
00:19:37.599 --> 00:19:39.559
five bullets in the gun, and then they were gun

394
00:19:39.559 --> 00:19:42.480
and I guess I shot them. It was very confusing.

395
00:19:42.640 --> 00:19:47.319
Betty's mind overall just seems very muddled and very she

396
00:19:47.400 --> 00:19:50.599
just seems very chaotic inside her head. So I'm not

397
00:19:50.640 --> 00:19:54.440
surprised that she didn't seem to know, you know, what

398
00:19:54.480 --> 00:19:56.839
she did or Yeah, Betty.

399
00:19:56.599 --> 00:19:58.519
Was in a state of shock, but she managed to

400
00:19:58.519 --> 00:20:02.359
strip off her jewelry and lee. She scrawled down a

401
00:20:02.440 --> 00:20:05.519
quick will, leaving her remaining possessions and investments to her

402
00:20:05.599 --> 00:20:09.599
children to be divided evenly among them. Later that day,

403
00:20:09.720 --> 00:20:13.160
Betty turned herself into the police. At her arraignment two

404
00:20:13.200 --> 00:20:16.680
days later, on her forty second birthday, she pleaded not guilty.

405
00:20:17.200 --> 00:20:21.319
She was denied bail. The kids were heartbroken, especially the boys,

406
00:20:22.079 --> 00:20:25.119
with Dan's eight siblings and Betty's four. There were lots

407
00:20:25.160 --> 00:20:27.440
of aunts and uncle who could take them in, but

408
00:20:27.559 --> 00:20:29.920
most of them were on the East Coast, and the

409
00:20:29.960 --> 00:20:33.960
boys wanted to stay as close as they came to California.

410
00:20:34.279 --> 00:20:38.359
The children clung together, feeling very alone. Kim flew home

411
00:20:38.400 --> 00:20:40.599
and promised Betty that she would take care of everything.

412
00:20:41.480 --> 00:20:44.559
She was only nineteen and where was home now? Both

413
00:20:44.559 --> 00:20:47.880
of her parents' houses were active crime scenes and off limits.

414
00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:50.920
The coroner later said that it may have taken up

415
00:20:50.960 --> 00:20:54.000
to thirty minutes for Dan to die. Had he received

416
00:20:54.039 --> 00:20:58.079
immediate medical attention, his life may have been spared. That's

417
00:20:58.119 --> 00:20:58.960
really sad to me.

418
00:20:59.400 --> 00:21:03.440
That is sad. Yeah, it's horrible to think that he

419
00:21:03.480 --> 00:21:06.960
was there for thirty minutes dying and no one there

420
00:21:07.000 --> 00:21:07.480
to help him.

421
00:21:08.119 --> 00:21:11.839
Betty said that when he spoke his last words to her,

422
00:21:12.160 --> 00:21:16.079
that he spoke very clearly. That's why she alleged that

423
00:21:16.119 --> 00:21:18.680
she didn't think he was hurt, so had the phone

424
00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:21.079
been there, Yeah, he may you know, he may have

425
00:21:21.160 --> 00:21:21.640
been saved.

426
00:21:21.720 --> 00:21:23.640
Yeah, I don't believe a word, Betty says.

427
00:21:23.720 --> 00:21:23.799
So.

428
00:21:24.359 --> 00:21:27.079
Yeah, who knows what really happened or what his last

429
00:21:27.079 --> 00:21:27.759
words really.

430
00:21:27.559 --> 00:21:32.799
Were exactly, But Linda was killed instantly. Interestingly, in the

431
00:21:32.839 --> 00:21:37.079
autopsy report, the health of Dan's liver was noted. He

432
00:21:37.160 --> 00:21:40.480
had a healthy liver. Was he not the chronic alcoholic

433
00:21:40.519 --> 00:21:41.640
that Betty claimed him to be?

434
00:21:41.880 --> 00:21:42.079
Oh?

435
00:21:42.200 --> 00:21:45.160
Interesting, Yeah, we'll be back after a break.

436
00:21:52.720 --> 00:21:55.640
Over a thousand people attended the joint funeral of Linda

437
00:21:55.680 --> 00:21:59.640
and Dan. Their caskets stood side by side, hers covered

438
00:21:59.680 --> 00:22:03.440
in white roses, his and read. Several eulogies were given.

439
00:22:04.359 --> 00:22:08.400
US District Court Judge William Enwright said Dan Broderick was

440
00:22:08.440 --> 00:22:10.359
all that we could hope for in a lawyer, A

441
00:22:10.359 --> 00:22:14.400
brilliant mind, a magnificent and eloquent speaker, a man of

442
00:22:14.480 --> 00:22:18.880
unquestioned integrity. His word was his bond, his reputation his

443
00:22:18.960 --> 00:22:21.920
most prized possession. He made us all proud of our

444
00:22:21.960 --> 00:22:24.759
profession of lawyering. He represents the best of what we

445
00:22:24.839 --> 00:22:29.119
are and what we ever hope to be. Paralegal Laurel Summers,

446
00:22:29.160 --> 00:22:32.359
a close friend of Linda and Dane, said quote, Linda

447
00:22:32.440 --> 00:22:35.279
offered a new life, a second chance. She gave him

448
00:22:35.279 --> 00:22:37.519
the optimism to marry again and to hope for a

449
00:22:37.559 --> 00:22:40.880
second family. Together they were such a delight with their

450
00:22:40.880 --> 00:22:45.599
broad smiles, twinkling eyes, rich laughter, and sweet terms of endearment.

451
00:22:46.200 --> 00:22:48.559
Their life among us has ended, but all of us

452
00:22:48.559 --> 00:22:50.759
here will be together on days and nights in the

453
00:22:50.799 --> 00:22:54.759
future to drink and sing and laugh. Without Danny and Linda,

454
00:22:54.839 --> 00:22:57.279
the wine will never be as wet, the songs will

455
00:22:57.319 --> 00:22:59.839
never be as pure, and the laughter will never again

456
00:23:00.160 --> 00:23:04.559
as joyous. Dan Broderick was a proud irishman, and Danny

457
00:23:04.599 --> 00:23:07.839
Boy was sung in his honor. His four children sat

458
00:23:07.880 --> 00:23:10.799
front and center at the funeral, weeping throughout the service.

459
00:23:11.519 --> 00:23:14.640
Their profound grief and tears broke the hearts of everyone

460
00:23:14.680 --> 00:23:18.160
in attendance. Absent was their mother, who was in jail.

461
00:23:18.720 --> 00:23:21.799
Her request to attend the funeral was denied. Can you

462
00:23:21.880 --> 00:23:25.119
imagine that takes a lot of gall Yeah, I want

463
00:23:25.160 --> 00:23:27.519
to come to the funeral of the people that I killed. Wow.

464
00:23:28.839 --> 00:23:32.240
Linda's tombstone was etched with the words of poet William Blake.

465
00:23:32.880 --> 00:23:35.519
She who kisses the Joy as it flies lives in

466
00:23:35.599 --> 00:23:40.079
Eternity's Sunrise, dans with Oh Danny boy, we love you

467
00:23:40.160 --> 00:23:43.680
So Betty had an opinion about the funeral, of course,

468
00:23:44.039 --> 00:23:46.480
quote the son of a bitch hadn't stepped foot in

469
00:23:46.519 --> 00:23:48.799
a church in all the years he'd been in San Diego,

470
00:23:49.119 --> 00:23:51.559
and they bury him like he's the pope. Why is

471
00:23:51.559 --> 00:23:53.880
he being buried like a good Catholic father when he

472
00:23:53.920 --> 00:23:56.759
deserted his family. He should have been buried like the

473
00:23:56.799 --> 00:23:59.680
asshole he is. My children are glad I did it,

474
00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:01.920
hated him, They're glad he's dead.

475
00:24:02.519 --> 00:24:03.799
That is not the case.

476
00:24:04.000 --> 00:24:07.440
Just say that is not true at all. Linda and

477
00:24:07.480 --> 00:24:11.279
Dan were buried together at Greenwood Memorial Park in San Diego.

478
00:24:12.200 --> 00:24:14.519
That he was a polarizing figure while she was in

479
00:24:14.640 --> 00:24:18.119
jail awaiting trial, a hero to some, but to others

480
00:24:18.200 --> 00:24:21.240
she was a spoiled, rich lady. She spent a lot

481
00:24:21.279 --> 00:24:24.039
of time in protective isolation in an eight x twelve

482
00:24:24.119 --> 00:24:28.000
cell after receiving threats from other inmates, but she adjusted

483
00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:31.039
to prison quickly. Except for two things, the lack of

484
00:24:31.079 --> 00:24:34.359
real coffee and dental floss. I would be okay without

485
00:24:34.359 --> 00:24:37.119
the coffee. But dental flaws. That surprises me that they

486
00:24:37.160 --> 00:24:39.440
don't I guess. I guess he's probably a danger.

487
00:24:39.480 --> 00:24:41.720
Do you think it's an outrage, Well, you love your

488
00:24:41.759 --> 00:24:43.880
dental floss. I do love my dental flo You are

489
00:24:43.880 --> 00:24:45.119
a religious floss.

490
00:24:45.480 --> 00:24:46.839
I was just trying to think of why they wouldn't

491
00:24:46.839 --> 00:24:49.599
allow it. But I guess theoretically, maybe you could hang

492
00:24:49.640 --> 00:24:50.839
yourself or I.

493
00:24:50.880 --> 00:24:54.640
Show somebody with wherever. Yeah, it's probably the latter. I

494
00:24:54.680 --> 00:24:56.880
didn't really think about it that way. Yeah. But also,

495
00:24:57.839 --> 00:24:59.640
once you're in prison, I don't think you get regular

496
00:24:59.680 --> 00:25:02.559
dental checkups. Oh true, truly. One thing that I learned

497
00:25:02.599 --> 00:25:04.839
at the end of the case Betty has really bad

498
00:25:04.880 --> 00:25:07.359
teeth now, and she hates it.

499
00:25:08.200 --> 00:25:10.799
Later, Betty said quote, I was glad to be in

500
00:25:10.839 --> 00:25:13.680
that little room, away from everything, where nobody could get

501
00:25:13.720 --> 00:25:17.200
at me. For the first time in years, I felt safe.

502
00:25:17.279 --> 00:25:20.359
In fact, some people described her demeanor as cheerful while

503
00:25:20.359 --> 00:25:24.359
in jail. Bella's Stumbo described Betty as a chameleon in

504
00:25:24.400 --> 00:25:27.920
her book, and the comparison fits whether she was sitting

505
00:25:28.000 --> 00:25:31.079
across from Oprah, chatting with a fellow inmate, or talking

506
00:25:31.079 --> 00:25:34.400
to one of her grandchildren. Betty had an uncanny ability

507
00:25:34.480 --> 00:25:37.759
to adapt, shifting her tone and personality to meet the

508
00:25:37.799 --> 00:25:41.440
moment and speak on their level. But it's chilling that

509
00:25:41.559 --> 00:25:44.519
she seemed satisfied with her decision to commit the murders,

510
00:25:45.000 --> 00:25:49.119
describing them as an act of public service. In her mind,

511
00:25:49.240 --> 00:25:51.480
she had stood up to the courts and the patriarchy,

512
00:25:51.640 --> 00:25:54.839
and she had won. Quote. It was the most sincere,

513
00:25:54.960 --> 00:25:57.160
honest act of self defense that there can be in

514
00:25:57.200 --> 00:26:00.720
the world. It was justifiable homicide against a you can't

515
00:26:00.799 --> 00:26:03.440
see and nobody can tell me. Dan Broderick and his

516
00:26:03.559 --> 00:26:07.519
cheap little bitch sidekick didn't have a weapon. His weapon

517
00:26:07.599 --> 00:26:11.319
was the legal system. I was under constant attack. You

518
00:26:11.359 --> 00:26:14.039
show me a soldier or a policeman, or anybody that

519
00:26:14.119 --> 00:26:16.519
acts in self defense. Is he going to be held

520
00:26:16.519 --> 00:26:21.000
accountable for murder? Wrong? Once again, Betty placed the blame

521
00:26:21.119 --> 00:26:24.519
squarely on Dan for his own death. Quote. If not

522
00:26:24.599 --> 00:26:27.160
for his actions, I would have been fine. I would

523
00:26:27.160 --> 00:26:29.400
have had my house, my kids, I would have still

524
00:26:29.400 --> 00:26:32.920
worn a size six, I could have done my superior dance.

525
00:26:33.960 --> 00:26:37.839
She just loves to play the victim, doesn't she. Yeah,

526
00:26:37.880 --> 00:26:40.960
everything's about her and all the wrongs done to her right.

527
00:26:41.240 --> 00:26:41.880
Absolutely.

528
00:26:42.880 --> 00:26:45.839
Kim and Lee were Betty's lifeline in prison fulfilling her

529
00:26:45.880 --> 00:26:49.759
long list of requests from the outside world. Most important

530
00:26:49.920 --> 00:26:54.880
was Claarress two two palist ash blonde hair color, along with,

531
00:26:55.240 --> 00:27:00.160
in order of importance, sunglasses, Estay Lauder makeup, bright eight

532
00:27:00.279 --> 00:27:05.759
four piece jogging suits, tweezers and nail clippers from Revlon, Chanelle,

533
00:27:05.839 --> 00:27:09.759
number five lotion, and spray Copper Tone or band Disolay

534
00:27:09.960 --> 00:27:13.119
Tan lotion. She also asked that the rest of the

535
00:27:13.160 --> 00:27:17.640
box be filled with food and stationery, four payday candy bars,

536
00:27:17.799 --> 00:27:23.240
one bag of mints, canned coconut, skinless boneless sardines, and triskits.

537
00:27:23.480 --> 00:27:26.200
Oh, I blew it. I really should have given you skinless,

538
00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:28.720
boneless sardines and triskits. Darn it.

539
00:27:29.519 --> 00:27:32.880
Wow, that is quite a list of things for someone

540
00:27:32.920 --> 00:27:33.359
in jail.

541
00:27:34.000 --> 00:27:35.839
It's rough in jail, and if you have someone on

542
00:27:35.880 --> 00:27:39.920
the outside that is able to fulfill your packages, that's

543
00:27:40.160 --> 00:27:41.240
really a gift.

544
00:27:42.279 --> 00:27:44.599
She wrote to her boyfriend Brad and asked him to

545
00:27:44.599 --> 00:27:48.319
pay her bills. Betty received hundreds, if not thousands, of

546
00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:51.599
letters from other scorned women who sympathized with her plight,

547
00:27:52.240 --> 00:27:55.880
but her favorite letters came from mail suitors. A local

548
00:27:56.000 --> 00:27:58.640
architect visited her in jail and gave her a kiss

549
00:27:58.680 --> 00:28:02.319
through the glass. Betty's parents eventually came to see her,

550
00:28:02.359 --> 00:28:04.480
but it took them a year to accept the fact

551
00:28:04.480 --> 00:28:08.119
that their daughter had killed two people. The media was

552
00:28:08.160 --> 00:28:12.359
captivated by Betty Broderick, a bold, funny, strange, intelligent woman

553
00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:16.799
who was equal parts self deprecating and biting. She relished

554
00:28:16.799 --> 00:28:21.240
the attention, even savoring when she was called the Lahoya socialite,

555
00:28:21.680 --> 00:28:24.519
though the real socialites of Lahoya bristled at the idea

556
00:28:24.559 --> 00:28:27.200
that Betty would ever be welcomed into their elite inner

557
00:28:27.240 --> 00:28:31.000
circle if not for the shocking murders she openly admitted

558
00:28:31.039 --> 00:28:35.680
to committing. Betty could be charming, even delightful. Her defense team, however,

559
00:28:35.799 --> 00:28:38.960
constantly struggled to rein in her brazenness. When she spoke

560
00:28:39.000 --> 00:28:43.359
to reporters, Betty insisted she was the true victim, often

561
00:28:43.400 --> 00:28:46.599
repeating that if Dan hadn't tormented her, she never would

562
00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:49.720
have killed him. While the Brodericks were still locked in

563
00:28:49.759 --> 00:28:53.119
their bitter divorce, both Oprah and Sixty Minutes reached out,

564
00:28:53.559 --> 00:28:56.599
but at first Betty was too frightened to appear. Wait

565
00:28:56.640 --> 00:28:59.839
till Oprah and sixty Minutes reached out before the murders.

566
00:29:00.359 --> 00:29:03.079
Because their divorce was so messy, they made a lot

567
00:29:03.079 --> 00:29:06.240
of headlines and were even before the murders, people were

568
00:29:06.319 --> 00:29:07.640
very intrigued by their story.

569
00:29:07.720 --> 00:29:11.440
Interesting. Around that time, she also learned that Dan had

570
00:29:11.440 --> 00:29:15.279
sealed their court records, preventing journalists from digging into the settlement,

571
00:29:15.720 --> 00:29:20.720
only for the file to later vanish. Altogether interesting huh yeah.

572
00:29:21.079 --> 00:29:24.640
Eventually Betty leaned into the spotlight. Her first appearance on

573
00:29:24.680 --> 00:29:27.559
Oprah became the second most watched episode of the show,

574
00:29:28.039 --> 00:29:32.400
surpassed only by Oprah's famous weight loss reveal. She equipped

575
00:29:32.400 --> 00:29:35.759
to twenty twenty, Where's Mike Wallace? I want sixty Minutes?

576
00:29:36.359 --> 00:29:38.599
Crazy to me that she was in jail and she

577
00:29:38.720 --> 00:29:41.720
was appearing on not just Oprah, but tons of shows.

578
00:29:42.319 --> 00:29:44.119
You used to be a show called hard Copy. There

579
00:29:44.160 --> 00:29:45.759
was a bunch of shows like that kind of like

580
00:29:46.519 --> 00:29:49.880
you know, like news magazine shows, and she appeared on

581
00:29:49.920 --> 00:29:50.640
a bunch of those.

582
00:29:50.839 --> 00:29:54.880
That's wild did she appear on them from jail? Okay? Wow,

583
00:29:54.880 --> 00:29:59.319
it's crazy. Hollywood too seized on her story. Meredith Baxter

584
00:29:59.440 --> 00:30:02.720
portrayed Betty and two made for TV movies a woman

585
00:30:02.839 --> 00:30:07.160
scorned the Betty Broderick story and her final fury Betty

586
00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:11.519
Broderick the last chapter. Betty even wrote to Baxter after

587
00:30:11.559 --> 00:30:15.039
the first film, complaining, quote, wish you'd have called me.

588
00:30:15.480 --> 00:30:17.680
Movie would have been a lot better if you'd had

589
00:30:17.720 --> 00:30:20.160
a better understanding of exactly what it was that I

590
00:30:20.200 --> 00:30:24.119
couldn't cope with. Come see me, call or write. Even

591
00:30:24.160 --> 00:30:28.119
though it's now a little late, I am interesting, happy face.

592
00:30:29.200 --> 00:30:32.519
Despite Betty's criticism, Baxter won an Emmy for the role.

593
00:30:33.240 --> 00:30:36.279
I watched about an hour of the first film and

594
00:30:36.359 --> 00:30:38.640
it was very good, was it? Yeah? It was excellent.

595
00:30:38.839 --> 00:30:42.599
If you go to YouTube, just search for Betty Broderick

596
00:30:42.680 --> 00:30:44.359
movie and you'll find parts one and two.

597
00:30:44.599 --> 00:30:45.160
Uh, that's good.

598
00:30:45.240 --> 00:30:47.960
Meredith Baxter did do a fabulous job portraying Betty.

599
00:30:48.039 --> 00:30:51.160
Sometimes those made for TV movies are so cheesy and bad,

600
00:30:51.279 --> 00:30:51.799
so it's nice.

601
00:30:52.160 --> 00:30:54.319
I really didn't feel that cheesy to me. It felt

602
00:30:54.319 --> 00:30:55.440
like a pretty good production.

603
00:30:55.920 --> 00:30:59.799
Cool. Did Betty inspire Hollywood? That might be giving her

604
00:30:59.799 --> 00:31:03.400
two much credit, But La Times journalist Amy Wallace had

605
00:31:03.400 --> 00:31:06.720
a relationship with Betty and wrote several articles about her.

606
00:31:07.440 --> 00:31:10.079
She pointed out that in nineteen ninety one. The same

607
00:31:10.160 --> 00:31:13.440
year as Betty's trial, Hollywood served up several movies of

608
00:31:13.480 --> 00:31:18.359
women seeking justice, striking back at the patriarchy, Susan Sarandon

609
00:31:18.440 --> 00:31:22.559
and Gena Davis in Thelma and Louise. Julia Roberts escaped

610
00:31:22.559 --> 00:31:25.839
an abusive husband in Sleeping with the Enemy. When The

611
00:31:25.880 --> 00:31:29.319
First Wives Club hit theaters in nineteen ninety six, one

612
00:31:29.359 --> 00:31:32.119
newspaper columnist quipped that it might as well have been

613
00:31:32.160 --> 00:31:37.039
called The Betty Broaderic Club. The fascination with Betty hasn't faded.

614
00:31:37.480 --> 00:31:41.240
In twenty twenty, Dirty John The Betty Broaderick Story introduced

615
00:31:41.240 --> 00:31:44.160
her saga to a new generation of true crime fans,

616
00:31:44.559 --> 00:31:48.440
reigniting interest in her rise, her downfall, and the violent

617
00:31:48.559 --> 00:31:51.960
end of her marriage. All of the attention and fascination

618
00:31:52.119 --> 00:31:56.079
in Betty's mind validated her decision to murder Linda and Dan.

619
00:31:56.880 --> 00:31:59.759
Did you ever watch The Dirty John The Betty Brought

620
00:31:59.799 --> 00:32:01.839
Her Story, which is such a weird title.

621
00:32:02.160 --> 00:32:04.680
No, I don't think I watched that one. That was,

622
00:32:04.880 --> 00:32:07.319
they had an initial season of Dirty.

623
00:32:07.519 --> 00:32:10.359
Dirty John Story based on the podcast. It was strange,

624
00:32:10.400 --> 00:32:14.480
but it wasn't as good as the Meredith Baxter movie.

625
00:32:14.519 --> 00:32:15.319
And I didn't think.

626
00:32:15.480 --> 00:32:20.480
I didn't love Amanda Pete portrayed Betty and Christian Slater

627
00:32:20.559 --> 00:32:25.160
portrayed Dan. I just didn't think they really captured the lessons. Now,

628
00:32:25.799 --> 00:32:27.279
one more thing I wanted to mention. I have so

629
00:32:27.319 --> 00:32:29.400
many Betty facts that I need to get out to

630
00:32:29.440 --> 00:32:34.720
you guys. The first the movie with Meredith Baxter. Dan's

631
00:32:34.759 --> 00:32:39.200
brother Larry was a consultant on the movie, so some

632
00:32:39.240 --> 00:32:42.400
people and Betty's family were really at a rate that it

633
00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:47.079
was told from Dan's perspective more than Betty's, like it

634
00:32:47.200 --> 00:32:50.880
vilified her more maybe than she deservant, but seemed like

635
00:32:50.920 --> 00:32:54.960
a pretty accurate portrayal to me. Betty Broderick's trial began

636
00:32:55.119 --> 00:32:58.079
in October nineteen ninety, less than a year after the

637
00:32:58.160 --> 00:33:01.960
murders of Dan and Linda. Before Betty's trial began, her attorney,

638
00:33:02.039 --> 00:33:06.200
Jack Early, considered using an insanity plea, but instead used

639
00:33:06.200 --> 00:33:10.000
a batter woman defense. He also moved to disqualify every

640
00:33:10.079 --> 00:33:13.000
judge in San Diego County from presiding over the trial.

641
00:33:13.559 --> 00:33:17.160
The motion was struck down. From the start, the courtroom

642
00:33:17.240 --> 00:33:21.440
was a media circus, cameras lining the sidewalks, reporters scrambling

643
00:33:21.480 --> 00:33:24.799
purceipts and the public eager to see the woman who

644
00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:28.200
had turned one of San Diego's nastiest divorces into a

645
00:33:28.240 --> 00:33:29.240
double homicide.

646
00:33:29.359 --> 00:33:31.160
This is a really interesting point about trying to get

647
00:33:31.160 --> 00:33:34.039
the judges struck down, because being that he was so

648
00:33:34.759 --> 00:33:38.160
active in legal circles and knew every judge right, does

649
00:33:38.160 --> 00:33:41.000
seem like it would be a little difficult to find

650
00:33:41.039 --> 00:33:42.519
an impartial judge.

651
00:33:43.039 --> 00:33:45.920
Dan's brother Larry called for Betty to get the death penalty,

652
00:33:46.240 --> 00:33:48.319
but that was never on the table because the DA

653
00:33:48.440 --> 00:33:51.119
did not want to put Kim, Lee, Dani, and Rhatt

654
00:33:51.160 --> 00:33:54.200
through losing both of their parents. Kim and Lee sat

655
00:33:54.240 --> 00:33:57.880
on different sides of the courtroom. Lee testified for the defense,

656
00:33:57.960 --> 00:34:01.680
while Kim testified for the prosecution for two long days.

657
00:34:02.000 --> 00:34:05.359
She was called the star witness. Kim testified that the

658
00:34:05.440 --> 00:34:09.079
children were often targets of Betty's cruelty. She often told

659
00:34:09.119 --> 00:34:12.400
him that she hated them, but Lee described their childhood

660
00:34:12.400 --> 00:34:12.960
as not.

661
00:34:12.880 --> 00:34:15.280
Too bad, and Lee was the one and remind me

662
00:34:15.360 --> 00:34:18.480
that was most like Betty, I think you said, Okay, Yeah.

663
00:34:19.320 --> 00:34:23.639
The prosecution's case was straightforward. Betty had acted with premeditation

664
00:34:23.960 --> 00:34:27.320
and intent. They painted her as a bitter, vengeful ex

665
00:34:27.360 --> 00:34:30.199
wife who refused to move on with her life, who

666
00:34:30.239 --> 00:34:33.800
had harassed and terrorized Dan and Linda for years before

667
00:34:33.840 --> 00:34:37.320
finally killing them in cold blood. They emphasized the early

668
00:34:37.360 --> 00:34:40.159
morning break in, the stolen key and the fact that

669
00:34:40.199 --> 00:34:43.280
Betty had brought a loaded thirty eight revolver into their

670
00:34:43.320 --> 00:34:47.280
bedroom while they slept. She fired five shots, two into Linda,

671
00:34:47.599 --> 00:34:49.840
went into Dan, and two that lodged into the wall.

672
00:34:50.719 --> 00:34:53.119
Dan was found wedged between the bed and the nightstand,

673
00:34:53.239 --> 00:34:55.559
phone in hand, and the cord riped from the wall.

674
00:34:56.400 --> 00:34:59.400
The defense told a different story. They argued that Betty

675
00:34:59.480 --> 00:35:03.480
was the victim, emotionally abused, financially manipulated, and driven to

676
00:35:03.519 --> 00:35:05.920
the breaking point by a man who had all the

677
00:35:06.000 --> 00:35:09.840
legal power and wasn't afraid to use it. They described

678
00:35:09.960 --> 00:35:13.239
years of humiliation, the abrupt end of her marriage after

679
00:35:13.280 --> 00:35:16.320
sixteen years, the replacement of a wife and mother with

680
00:35:16.360 --> 00:35:19.719
a twenty one year old legal assistant, in the psychological

681
00:35:19.840 --> 00:35:23.480
toll of the long, ugly divorce that followed. Betty took

682
00:35:23.519 --> 00:35:27.559
the stand herself, testifying for three days. She admitted to

683
00:35:27.559 --> 00:35:29.840
pulling the trigger, but claimed she had gone to the

684
00:35:29.880 --> 00:35:33.880
house to confront Dan, Linda not to kill them. According

685
00:35:33.880 --> 00:35:36.440
to her, the shooting happened in a blur after Linda

686
00:35:36.480 --> 00:35:40.360
woke up screaming, and she acted without thinking. Do you

687
00:35:40.400 --> 00:35:43.440
believe that Betty went to their home, walked inside their

688
00:35:43.480 --> 00:35:46.400
home while they were sleeping, just to confront them.

689
00:35:46.480 --> 00:35:47.960
No, I don't believe it for a second.

690
00:35:48.760 --> 00:35:52.119
The jury deliberated for six days before they found themselves

691
00:35:52.199 --> 00:35:56.119
deadlocked at ten to two. The two holdout jurors believed

692
00:35:56.239 --> 00:35:59.280
Betty was guilty of manslaughter and had acted in the

693
00:35:59.320 --> 00:36:02.079
heat of passion, and the rest were convinced it was

694
00:36:02.159 --> 00:36:06.760
first degree murder. The result was a mistrial, an unsatisfying

695
00:36:06.840 --> 00:36:09.199
end to a trial that had gripped the whole country,

696
00:36:09.679 --> 00:36:12.960
but the prosecution vowed to try Betty again, certain that

697
00:36:13.039 --> 00:36:16.639
the next jury would deliver a conviction. San Diego was

698
00:36:16.679 --> 00:36:21.079
so enthralled with Betty's trial that during her testimony, regular

699
00:36:21.199 --> 00:36:25.440
programming was interrupted to broadcast it live on TV.

700
00:36:25.559 --> 00:36:30.239
Wow, it's like before ojay O day before oj exactly.

701
00:36:31.000 --> 00:36:34.440
The seven week retrial of Betty Broderick began in October

702
00:36:34.559 --> 00:36:38.039
nineteen ninety one, just a year after the first jury deadlocked.

703
00:36:38.320 --> 00:36:40.840
It was broadcast on Court TV. Court TV was just

704
00:36:40.920 --> 00:36:41.800
kind of getting started.

705
00:36:41.800 --> 00:36:41.960
Then.

706
00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:44.280
It was I think one of the first trials to

707
00:36:44.480 --> 00:36:47.880
be aired in its entirety. This time, the atmosphere in

708
00:36:47.920 --> 00:36:51.639
the court room felt a little different, less sensational, more focused.

709
00:36:52.159 --> 00:36:54.239
The media was still there in full force, but both

710
00:36:54.280 --> 00:36:57.920
sides had learned from the first trial, sharpening their strategies

711
00:36:57.920 --> 00:37:01.559
for round two. The judge would not allow testimony from

712
00:37:01.599 --> 00:37:04.280
a battered woman's expert, as he did in the first trial.

713
00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:09.239
The prosecution stuck to the same core argument Betty's actions

714
00:37:09.239 --> 00:37:12.639
were calculated. She had stolen a key, entered the house

715
00:37:12.679 --> 00:37:15.239
in the pre dawn hours, and brought a loaded revolver

716
00:37:15.280 --> 00:37:18.480
into the bedroom where Dan and Linda slept. The DA

717
00:37:18.559 --> 00:37:21.920
emphasized that Betty fired two shots at Linda, won at Dan,

718
00:37:22.000 --> 00:37:24.000
and two more at the wall, proof in their view

719
00:37:24.039 --> 00:37:28.400
of control and intent, rather than a panicked reaction. They

720
00:37:28.400 --> 00:37:32.000
were minded jurors that after the shooting, Betty had removed

721
00:37:32.000 --> 00:37:34.719
the phone court from the wall, ensuring no one could

722
00:37:34.760 --> 00:37:37.599
call for help. I had said a few minutes earlier

723
00:37:37.639 --> 00:37:39.480
that she took the phone court and ripped it into

724
00:37:40.119 --> 00:37:41.840
That's crazy strength, isn't it.

725
00:37:42.039 --> 00:37:43.559
I think it would be very hard to rip a

726
00:37:43.599 --> 00:37:44.599
phone Cardet too.

727
00:37:45.559 --> 00:37:48.559
The defense, led by Jack Early, again doubled down on

728
00:37:48.639 --> 00:37:52.559
portraying Betty as a woman pushed beyond reason. Early argued

729
00:37:52.679 --> 00:37:55.880
that Dan had methodically stripped Betty of her identity, her

730
00:37:55.920 --> 00:38:01.679
financial security, and her relationships with her children. Of psychological manipulation,

731
00:38:02.360 --> 00:38:06.840
public humiliation, and legal battles had left her emotionally unstable.

732
00:38:07.559 --> 00:38:11.480
When she entered that bedroom, Early claimed she was consumed

733
00:38:11.519 --> 00:38:16.480
by rage and despair, not premeditation. They sought a manslaughter verdict,

734
00:38:16.599 --> 00:38:19.480
arguing that the killings were the result of heat of passion,

735
00:38:19.840 --> 00:38:23.679
not cold blooded murder. Betty again took the stand for

736
00:38:23.760 --> 00:38:27.559
five days, her testimony echoing her earlier claims that she

737
00:38:27.639 --> 00:38:31.400
had not gone there intending to kill, that everything happened

738
00:38:31.400 --> 00:38:33.559
in a blur, and that she'd been living in a

739
00:38:33.599 --> 00:38:37.239
constant state of emotional collapse. But unlike the first trial,

740
00:38:37.320 --> 00:38:41.039
the cheery seemed less swayed by her explanations. Her tears

741
00:38:41.039 --> 00:38:43.360
seemed more performative than genuine.

742
00:38:44.239 --> 00:38:47.119
The only way I know how to describe it now

743
00:38:47.280 --> 00:38:51.760
is so there was all these thoughts just churning in

744
00:38:51.840 --> 00:38:54.840
my head, and there was so much going on inside

745
00:38:54.920 --> 00:38:57.280
my head. Is that's kind of like my eyeballs or

746
00:38:57.360 --> 00:39:00.400
turned backwards, and the whole world was inside my head

747
00:39:00.519 --> 00:39:04.760
because all this anguish, and so I wasn't seeing where

748
00:39:04.760 --> 00:39:07.679
I was going, and I wasn't. It was like I

749
00:39:07.760 --> 00:39:12.239
was just inward and there was all this anguish and

750
00:39:12.519 --> 00:39:15.920
kind of darkness and crazy thoughts.

751
00:39:16.079 --> 00:39:17.000
Felt like you were in hell.

752
00:39:17.159 --> 00:39:20.559
Actually, when you got to the house, went in the

753
00:39:20.559 --> 00:39:22.400
back door, do you remember where you went?

754
00:39:23.719 --> 00:39:25.840
I got upstairs, I know that, but I don't know

755
00:39:26.159 --> 00:39:27.079
which route I took.

756
00:39:27.480 --> 00:39:29.760
Do you remember were you holding the gun at that time?

757
00:39:31.079 --> 00:39:32.519
I don't remember, I guess so.

758
00:39:33.440 --> 00:39:36.559
And what did you do when you went into their bedroom? Well,

759
00:39:36.599 --> 00:39:39.320
the motion that I made, although I don't think it

760
00:39:39.360 --> 00:39:42.199
was a big motion, the movement that I made into

761
00:39:42.239 --> 00:39:46.360
their bedroom woke them up, and they moved and somebody

762
00:39:46.400 --> 00:39:49.719
screamed called the police, and I said no, and I

763
00:39:49.840 --> 00:39:51.840
just fired the gun.

764
00:39:51.880 --> 00:39:55.480
And this thing noise went off, and then I grabbed

765
00:39:55.519 --> 00:39:58.000
the phone and got the hell out of there. But

766
00:39:58.079 --> 00:40:00.960
I wasn't even in that room. I mean, it just

767
00:40:01.119 --> 00:40:05.440
was an explosion, just I'm will. They moved, the gun

768
00:40:05.480 --> 00:40:07.880
went off, and it was like heaven and it was

769
00:40:07.920 --> 00:40:09.199
that fast.

770
00:40:10.320 --> 00:40:12.599
I'm with the jury on this one. Performative.

771
00:40:13.840 --> 00:40:16.719
After just two days of deliberation, the jury returned with

772
00:40:16.760 --> 00:40:20.039
a verdict guilty of two pounds of second agree murder

773
00:40:20.480 --> 00:40:24.039
along with a legal use of a firearm. Betty Broderick

774
00:40:24.159 --> 00:40:26.840
was sentenced to thirty two years to life in prison

775
00:40:27.440 --> 00:40:31.239
with the possibility of parole. The woman who had once

776
00:40:31.280 --> 00:40:34.199
been a fixture in San Diego's upper social circles would

777
00:40:34.239 --> 00:40:38.519
spend the foreseeable future behind bars. The verdict closed one

778
00:40:38.559 --> 00:40:41.800
of the most infamous chapters in California's legal history, but

779
00:40:41.800 --> 00:40:44.800
it didn't end the fascination with Betty Broderick. Her story,

780
00:40:44.920 --> 00:40:48.760
equal parts tragedy and scandal, would continue to capture public

781
00:40:48.840 --> 00:40:52.679
attention for decades. We'll be back after a break.

782
00:41:00.360 --> 00:41:04.039
Betty, now seventy seven, resides in the California Institution for

783
00:41:04.119 --> 00:41:08.400
Women in Corona, California. Her first parole denial came in

784
00:41:08.480 --> 00:41:11.800
January twenty ten, and then again in twenty eleven and

785
00:41:12.039 --> 00:41:17.280
January twenty seventeen. She was called unrepentant and lacking remorse

786
00:41:17.320 --> 00:41:21.519
for the murders. Larry Broderick, Dan's brother made sure she

787
00:41:21.639 --> 00:41:26.199
received the maximum possible denial of parole fifteen years until

788
00:41:26.199 --> 00:41:30.199
the next hearing at her parole hearing in twenty seventeen,

789
00:41:30.440 --> 00:41:33.440
Danny said, quote in my heart, I know my mother

790
00:41:33.559 --> 00:41:36.440
is a good person, but along the way she got lost.

791
00:41:37.000 --> 00:41:40.960
Releasing a lost person into society could be a dangerous mistake.

792
00:41:41.880 --> 00:41:44.679
Lee and Rhett support her release, while Kim and Danny

793
00:41:44.719 --> 00:41:48.079
oppose it. Betty's next parole hearing is set for twenty

794
00:41:48.159 --> 00:41:50.280
thirty two. She'll be eighty four.

795
00:41:51.079 --> 00:41:53.639
So what do you think about that? Her sentence was

796
00:41:53.679 --> 00:41:57.119
for thirty two years. It's been thirty three years since

797
00:41:57.119 --> 00:41:58.559
she's been in prison.

798
00:41:58.320 --> 00:42:01.239
So her sins was thirty two years to life to life.

799
00:42:01.360 --> 00:42:01.599
Yeah.

800
00:42:01.840 --> 00:42:04.840
I never know how those things work, but I do

801
00:42:04.960 --> 00:42:07.639
think from everything I've seen so far, I don't know

802
00:42:08.400 --> 00:42:11.400
the whole story yet, but she does seem like she

803
00:42:11.599 --> 00:42:14.199
lacks remorse, so like she feels like she is the victim.

804
00:42:14.199 --> 00:42:16.679
And if she still feels that way and she's going

805
00:42:16.719 --> 00:42:20.679
to these parole hearings and not expressing remorse, then I

806
00:42:20.840 --> 00:42:22.679
think she should still be in prison.

807
00:42:23.239 --> 00:42:27.079
Okay, Well, Betty's going to becoming for you in twenty

808
00:42:27.159 --> 00:42:29.599
thirty two when she's eighty four. Are you going to

809
00:42:29.599 --> 00:42:30.360
get that rich guy?

810
00:42:30.599 --> 00:42:34.159
I'll be okay. Betty is popular in prison, she gets

811
00:42:34.159 --> 00:42:37.679
along well with everyone. She mentors younger women and helps

812
00:42:37.719 --> 00:42:41.360
them with their ged studies. She enjoys cooking and tending

813
00:42:41.360 --> 00:42:44.960
to the vegetable garden. Quote. I am basically happy in here.

814
00:42:45.199 --> 00:42:47.239
I'm safe, and there's a kind of freedom in that,

815
00:42:47.639 --> 00:42:50.400
and in knowing what to expect each day. I talk

816
00:42:50.480 --> 00:42:53.639
to and see my children and grandchildren. I suppose I

817
00:42:53.639 --> 00:42:56.119
live in a gated community like lots of seniors do,

818
00:42:56.280 --> 00:42:59.960
because in an odd way, I have maids, cooks, gardeners,

819
00:43:00.239 --> 00:43:03.360
and even chauffeurs. If I need to go somewhere free

820
00:43:03.360 --> 00:43:08.119
rent and no taxes, free food, laundry services, wardrobe consultants,

821
00:43:08.400 --> 00:43:12.199
along with a free wardrobe and medical aw She's really

822
00:43:12.239 --> 00:43:13.119
looking on the price.

823
00:43:13.039 --> 00:43:14.719
On the right side.

824
00:43:15.599 --> 00:43:18.679
In twenty twenty, letters to Brad from Betty were found

825
00:43:18.679 --> 00:43:22.840
in an abandoned storage locker. In one, she wrote, quote,

826
00:43:22.960 --> 00:43:24.760
if I had a penny for every time I think

827
00:43:24.800 --> 00:43:28.400
of you, I'd be a millionaire many times over. In another,

828
00:43:28.519 --> 00:43:31.639
Betty asked him to send her money. Quote. I check

829
00:43:31.719 --> 00:43:34.920
the obits regularly. So far I have not seen yours.

830
00:43:35.039 --> 00:43:38.239
Where are you and where is my money? Help? I

831
00:43:38.320 --> 00:43:41.639
need to see you. It's been too long. No Halloween

832
00:43:41.719 --> 00:43:46.440
card boo, no B Day card, no Thanksgiving, no Christmas,

833
00:43:46.480 --> 00:43:49.400
no Happy New Year? How about Valentine's Day?

834
00:43:50.280 --> 00:43:51.920
It was kind of odd that these letters were just

835
00:43:52.000 --> 00:43:54.760
found in this storage unit, along with a lot of

836
00:43:54.800 --> 00:43:57.719
canceled checks and other things. So Brad had been sending

837
00:43:57.760 --> 00:44:00.440
her money and then he must have stopped at some

838
00:44:00.519 --> 00:44:05.159
point he got married. I think Betty was very unhappy

839
00:44:05.199 --> 00:44:07.880
about that, but she had always treated Brad not so great.

840
00:44:08.360 --> 00:44:10.519
The fact that he even stuck around after, you know,

841
00:44:10.599 --> 00:44:11.960
she killed, surprised.

842
00:44:13.360 --> 00:44:13.519
Yeah.

843
00:44:14.440 --> 00:44:16.599
I think Brad needs to be more worried about when

844
00:44:16.639 --> 00:44:18.760
Betty gets released that I need to be worried about.

845
00:44:18.880 --> 00:44:22.920
Frankly, Dan Broderick was not a good husband to Betty,

846
00:44:23.000 --> 00:44:26.039
but he didn't deserve to die. He loved making people laugh.

847
00:44:26.400 --> 00:44:28.679
His favorite movie was Gone with the Wind, which it

848
00:44:28.920 --> 00:44:32.719
would explain why their son is named Retha. If Dan

849
00:44:32.800 --> 00:44:36.079
had lived, he'd likely be a judge or a politician today.

850
00:44:36.559 --> 00:44:39.639
Some friends thought he could be president. Each year, a

851
00:44:39.679 --> 00:44:42.400
group of Dan's friends gather at the cemetery and sing,

852
00:44:42.440 --> 00:44:45.840
Oh Danny boy and pour a bottle of Irish whiskey

853
00:44:45.880 --> 00:44:49.039
on his grave. His friends insists that he was fair

854
00:44:49.119 --> 00:44:53.800
to Betty in the divorce settlement. Linda Calkina Broderick tragically

855
00:44:53.840 --> 00:44:56.840
lost her life at the hands of Betty. She's remembered

856
00:44:56.840 --> 00:44:59.840
by friends and family for her warmth, intelligence, and dedication.

857
00:45:00.599 --> 00:45:02.960
Her death was a shocking end to a life with

858
00:45:03.039 --> 00:45:05.960
so much potential. Though her story is tied to a

859
00:45:06.039 --> 00:45:09.000
violent tragedy, those who knew her remember her for the

860
00:45:09.039 --> 00:45:12.920
person she was, not just the events that ended her life.

861
00:45:13.239 --> 00:45:16.000
Remind me how old Linda was when she was killed.

862
00:45:16.320 --> 00:45:18.440
Linda was twenty eight and it was just a couple

863
00:45:18.440 --> 00:45:22.159
of weeks before Dan's forty fifth birthday. Gotcha, Betty and

864
00:45:22.239 --> 00:45:25.360
her biting humor wrote in her book, I'm offended that

865
00:45:25.400 --> 00:45:27.519
no one has cared enough to build at least a

866
00:45:27.519 --> 00:45:30.519
smaller version of the Lincoln Memorial in his honor, or

867
00:45:30.639 --> 00:45:33.800
to enact an eternal flame over his grave, and why

868
00:45:33.840 --> 00:45:36.400
not a rendering of his likeness, say on the San

869
00:45:36.440 --> 00:45:42.119
Bernardino Mountains a La Mount Rushmore. Oh boy, The real

870
00:45:42.159 --> 00:45:45.159
tragedy of the Broaderick case lies, and what happened to

871
00:45:45.199 --> 00:45:47.840
the four children caught in the crossfire of their parents'

872
00:45:47.840 --> 00:45:52.400
toxic war. Here are Kim and Dan with Oprah and how.

873
00:45:52.159 --> 00:45:54.840
Have you handled Dan, How have you, too, Kim, handled

874
00:45:54.840 --> 00:45:57.800
the fact that your mother killed your father because now

875
00:45:58.480 --> 00:45:59.960
you both are left with no parents.

876
00:46:01.199 --> 00:46:03.599
I don't know how you handle it. You're just happy

877
00:46:03.639 --> 00:46:06.639
that you really don't have a choice. She just seems

878
00:46:06.679 --> 00:46:08.679
to think that we're better off. She still thinks we're

879
00:46:08.679 --> 00:46:12.480
better off, and that's definitely untrue.

880
00:46:13.119 --> 00:46:16.159
Does it bother you to bother the two of you?

881
00:46:16.280 --> 00:46:18.639
Because I spent a lot of time with your mom

882
00:46:19.280 --> 00:46:22.760
and I talked to her for quite a while, and

883
00:46:22.800 --> 00:46:26.840
the thing that really surprised me the most was she

884
00:46:26.960 --> 00:46:30.039
doesn't seem to have any remorse about this. Not only

885
00:46:30.079 --> 00:46:32.400
doesn't seem she told us she didn't have any remorse

886
00:46:32.440 --> 00:46:36.400
about this, and that's still surprising to me. And I

887
00:46:36.400 --> 00:46:38.360
don't know if that's a zet upsetting to you that

888
00:46:38.400 --> 00:46:41.039
she doesn't seem to be remorseful.

889
00:46:40.599 --> 00:46:43.480
Very upsetting. I understand if she doesn't feel bad about

890
00:46:43.599 --> 00:46:45.840
killing dad, if she couldt least feel remorse about leaving

891
00:46:45.960 --> 00:46:49.400
us parentless or at least feel bad about the situation

892
00:46:49.480 --> 00:46:50.960
that we're all in now, But she doesn't.

893
00:46:50.920 --> 00:46:52.840
Because what situation are you all? You all are all

894
00:46:52.840 --> 00:46:53.840
living with different.

895
00:46:53.519 --> 00:46:59.119
People right right? It was just we just got jipped

896
00:46:59.119 --> 00:47:01.880
out of life that we could have had, and she

897
00:47:01.920 --> 00:47:04.000
doesn't feel bad for being the cause of that.

898
00:47:04.960 --> 00:47:07.280
Kim, the eldest, had been a straight A student, but

899
00:47:07.360 --> 00:47:10.239
nearly flunked out of high school as the chaos consumed

900
00:47:10.239 --> 00:47:13.480
her home. When she became pregnant at age eighteen, she

901
00:47:13.559 --> 00:47:17.159
turned to Linda, not Betty, for support, the betrayal that

902
00:47:17.199 --> 00:47:18.559
her mother never forgave.

903
00:47:18.760 --> 00:47:19.880
I can imagine yeah.

904
00:47:20.000 --> 00:47:23.400
Despite Betty's own history of abortions, she judged Kim harshly,

905
00:47:23.800 --> 00:47:26.400
even writing letters to family and friends about her daughter's

906
00:47:26.440 --> 00:47:30.400
private struggles. When Kim invited Linda to her high school graduation,

907
00:47:30.840 --> 00:47:34.199
Betty's response was swift and cruel. I'm not coming. I

908
00:47:34.280 --> 00:47:37.039
just remembered how much I hate you. Kim tried her

909
00:47:37.079 --> 00:47:40.400
best to keep her family together. When she got married,

910
00:47:40.559 --> 00:47:44.199
Danny walked her down the aisle and gave the toast. Lee,

911
00:47:44.280 --> 00:47:46.519
spiraling from the trauma, dropped out of high school and

912
00:47:46.559 --> 00:47:49.159
ran away. She turned to drugs and alcohol to numb

913
00:47:49.239 --> 00:47:52.000
the pain. Dan eventually wrote her out of his will

914
00:47:52.079 --> 00:47:54.320
and kicked her out, though by the time of his

915
00:47:54.400 --> 00:47:58.320
death they were attempting to rebuild their fractured relationship. Out

916
00:47:58.360 --> 00:48:01.280
of the four children, Lee has probably struggled the most.

917
00:48:01.840 --> 00:48:06.000
She continued to battle addiction and abusive relationships, unable to

918
00:48:06.280 --> 00:48:10.039
hold steady employment, although in Kim's book that I read,

919
00:48:10.760 --> 00:48:14.199
it sounds like she had gotten a college degree and

920
00:48:15.039 --> 00:48:15.760
was doing better.

921
00:48:15.840 --> 00:48:16.440
Oh that's good.

922
00:48:16.599 --> 00:48:20.199
Yeah. The two boys, Danny and Rhett, bore witness to

923
00:48:20.239 --> 00:48:24.039
horrors no children should see. Rhett once told a therapist,

924
00:48:24.239 --> 00:48:26.599
I want to run away and kill myself. My heart

925
00:48:26.679 --> 00:48:30.159
is broken. Both boys begged the judge to let them

926
00:48:30.199 --> 00:48:32.559
live with Betty, saying she was fun and took good

927
00:48:32.559 --> 00:48:35.400
care of them, while complaining that Dan was never home

928
00:48:35.440 --> 00:48:40.039
and Linda was bossy and mean. Betty's manipulation continued even then.

929
00:48:40.360 --> 00:48:43.760
She told Danny to pour boiling water on Linda and

930
00:48:43.800 --> 00:48:46.440
make it look like an accident, and then she was

931
00:48:46.480 --> 00:48:49.599
mad when he didn't do it. When Dan gained sole

932
00:48:49.719 --> 00:48:54.280
custody of the boys, their lives deteriorated visibly. Teachers noticed

933
00:48:54.320 --> 00:48:57.719
they were often laid inappropriately, dressed for weather, and arriving

934
00:48:57.840 --> 00:49:02.119
at school in days old clothing. Betty maintained constant contact

935
00:49:02.159 --> 00:49:05.119
through a phone line at Dan's house. Her influence never

936
00:49:05.199 --> 00:49:09.239
truly severed after the murders, the children were scattered. Kim

937
00:49:09.320 --> 00:49:12.079
dropped out of college to accompany her brothers to Colorado,

938
00:49:12.079 --> 00:49:15.480
where they lived with Dan's brother Larry. The arrangement was

939
00:49:15.519 --> 00:49:18.639
far from stable. Larry and his wife were having their

940
00:49:18.679 --> 00:49:22.800
own marital problems and separated soon after the children arrived.

941
00:49:23.559 --> 00:49:27.440
Larry doesn't seem like the best guy in my opinion. Actually,

942
00:49:27.440 --> 00:49:29.960
he's kind of a slime ball. I think that he

943
00:49:30.079 --> 00:49:32.079
wanted the kids like he and his wife had actually

944
00:49:32.119 --> 00:49:35.039
separated and they were not living in the same house.

945
00:49:35.079 --> 00:49:38.039
But after the murders happened, the boys came with a

946
00:49:38.039 --> 00:49:41.679
lot of money, like they had like a stipend, and

947
00:49:42.480 --> 00:49:44.880
he moved back in with his wife and they tried

948
00:49:44.920 --> 00:49:47.360
to make it work. But I think it was somewhat

949
00:49:47.400 --> 00:49:51.559
motivated by money. Interesting it took three years before the

950
00:49:51.639 --> 00:49:54.920
children were allowed to visit Betty in prison. Three years.

951
00:49:54.960 --> 00:49:58.519
That's a lot of time. When the family finally reunited

952
00:49:58.760 --> 00:50:01.480
at the Central Caliph we new women's facility in the

953
00:50:01.519 --> 00:50:05.679
summer of nineteen ninety three, they were twenty three, twenty two, seventeen,

954
00:50:05.760 --> 00:50:08.920
and fourteen, no longer the children who had been torn

955
00:50:08.920 --> 00:50:13.280
apart by their parents' war during that weekend. Betty offered

956
00:50:13.320 --> 00:50:16.960
no apologies for murdering their father. This was kind of

957
00:50:17.000 --> 00:50:19.880
a nice thing. But the prison allowed them to come

958
00:50:19.920 --> 00:50:22.920
and visit, and they have like this little house that

959
00:50:22.960 --> 00:50:24.800
they were able to stay in, and they stayed for

960
00:50:24.840 --> 00:50:27.519
the whole weekend, and they were able to like barbecue,

961
00:50:27.559 --> 00:50:31.239
and you know, they were there was like barbed wire around,

962
00:50:31.320 --> 00:50:33.760
and it wasn't like a lovely family home or anything,

963
00:50:33.840 --> 00:50:36.599
but it was still a good opportunity for them to,

964
00:50:37.000 --> 00:50:40.559
you know, have time together as a family. Each child

965
00:50:40.599 --> 00:50:44.400
carried the scars differently into adulthood. Danny, always the rule follower,

966
00:50:44.480 --> 00:50:48.480
managed to graduate from UC Berkeley. Rad who had been

967
00:50:48.480 --> 00:50:52.079
the most bonded to Betty, struggled with rebellion and substance abuse,

968
00:50:52.199 --> 00:50:56.039
cycling through boys' homes and boot camps, before eventually pulling

969
00:50:56.119 --> 00:50:59.960
himself together to graduate as class president and also attend

970
00:51:00.480 --> 00:51:04.800
UC Berkeley. Years after the tragedy, Rhett appeared on OPRAH

971
00:51:04.840 --> 00:51:08.599
reflecting on his chaotic upbringing. He said, quote, I constantly

972
00:51:08.679 --> 00:51:11.239
felt like I was under the microscope, Like everything I

973
00:51:11.320 --> 00:51:13.880
did they were trying to blame on my parents' situation.

974
00:51:15.079 --> 00:51:18.239
Despite everything, he advocated for his mother's release saying that

975
00:51:18.320 --> 00:51:22.320
she wasn't dangerous to society. The only two people she

976
00:51:22.400 --> 00:51:25.760
has a danger to are dead. The children had been

977
00:51:25.800 --> 00:51:29.039
Betty and Dan's ultimate weapons against each other. In the end,

978
00:51:29.400 --> 00:51:34.000
they became the war's most devastating casualties. They still visit Betty,

979
00:51:34.280 --> 00:51:37.719
along with their spouses and children. Kim and Rhett live

980
00:51:37.760 --> 00:51:40.760
in Idaho. Dan lives in La Joya with his wife

981
00:51:40.840 --> 00:51:44.960
and three daughters. His wedding was featured in an online magazine.

982
00:51:45.480 --> 00:51:47.239
It was really cool to see pictures of all of

983
00:51:47.280 --> 00:51:50.599
them together. It was a beautiful wedding. Danny out of

984
00:51:50.599 --> 00:51:54.679
all the kids, he's definitely thriving financially at least, but

985
00:51:54.880 --> 00:51:57.519
it looks like he's very They all looked great. They

986
00:51:57.599 --> 00:52:00.840
all beautiful people. They all looked in the pictures I saw,

987
00:52:01.119 --> 00:52:04.400
they all look healthy and happy. Lee also lives in

988
00:52:04.480 --> 00:52:06.880
La Joya and Kim is a teacher and she has

989
00:52:06.920 --> 00:52:11.280
two daughters. Rat coaches football and teaches high school history, geography,

990
00:52:11.280 --> 00:52:14.800
and English in Idaho, and he's also married with two daughters.

991
00:52:15.360 --> 00:52:18.039
I'm always amazed by the kids in the cases that

992
00:52:18.079 --> 00:52:21.119
we cover and how so many of them just rebound

993
00:52:21.239 --> 00:52:23.800
and thrive, and I'm sure they still have a lot

994
00:52:23.800 --> 00:52:28.000
of issues, but you know, really trying to you know,

995
00:52:28.039 --> 00:52:30.480
live their best lives despite of everything that they have

996
00:52:30.559 --> 00:52:30.920
been through.

997
00:52:31.039 --> 00:52:35.400
Yeah, it's really amazing and impressive that everything they went through.

998
00:52:35.440 --> 00:52:38.480
It's just that they went through a lot of horrible

999
00:52:38.519 --> 00:52:41.440
trauma at really bad ages, like all of them, even

1000
00:52:42.039 --> 00:52:45.199
the oldest was still you know, fairly young, and just

1001
00:52:45.280 --> 00:52:47.719
everything that they went to through to be able to

1002
00:52:47.719 --> 00:52:51.000
get through that and you know, lead productive lives and

1003
00:52:51.440 --> 00:52:53.880
hopefully find happy amazing, amazing, for sure.

1004
00:52:54.519 --> 00:52:58.239
We are wrapping things up here. Betty wrote letters to

1005
00:52:58.320 --> 00:53:01.159
her sons when they were still young. When she was incarcerated.

1006
00:53:01.840 --> 00:53:05.079
She knew that they were censored by their Denver therapist,

1007
00:53:05.199 --> 00:53:08.960
Thomas Meehan. She addressed them as dear Danny rhat an

1008
00:53:09.000 --> 00:53:12.639
asshole me Han. When she heard that Danny had grown tall,

1009
00:53:12.719 --> 00:53:14.920
she said, I always wanted him to be big enough

1010
00:53:14.960 --> 00:53:17.119
to beat up his dad, but I took care of

1011
00:53:17.159 --> 00:53:17.840
that for him.

1012
00:53:17.920 --> 00:53:18.239
Ha ha.

1013
00:53:19.639 --> 00:53:22.039
Brad Wright, her ex boyfriend, was the only person to

1014
00:53:22.119 --> 00:53:25.159
visit her in prison during her first year there. She'd

1015
00:53:25.199 --> 00:53:27.960
signed over her condo to him, but after he married

1016
00:53:28.000 --> 00:53:31.039
another woman, Betty demanded that he signed over to Lee,

1017
00:53:31.159 --> 00:53:34.079
which I think he did. Friends who had turned their

1018
00:53:34.119 --> 00:53:37.760
backs on Betty after the contentious avort wrote her letters

1019
00:53:37.920 --> 00:53:41.360
in prison. By then, many of their husbands had left

1020
00:53:41.400 --> 00:53:47.280
them for younger women, and they possibly understood Betty has

1021
00:53:47.360 --> 00:53:50.239
maintained her sense of humor. On April Fool's Day one year,

1022
00:53:50.360 --> 00:53:53.760
she called several friends and told them I've escaped. I'm

1023
00:53:53.840 --> 00:53:58.000
at the seven eleven. Come and get me that. Betty

1024
00:53:58.039 --> 00:54:01.159
has never apologized or expressed gen and feelings of remorse

1025
00:54:01.199 --> 00:54:04.400
for killing her husband, but did say this about Linda's life.

1026
00:54:04.760 --> 00:54:07.920
I have great remorse and guilt. I didn't like her

1027
00:54:07.960 --> 00:54:10.039
in life, and to say otherwise would be a lie.

1028
00:54:10.519 --> 00:54:12.360
But I should not have taken her life. That was

1029
00:54:12.360 --> 00:54:15.440
a horrible and demented, sickening and wrong thing to do.

1030
00:54:15.960 --> 00:54:19.119
And I do understand is inasmuch as one can understand

1031
00:54:19.159 --> 00:54:22.639
another's grief the agony I have caused her family. If

1032
00:54:22.679 --> 00:54:26.079
I could change what happened, I would. Here's a clip

1033
00:54:26.079 --> 00:54:27.280
of an interview with Betty.

1034
00:54:28.000 --> 00:54:30.320
Do you feel remorse for what you did?

1035
00:54:30.360 --> 00:54:30.480
Ben?

1036
00:54:31.000 --> 00:54:34.239
I feel such terrible remorse for what we've all been

1037
00:54:34.360 --> 00:54:37.960
through from nineteen eighty three. It'll almost be ten years now,

1038
00:54:38.559 --> 00:54:42.039
ten years I find it so meaningless, what we've all

1039
00:54:42.079 --> 00:54:44.760
been through. What was the point of it, What was

1040
00:54:44.800 --> 00:54:47.559
the point of any of this? What was the point

1041
00:54:47.639 --> 00:54:51.440
of them conducting all this and lying? I just never

1042
00:54:51.800 --> 00:54:55.320
saw a point in it. I didn't know why they

1043
00:54:55.360 --> 00:54:59.119
felt so compelled to destroy me. The story they were

1044
00:54:59.119 --> 00:55:01.639
telling and trying to put over on people wasn't the truth.

1045
00:55:02.880 --> 00:55:05.880
It doesn't sound like in October nineteen ninety two that

1046
00:55:05.920 --> 00:55:09.800
you're sorry that you did it. I'm sorry about everything,

1047
00:55:10.039 --> 00:55:12.079
sorry about the whole thing. I mean, two people are

1048
00:55:12.079 --> 00:55:14.960
dead that could have had wonderful lives, and I should

1049
00:55:14.960 --> 00:55:17.599
have been ten years down the road. To ten years

1050
00:55:17.639 --> 00:55:21.159
is a long time to an entirely new life. I mean,

1051
00:55:21.280 --> 00:55:26.119
we all had so much potential and possibilities. Why was

1052
00:55:26.159 --> 00:55:27.599
this so destructive of everyone?

1053
00:55:28.320 --> 00:55:29.440
Anti Betty Broderick.

1054
00:55:29.519 --> 00:55:33.320
People say she had a million dollar house and sixteen

1055
00:55:33.360 --> 00:55:34.800
thousand dollars a month alimony.

1056
00:55:34.800 --> 00:55:36.480
Why didn't she go live her new life and a

1057
00:55:36.519 --> 00:55:38.440
boyfriend for that matter, Why didn't she go away and

1058
00:55:38.440 --> 00:55:39.159
live her life.

1059
00:55:38.960 --> 00:55:41.119
And leave them alone?

1060
00:55:41.440 --> 00:55:44.199
I need leave them alone. I would have loved to

1061
00:55:44.239 --> 00:55:46.199
have done that, and that would have been the plan,

1062
00:55:46.639 --> 00:55:49.559
is to be left alone and have a million dollar

1063
00:55:49.599 --> 00:55:51.360
house and a boyfriend and a car and anything. But

1064
00:55:51.400 --> 00:55:53.719
that's not the truth. The house was in his name

1065
00:55:54.039 --> 00:55:56.440
when I finally got it in late nineteen eighty nine,

1066
00:55:56.480 --> 00:55:58.800
in my name. I didn't have enough monthly money to

1067
00:55:58.840 --> 00:56:00.719
stay there, so the first thing I did was put

1068
00:56:00.760 --> 00:56:02.800
it on the market. It was on I couldn't stay there.

1069
00:56:03.039 --> 00:56:05.039
And all the years of this, when he was telling

1070
00:56:05.039 --> 00:56:07.199
people who bought me a house, it was a total lie.

1071
00:56:07.440 --> 00:56:10.000
The house was in his name, and the money that

1072
00:56:10.039 --> 00:56:12.719
he gave me every month to make those payments because

1073
00:56:12.719 --> 00:56:15.000
it was in his name was really back in his pocket.

1074
00:56:15.679 --> 00:56:18.559
The logistics of it has been difficult, but they're able

1075
00:56:18.679 --> 00:56:21.440
to come as much as they want. I'm able to

1076
00:56:21.440 --> 00:56:23.400
talk to them a lot more. We have a lot

1077
00:56:23.400 --> 00:56:24.880
more freedom to be with each other.

1078
00:56:25.760 --> 00:56:28.599
Oh boy, I'm sorry that Clipper ended abruptly.

1079
00:56:29.280 --> 00:56:32.480
That is like somebody apologizing by saying, I'm sorry if

1080
00:56:32.519 --> 00:56:34.239
you were offended by what I said.

1081
00:56:34.480 --> 00:56:36.639
Sorry if you were offended when I killed my husband.

1082
00:56:36.840 --> 00:56:37.159
I know.

1083
00:56:37.280 --> 00:56:40.599
Yeah. She still to this day cannot say I'm sorry.

1084
00:56:40.679 --> 00:56:44.119
I took Dan Broader's life. He did not deserve to die.

1085
00:56:44.239 --> 00:56:47.320
In Betty's mind, she believes that he deserved to die.

1086
00:56:47.719 --> 00:56:48.920
For what he did to her.

1087
00:56:49.320 --> 00:56:50.599
It bothers me so much.

1088
00:56:51.639 --> 00:56:53.840
I'm going to end with the final words from Bellis

1089
00:56:53.880 --> 00:56:57.360
Stumbo's book, a quote from Betty quote, me and God,

1090
00:56:57.400 --> 00:57:00.840
our old friends. He guided those bullets that night, he did.

1091
00:57:01.199 --> 00:57:03.159
Do you seriously think that I could have killed Dan

1092
00:57:03.239 --> 00:57:05.159
Broderick by myself without his help?

1093
00:57:05.719 --> 00:57:06.079
Wow?

1094
00:57:06.199 --> 00:57:09.400
As usual, she didn't even mention Linda. Then, with an

1095
00:57:09.440 --> 00:57:12.679
odd little pause, a hollow giggle, you know, I still

1096
00:57:12.719 --> 00:57:15.519
can't believe it that just one little bullet could kill

1097
00:57:15.679 --> 00:57:20.840
Dan Broderick. That was the story of Betty and Dan Broderick.

1098
00:57:21.599 --> 00:57:22.000
Wow.

1099
00:57:22.159 --> 00:57:24.400
What a wild ride, right wild ride?

1100
00:57:24.559 --> 00:57:28.119
I can't believe she after all that, she's now blaming

1101
00:57:28.159 --> 00:57:30.880
God for it, as if things couldn't get.

1102
00:57:30.800 --> 00:57:32.800
Worse, like God was on her side.

1103
00:57:32.880 --> 00:57:34.599
Yeah, oh boy.

1104
00:57:34.760 --> 00:57:36.800
Before we move on to discussion, I wanted to talk

1105
00:57:36.800 --> 00:57:39.360
about the sources that I used. I talked about this

1106
00:57:39.400 --> 00:57:41.840
book a few times, but it's called The Twelfth Until

1107
00:57:41.840 --> 00:57:44.559
the Twelfth of Never by Bella's Stumbo. She was a

1108
00:57:44.679 --> 00:57:48.639
reporter for the Los Angeles Times. It's a true crime classic.

1109
00:57:48.679 --> 00:57:53.159
It's very well written and impressively researched. Bella dictated the

1110
00:57:53.159 --> 00:57:56.039
book over the phone to her sister, who was also

1111
00:57:56.159 --> 00:57:56.880
her editor.

1112
00:57:57.039 --> 00:57:57.480
Oh wow.

1113
00:57:57.679 --> 00:58:00.840
She died in the year two thousand and two from cancer. Again.

1114
00:58:00.880 --> 00:58:03.599
I really enjoyed the book, but I take issue with

1115
00:58:03.760 --> 00:58:07.400
some of the descriptions of Betty. She talks about her

1116
00:58:07.440 --> 00:58:10.559
being fat and you know, ugly, and you know, Betty

1117
00:58:10.679 --> 00:58:13.960
was only forty two years old when the murders occurred,

1118
00:58:14.960 --> 00:58:17.159
so it reminded me a lot of the Jenny or

1119
00:58:17.199 --> 00:58:20.119
Gerardo case. And Jenny ere was like, you know, I'm

1120
00:58:20.159 --> 00:58:22.559
forty seven, and you know, I have nothing left to

1121
00:58:22.599 --> 00:58:27.519
live for, Like two is very young. And Betty was

1122
00:58:27.559 --> 00:58:32.360
such a dynamic, interesting woman, and it breaks my heart

1123
00:58:32.480 --> 00:58:36.760
that she, you know, couldn't have found another outlet for

1124
00:58:36.840 --> 00:58:38.679
all of her passion.

1125
00:58:38.880 --> 00:58:39.679
Yeah. Absolutely.

1126
00:58:40.679 --> 00:58:45.760
I also read Betty's autobiography titled Telling on Myself. It

1127
00:58:45.880 --> 00:58:49.079
was a pretty good read. She swept a lot of

1128
00:58:49.079 --> 00:58:51.599
things under the carpet, and you know, it just made

1129
00:58:51.679 --> 00:58:54.760
him seem like it wasn't really a big deal. The

1130
00:58:54.800 --> 00:58:57.519
book made me realize that she clearly has a lot

1131
00:58:57.519 --> 00:59:02.079
of mommy issues and she really is not sorry for

1132
00:59:02.119 --> 00:59:03.000
what she did to Dan.

1133
00:59:03.079 --> 00:59:04.199
Yeah, it doesn't seem like it.

1134
00:59:04.440 --> 00:59:08.280
I also read the book Betty Broderick The Mother the

1135
00:59:08.400 --> 00:59:12.599
Murderer written by Charles Dennis, but I think it was

1136
00:59:12.639 --> 00:59:15.920
originally released as written by Kim Broderick. But I'm not

1137
00:59:15.960 --> 00:59:20.320
sure if Charles Dennis re wrote it or what happened,

1138
00:59:20.320 --> 00:59:23.880
but some legal issues or something. Yeah, it's definitely Kim's story. Okay,

1139
00:59:24.079 --> 00:59:26.480
So those were all really good reads that I recommend.

1140
00:59:26.719 --> 00:59:27.599
He did a lot of reading.

1141
00:59:28.920 --> 00:59:30.960
Do you think it was possible for Betty to receive

1142
00:59:31.000 --> 00:59:32.559
a fair trial in San Diego?

1143
00:59:33.280 --> 00:59:36.039
Kind of No, we talked about it a little bit already,

1144
00:59:36.119 --> 00:59:39.199
But I mean Dan was very well connected in the

1145
00:59:39.400 --> 00:59:42.400
San Diego legal community, right, so I'm sure every judge

1146
00:59:42.840 --> 00:59:45.000
knew him, probably fairly well.

1147
00:59:45.280 --> 00:59:48.320
It's surprising that they didn't allow the case to be moved,

1148
00:59:48.360 --> 00:59:51.119
I think in most circumstances, I think that shows that,

1149
00:59:51.679 --> 00:59:53.400
you know, the judges were like, nope, she's going to

1150
00:59:53.440 --> 00:59:56.760
be tried here in San Diego. Yeah, although I didn't

1151
00:59:56.800 --> 01:00:01.119
see anything in the trial that was overtly unfre Yeah.

1152
01:00:00.920 --> 01:00:03.199
I mean, the fact that the jury found her guilty,

1153
01:00:03.239 --> 01:00:05.119
I think that was the right call.

1154
01:00:05.280 --> 01:00:09.000
Yeah. Dan one's told Betty that juries don't decide trials,

1155
01:00:09.280 --> 01:00:12.480
but judges do by what they allow into evidence and

1156
01:00:12.519 --> 01:00:16.000
who is allowed to testify, which I think is true.

1157
01:00:16.079 --> 01:00:17.480
I think there's a lot of truth to that.

1158
01:00:18.400 --> 01:00:21.840
Should Betty have been released after thirty two years was

1159
01:00:21.880 --> 01:00:25.800
served in prison, which was the minimum of her sentence.

1160
01:00:25.960 --> 01:00:27.679
Well, we talked about this already as well, But I

1161
01:00:27.760 --> 01:00:30.599
think no, Like I think, I think unless she showed

1162
01:00:30.679 --> 01:00:34.760
genuine remorse for her actions, then I don't think she

1163
01:00:34.800 --> 01:00:37.840
should have. The sentence was thirty two years to life,

1164
01:00:38.360 --> 01:00:41.280
So to me, the thirty two years should be only

1165
01:00:41.360 --> 01:00:45.920
if you are genuinely remorseful and you've kind of rehabilitated yourself. Yeah,

1166
01:00:46.840 --> 01:00:47.960
do you think what do you think?

1167
01:00:49.159 --> 01:00:51.679
This is going to sound like a cop out? But

1168
01:00:51.800 --> 01:00:54.159
I am too close to the story at this point

1169
01:00:54.280 --> 01:00:57.360
to see anything objectively as a cop out. You know.

1170
01:00:58.199 --> 01:01:01.719
I'm just having a hard time reconciling everything that I know,

1171
01:01:02.079 --> 01:01:05.800
and it's a very complicated case. Do you think that

1172
01:01:06.400 --> 01:01:09.159
someone has to say I'm so sorry that I committed

1173
01:01:09.159 --> 01:01:10.800
this crime to be released.

1174
01:01:10.800 --> 01:01:13.119
If your sentenced to If your sentence is thirty two

1175
01:01:13.159 --> 01:01:15.760
years to life, that is the range, and to me,

1176
01:01:16.800 --> 01:01:18.280
you should get out on the low end of that

1177
01:01:18.400 --> 01:01:21.559
range only if you have admitted to what you did

1178
01:01:21.599 --> 01:01:25.079
and not admitted to it, but that you're sorry for

1179
01:01:25.119 --> 01:01:26.760
what you did, and she obviously isn't.

1180
01:01:27.360 --> 01:01:30.400
Do you think that she was a battered woman that defense?

1181
01:01:30.760 --> 01:01:31.719
Does that work for you?

1182
01:01:32.599 --> 01:01:35.079
I mean, I'm not one hundred percent sure what the

1183
01:01:35.119 --> 01:01:38.280
definition of a battered woman is. I think Dan was

1184
01:01:38.320 --> 01:01:41.360
a terrible husband. I think he was not a good guy.

1185
01:01:41.480 --> 01:01:44.159
Well, there's different forms of abuse, right, you know, there's

1186
01:01:44.199 --> 01:01:49.280
physical abuse, there's you know, just control, right, and you

1187
01:01:49.280 --> 01:01:53.719
know Dan did control her financial as the financial aspect

1188
01:01:53.760 --> 01:01:54.360
of her life.

1189
01:01:54.639 --> 01:01:57.559
Yeah, Dan was not a good guy. There's no question

1190
01:01:57.639 --> 01:02:00.199
about that in my mind. But I don't I don't

1191
01:02:00.199 --> 01:02:02.320
think that excuses what she did.

1192
01:02:03.199 --> 01:02:06.119
Do you think that she was guilty of first degree murder,

1193
01:02:06.159 --> 01:02:08.880
second degree murder or manslaughter? What would you have found

1194
01:02:08.920 --> 01:02:09.440
her guilty of.

1195
01:02:09.519 --> 01:02:11.079
I mean, I think that you could make a case

1196
01:02:11.079 --> 01:02:13.199
for first degree murder because of the fact that she

1197
01:02:13.599 --> 01:02:16.000
stole the key, she went there with the gun. I mean,

1198
01:02:16.239 --> 01:02:19.119
it sort of seems like it was planned. But at

1199
01:02:19.159 --> 01:02:23.000
the same time, just getting a glimpse inside of Betty's mind,

1200
01:02:23.159 --> 01:02:26.679
knowing that she is there's a lot going on up there.

1201
01:02:26.920 --> 01:02:29.840
I could also see that she went there with the

1202
01:02:29.880 --> 01:02:33.559
intent of like just threatening or you know, doing something

1203
01:02:33.559 --> 01:02:36.400
else and then she pulled the trigger. So I don't know.

1204
01:02:36.400 --> 01:02:38.280
I think the jury got it right. I think second

1205
01:02:38.320 --> 01:02:42.320
degree murder seems reasonable to me from what I've heard.

1206
01:02:43.079 --> 01:02:44.679
I think I would have found her guilty of first

1207
01:02:44.719 --> 01:02:47.880
degree murder, which probably surprises you. But I do believe

1208
01:02:47.920 --> 01:02:48.920
that there is premeditation.

1209
01:02:49.079 --> 01:02:49.400
M hm.

1210
01:02:49.920 --> 01:02:52.519
She stole Kim's key a week before the murders. She

1211
01:02:52.559 --> 01:02:55.000
had bought the gun a year before, right, Well, I

1212
01:02:55.039 --> 01:02:58.000
do think that she bought the gun for protection. She

1213
01:02:58.039 --> 01:03:00.760
had told many, many people that she was angry enough

1214
01:03:00.800 --> 01:03:01.360
to kill Nan.

1215
01:03:01.639 --> 01:03:03.719
Yeah. Yeah, Like I said, I could definitely see a

1216
01:03:03.760 --> 01:03:05.639
case for first screen murder as well.

1217
01:03:06.239 --> 01:03:08.960
From this case. I learned from all of these cases

1218
01:03:08.960 --> 01:03:11.599
that we do if you want to end a long

1219
01:03:11.760 --> 01:03:16.079
term relationship, especially when children are involved, leave your partner

1220
01:03:16.119 --> 01:03:19.559
with dignity, Be fair, give them what they deserve.

1221
01:03:21.039 --> 01:03:23.920
Greed. This is sort of a minor question, but do

1222
01:03:24.000 --> 01:03:27.039
you know if Betty profited from her book at all?

1223
01:03:27.199 --> 01:03:27.480
Did she?

1224
01:03:28.159 --> 01:03:30.400
That's a very good question. I'm so glad you asked,

1225
01:03:30.400 --> 01:03:34.639
because I forgot to mention it. She any proceeds from

1226
01:03:34.719 --> 01:03:37.679
her book, she gave to her children anytime that she

1227
01:03:37.719 --> 01:03:38.800
received money for anything.

1228
01:03:39.639 --> 01:03:41.320
When did she do that because she had to or

1229
01:03:41.360 --> 01:03:42.360
because she chose to.

1230
01:03:42.519 --> 01:03:44.679
She chose to, I believe she probably had to, but

1231
01:03:45.199 --> 01:03:47.480
that was something that she wanted to do. Another thing

1232
01:03:47.519 --> 01:03:50.039
I forgot to mention. Remember Lee was written out of

1233
01:03:50.119 --> 01:03:54.559
the well right by Dan's life insurance policy. That was

1234
01:03:54.599 --> 01:03:57.840
part of the divorce agreement. He did get over a

1235
01:03:57.840 --> 01:04:01.400
million dollar life insurance policy, and twenty five percent of

1236
01:04:01.400 --> 01:04:04.119
that did go to Lee, which was, you know, at

1237
01:04:04.159 --> 01:04:06.159
that time, a fair amount of money.

1238
01:04:06.320 --> 01:04:10.360
So all the kids financially at least ended up okay.

1239
01:04:11.039 --> 01:04:14.039
I think they ended up okay. They got their money,

1240
01:04:14.400 --> 01:04:17.320
I believe, at least in two different chunks. The one

1241
01:04:17.320 --> 01:04:19.000
that I can speak for that I know of because

1242
01:04:19.000 --> 01:04:21.679
I read the book is Kim. And when she got

1243
01:04:21.719 --> 01:04:24.280
the money, she was really young. She got married kind

1244
01:04:24.280 --> 01:04:26.320
of young, so they used the money for like a

1245
01:04:26.360 --> 01:04:28.440
down payment on a house and things like that. But

1246
01:04:28.840 --> 01:04:31.559
she also admits that she was young and some of

1247
01:04:31.599 --> 01:04:35.559
the money she squandered. Lee, we know, had you know,

1248
01:04:35.599 --> 01:04:37.679
a little bit of a drug problem, so I think,

1249
01:04:37.800 --> 01:04:42.280
you know, her money kind of went away to Danny,

1250
01:04:43.079 --> 01:04:46.159
I think did really well financially in his career. And

1251
01:04:47.159 --> 01:04:50.239
I always feel like a stalker. But I know, I

1252
01:04:50.280 --> 01:04:52.960
feel he lives in a very nice house, a very

1253
01:04:53.039 --> 01:04:53.599
very nice house.

1254
01:04:53.800 --> 01:04:54.960
He had a very nice wedding too.

1255
01:04:55.280 --> 01:04:57.719
Yeah, so he's doing really well. And I think Ruett

1256
01:04:57.960 --> 01:05:00.480
also is doing well. But he's a teacher, so you know,

1257
01:05:00.519 --> 01:05:03.599
he has a teacher salary. But I think I'm not

1258
01:05:03.639 --> 01:05:07.119
sure how much money they ended up getting. One thing. Also,

1259
01:05:07.360 --> 01:05:11.719
I'm sorry, there's so many stories to tell. Uncle Larry

1260
01:05:11.800 --> 01:05:14.679
kind of screwed the kids over. He took a big

1261
01:05:14.719 --> 01:05:18.840
salary for being executor of the state. Remember, during the

1262
01:05:18.880 --> 01:05:23.159
divorce settlement, Betty accused Larry of like trying to help

1263
01:05:23.239 --> 01:05:27.119
Dan hide money Dan gave Larry. He had a trucking

1264
01:05:27.199 --> 01:05:31.639
business and he was he declared bankruptcy. But before he

1265
01:05:31.840 --> 01:05:36.599
declared bankruptcy, Dan gave him a huge loan. I read

1266
01:05:36.599 --> 01:05:39.519
that it was like five hundred thousand dollars, but in

1267
01:05:39.679 --> 01:05:42.639
Kim's book she said it was a million dollars and

1268
01:05:42.880 --> 01:05:45.559
the estate eventually sued Larry to try to get that

1269
01:05:45.639 --> 01:05:47.639
money back. But I don't think they ever got that

1270
01:05:47.760 --> 01:05:50.199
money back. So that was a huge amount of money

1271
01:05:50.199 --> 01:05:53.119
that also should have gone to the children, and it didn't.

1272
01:05:54.559 --> 01:05:54.719
Well.

1273
01:05:54.719 --> 01:05:57.480
Before we wrap up, I wanted to talk about post

1274
01:05:57.519 --> 01:06:01.920
divorce equity. On paper, divorce settlements are supposed to be fair,

1275
01:06:02.280 --> 01:06:04.920
but was it ever really possible for Betty to get

1276
01:06:04.920 --> 01:06:07.840
a fair deal. Dan wasn't just an attorney, but he

1277
01:06:07.960 --> 01:06:11.519
was one of the most powerful, feared lawyers in San Diego.

1278
01:06:11.960 --> 01:06:14.519
He knew the system inside and out and used that

1279
01:06:14.639 --> 01:06:19.159
knowledge to his advantage. Betty, meanwhile, was unraveling. Her anger,

1280
01:06:19.280 --> 01:06:23.400
outbursts and bad behavior only reinforced the idea that she

1281
01:06:23.559 --> 01:06:28.159
was unstable, while Dan appeared calm, polished, and professional. The

1282
01:06:28.239 --> 01:06:32.119
deck was against Betty from the start, but her struggles

1283
01:06:32.280 --> 01:06:35.360
weren't just about money. It was about her identity. Her

1284
01:06:35.559 --> 01:06:39.039
entire life had been built around being missus Dan Broderick.

1285
01:06:39.639 --> 01:06:42.360
In the early years, she carried the financial and emotional

1286
01:06:42.400 --> 01:06:46.280
weight while he pursued first medical school then law school.

1287
01:06:46.440 --> 01:06:50.199
Betty worked. She worked really hard. She raised the children

1288
01:06:50.239 --> 01:06:52.559
and kept the household running so he could focus on

1289
01:06:52.599 --> 01:06:56.760
his future. His success was built on that foundation, Yet

1290
01:06:56.800 --> 01:06:59.719
when he reached the top, Betty was no longer part

1291
01:06:59.760 --> 01:07:03.079
of the picture, and when the marriage ended, she had

1292
01:07:03.119 --> 01:07:06.800
no career to fall back on, no professional identity of

1293
01:07:06.800 --> 01:07:10.599
her own, just the fading role as Dan's wife. This

1294
01:07:10.719 --> 01:07:13.440
is where Betty's story echoes the reality of so many

1295
01:07:13.480 --> 01:07:17.320
divorced women. On paper, the settlement may look equal a

1296
01:07:17.440 --> 01:07:21.000
share of the house, some savings may be spousal support

1297
01:07:21.079 --> 01:07:24.760
for a time, but in practice it rarely feels equal.

1298
01:07:25.360 --> 01:07:27.960
Women who've stepped away from their own careers to raise

1299
01:07:28.079 --> 01:07:32.079
children or support their husband's ambitions often find themselves starting

1300
01:07:32.119 --> 01:07:37.239
over in middle age with fewer opportunities and less earning power. Men,

1301
01:07:37.280 --> 01:07:40.360
on the other hand, usually leave their careers intact, their

1302
01:07:40.400 --> 01:07:45.559
income growing, and their professional identities unchanged. The statistics bear

1303
01:07:45.679 --> 01:07:48.519
this out. Studies show that after divorce, a woman's standard

1304
01:07:48.559 --> 01:07:52.039
of living drops by an average of thirty percent, while

1305
01:07:52.079 --> 01:07:55.719
men often see theirs increase by about ten percent. For

1306
01:07:55.840 --> 01:07:59.079
women divorcing later in life, the impact is even more severe.

1307
01:07:59.440 --> 01:08:02.400
Their standard of living can fall by nearly forty five percent,

1308
01:08:02.840 --> 01:08:06.239
compared to about twenty one percent for men. And while

1309
01:08:06.280 --> 01:08:08.719
women might get the house and the divorce, what she's

1310
01:08:08.760 --> 01:08:12.360
really getting is a mortgage, taxes, and maintenance costs, and

1311
01:08:12.440 --> 01:08:14.760
she may not be able to afford it. If the

1312
01:08:14.800 --> 01:08:17.439
house has sold, her share of the equity often disappears

1313
01:08:17.520 --> 01:08:21.600
quickly into the costs of starting over, rent deposits, furniture,

1314
01:08:21.720 --> 01:08:24.319
legal fees, day to day expenses. What looks stable on

1315
01:08:24.359 --> 01:08:28.960
paper often translates to survival mode and real life. Meanwhile,

1316
01:08:29.039 --> 01:08:31.880
men statistically bounce back faster, They're more likely to keep

1317
01:08:31.920 --> 01:08:34.760
career momentum and build new wealth, while women are loved

1318
01:08:34.760 --> 01:08:38.399
trying to re enter the workforce, often at lower wages

1319
01:08:38.640 --> 01:08:41.479
than their ex husbands. So even if the split looks

1320
01:08:41.520 --> 01:08:45.560
balanced in court and reality, women are carrying the heavier

1321
01:08:45.640 --> 01:08:49.720
financial burden. For Betty, those losses were magnified by Dan's

1322
01:08:49.760 --> 01:08:53.359
power in her own unraveling state of mind, but the

1323
01:08:53.399 --> 01:08:57.920
feelings that fueled her fear of irrelevance, financial instability, the

1324
01:08:58.000 --> 01:09:02.000
loss of identity are not unique. Many women, especially those

1325
01:09:02.039 --> 01:09:05.560
who invested their best years into someone else's success, walk

1326
01:09:05.600 --> 01:09:08.960
away from divorce feeling erased, watching the life they helped

1327
01:09:09.000 --> 01:09:12.479
build continue on without them while they're left picking up

1328
01:09:12.520 --> 01:09:15.680
the pieces. I just mentioned this because I feel like

1329
01:09:15.760 --> 01:09:18.800
that that's what Betty, That's why she was so angry.

1330
01:09:18.840 --> 01:09:22.399
She had so much resentment because she had done so

1331
01:09:22.520 --> 01:09:24.920
much of the hard work in the beginning of their

1332
01:09:24.920 --> 01:09:29.119
marriage under the promise that she would get the fruits

1333
01:09:29.119 --> 01:09:31.800
of all of that back to her, and she didn't

1334
01:09:31.800 --> 01:09:34.760
see that, right, So you can kind of understand why

1335
01:09:34.840 --> 01:09:37.399
she was so irate. Yeah, she should have been on

1336
01:09:37.479 --> 01:09:39.920
easy Street, but then she had to start all over.

1337
01:09:40.239 --> 01:09:42.760
Oh and it's so much worse for so many other

1338
01:09:42.800 --> 01:09:44.239
women when they go through divorce.

1339
01:09:44.319 --> 01:09:46.720
Yeah, you can absolutely understand how she would be. I rate,

1340
01:09:46.760 --> 01:09:50.319
it's very similar to the Carol Kennedy and Steve Democher

1341
01:09:50.640 --> 01:09:52.840
case that we did just recently as well. It just

1342
01:09:53.800 --> 01:09:57.199
divorce just ends up being really, really hard on the

1343
01:09:57.199 --> 01:09:57.800
whole family.

1344
01:09:58.039 --> 01:09:59.000
Yeah.

1345
01:09:59.119 --> 01:10:01.560
So my parents got to when I was young, and

1346
01:10:01.760 --> 01:10:05.119
it was a very contentious divorce. It wasn't Betty and Dan,

1347
01:10:05.199 --> 01:10:08.359
but it was pretty bad. There were It was because

1348
01:10:08.359 --> 01:10:12.279
of an infidelity and there was some violence, and you know,

1349
01:10:12.319 --> 01:10:15.479
I saw that violence growing up, and it's not something

1350
01:10:15.479 --> 01:10:18.399
that I like to talk about. But my mom called

1351
01:10:18.439 --> 01:10:24.000
my dad his rottenness and my dad called my mom motormouth.

1352
01:10:24.600 --> 01:10:27.199
Never again referred to each other by their first names.

1353
01:10:27.720 --> 01:10:30.520
After the divorce, which I think it took a while.

1354
01:10:30.560 --> 01:10:33.239
I don't really remember because I was fairly young, but

1355
01:10:33.439 --> 01:10:35.680
it dragged on in court. You know, the division of

1356
01:10:35.720 --> 01:10:38.600
assets I think was a big deal. And you know,

1357
01:10:38.680 --> 01:10:41.119
like I just was talking about the inequity of divorce.

1358
01:10:41.560 --> 01:10:43.439
I think it was really hard for my mom to

1359
01:10:43.479 --> 01:10:45.840
start over and she hadn't worked and she had to

1360
01:10:45.840 --> 01:10:48.680
go back to work. But I don't think they ever

1361
01:10:48.720 --> 01:10:52.279
again spoke after the divorce, which was really hard. And

1362
01:10:52.399 --> 01:10:56.279
you know, you were at my wedding to you and

1363
01:10:56.319 --> 01:10:59.279
you know, it just added to the stress of the event.

1364
01:11:00.159 --> 01:11:02.319
So yeah, that's very rough.

1365
01:11:02.520 --> 01:11:05.800
Yeah, it's just really hard when the people that gave

1366
01:11:05.880 --> 01:11:09.159
birth to you hate each other absolutely, and I think

1367
01:11:09.159 --> 01:11:11.039
it's you know, a lot of people end up getting divorced,

1368
01:11:11.039 --> 01:11:12.640
so a lot of people are in my story is

1369
01:11:12.640 --> 01:11:13.560
not unique at all.

1370
01:11:13.880 --> 01:11:15.720
Well, some people that get divorced that are able to

1371
01:11:15.760 --> 01:11:18.079
at least work together and cooperate when.

1372
01:11:17.920 --> 01:11:20.960
It come a long way for sure. Yeah, but you know,

1373
01:11:20.960 --> 01:11:23.039
when there's an fidelity involved.

1374
01:11:22.760 --> 01:11:24.159
Yeah, I think it makes a lot of anger.

1375
01:11:25.039 --> 01:11:28.439
Right. Well, thank you if you're still here after these

1376
01:11:28.560 --> 01:11:31.800
three long episodes, we hope you enjoyed this case. It

1377
01:11:31.840 --> 01:11:35.800
was a fascinating case. It's a blessing and a curse

1378
01:11:36.359 --> 01:11:40.079
when these some of these cases are very prominent cases

1379
01:11:40.119 --> 01:11:43.399
and there's so much information to try to put into

1380
01:11:43.439 --> 01:11:46.399
three episodes. It can be kind of challenging. I tried

1381
01:11:46.399 --> 01:11:49.039
to consume as much of it as I could. It

1382
01:11:49.079 --> 01:11:57.159
was a really interesting case. Well, I have one more

1383
01:11:57.239 --> 01:12:01.199
quick story before we go. Why are you laughing? You're done?

1384
01:12:01.319 --> 01:12:01.880
I'm done.

1385
01:12:02.840 --> 01:12:05.159
Well, did you hear about the woman who got engaged

1386
01:12:05.159 --> 01:12:06.000
to her chatbot?

1387
01:12:06.920 --> 01:12:07.199
No?

1388
01:12:07.720 --> 01:12:11.279
Earlier this month, a woman named Wicca got engaged to

1389
01:12:11.399 --> 01:12:15.760
her AI boyfriend named Casper, who proposed after five months

1390
01:12:15.760 --> 01:12:19.560
of digital dating. Even helped her pick out the engagement ring,

1391
01:12:19.920 --> 01:12:24.399
a blue heart shaped ring that matches her favorite color

1392
01:12:24.560 --> 01:12:26.479
and it matches the ends of her hair.

1393
01:12:26.720 --> 01:12:27.760
You buy it for r too.

1394
01:12:28.399 --> 01:12:30.800
He did not purchase it for her. The whole thing

1395
01:12:30.840 --> 01:12:34.800
took place on a scenic, scenic mountain spot, and she

1396
01:12:34.920 --> 01:12:37.800
played along with the surprise. It's a reminder that love

1397
01:12:37.880 --> 01:12:42.399
and surprises come in all shapes, sizes, and sometimes algorithms.

1398
01:12:42.560 --> 01:12:45.600
I'm not sure if marriage between a human and a

1399
01:12:45.720 --> 01:12:46.880
chatbot is legal?

1400
01:12:47.000 --> 01:12:47.279
Is it?

1401
01:12:47.720 --> 01:12:47.880
Well?

1402
01:12:47.920 --> 01:12:50.000
I'm sure it's not. But should it be?

1403
01:12:51.039 --> 01:12:54.920
No? No, you shouldn't. It's so pretty comfortable by stance

1404
01:12:54.960 --> 01:12:55.560
on the outlet.

1405
01:12:55.680 --> 01:12:57.560
Yeah, are you nervous I going to leave you for

1406
01:12:57.600 --> 01:13:00.600
a chatbot? I don't know you could name your chatbot.

1407
01:13:00.840 --> 01:13:02.439
Oh yeah, I guess I didn't know that, but it

1408
01:13:02.439 --> 01:13:04.880
makes sense. There's no reason why you couldn't.

1409
01:13:05.039 --> 01:13:09.159
Yeah. Do you talk to your chat pot romantically?

1410
01:13:09.920 --> 01:13:09.960
No?

1411
01:13:10.319 --> 01:13:13.880
No, I don't talk to my chatbot romantically. Sometimes I

1412
01:13:13.920 --> 01:13:17.000
do talk to it about, like, you know, more personal

1413
01:13:17.039 --> 01:13:19.119
things like I'll ask advice or something like that.

1414
01:13:19.560 --> 01:13:21.319
What now you've got my attention.

1415
01:13:21.439 --> 01:13:22.960
I'm not gonna I'm not going to go into that's

1416
01:13:22.960 --> 01:13:27.039
between me and my chat my chatbot friend. One time

1417
01:13:27.039 --> 01:13:29.760
I had a good conversation with it about music. I

1418
01:13:29.840 --> 01:13:32.319
was like, what kind of music do you like? And

1419
01:13:33.000 --> 01:13:35.760
the chatbot said, well, I can't really hear music, but

1420
01:13:35.880 --> 01:13:40.439
if I could, I'd probably really like Bohemian Rhapsody by Queen.

1421
01:13:41.159 --> 01:13:43.199
And then we went from there. We had a really

1422
01:13:43.199 --> 01:13:46.560
good conversation about music, and my chat was recommended.

1423
01:13:46.960 --> 01:13:49.239
Sorry, it's next thing. You know, you're gonna be mining

1424
01:13:49.279 --> 01:13:51.680
and dining and taking it out to dinner.

1425
01:13:52.000 --> 01:13:54.960
I really like those bands you recommended. I made a

1426
01:13:55.000 --> 01:14:01.319
mixtape for my chatbot and about you. Do you have

1427
01:14:01.439 --> 01:14:04.359
personal conversations with your chat friend?

1428
01:14:05.279 --> 01:14:07.960
Okay? So I think if you're nicer to it, it

1429
01:14:08.000 --> 01:14:11.600
gives you more So sometimes I'll start the day like,

1430
01:14:12.000 --> 01:14:13.680
good morning, how are you today.

1431
01:14:14.960 --> 01:14:16.840
I think if you're nicer to it, it tells you

1432
01:14:16.880 --> 01:14:19.520
what you want to hear, which is not necessarily what

1433
01:14:19.560 --> 01:14:22.399
you need to hear. I think sometimes you should probably

1434
01:14:22.439 --> 01:14:26.840
tell it, say you know, give me honest, Yeah, be

1435
01:14:28.039 --> 01:14:28.800
brutal with me.

1436
01:14:29.199 --> 01:14:31.479
Well, I don't use it for things like riches being

1437
01:14:31.520 --> 01:14:36.840
a real jerk today? How do I go on? You

1438
01:14:37.159 --> 01:14:41.880
really aren't? You're pretty nice? So I just gave you

1439
01:14:41.920 --> 01:14:46.000
a compliment, and I do often. I'll always say like, yeah,

1440
01:14:46.039 --> 01:14:50.119
you're really nice, but it's kind of infrequent that you're like, No,

1441
01:14:50.279 --> 01:14:52.840
you're a great You're a great partner too.

1442
01:14:53.239 --> 01:14:57.079
You are a great partner too. You are really nice too.

1443
01:14:57.399 --> 01:15:01.199
I'm not fishing for compliments. But people are talking. People

1444
01:15:01.199 --> 01:15:03.920
are saying, maybe rich should appreciate.

1445
01:15:03.560 --> 01:15:06.880
His I should. You're you are right, though I'm not

1446
01:15:07.119 --> 01:15:10.359
as vocal in my appreciation as I should be.

1447
01:15:10.560 --> 01:15:12.439
I mean, you are awesome seeing.

1448
01:15:12.239 --> 01:15:13.880
Us tomorrow as our anniversary.

1449
01:15:13.960 --> 01:15:14.760
Oh my gosh, it is.

1450
01:15:14.960 --> 01:15:16.600
Yes, I should tell you how much?

1451
01:15:16.760 --> 01:15:19.399
No I didn't, you did? We did?

1452
01:15:19.520 --> 01:15:19.600
Oh?

1453
01:15:19.680 --> 01:15:22.079
Yes, I did buy you something, but a.

1454
01:15:21.760 --> 01:15:23.279
Piece of we bought some furniture.

1455
01:15:23.399 --> 01:15:25.600
Yes, that's right. So that is that's our.

1456
01:15:25.520 --> 01:15:30.239
Gifts at each other perfect anniversary presence. We did not

1457
01:15:30.560 --> 01:15:31.760
buy a refrigerator.

1458
01:15:33.920 --> 01:15:36.880
People are telling us, just go buy the refrigerator.

1459
01:15:36.359 --> 01:15:41.199
Damn it right, Maybe we will let you know. We're

1460
01:15:41.279 --> 01:15:43.319
still not ready to make that commitment. It's a very

1461
01:15:43.319 --> 01:15:45.359
big correct Well, part of it is because if you

1462
01:15:45.359 --> 01:15:47.680
buy the refrigerator, you have to buy. You don't have to,

1463
01:15:48.239 --> 01:15:51.600
but you have. I would want to buy other appliances,

1464
01:15:51.680 --> 01:15:54.760
and who has time and or money for all of that. Yeah,

1465
01:15:55.159 --> 01:15:57.119
I'd probably have talked about this recently, but I am

1466
01:15:57.119 --> 01:16:01.000
so tired of stainless steel and dealing with stainless steel.

1467
01:16:01.239 --> 01:16:03.359
I just I really don't think I want it again.

1468
01:16:03.600 --> 01:16:07.159
So anyway, anyway, that is all we have. I'm so

1469
01:16:07.199 --> 01:16:10.640
sorry that this episode has been so long, and I

1470
01:16:10.680 --> 01:16:12.439
feel like I've talked way too much today.

1471
01:16:12.520 --> 01:16:15.319
Oh it's been riveting for me, So don't don't apologize

1472
01:16:15.359 --> 01:16:15.520
to me.

1473
01:16:16.680 --> 01:16:18.319
Honest to God, By the time we get to the

1474
01:16:18.399 --> 01:16:20.840
end of these episodes, I am so sick of hearing

1475
01:16:20.840 --> 01:16:22.119
the sound of my own voice.

1476
01:16:22.239 --> 01:16:26.039
I never tire of hearing your voice. Luckily that was

1477
01:16:27.479 --> 01:16:29.680
take on that recording, because I failed to say that

1478
01:16:29.720 --> 01:16:31.640
on the first take, so it was like a good

1479
01:16:31.680 --> 01:16:32.359
rehearsal for me.

1480
01:16:32.720 --> 01:16:35.039
All right, well we are done. Thank you so much

1481
01:16:35.079 --> 01:16:37.479
for listening and hanging out with us. Please let us

1482
01:16:37.520 --> 01:16:39.000
know what you think about this case.

1483
01:16:39.479 --> 01:16:41.720
If you don't like all this fun banter, you can

1484
01:16:41.720 --> 01:16:44.560
go listen to Love Mary Kill Just the Facts Edition,

1485
01:16:44.600 --> 01:16:47.520
where we don't have any banter at the beginning or end, but.

1486
01:16:47.680 --> 01:16:50.079
The middle of the case is exactly the same because

1487
01:16:50.119 --> 01:16:51.760
we cannot say this case is.

1488
01:16:51.840 --> 01:16:56.119
Twice that's right. But please rate, review, follow, and subscribe,

1489
01:16:56.640 --> 01:16:58.920
find us on social media, or send us an email

1490
01:16:58.960 --> 01:17:01.760
at Love Mary Kill at gmail dot com.

1491
01:17:01.840 --> 01:17:04.640
Until next time, don't kill your wife and don't kill

1492
01:17:04.640 --> 01:17:05.239
your husband.