Nov. 11, 2024

Brynn and Phil Hartman

Brynn and Phil Hartman
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Phil Hartman, beloved comedian and actor, known for his roles on Saturday Night Live, The Simpsons, and films like Jingle All the Way, had a career full of laughter, creativity, and success. But behind the scenes, his personal life was far more complicated and troubled. His wife, Brynn Hartman, was a woman struggling with addiction, emotional turmoil, and a deeply troubled relationship.In the early morning hours of May 28th, 1998, their lives would come to a devastating and violent end, leaving the world stunned and questioning how it all unraveled. In this episode, we’ll explore the rise of Phil Hartman, the dark secrets of his marriage to Brynn, and the tragic events that led to one of the most senseless and devastating deaths in Hollywood history.

Today's snack: Great Lakes Potato Chip Co. Purple Potato Chips with Sea Salt

Research and script by Owen Wesorick

Support us on Patreon

Clips and sources:

WEBVTT

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Hi, I'm Tina, and I'm rich. And if there's one

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thing we've learned in over twenty years of marriage.

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It's that some days you'll feel like killing your wife.

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And some days you'll feel like killing your husband.

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Welcome to love, Mary Kill.

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All right, boys, stop in here for a second. I'm

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a little parked from the jog. Oh sir, we've only

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been jogging for three blocks.

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Besides, Missus Clint asked us not to let you into

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any more fast food places.

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Well, I just want to mingle with the American people,

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talk with some real folks. Maybe get a diet coke

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or something.

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Fine, but please don't tell missus Clinton.

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Jim, let me tell you something. There's gonna be a

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whole bunch of things we don't tell Missus Clinton. Fast

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food is the least of our worries. Okay, buddy clean?

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Oh my god?

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Hey, hey, how you know? Nice to meet you.

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How are you?

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Oh?

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That's an adorable day.

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What's your name?

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Swatheart?

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Her name is Shakira.

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Shakira.

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That means African princess, doesn't it.

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Why?

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Yes, well, she certainly is beautiful enough to be a princess.

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So you're gonna finish these fries.

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No, well, if you're not gonna hate him, those are good.

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What's your care?

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You take good care of your mom.

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That was the late great Phil Hartman on one of

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his many sketches from Saturday Night Live.

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That's a classic one. I love it.

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Growing up, I was a big fan of pop culture

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and Saturday Night Live. It's a huge part of that.

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Yeah, same for me. I mean, I loved Saturday Night

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Live and I'm old enough to have been around, like

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in the very early years of Saturday Night Live.

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Too crazy that it's the fiftieth year of Saturday Night Live.

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Yeah, it really is.

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We'll talk about it a little bit more at the

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end about Saturday Night Live and you know the impact

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it had on us growing up. But this is an

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episode that I've been wanting to do for a long time.

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So thank you to me for recommending this episode.

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I'm excited about it too, because you know, like we

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all know who Phil Hartman is, but I don't really

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know much about him or his story really. I mean,

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obviously I know what happened to him, but I don't

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really know his background. I don't really know a lot

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about him other than he seemed like such a.

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Great guy, I and he was. And I hope everyone

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enjoys this episode because we are going to talk a

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lot about Phil's background and how he became a comedian.

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But before we get into that, I brought you a snack.

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Oh goodie.

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So Phil was from Canada, and as you know earlier,

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I tried to make Median snack Nanaimo bars n A

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n A. I m oh, if you're a Canadian, you

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know you know them and you love them. I think

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we might have possibly made them. We did okay, but

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I wanted to make them again because they're awesome. They're

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deliciously but it was one of the worst baking disasters

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of my life. I'm not sure what happened, but when

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I went to cut into them, all the cream filling

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oozed out. It's kind of like a browdie layer and

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then there's this cream filling and then you top it

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with like chocolate and the.

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Cream filling it's supposed to be pretty thick and like that.

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I think that might have been one of the things

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that I did wrong, is I made one and a

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half times the filling because there's super filling in my opinion,

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and I don't think there was enough confection or sugar

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in it, so it just oozed all over the place.

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So I did. I do have a backup snack that

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isn't nearly as exciting that I brought you some of

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my favorite potato chips. They're a limited addition. You can

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only get them this time of year. I'm not kidding,

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I know, I believe from the Great Lakes Potato Chip Company.

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They're made in Traverse City, Michigan, kettle cooked purple potato

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chips with sea salt.

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I'm just laughing because I remember I came home the

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other day and there was two huge boxes in our garage.

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I need to know that it's one of these huge

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boxes doing in our garage.

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Well, I really, they're really great and they sell out

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really quickly. And I thought I was buying like the

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single syrup, but no, I was buying the.

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Two giant crates.

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Well there's one left, so but they're great and our

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costco sells them. I haven't seen them yet, but if

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you see them at your costco, definitely give them a try.

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Or you can order them from the Great Lakes Potato

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Chip Company like I did. And then I brought you

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some red grapes. But they look really purple, so we're

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having it's a tribute to Mariah Carey, who sometimes only

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eats purple food What you never heard that?

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I did not know that.

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No, yeah, I don't think she usually eats potato chips.

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I think it's like plums and actually.

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Enjoy purple foods. So I'll look forward to this then, okay,

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all right, we'll be right back.

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You just did a whole little comedy routine there, like

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eating your chip and crunching your chip, and to get

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like ten minutes to eat that snack.

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Well, I was going to enjoy it. It was really

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good and I'm actually pretty hungry, so oh are you? Yeah?

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Those are really good. Though, I do like those a lot.

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I don't think I like them quite as much as

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you do.

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But I think you like them anywhere because you in

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order to box.

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I love that they're very like salty and the they're

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really unique. Yeah, they're really good. I like them.

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I wish I could send you all a box. I

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feel really bad, but most people probably won't be able

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to get them. But yeah, they're interesting. What do you

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rate them out of time?

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I'm going to give them a ton out of ten.

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Really, that surprises me. Rich really loves a laze potato chip.

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You like them, kind of a.

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Classic laze kind of guy. But these are.

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They're kind of a in between.

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Yeah.

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I like thicker tip.

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They're a little bit thicker, but they're not super thick.

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And what about the grapes.

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I don't know, they're they're grapes. They're good eat out

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of time.

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I promise we eat healthy and we exercise, right, right, right,

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it's not all just about snacks, solid time.

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Grapes are very healthy. Before we start talking about Phil Hartman,

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I did want to mention that we are working on

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some merch and we've had a lot of people ask

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us about merch and we are working on it. We'll

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talk about it at the end. We don't have the

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shop quite ready yet, but it should be in a

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couple of weeks, within a week or two. Yeah.

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And it's a cute design. It's not the one that

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we did last year was just our logo. This one

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is a little cuter.

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Yeah, I think you'll like it.

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In nineteen ninety eight, Phil Hartman had everything a person

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could want. His career was flourishing. He was a regular

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cast member on successful television programs, News Radio and The Simpsons,

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and his career as a movie star was taking off.

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He had just started and Jingle All the Way with

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Arnold Schwarzenegger and had another film in the Pipeline, Joe

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Dante's animated Small Soldiers. His success had made him wealthy

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beyond his wildest dreams. He was making fifty thousand dollars

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per episode of News Radio in its fourth season, and

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frequently did lucrative voice work for commercials, which sometimes paid

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up to seven figures. He owned a spacious home in

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the San Fernando Valley, an extensive collection of luxury cars, sailboats,

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a Harley Davidson, and even a plane. He had two children,

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who by all accounts, he absolutely adored, and he was

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married to a beautiful ex model, Brynn. But of course,

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there is always more going on behind the scenes. In

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May of nineteen ninety eight, Phil's life would come to

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an unexpected and shockingly violent end, which left Hollywood and

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the world stunned and devastated at the loss of such

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a great talent. Ron Douglas was a stunt coordinator and

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a family friend of Phil and Bryn Hartman. Brynn was

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especially close to Ron, who she affected actionally nicknamed Ronald McDonald,

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Ron was briefly a romantic partner of hers, though by

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all accounts their relationship was now completely platonic. On the

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evening of May twenty seventh, nineteen ninety eight, Bynn bring

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up Ron looking to hang out. She agreed to meet

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him at his place in Studio City, just north of Hollywood.

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Brenn arrived at ten fifteen pm and stayed for two

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and a half hours. It was mostly an unremarkable night.

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Brenn told Ron about a screenplay she was working on.

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They played around on Ron's piano, and Ron listened as

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Brynn complained about some of her husband's last attractive qualities.

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According to her, he was always out sailing with his

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good friend Britt marn Or smoking weed in his office.

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Over the course of these two and a half hours,

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Brenn drank three beers.

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Now you said that Brynn had a romantic relationship with

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Ron at some point. Was that before she was married

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to Phil Or did she have an affair with him

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after she was married.

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I believe it was prior to her marriage.

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Ok.

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When Bryn got into her car at twelve forty five,

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a m. Ron told her to call when she got home.

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Brynn didn't call within the next hour, but Ron was

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a laid back guy and wasn't particularly concerned. She probably

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just forgot and fell asleep, he thought, and went to bed,

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but he didn't get to sleep for very long. He

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was jarred awake by the phone ringing, ringing at the

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entirely unreasonable hour of three twenty five a m. It

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was Brynn sounding off again about her husband. Phil isn't home.

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She said. He left a note, I'm going out for

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the night. I'll be back Phil, Love you. Brynn wanted

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to come back to Ron's place. She insisted she didn't

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want to be alone. Ron, well aware of the fact

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that Bryn was responsible for the well being of her

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two children, told her not to leave her home. It

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was too late and they needed somebody in the house

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with them. He hung up and tried to get back

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to sleep, but he would not be sleeping any more

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that night. Twenty minutes later, Ron's door bell rang over

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and over or somebody was pounding on his front door

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as if they were trying to break it down. When

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he answered his door, equal parts annoyed and confused, he

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found Brynn in her pajamas, barefoot and obviously inebriated. Before

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he could get a word in, Bren exclaimed, don't yell

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at me. Phil yells at me all the time. Ron

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ushered Bryn inside, where she collapsed onto the floor crying.

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She screamed nonsense, or at least ron thought it had

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to be nonsense, because what she said couldn't be real.

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She said that she had just killed her husband. She

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said that she had just killed Phil Hartman. Philip Edward

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Hartman with two ends was born in Brantford, Ontario, a

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Canadian city just outside of Toronto, on September twenty fourth,

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nineteen forty eight. His parents, Doris, a beautician and artist,

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and Rupert, a delivery driver and salesman, were very traditional

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and very Catholic. Phil certainly loved his parents and continued

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to love them through his entire life, but he had

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a complicated relationship with them, and he found affection especially

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difficult to come by in his childhood, likely in part

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because his parents had eight children to raise. Phil or Fippy,

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as his family called him, was the fourth born. He

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weighed only five pounds at birth. They were a wild

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bunch and always found ways to entertain each other. Phil's

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sister described him as a scamp growing up. Once his

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older brother shot him in the eye with a red

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Rider BB gun, but lucky for Phil, his eye wasn't shot.

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Out red gun.

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Among the eight Hartman children was Sarah, who had angel

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Man syndrome, a rare genetic disorder marked by delayed development,

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intellectual disability, problems with motor skills and balance, frequent seizures,

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and a severe speech impediment, along with hyperactivity and frequent

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nonspecific smiling and laughter. Sarah's care demanded a disproportionate amount

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of time from her parents, who were ill equipped to

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deal with such a situation. Phil vied for his exhausted

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mother's attention, but she didn't have much to offer him.

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Doris suffered a mental breakdown after five years of caring

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for Sarah. She was later placed in a facility that

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could better meet her needs. Phil reportedly felt a lot

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of guilt about Sarah and thought he was responsible for

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her condition. When Phil was ten, his family emigrated from

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Canada to the United States. They first settled in Maine,

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living in a small cottage without running water or electricity.

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Then they moved to Connecticut, before eventually heading to Anaheim, California.

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Rupert got a job working as a salesman for Whirlpool.

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The Hartman's lived within walking distance of Disneyland. Back then,

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entry was cheap and often free, so Phil would take

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his younger brother Paul regularly, which likely inspired Phil's art.

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Even as a child, he was a talented artist. He

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could draw anything. A school friend said.

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That would be so fun to live right next to Disneyland.

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Yeah.

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Phil attended Westchester High School in Los Angeles and quickly

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embraced the California beach bum lifestyle. He took up surfing,

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smoking cigarettes, and other substances. After school, Phil and his

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friends raced to the beach. He said quote surfers always

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looked down on jocks because they were stupid enough to

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stay after school while we were at the beach. He

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also dabbled in theater, playing the role of Lil Abner.

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Phil was voted class clown in the yearbook due to

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his talent and impersonation. He often entertained his friends with

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impressions of well known pop culture figures like JFK. Lyndon Johnson,

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Jonathan Winners, Bob Newhart, and John Wayne. This talent would

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prove to be quite profitable for him. Later in life.

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Phil listened to comedy albums in his bedroom at night

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and absorbed the performer's cadence and timing, honing his own

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sense of humor until it became second nature. Phil's friend

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Ettore Barrardinelli said quote, he could have gone out with anybody,

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and he was a good looking guy, but it was

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his personality. He was mister personality, and he was entertaining.

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He could hold court any time he wanted. People were

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drawn to him. Phil kind of hung out with the

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people that were going places. I don't know if i'd

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call them ambitious. They were just people who kind of

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had their act together, and they dressed nicer, you know.

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But Phil could transcend any group unquote. Another friend of Phil's,

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Wink Roberts, said quote, he could never walk into a

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room and be happy if he couldn't make people laugh. Unquote.

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I am changing our son's name to Wink Wink.

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That's a good name.

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Good name.

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Even in high school, Phil fell in love quickly, but

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his romances were fleeting, and his love interests often felt

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as if he was always in performance mode. They were

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left feeling that they never truly got to know Phil.

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In reality, Phil was darker and more introspective than the

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persona he showed to the world, but he rarely allowed

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his mask to slip. He enjoyed the chase and falling

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in love more than he liked being in a monogamous relationship.

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He was known to have a wandering eye when he

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was in a committed relationship. Phil and his good friend

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Kathy tried dating. She got to know him better than most,

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she said, quote. Phil always liked getting outside of himself.

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He'd always get into a role and I'd lose the

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Phil that I knew. That was always very interesting for

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me because I knew him at a different level where

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we talked and talked and talked. I kind of knew

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his heart and knew who he was, which I don't

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think a lot of people did. He would tell me

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whatever he was thinking, his insecurities, his fears, his ambitions.

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He was deep and he was very serious unquote. Upon

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graduating high school in nineteen sixty six, Phil enrolled as

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an art student at Santa Monica City College. Phil's real dream, however,

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was to break into the entertainment industry. In nineteen ninety one,

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he said quote. As a senior in high school, I

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made the conscious choice to become an art major instead

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of pursuing acting. It was largely because my brother John

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had attempted to be an act and I was exposed

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to the slimy underbelly of Hollywood life. It was important

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to me to make a living because I wanted independence.

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I didn't want to get into a career that involved

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a lot of effort for no return period. After four

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semesters in art school, Phil found himself drawn to other

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careers and lifestyles. He was, after all, a hippie baby boomer,

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and it was nineteen sixty nine. Why on earth would

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he spend his time at school when he could instead

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spend months living in the mountains doing nothing but skiing.

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And so that's what he did. And once he finished

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with that, he took a gig as a roadie for

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a psychedelic rock band that his brother, John Hartman managed.

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The band called themselves the Rock and Foo. Phil enjoyed

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the rock and roll lifestyle. In a letter to a friend,

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Phil bragged quote, I bawl the playboy bunny. I won't

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give you the details in the mail, but pal, it

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was beyond your imagination. Unquote. Phil was still in his

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surfboy era. He and John rented a cottage in Malibu

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on the beach back then Malibu was still affordable. Phil

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made an unlikely friend in neighbor Larry Hagman from I

334
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Dream of Genie and Dallas Fame. Phil and Larry would

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sit in his hot tub, smoke pot and ponder life.

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An important thing to know about Phil was that despite

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living a rock and roll or celebrity lifestyle, often surrounded

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by drugs, he was very measured and disciplined. Throughout his life.

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People around him would snort coke or drop acid, but

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Phil would stick to weed, which just made him more

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laid back and affable.

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In nineteen seventy, Phil married Gretchen Lewis. He was twenty

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one and she was twenty. It'd only known each other

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for about a year. Gretchen worked at an upscale clothing

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boutique and lived with her father, An, a fluent dentist,

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before moving in with Phil. They lived a simple life

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but struggle to support themselves. Gretchen gently encouraged Phil to

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broaden his horizons and do more than be a weed smoking,

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rody surfer. She is likely the reason that Phil enrolled

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in college, this time at California State University at Northridge. Again,

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he studied graphic design, but dropped out by spring. Gretchen

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said quote, he wanted to be a comedian. It was

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his passion. We had a lot of friends because he

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was so funny. People wanted to be around him, and

355
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they always wanted him to perform. There was no question

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that Gretchen and Phil loved each other, but the way

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they expressed their love differed drastically. Gretchen increasingly thought that

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Phil was too emotionally removed and found herself attracted to

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other men. She had had two abortions during their relationship,

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and that might have played a part in their disintegrating marriage.

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They am a Cley divorced in March nineteen seventy two.

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They both agreed that they were too young and too

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poor to make marriage work, but they remained friends for

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00:18:47.359 --> 00:18:50.519
the remainder of Phil's life. Phil went on to become

365
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a prolific and successful graphic designer, working as the in

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house album artist for his brother John's music management company

367
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H and G short for Hartman and Goodman. Phil designed

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an album cover for the rock and Fu now good

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00:19:03.720 --> 00:19:06.480
friends of his but also worked on album covers for

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much larger, high profile clients, including Crosby, Stills and Nash, Poco,

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00:19:12.119 --> 00:19:16.640
and Steely Dan. Ultimately, he designed over forty album covers,

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00:19:17.000 --> 00:19:20.680
as well as the familiar Crosby, Stills Nash interwoven logo.

373
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I had no idea of about that amazing. That really

374
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is wild. I had no idea.

375
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Phil told the Las Vegas Son in nineteen ninety eight

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that Rusty Young wanted him to draw a horse for

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the cover. Quote. I think my most famous was Poco's legend.

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I drew the image maybe twenty times until I came

379
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up with a cover that I'm very proud of. Are

380
00:19:40.200 --> 00:19:41.079
you familiar with that cover?

381
00:19:41.920 --> 00:19:43.160
Not off the top of my head? Now, I'll have

382
00:19:43.240 --> 00:19:43.720
to look it up.

383
00:19:44.039 --> 00:19:45.640
And we took a little break so I could show

384
00:19:45.640 --> 00:19:47.279
you some of those album covers. What do you think?

385
00:19:47.440 --> 00:19:50.359
I mean, it's really amazing, like very cool, like very

386
00:19:51.480 --> 00:19:53.640
today like graphic design. A lot of it is, like

387
00:19:54.039 --> 00:19:56.200
you know, cutting and pasting designs, but it was very

388
00:19:56.279 --> 00:20:01.119
much illustrations that he obviously drew, and very int and elaborate.

389
00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:03.799
When you're a big album cover art guy, so you

390
00:20:03.960 --> 00:20:05.440
kind of, yeah, very.

391
00:20:05.440 --> 00:20:07.559
Talented Yeah, that's really cool. I had no idea.

392
00:20:08.240 --> 00:20:11.359
The job paid relatively well. Phil was able to buy

393
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a little house in Sherman Oaks. His work at H

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00:20:14.240 --> 00:20:17.160
and G allowed Phil to express himself artistically, but it

395
00:20:17.240 --> 00:20:22.680
was also deadline dependent, lonely, and required long hours. Extroverted,

396
00:20:22.720 --> 00:20:26.319
Phil Hartman needed a way to cut loose. In nineteen

397
00:20:26.400 --> 00:20:28.839
seventy five, Phil went to a friend's birthday party at

398
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a small theater in West Hollywood to see The Groundlings,

399
00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:36.200
the legendary Los Angeles based improv sketch comedy group founded

400
00:20:36.559 --> 00:20:40.359
in nineteen seventy two. Before the show even started, laughter

401
00:20:40.440 --> 00:20:43.119
could be heard coming from the audience. Members of the

402
00:20:43.160 --> 00:20:45.480
ground Links peaked through the stage curtain and saw an

403
00:20:45.519 --> 00:20:49.640
audience member on stage cracking jokes and doing impressions. He

404
00:20:49.880 --> 00:20:53.279
had everyone in stitches. The man, of course, was Phil Hartman.

405
00:20:53.640 --> 00:20:54.480
That's really funny.

406
00:20:55.119 --> 00:20:58.279
Later Phil auditioned for and was accepted into the ground Links,

407
00:20:58.440 --> 00:21:00.759
but it would be a year until he got to perform.

408
00:21:01.319 --> 00:21:04.480
Competition was steep, and there were over ninety members.

409
00:21:04.680 --> 00:21:05.599
Steep members wow.

410
00:21:06.319 --> 00:21:09.480
In nineteen ninety five, Phil told CNN quote, I was

411
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working twelve hours a day at a drawing board all

412
00:21:11.920 --> 00:21:14.480
by myself, and I was going Nutso I just started

413
00:21:14.519 --> 00:21:17.160
getting up on stage and talking, and I loved it.

414
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I did it for ten years just for the fun

415
00:21:19.720 --> 00:21:23.119
of it. Phil used the Groundlings to workshop new voices

416
00:21:23.160 --> 00:21:26.000
and characters. He found it therapeutic to work through some

417
00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:28.839
of the anger and resentment he carried from his childhood.

418
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In nineteen ninety one, Phil told Stanley Moss in an

419
00:21:32.559 --> 00:21:35.519
interview in The Paris Review, quote, I noticed in the

420
00:21:35.599 --> 00:21:38.039
beginning that a lot of my characters had a tremendous

421
00:21:38.039 --> 00:21:41.720
amount of rage. I had never had any therapeutic experience,

422
00:21:42.200 --> 00:21:44.359
but it was all welling up and coming out of

423
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:46.839
me because I was in an environment where it was

424
00:21:46.920 --> 00:21:50.000
okay to do that. There's something about rage. We all

425
00:21:50.119 --> 00:21:51.920
have it, but too many of us don't have a

426
00:21:52.000 --> 00:21:56.119
healthful way to express it. Former Groundlings are a who's

427
00:21:56.119 --> 00:21:59.440
who of Hollywood elite and Saturday Night Live royalty, including

428
00:22:00.000 --> 00:22:03.799
Old Farrell, John Lovetz, Christen Wigg, Jimmy Fallon, Lisa Kudro,

429
00:22:03.960 --> 00:22:08.599
Mindy Keeling, Maya Rudolph, Melissa McCarthy, and Conan O'Brien. There

430
00:22:08.640 --> 00:22:12.359
were a few former Groundlings who may surprise you, Tyra Banks,

431
00:22:13.200 --> 00:22:17.119
JJ Abrams and Marishka Hargatea that is a little surprising.

432
00:22:17.400 --> 00:22:20.079
Phil Hartman was a natural fit and quickly became a

433
00:22:20.200 --> 00:22:23.799
leader in the group. Saturday Night Live creator Lauren Michaels

434
00:22:23.960 --> 00:22:26.960
was known to attend Groundling shows searching for bright, young talent.

435
00:22:27.640 --> 00:22:30.680
When he attended a show during Phil's tenure, Lauren tapped

436
00:22:30.839 --> 00:22:33.640
John Lovitz to come to New York to audition for SNL.

437
00:22:34.039 --> 00:22:38.440
Not philled. To everyone's surprise, even John's. The Groundlings led

438
00:22:38.480 --> 00:22:41.799
to bit parts and commercials, voice over work, and television

439
00:22:41.839 --> 00:22:44.799
shows for Phil over the next several years, but his

440
00:22:44.960 --> 00:22:48.559
first ever television appearance was in the late nineteen seventies

441
00:22:48.960 --> 00:22:52.240
on the dating game That's Number three.

442
00:22:53.240 --> 00:22:56.440
Has actually designed the covers for over twenty five best

443
00:22:56.480 --> 00:22:59.440
selling record albums. He has appeared on over one hundred

444
00:22:59.519 --> 00:23:02.599
radio cammercials, and they say he makes the best avocado

445
00:23:02.680 --> 00:23:06.960
sandwich in the world. Please welcome Phillip Hartman, Well.

446
00:23:08.359 --> 00:23:09.319
Bachelor number three.

447
00:23:09.759 --> 00:23:11.599
What road signs should I heed while dating you?

448
00:23:11.680 --> 00:23:14.000
And why slippery when wet?

449
00:23:18.400 --> 00:23:18.440
No?

450
00:23:18.599 --> 00:23:21.119
No, no, they'd got the wrong idea. I like to swim?

451
00:23:21.319 --> 00:23:23.519
And sometimes are you real athletic?

452
00:23:24.000 --> 00:23:24.680
Very athletic?

453
00:23:25.720 --> 00:23:28.640
So you're real versatile yes and filt something like a

454
00:23:28.720 --> 00:23:29.240
Greek god.

455
00:23:30.200 --> 00:23:34.119
What's your number again? Bachelor number three? That's three boy,

456
00:23:36.039 --> 00:23:39.720
so funny looking up this clip, there were a lot

457
00:23:39.799 --> 00:23:42.640
of different celebrities that had appeared on the Dating Game

458
00:23:42.680 --> 00:23:46.720
over the years, like Steve Martin and George Foreman. Just

459
00:23:46.799 --> 00:23:50.480
a it's so you had a little entertainment. Just go

460
00:23:50.599 --> 00:23:53.039
to YouTube and look them up because it's it's pretty funny.

461
00:23:53.160 --> 00:23:55.720
And Steve Martin was actually pretty hot when he was

462
00:23:55.799 --> 00:23:59.880
really Yeah. Phil won the bachelorette's heart, but she later

463
00:24:00.160 --> 00:24:04.279
stood him up. While with the Groundlings, Phil met two

464
00:24:04.400 --> 00:24:07.240
friends who would help shape his career, John Lovett's and

465
00:24:07.319 --> 00:24:09.599
Paul Rubins, who you may know is pee Wee Herman.

466
00:24:10.519 --> 00:24:13.400
Paul developed his pee Wee character alongside Phil, and the

467
00:24:13.480 --> 00:24:16.839
two staged a weekly midnight show at the Roxy Theater

468
00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:20.359
called The Pee Wee Herman Show. It became a huge hit,

469
00:24:20.559 --> 00:24:23.960
ticket sold out every night. Phil played Captain Carl in

470
00:24:24.039 --> 00:24:27.319
the show. The role is ultimately what propelled him to fame.

471
00:24:28.559 --> 00:24:31.200
Oh Peewee, did you want to think of all the

472
00:24:31.319 --> 00:24:32.799
things that are wrong with women?

473
00:24:34.160 --> 00:24:34.200
What?

474
00:24:35.720 --> 00:24:41.279
While I live on land for one thing, and they're

475
00:24:41.319 --> 00:24:43.400
all soft jellyfish.

476
00:24:43.720 --> 00:24:45.359
Yeah, just like a jelly bitchok.

477
00:24:45.559 --> 00:24:47.599
And what are women like more than anything else in

478
00:24:47.680 --> 00:24:48.119
the world?

479
00:24:49.079 --> 00:24:49.920
Charge accounts.

480
00:24:52.480 --> 00:24:55.640
I was thinking of flowers. They even smell like flowers.

481
00:24:55.759 --> 00:24:59.119
Flowers going land too, That's right.

482
00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:02.799
I never thought women love women.

483
00:25:03.039 --> 00:25:08.039
Women women dame same women, women.

484
00:25:12.720 --> 00:25:16.160
That's funny. Some Groundings members accused Phil of becoming less

485
00:25:16.240 --> 00:25:18.440
of a team player and more competitive as the years

486
00:25:18.480 --> 00:25:21.960
went on. But it was a very competitive environment and

487
00:25:22.119 --> 00:25:24.839
there were a lot of talented people vying for precious

488
00:25:24.880 --> 00:25:25.400
stage time.

489
00:25:25.559 --> 00:25:28.880
I'm sure that's very typical for a comedy group like that.

490
00:25:29.200 --> 00:25:31.200
It is, and you really had to fight to get

491
00:25:31.240 --> 00:25:35.160
your material on stage. Phil was talented at playing a

492
00:25:35.200 --> 00:25:37.920
smorgas board of characters, but some people thought he was

493
00:25:38.039 --> 00:25:40.440
limited in his range, and while he was talented at

494
00:25:40.440 --> 00:25:44.440
sketch comedy, he lacked a unique or interesting perspective that

495
00:25:45.240 --> 00:25:49.400
might manifest to leading man roles. Most use the Groundlings

496
00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:52.240
as a springboard to be discovered by Saturday Night Live

497
00:25:52.400 --> 00:25:55.359
or Hollywood producers. There was no money in the Groundlings,

498
00:25:55.440 --> 00:25:58.359
but Phil stayed because he really wanted to make it

499
00:25:58.400 --> 00:26:01.400
big and thought it was the best shot at getting noticed.

500
00:26:02.000 --> 00:26:04.759
After several years with the True PBN teaching classes there.

501
00:26:05.200 --> 00:26:08.759
One of his students was future SNL castmate Julia Sweeney.

502
00:26:09.519 --> 00:26:12.240
She said quote, I was in love with him immediately.

503
00:26:12.759 --> 00:26:14.880
He was sort of like carry Grant to me. I

504
00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:17.119
think every girl was in love with him, and every

505
00:26:17.160 --> 00:26:20.000
guy was in awe of him and wished that they

506
00:26:20.039 --> 00:26:20.880
could be his friend.

507
00:26:22.079 --> 00:26:25.200
While he was in the Groundlings, Phil had a spiritual awakening.

508
00:26:25.480 --> 00:26:28.400
Parting ways with the Catholic religion that he'd been raised with.

509
00:26:29.240 --> 00:26:32.319
He became obsessed with the e Ching or Book of Changes,

510
00:26:32.759 --> 00:26:35.720
an ancient Chinese book which taught a form of divination.

511
00:26:36.519 --> 00:26:40.000
It's not unlike astrology, but instead of reading the stars,

512
00:26:40.079 --> 00:26:43.039
Phil would read the numbers around him. He would throw

513
00:26:43.160 --> 00:26:46.039
multiple coins onto a surface, the head or the tales

514
00:26:46.079 --> 00:26:49.440
they landed on, each represented different numbers, and the sum

515
00:26:49.519 --> 00:26:53.519
would supposedly foretell the future. Each letter in a person's

516
00:26:53.599 --> 00:26:57.000
name represented a number, and the total numerological value of

517
00:26:57.039 --> 00:27:00.599
a person's name was tied to their fate. And Phil

518
00:27:00.640 --> 00:27:03.839
Hartman added up to a destiny number of eight, not

519
00:27:04.079 --> 00:27:06.799
bad but not the ideal number for a budding artist.

520
00:27:07.319 --> 00:27:09.839
If he dropped the second N from his last name,

521
00:27:09.960 --> 00:27:13.920
his destiny number became a three, a preferable number symbolic

522
00:27:14.000 --> 00:27:17.680
of artistic enlightenment, and so Phil took the stage name

523
00:27:18.119 --> 00:27:21.759
Phil Hartman with only one en, and later filed paperwork

524
00:27:21.799 --> 00:27:25.960
to change it legally. It's really interesting reasoning for changing

525
00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:29.920
your name, but apparently it worked. Phil met his second wife,

526
00:27:30.039 --> 00:27:33.319
Lisa Strain, at a bar in nineteen eighty one. Lisa

527
00:27:33.400 --> 00:27:36.279
worked as an assistant to a realtor and as a waitress.

528
00:27:36.799 --> 00:27:39.400
She was very much a creature of the eighties, immersed

529
00:27:39.440 --> 00:27:43.759
in punk rock, with a wardrobe to match leather, rubber, spandex,

530
00:27:43.799 --> 00:27:47.839
and stilettos. She was a self confessed handful and a

531
00:27:47.920 --> 00:27:52.319
free spirit. She was a counterculture artist, specializing in sculptures

532
00:27:52.400 --> 00:27:55.400
made out of wood and neon. After their first date,

533
00:27:55.559 --> 00:27:58.480
Phil threw an itching, read the numbers and liked what

534
00:27:58.599 --> 00:28:02.759
they told him. Own the marrying maiden, they both fell

535
00:28:02.839 --> 00:28:06.720
head over heels. Phil called her his soulmate. He proposed

536
00:28:06.839 --> 00:28:10.640
several times before Lisa finally accepted. They were married in

537
00:28:10.720 --> 00:28:14.119
December nineteen eighty two. Phil was thirty two and Lisa

538
00:28:14.279 --> 00:28:18.279
was twenty three. When Phil grew frustrated and considered giving

539
00:28:18.359 --> 00:28:20.920
up on his Hollywood dreams, Lisa wouldn't hear of it.

540
00:28:21.519 --> 00:28:25.000
She stood by him, providing both financial and emotional support,

541
00:28:25.519 --> 00:28:28.200
and convinced him that he had what it took to succeed.

542
00:28:29.200 --> 00:28:33.480
Over the next few years, their incompatibilities became apparent. Phil

543
00:28:33.559 --> 00:28:36.599
found Lisa needy with a sexual appetite that he simply

544
00:28:36.640 --> 00:28:39.920
couldn't keep up with. He told a friend, quote, Lisa

545
00:28:40.000 --> 00:28:42.680
wants to have sex eight ten times a day. I

546
00:28:42.799 --> 00:28:45.839
need breaks. I like to watch television. I enjoy the

547
00:28:45.960 --> 00:28:49.400
Jeffersons unquote. That's really funny that he would bring the

548
00:28:49.480 --> 00:28:56.519
Jeffersons into that conversation. Lisa found Phil emotionally distant, jealous, moody, boring,

549
00:28:56.799 --> 00:28:59.920
and incapable of actually discussing their marital issues.

550
00:29:00.519 --> 00:29:00.880
Quote.

551
00:29:01.160 --> 00:29:04.480
He was very boring to live with. He was brilliantly funny,

552
00:29:04.559 --> 00:29:06.839
but he didn't want to do anything or go anywhere.

553
00:29:07.400 --> 00:29:09.440
His idea of a great night out was to go

554
00:29:09.519 --> 00:29:11.920
to hagendhass and get an ice cream and then drive

555
00:29:12.039 --> 00:29:14.759
up to Ventura Boulevard and look at old cars in

556
00:29:14.839 --> 00:29:19.480
a lot. I was thrilled. Thrilled unquote. Phil's fear of

557
00:29:19.599 --> 00:29:23.319
confrontation ultimately led to the end of their marriage. Little

558
00:29:23.359 --> 00:29:26.720
issues piled up over time, and with them, so did resentment.

559
00:29:27.279 --> 00:29:30.480
They divorced in nineteen eighty four. Like Phil's first marriage

560
00:29:30.519 --> 00:29:34.039
to Gretchen, it lasted about two years. Phil entered into

561
00:29:34.079 --> 00:29:37.599
the lowest point of his life. After their divorce was final.

562
00:29:37.759 --> 00:29:41.880
There was an attempt at reconciliation. Lisa dating someone new,

563
00:29:42.240 --> 00:29:45.519
was cheating on her boyfriend with her ex husband. Quote.

564
00:29:45.599 --> 00:29:48.000
I really missed Phil. I was still really in love

565
00:29:48.039 --> 00:29:51.240
with him. Unquote. He loved her too, but they couldn't

566
00:29:51.240 --> 00:29:54.559
make it work. Their second breakup was ugly, which caused

567
00:29:54.599 --> 00:29:58.039
a rift that took several years to heal. Phil was

568
00:29:58.079 --> 00:30:00.720
a born entertainer, but he also had a a keen mind,

569
00:30:00.960 --> 00:30:04.519
an artistic spirit, and a broad range of interests. He

570
00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:07.960
enjoyed creating art and consumed a variety of books and music.

571
00:30:08.559 --> 00:30:10.880
If he hadn't become a performer, he likely would have

572
00:30:10.920 --> 00:30:15.599
started a syndicated comic strip. In addition to his artistic pursuits,

573
00:30:15.640 --> 00:30:18.640
he earned his pilot's license and loved spending his free

574
00:30:18.680 --> 00:30:22.359
time on the water, whether sailing or surfing. Because he

575
00:30:22.480 --> 00:30:25.279
was forced to be on all the time, he often

576
00:30:25.400 --> 00:30:28.480
retreated to fill his creative battery, which made him a

577
00:30:28.599 --> 00:30:32.519
challenging partner. I obviously didn't know Phil Hartman personally either,

578
00:30:32.559 --> 00:30:34.920
but I can imagine it would be difficult to be

579
00:30:35.039 --> 00:30:37.759
married to someone like that who is kind of always

580
00:30:38.079 --> 00:30:40.240
sort of wearing a mask in some ways and always

581
00:30:40.319 --> 00:30:41.880
kind of performing in a lot of ways.

582
00:30:42.119 --> 00:30:44.359
I watched a lot of clips of Phil Hartman, and

583
00:30:44.440 --> 00:30:46.720
he really I think he was a very sweet and

584
00:30:46.839 --> 00:30:49.400
kind person, but I don't think he knew how to

585
00:30:49.480 --> 00:30:53.359
be a partner. And like you said, he was always on.

586
00:30:53.559 --> 00:30:55.759
He always had you know, he was good at impersonations,

587
00:30:56.400 --> 00:31:00.240
doing the voices, but also I think impersonating you know,

588
00:31:00.400 --> 00:31:04.519
like a functioning, you know, person in a relationship too.

589
00:31:04.799 --> 00:31:05.000
Yeah.

590
00:31:06.039 --> 00:31:09.839
After Phil's relationship with Lisa fizzled, his third wife entered

591
00:31:09.880 --> 00:31:12.720
the picture We'll be back after a break.

592
00:31:20.079 --> 00:31:23.160
Phil met Brinn on a blind daid in nineteen eighty six.

593
00:31:23.680 --> 00:31:28.160
Bren was born Vicky Joe Amdahl on April eleventh, nineteen

594
00:31:28.240 --> 00:31:30.839
fifty eight, one of four children in the tiny town

595
00:31:31.359 --> 00:31:35.559
of Thief River Falls, Minnesota. Her father, Don was an engineer,

596
00:31:35.759 --> 00:31:39.039
and Connie owned a small retail business. We don't know

597
00:31:39.240 --> 00:31:41.720
much about Vicky's early years, but her brother said that

598
00:31:41.799 --> 00:31:45.759
they had an idyllic childhood. Her high school principal called

599
00:31:45.799 --> 00:31:47.920
her average, an ordinary girl.

600
00:31:48.039 --> 00:31:49.079
Well, every girl wants to hear.

601
00:31:49.240 --> 00:31:51.519
I'm pretty sure my high school principle would say the

602
00:31:51.599 --> 00:31:54.759
same thing. She dropped out to marry a young man

603
00:31:55.079 --> 00:31:58.720
named Doug Tworfen, who worked as a telephone operator. They

604
00:31:58.799 --> 00:32:03.160
later divorced. Vicki worked as a swimsuit model in Minneapolis,

605
00:32:03.400 --> 00:32:07.319
hopped around the country a bit until inevitably she decided

606
00:32:07.359 --> 00:32:09.799
her new home was going to be Los Angeles, where

607
00:32:09.839 --> 00:32:12.839
she would pursue a career on the big screen. She

608
00:32:13.000 --> 00:32:16.200
first changed her name to Brindon, but later shortened it

609
00:32:16.319 --> 00:32:20.440
to Brynn Brenn. Like many Hollywood denizens of the seventies

610
00:32:20.480 --> 00:32:25.079
and eighties, liked cocaine a lot, and her excessive consumption

611
00:32:25.279 --> 00:32:28.680
of it was doing disastrous things to her life and career.

612
00:32:29.599 --> 00:32:32.960
She returned to Minnesota and attended rehab at the Hazelden

613
00:32:33.079 --> 00:32:36.160
Center for a while. When she returned to La clean

614
00:32:36.240 --> 00:32:39.519
and sober, she began going to AA meetings. She liked

615
00:32:39.559 --> 00:32:41.640
to go to the meetings around Hollywood to see which

616
00:32:41.680 --> 00:32:46.480
celebrities showed up. Phil Hartman met Brynn during this period

617
00:32:46.559 --> 00:32:50.119
of sobriety, he was depressed after his second divorse and

618
00:32:50.440 --> 00:32:55.039
very vulnerable. He enjoyed the attention from a beautiful swimsuit model.

619
00:32:55.720 --> 00:32:57.200
Have you seen pictures of Brynn? Do you know what

620
00:32:57.279 --> 00:32:57.599
she looks?

621
00:32:57.799 --> 00:32:59.920
Not since it happened, I don't recall.

622
00:33:00.640 --> 00:33:04.200
I mean she was stunning. She was very tall and statuesque.

623
00:33:04.319 --> 00:33:07.680
She was very beautiful. His friends noted that Brinn seemed

624
00:33:07.720 --> 00:33:11.200
quite a bit different from Phil's previous romantic partners. The

625
00:33:11.279 --> 00:33:14.240
women that had come before Brynn were, according to Phil's

626
00:33:14.279 --> 00:33:18.319
friend and former Groundling member Victoria Bell, fun and silly.

627
00:33:18.799 --> 00:33:21.839
That wasn't Brynn, who struck many as just the opposite,

628
00:33:22.319 --> 00:33:26.119
weird and artificial. But the only opinion that really mattered

629
00:33:26.319 --> 00:33:29.279
was Phil's, and he liked her. He liked her enough

630
00:33:29.359 --> 00:33:32.480
to keep crawling back to her even after their multudinous

631
00:33:32.559 --> 00:33:35.759
fights and breakups. It was an on again, off again

632
00:33:35.839 --> 00:33:39.880
relationship if there ever was one. Phil's friend Mike Thomas

633
00:33:40.079 --> 00:33:43.480
said of Phil and Brinn's relationship, quote, as with Lisa,

634
00:33:43.759 --> 00:33:47.599
as with Gretchen, it becomes very intense, very fast. But

635
00:33:47.720 --> 00:33:50.000
as the months go by, the cracks begin to show,

636
00:33:50.039 --> 00:33:52.920
and Phil does what he did with his last two relationships,

637
00:33:53.319 --> 00:33:57.000
he begins to withdraw emotionally. They began this pattern of

638
00:33:57.079 --> 00:33:59.680
fighting and making up and fighting and making up that

639
00:33:59.720 --> 00:34:04.240
would mark their relationship from there on out. They had

640
00:34:04.279 --> 00:34:07.160
this pattern of fighting all the time, and Brinn was

641
00:34:07.319 --> 00:34:11.280
very fiery and she liked to fight, and Phil was

642
00:34:11.400 --> 00:34:15.960
more passive and he tended to retreat and he didn't

643
00:34:16.039 --> 00:34:18.280
engage in the fighting kind of like you.

644
00:34:19.320 --> 00:34:23.519
Yea so familiar. Yeah, well some people really like feed

645
00:34:23.599 --> 00:34:25.840
off of that kind of like that kind of fighting,

646
00:34:25.880 --> 00:34:28.960
and other people, like Phil and myself, yeah, tend to

647
00:34:29.199 --> 00:34:30.480
like just shy away from it.

648
00:34:30.800 --> 00:34:33.039
Yeah, like if in the middle of a fight, he

649
00:34:33.079 --> 00:34:34.920
would just go to bed and he would want to

650
00:34:35.000 --> 00:34:35.480
go to sleep.

651
00:34:35.519 --> 00:34:37.800
And she was like, I, you know, we're not done fighting.

652
00:34:37.880 --> 00:34:41.239
We're not done fighting, which is very much like and

653
00:34:41.320 --> 00:34:43.679
we don't really fight very much, but you have done

654
00:34:43.719 --> 00:34:46.519
that before. What I want to like, you know, talk

655
00:34:46.639 --> 00:34:51.159
it into the ground and you're like, I'm going yeah,

656
00:34:51.320 --> 00:34:54.400
And so I can relate to this a little bit.

657
00:34:55.679 --> 00:34:59.320
Brinn was stunning, but insecure. She was always having little

658
00:34:59.400 --> 00:35:03.119
procedures on to feel younger and more beautiful, some encouraged

659
00:35:03.159 --> 00:35:06.199
by her husband, who had himself gone under the knife

660
00:35:06.239 --> 00:35:09.440
for an eyelid surgery. Fryn really wanted to make it

661
00:35:09.559 --> 00:35:12.599
as an actress. She had had a few minor roles

662
00:35:12.639 --> 00:35:15.119
over the years, but she knew her window of opportunity

663
00:35:15.400 --> 00:35:20.119
was rapidly closing in youth obsessed Hollywood. Phil reached a

664
00:35:20.199 --> 00:35:22.719
new level of fame with the success of the major

665
00:35:22.800 --> 00:35:26.000
studio release of Pee Wee's Big Adventure, which he co

666
00:35:26.159 --> 00:35:30.280
wrote with Paul Rubens and Michael Varhall. Did you see

667
00:35:30.599 --> 00:35:31.440
Pee's Big Advice?

668
00:35:31.559 --> 00:35:33.320
I was never a big Pee Wee Herman fan. I

669
00:35:33.400 --> 00:35:35.400
know you were a little more into that than I was,

670
00:35:35.480 --> 00:35:37.880
but I like the humor didn't really connect with me.

671
00:35:38.199 --> 00:35:38.360
Yeah.

672
00:35:38.440 --> 00:35:40.800
I thought it was the funniest thing I'd ever seen.

673
00:35:40.920 --> 00:35:41.679
I really enjoyed it.

674
00:35:41.800 --> 00:35:44.599
I didn't even honestly know Phil Hartman was part of

675
00:35:45.000 --> 00:35:46.000
Pee Wee's Big Adventure.

676
00:35:46.079 --> 00:35:49.440
Yeah. The film was directed by a first time director

677
00:35:49.599 --> 00:35:50.599
named Tim Burton.

678
00:35:50.840 --> 00:35:51.480
I've heard of him.

679
00:35:53.079 --> 00:35:55.719
Phil went on to star in this Saturday morning television

680
00:35:55.800 --> 00:36:00.119
series Pee Wee's Playhouse, alongside Paul, where he reprised his

681
00:36:00.239 --> 00:36:03.519
role as Captain Carl. After the release of Big Adventure,

682
00:36:03.639 --> 00:36:07.079
Paul Rubins became a major star and was asked to

683
00:36:07.159 --> 00:36:10.920
host Saturday Night Live. Because of pee Wee's unique character,

684
00:36:11.159 --> 00:36:15.719
pee Wee would be hosting, not Paul. In an unprecedented move,

685
00:36:16.000 --> 00:36:18.280
Paul wanted to bring his own writers to the show

686
00:36:18.440 --> 00:36:21.400
to assist in the writing of the sketches. Phil and

687
00:36:21.559 --> 00:36:25.239
John paragon tagged alot to New York. This time, Phil

688
00:36:25.320 --> 00:36:29.519
got Lauren Michael's attention. He was impressed with Phil's easygoing

689
00:36:29.639 --> 00:36:32.920
yet professional work ethic and was asked to audition for

690
00:36:33.000 --> 00:36:36.400
the show. Phil's pale John Lovett sparred with him and

691
00:36:36.559 --> 00:36:40.840
revived old ground link sketches for his audition. He nailed

692
00:36:40.880 --> 00:36:43.480
the audition and even got a rare laugh from Lauren.

693
00:36:43.719 --> 00:36:45.840
Is that like getting a handshake from Paul Hollywood on

694
00:36:45.880 --> 00:36:47.079
The Great British Baking Show?

695
00:36:47.519 --> 00:36:47.679
Yeah?

696
00:36:47.760 --> 00:36:49.519
And if it was like a thing with Carson too,

697
00:36:49.679 --> 00:36:51.719
Like if you could make Johnny Carson laugh, that was

698
00:36:51.760 --> 00:36:55.840
a big deal. He was offered the job. Surprisingly, Phil

699
00:36:55.960 --> 00:36:58.519
balked he wasn't sure if he wanted to uproot his

700
00:36:58.639 --> 00:37:02.360
life in Lahil was also privately a vain man. He

701
00:37:02.519 --> 00:37:04.920
was approaching his thirty eighth birthday and would be the

702
00:37:05.039 --> 00:37:09.039
oldest cast member by far. But of course Phil joined SNL.

703
00:37:09.880 --> 00:37:11.760
It would have been lunacy for him to turn down

704
00:37:11.800 --> 00:37:15.719
the opportunity. Phil was forced to quit pee Wee's playhouse. Sadly,

705
00:37:15.840 --> 00:37:18.639
Paul and Phil had a falling out after Phil suggested

706
00:37:19.119 --> 00:37:21.400
that Paul should branch out and focus lust on the

707
00:37:21.480 --> 00:37:24.199
character of pee Wee, warning him that he might get

708
00:37:24.239 --> 00:37:26.840
stuck playing the character for the rest of his life.

709
00:37:27.360 --> 00:37:29.800
Paul was offended and her by the comment, and they

710
00:37:29.880 --> 00:37:30.800
never spoke again.

711
00:37:31.079 --> 00:37:31.719
That's too bad.

712
00:37:31.880 --> 00:37:36.079
Yeah, their relationship had been souring for years. There may

713
00:37:36.159 --> 00:37:38.920
have been some jealousy and ego issues there. Paul had

714
00:37:38.960 --> 00:37:42.079
auditioned for a spot on SNL years earlier, but he

715
00:37:42.280 --> 00:37:46.199
was passed over for Gilbert Gottfried, and Phil had a

716
00:37:46.280 --> 00:37:49.400
three percent stake in pee Wee's earnings that he never saw.

717
00:37:49.639 --> 00:37:50.519
Oh that's not cool.

718
00:37:51.079 --> 00:37:54.440
I think most people would have sued pee Wee for

719
00:37:54.639 --> 00:37:56.800
that loss of revenue, but Phil was just like, oh,

720
00:37:56.840 --> 00:37:59.199
it's just not worth it. And they were like really

721
00:37:59.239 --> 00:38:03.400
close friends. And Paul Rubins I think after he died

722
00:38:03.400 --> 00:38:05.199
a few years ago, like people were like, you know,

723
00:38:05.840 --> 00:38:07.440
saying that he was a genius and he was such

724
00:38:07.440 --> 00:38:09.440
a great guy, and I'm sure he was, but he

725
00:38:09.599 --> 00:38:11.800
was also very difficult to work with at times.

726
00:38:13.199 --> 00:38:17.519
SNL had narrowly avoided cancelation after a disastrous season eleven.

727
00:38:18.280 --> 00:38:21.119
Lauren Michaels had fired almost the entire cast and had

728
00:38:21.159 --> 00:38:24.159
to rebuild from the ground up. Because Phil was a

729
00:38:24.199 --> 00:38:27.719
strong writer and performer, he was a perfect fit. Phil

730
00:38:27.840 --> 00:38:31.119
joined the likes of Kevin Neelan, Dennis Miller, Nora Dunn,

731
00:38:31.239 --> 00:38:34.719
Victoria Jackson, Jan Hooks, and Dana Carvey for the twelfth

732
00:38:34.800 --> 00:38:38.000
season in the fall of nineteen eighty six. That was

733
00:38:38.079 --> 00:38:39.920
quite a cast, really, it was.

734
00:38:40.280 --> 00:38:42.480
It was great and it really did bring them back

735
00:38:42.599 --> 00:38:43.280
to greatness.

736
00:38:43.480 --> 00:38:43.679
Yeah.

737
00:38:43.719 --> 00:38:45.239
I mean there's been a lot of great casts over

738
00:38:45.280 --> 00:38:47.840
the years, but I think like those names are a

739
00:38:47.920 --> 00:38:50.119
lot of them, you know, were pretty big and went

740
00:38:50.199 --> 00:38:52.599
on to do a lot of other things. Absolutely, Phil

741
00:38:52.679 --> 00:38:54.960
and Brinn broke up before he moved to New York,

742
00:38:55.199 --> 00:38:57.599
but they soon got back together and she moved in

743
00:38:57.719 --> 00:39:01.400
with him. The new cast was an hit. They quite

744
00:39:01.480 --> 00:39:05.519
literally saved the show from cancelation. Phil was nicknamed the

745
00:39:05.599 --> 00:39:09.719
Glue by his SNL castmates. He played stock or supporting

746
00:39:09.800 --> 00:39:12.679
characters during his years at SNL. He never had a

747
00:39:12.760 --> 00:39:16.760
popular runaway character like Dana Carvey's church lady, but he

748
00:39:16.920 --> 00:39:20.079
was stalwart and dependable and wasn't afraid to let someone

749
00:39:20.159 --> 00:39:24.159
else get the laughs. Jan Hooks, Phil's work wife, said

750
00:39:24.199 --> 00:39:27.159
that they were the Clydesdales while other castmates were the

751
00:39:27.239 --> 00:39:31.679
show ponies. Lauren Michaels told People magazine, quote, he kind

752
00:39:31.719 --> 00:39:34.519
of held the show together. He also had a gravitas

753
00:39:34.599 --> 00:39:37.800
that ensured a sketch would always stick the landing, even

754
00:39:37.840 --> 00:39:40.719
if the premise was paper thin and nobody quite knew

755
00:39:40.719 --> 00:39:44.679
what they were doing. Unquote, Lauren said Phil quote had

756
00:39:44.760 --> 00:39:48.119
done more work that's touched greatness than probably anybody else

757
00:39:48.119 --> 00:39:51.480
who's ever been here. Unquote. He was always the adult

758
00:39:51.559 --> 00:39:54.559
in the room and took the job seriously. He kept

759
00:39:54.599 --> 00:39:58.000
his scripts and binders highlighted and tagged with sticky notes.

760
00:39:58.559 --> 00:40:00.880
No one else in the cast was quot so professional,

761
00:40:01.079 --> 00:40:03.360
a trait Phil took with him for the remainder of

762
00:40:03.440 --> 00:40:06.599
his career. Phil saw his cast mates get their turn

763
00:40:06.679 --> 00:40:09.320
in the spotlight one by one, and he waited patiently

764
00:40:09.440 --> 00:40:12.320
for his moment, but he became frustrated as they left

765
00:40:12.360 --> 00:40:15.920
for opportunities in Hollywood, as Dana Carvey and Mike Myers

766
00:40:15.960 --> 00:40:17.719
did when they made Wayne's World.

767
00:40:18.400 --> 00:40:21.400
So Phil really wanted like a church lady type character.

768
00:40:21.599 --> 00:40:23.440
You remember church Lady? Oh yeah, I mean that was

769
00:40:23.480 --> 00:40:27.159
a great sketch drain. But if you asked Carvey to say,

770
00:40:27.480 --> 00:40:31.880
isn't that special? One word time, he probably really hated it.

771
00:40:32.320 --> 00:40:34.320
In a way, it was I think probably a mixed

772
00:40:34.400 --> 00:40:38.159
blessing that he was able to play a multitude of characters.

773
00:40:38.440 --> 00:40:40.519
He was really versatile. He could do a lot of different.

774
00:40:40.239 --> 00:40:42.960
Things exactly, and that allowed him to be in a

775
00:40:43.000 --> 00:40:43.960
lot more sketches.

776
00:40:44.119 --> 00:40:48.119
Yeah, for sure. When Phil told his friend Cassandra Peterson,

777
00:40:48.599 --> 00:40:52.119
also known as Elvira, Mistress of the Dark and former Groundling,

778
00:40:52.800 --> 00:40:55.679
that he was planning to propose to Brinn, she was horrified.

779
00:40:56.280 --> 00:40:59.079
Oh god, no, she exclaimed out loud. Before she could

780
00:40:59.119 --> 00:41:02.719
stop herself, Phil in a rare moment of fury, kicked

781
00:41:02.719 --> 00:41:06.719
her out of his office. Cassandra was correctly identifying a trend,

782
00:41:06.840 --> 00:41:10.480
of course, that Phil was once again rushing into a relationship,

783
00:41:10.880 --> 00:41:13.159
and even worse, this time doing so with a woman

784
00:41:13.199 --> 00:41:16.199
who she thought of as a phony. But Phil had

785
00:41:16.280 --> 00:41:19.280
his reasons for marriage, which Cassandra was not privy to.

786
00:41:19.920 --> 00:41:23.239
Brinn was two months pregnant and while Phil had left

787
00:41:23.320 --> 00:41:26.400
Catholicism behind. He certainly wasn't going to have a child

788
00:41:26.440 --> 00:41:27.199
out of wedlock.

789
00:41:27.800 --> 00:41:29.719
I feel like I need to defend Brynn here a

790
00:41:29.800 --> 00:41:33.440
little bit. Some people thought she was odd and off

791
00:41:33.519 --> 00:41:36.159
putting and maybe a little weird, but other people said

792
00:41:36.199 --> 00:41:39.480
that she was lovely and funny and a very sweet

793
00:41:39.519 --> 00:41:40.280
and kind person.

794
00:41:40.800 --> 00:41:42.440
Yeah. I think that's true of a lot of people

795
00:41:42.559 --> 00:41:45.079
that you know. Some people view you one way, other

796
00:41:45.119 --> 00:41:48.239
people view you another way, and it's just not necessarily

797
00:41:48.360 --> 00:41:49.280
consistent exactly.

798
00:41:49.360 --> 00:41:49.519
Yeah.

799
00:41:50.239 --> 00:41:53.119
Brin and Phil were married on November twenty fifth, nineteen

800
00:41:53.199 --> 00:41:55.960
eighty seven, in a small ceremony in New York. He

801
00:41:56.159 --> 00:41:59.679
was thirty nine, she was twenty nine. Sean Edward Hartman

802
00:41:59.760 --> 00:42:02.719
was born seven months later. In June nineteen eighty eight,

803
00:42:03.639 --> 00:42:06.679
Phil's second wife, Lisa, who he had since repaired things

804
00:42:06.760 --> 00:42:09.519
with and become friends with, sent a simple note to

805
00:42:09.559 --> 00:42:12.280
the Hartman's congratulating them on the birth of their son.

806
00:42:13.079 --> 00:42:17.320
Brinn mailed her a four page diatribe threatening Lisa, telling

807
00:42:17.400 --> 00:42:19.440
her to stay away from Phil and Sean or she

808
00:42:19.480 --> 00:42:21.199
would kill her and rip her eyes out.

809
00:42:21.320 --> 00:42:24.079
Oh, I just doing that. She was a kind person.

810
00:42:24.280 --> 00:42:29.159
Yeah, that's a boy. This was disturbing to Lisa, understandably,

811
00:42:29.239 --> 00:42:31.960
so who called Phil to ask him about it. It

812
00:42:32.079 --> 00:42:34.400
made more sense once Phil informed her that he and

813
00:42:34.519 --> 00:42:38.360
Brinn had just had a difficult conversation. Brinn had leveled

814
00:42:38.400 --> 00:42:41.800
the question to Phil. Were he and Brin's soulmates? This

815
00:42:42.000 --> 00:42:45.119
is an easy question to answer for most people. If

816
00:42:45.199 --> 00:42:52.400
your spouse asks you this question, the correct answer is yes, yes, absolutely.

817
00:42:53.280 --> 00:42:56.360
Phil had opted for the incorrect answer. He told Brynn

818
00:42:56.400 --> 00:42:59.639
that actually he and Lisa were soulmates. Oh boy, oh boy.

819
00:43:00.280 --> 00:43:03.840
Lisa handled the situation well, all things considered, simply saying

820
00:43:03.960 --> 00:43:06.559
that quote, not only do you have your head up

821
00:43:06.599 --> 00:43:10.679
your ass, your wife is a scary creature unquote, Phil

822
00:43:10.719 --> 00:43:13.239
advised her not to send any more notes to his home.

823
00:43:13.639 --> 00:43:16.079
He and Lisa didn't talk again for two years.

824
00:43:16.719 --> 00:43:21.239
Wait, I have a question for you. Yes, I actually

825
00:43:21.280 --> 00:43:22.519
don't believe in soulmates.

826
00:43:22.599 --> 00:43:23.119
What so?

827
00:43:23.840 --> 00:43:26.239
Well, it's okay to say I don't believe in soulmates,

828
00:43:26.320 --> 00:43:28.000
but it would be worse to say, oh, well, my

829
00:43:28.159 --> 00:43:31.199
old boy, Yeah.

830
00:43:31.519 --> 00:43:33.760
I mean, I love you to death, but I don't.

831
00:43:33.840 --> 00:43:35.880
I think a lot of people can be your soulmates.

832
00:43:36.559 --> 00:43:40.440
Brinn was also jealous of Phil's SNL castmates. She felt

833
00:43:40.519 --> 00:43:43.119
some were getting too close to him, including Jan Hooks,

834
00:43:43.119 --> 00:43:46.880
who played Hillary to Phil's Bill Clinton. Brinn drafted a

835
00:43:46.960 --> 00:43:50.159
threatening missive to Jan and other cast members, but never

836
00:43:50.280 --> 00:43:51.119
actually sent them.

837
00:43:52.039 --> 00:43:55.079
Phil said that the letter that Brynn sent to Lisa

838
00:43:55.280 --> 00:43:57.400
the one you know, I'll scratch your hands out or whatever.

839
00:43:58.679 --> 00:44:02.559
He said, like you should have seen the original. I

840
00:44:02.599 --> 00:44:04.199
guess it was even worse.

841
00:44:04.360 --> 00:44:08.800
Oh boy. Over the next few years, Phil became megawatt famous.

842
00:44:09.079 --> 00:44:12.920
He found his niche by playing larger than life, buffoonish characters.

843
00:44:13.679 --> 00:44:16.440
In nineteen ninety, Phil joined the cast of The Simpsons,

844
00:44:16.480 --> 00:44:19.800
where he was featured in fifty two episodes. It was

845
00:44:19.880 --> 00:44:23.000
one job that brought him pure joy. He gave voice

846
00:44:23.039 --> 00:44:26.480
to washed up D list actor Troy McClure, ambulance chasing

847
00:44:26.519 --> 00:44:29.039
attorney Lionel Huts, and many others.

848
00:44:29.480 --> 00:44:30.760
You I've never seen before.

849
00:44:31.400 --> 00:44:31.440
You.

850
00:44:31.599 --> 00:44:32.079
Who are you?

851
00:44:32.360 --> 00:44:34.840
I saw You're chasing bird's ambulance. Huts is the name,

852
00:44:34.880 --> 00:44:37.880
mister Simpson. Lionel Hat's attorney at law. Here's my card.

853
00:44:38.320 --> 00:44:41.079
It turns into a sponge when you put it in water. Ooh, classy.

854
00:44:41.199 --> 00:44:43.440
I'd like to talk to you about bringing legal action

855
00:44:43.599 --> 00:44:46.840
against the fiend. Who did this to your boy? Well,

856
00:44:47.800 --> 00:44:51.440
who did this to my boy? Is my boss? And besides,

857
00:44:51.840 --> 00:44:54.320
doctor says just a bump on a hand of broken tone,

858
00:44:54.440 --> 00:44:58.800
nothing cheeriot doctors. Doctors are idiots. There's no telling what

859
00:44:58.920 --> 00:45:01.320
kind of permanent injuries he might have. You might have

860
00:45:01.400 --> 00:45:03.440
to wait on hand and foot for the rest of

861
00:45:03.559 --> 00:45:07.360
his natural life. That's the downside. Now here's the good part.

862
00:45:07.679 --> 00:45:12.280
You can jing jing jing cash in on this tragedy. Hi,

863
00:45:12.440 --> 00:45:15.519
I'm actor Troy McClure. You might remember me from such

864
00:45:15.679 --> 00:45:19.519
driver's ed films as Alice's Adventures through the Windshield Glass

865
00:45:19.679 --> 00:45:23.840
and the Decapitation of Larry Leadfoot. For the next sixty minutes,

866
00:45:23.920 --> 00:45:33.159
we'll be seeing actual film of car crash victims. Here's

867
00:45:33.199 --> 00:45:37.760
an appealing fellow. In fact, they're appealing him off the sidewalk.

868
00:45:39.480 --> 00:45:41.360
It's funny because they don't know him.

869
00:45:43.719 --> 00:45:49.320
His voice was just so recognizable. After his death, the

870
00:45:49.440 --> 00:45:53.519
characters were retired in Phil's honor. On SNL, he portrayed

871
00:45:53.599 --> 00:45:57.719
the unfrozen caveman lawyer, the anal retentive chef, and he

872
00:45:57.800 --> 00:46:01.320
became the go to cast member to portray politicians and

873
00:46:01.519 --> 00:46:05.880
other strong jawed well quaffed masculine characters, along with pop

874
00:46:05.960 --> 00:46:10.039
culture icons including Bill Clinton, Donald Trump, Ronald Reagan, and

875
00:46:10.159 --> 00:46:13.880
Frank Sinatra. I loved his portrayal of Frank Sinatra in particular.

876
00:46:14.079 --> 00:46:15.159
You know, I don't remember that one.

877
00:46:15.280 --> 00:46:17.800
It was just really it was really good. By Phil's

878
00:46:17.840 --> 00:46:21.599
fourth season on SNL, exhausted from the grueling schedule, often

879
00:46:21.679 --> 00:46:24.519
working late into the night, he stepped back from writing

880
00:46:24.599 --> 00:46:26.360
and focused solely on performing.

881
00:46:26.960 --> 00:46:30.079
He said that he worked between sixty and seventy hours

882
00:46:30.159 --> 00:46:32.400
during his time on SNL when he was writing.

883
00:46:32.559 --> 00:46:33.760
Wow, that's a lot.

884
00:46:34.000 --> 00:46:38.039
I think today less performers do both roles. I think

885
00:46:38.159 --> 00:46:41.039
a lot of them just do you know their performing

886
00:46:41.119 --> 00:46:44.119
and the writers. I think Andy Samberg recently said, did

887
00:46:44.199 --> 00:46:47.760
you hear this? No, he was a prominent cast member too.

888
00:46:48.960 --> 00:46:52.159
He had to quit because he just couldn't take the hours.

889
00:46:52.159 --> 00:46:55.480
Any oh, I couldn't imagine. Yeah. As the years ticked by,

890
00:46:55.639 --> 00:46:59.039
Phil became the patriarch of SNL, he welcomed the new

891
00:46:59.159 --> 00:47:02.800
younger cast me Chris Rock, Adam Sandler, David Spade, and

892
00:47:02.880 --> 00:47:05.519
Chris Farley among them. They all looked up to him,

893
00:47:05.679 --> 00:47:09.960
especially Chris Farley. They shared a special bond Chris's mother,

894
00:47:10.119 --> 00:47:13.079
Mary Anne said, quote, he kept an eagle eye on Chris,

895
00:47:13.159 --> 00:47:15.719
which was good, and Chris listened to him, which was

896
00:47:15.800 --> 00:47:17.039
even better. Unquote.

897
00:47:18.159 --> 00:47:21.280
Brin swung by thirty Rock often. During this time, she

898
00:47:21.440 --> 00:47:23.800
became friends with some of the cast members and writers.

899
00:47:24.199 --> 00:47:28.679
Julia Sweeney cast member, and Christine Xander writer, especially became

900
00:47:28.800 --> 00:47:32.320
great friends with Brynn. Sweeney, looking back on that period,

901
00:47:32.440 --> 00:47:36.280
described Bryn's appearance in blunt terms, she had a kind

902
00:47:36.320 --> 00:47:41.599
of high end call girl look. She also she also

903
00:47:41.760 --> 00:47:45.719
characterized Phil less favorably than most, wondering how much Phil

904
00:47:45.840 --> 00:47:48.800
loved Brynn as a person versus how much she loved

905
00:47:48.840 --> 00:47:52.719
how people looked at him when Brynn was on his arm, quote,

906
00:47:53.000 --> 00:47:56.000
he needed to be with a knockout. Some of Phil's

907
00:47:56.039 --> 00:48:00.320
friends began to dislike Brynn. During one visitor, sett on

908
00:48:00.360 --> 00:48:03.000
the laps of many of the guys, stuck her tongue

909
00:48:03.000 --> 00:48:06.559
in their ears and kissed them. On other visits, they

910
00:48:06.679 --> 00:48:10.400
fought loudly in Phil's dressing room. Often she had temper

911
00:48:10.519 --> 00:48:15.679
tantrums and ended up throwing things at Phil. In February eighth,

912
00:48:15.800 --> 00:48:18.719
nineteen ninety two, Phil and Brynn welcomed their second child,

913
00:48:18.960 --> 00:48:23.559
a daughter, Bergan Anka Hartman. Phil was walking on air

914
00:48:23.639 --> 00:48:26.079
after her birth. He was so smitten with his new daughter.

915
00:48:26.639 --> 00:48:29.000
There was a live show that night, and Bergan's birth

916
00:48:29.079 --> 00:48:31.000
was announced at the end of the night during the

917
00:48:31.079 --> 00:48:35.360
curtain call. According to Nancy Cartwright, also known as Bart Simpson,

918
00:48:35.719 --> 00:48:39.400
Phil enjoyed fatherhood. The two would often chat about being parents,

919
00:48:39.480 --> 00:48:42.920
and he would gush about his children. Brynn was having

920
00:48:42.960 --> 00:48:45.800
an internal crisis. She had always value to her appearance

921
00:48:45.840 --> 00:48:47.960
and her social life, and the work of parenting two

922
00:48:48.079 --> 00:48:51.320
young children was interfering with that. She started to feel

923
00:48:51.360 --> 00:48:54.360
as though she had no identity outside of wife and mother.

924
00:48:55.159 --> 00:48:57.440
She had moved to Los Angeles to be famous, to

925
00:48:57.519 --> 00:49:00.559
pursue a life and the public eye. The public eye

926
00:49:00.639 --> 00:49:03.400
wasn't on her, it was on Phil. She was a

927
00:49:03.440 --> 00:49:07.719
supporting character. Phil was the protagonist, and that drove her crazy.

928
00:49:08.519 --> 00:49:12.320
At least. O'Hara Hartman, Phil's niece, thinks so quote she

929
00:49:12.480 --> 00:49:14.480
always wanted to be an actress, and I think she

930
00:49:14.679 --> 00:49:18.000
was jealous that Phil was. Do you remember, you know

931
00:49:18.079 --> 00:49:20.719
how the opening montage of SNL and they say the

932
00:49:20.880 --> 00:49:24.039
cast members and there's like a picture of them I

933
00:49:24.079 --> 00:49:27.159
think it was in Phil's like last few years. There

934
00:49:27.280 --> 00:49:30.119
was a picture of him sitting at a table at

935
00:49:30.119 --> 00:49:33.320
a restaurant or a diner and there is a blonde

936
00:49:33.360 --> 00:49:35.960
woman sitting next to him, and you can't see the

937
00:49:36.000 --> 00:49:39.119
blonde woman's face at all. Okay, that woman was Brent,

938
00:49:39.880 --> 00:49:42.719
and i'll show you the clip later. She has long,

939
00:49:42.880 --> 00:49:46.199
dangly earrings on and they're bobbing back and forth. And

940
00:49:46.280 --> 00:49:48.440
the reason the earrings are bobbing back and forth is

941
00:49:48.480 --> 00:49:51.079
she kept trying to look at the camera and it

942
00:49:51.400 --> 00:49:54.119
was ever filling. Was like, Brin, we don't want to

943
00:49:54.159 --> 00:49:56.559
see her face, We just need to see the back

944
00:49:56.639 --> 00:49:58.480
of her head. And she really wanted to be in

945
00:49:58.519 --> 00:49:58.840
the shot.

946
00:49:58.960 --> 00:49:59.639
Oh interesting.

947
00:50:00.559 --> 00:50:04.800
Grinn's jealousy, mixed with frustration over Phil's physical and emotional absence,

948
00:50:05.159 --> 00:50:09.360
led to an ever increasing frequency in their fighting. Many

949
00:50:09.440 --> 00:50:12.159
in the cast and crew on SNL were all too

950
00:50:12.199 --> 00:50:14.760
aware of the issues in the Hartman's marriage. Whether in

951
00:50:14.920 --> 00:50:17.840
person or over the phone, there was always serious discord

952
00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:21.360
in their relationship. Chris Rock said, quote, Phil had a

953
00:50:21.440 --> 00:50:24.199
weird marriage. He was always going through some shit with it,

954
00:50:24.679 --> 00:50:26.679
and I never liked to spend time with them as

955
00:50:26.719 --> 00:50:29.519
a couple. While Phil was in the middle of filming

956
00:50:29.599 --> 00:50:32.920
the nineteen ninety four comedy Greedy with Ed Begley Junior.

957
00:50:33.159 --> 00:50:36.000
One night he had made plans to meet at for dinner.

958
00:50:36.400 --> 00:50:40.039
On the night they were supposed to meet, Phil called Ed, Ed,

959
00:50:40.119 --> 00:50:40.760
can I talk to you?

960
00:50:41.239 --> 00:50:42.400
Of course you're okay?

961
00:50:42.760 --> 00:50:45.119
No, I'm not okay. Do I remember right? Do you

962
00:50:45.199 --> 00:50:46.599
have a guest room above your garage?

963
00:50:47.079 --> 00:50:47.960
Do you have a friend.

964
00:50:48.360 --> 00:50:50.280
No, it's for me Brennan and I. It's bad. It's

965
00:50:50.400 --> 00:50:52.400
very bad. We've split up and I can't stay there

966
00:50:52.440 --> 00:50:52.880
in the house.

967
00:50:53.480 --> 00:50:55.599
Come over, buddy, We'll go there right when we're done

968
00:50:55.639 --> 00:50:56.880
with work. I'll give you a key.

969
00:50:57.519 --> 00:50:59.800
Do you Rememberry there was a Ed Begley Junior like

970
00:51:00.199 --> 00:51:02.639
reality show. I used to be obsessed with that. Yeah,

971
00:51:02.639 --> 00:51:05.000
and I do remember. Like I think his office was

972
00:51:06.719 --> 00:51:09.360
and he had a bike, like an exercise bike, and

973
00:51:09.400 --> 00:51:13.119
he would like, Yeah, he would make toast by peddling

974
00:51:13.199 --> 00:51:16.719
his bike. Phil didn't end up going over to Ed's house.

975
00:51:16.880 --> 00:51:19.079
He never got an answer as to why, nor did

976
00:51:19.119 --> 00:51:21.840
he ask Ed didn't want to pry, but he assumed

977
00:51:21.840 --> 00:51:25.840
that Phil and Brynn had worked out their problems. Meanwhile,

978
00:51:25.960 --> 00:51:29.079
Phil's second wife, Lisa, became a sounding board for Phil's

979
00:51:29.079 --> 00:51:33.159
complaints about Brn. Phil had since apologized for the nasty

980
00:51:33.239 --> 00:51:36.400
note that Brynn had sent and his own idiotic behavior.

981
00:51:37.119 --> 00:51:39.920
He told Lisa all about the violent episodes when Brin's

982
00:51:39.960 --> 00:51:44.320
temper flared and she started to throw things. Phil complained

983
00:51:44.320 --> 00:51:47.960
about Brin's facelifts and boob jobs and ever increasing appetite

984
00:51:48.000 --> 00:51:52.159
for plastic surgeries, though there are complainting sources about just

985
00:51:52.280 --> 00:51:56.360
how upset Phil was about that. When Lisa heard that

986
00:51:56.480 --> 00:51:58.559
there was a gun in the house, she was shocked.

987
00:51:58.679 --> 00:52:01.320
She warned Phil and no one certain terms that Brynn

988
00:52:01.800 --> 00:52:05.280
should not have access to a gun. Phil brushed Lisa's

989
00:52:05.320 --> 00:52:10.119
warning off, saying that nothing's ever going to happen. In fact,

990
00:52:10.400 --> 00:52:13.000
Phil and Brynn both owned guns. Brenn had a Charter

991
00:52:13.239 --> 00:52:17.519
Arms thirty eight caliber, a tiny, easily concealed revolver that

992
00:52:17.639 --> 00:52:21.119
she'd had since living in Minnesota. Phil owned several guns

993
00:52:21.159 --> 00:52:24.079
over the course of his life. His most recent purchase

994
00:52:24.199 --> 00:52:27.039
was a Smith and Wesson thirty eight, a revolver similar

995
00:52:27.119 --> 00:52:29.719
to Brin's. He'd never been in a situation where he

996
00:52:29.760 --> 00:52:31.960
had to use a gun, but he said they made

997
00:52:32.039 --> 00:52:35.360
him feel safer, especially since he was a celebrity and

998
00:52:35.480 --> 00:52:39.559
a post manson murders world. In reality, Phil probably thought

999
00:52:39.599 --> 00:52:42.239
of them more as toys. He was always tinkering with

1000
00:52:42.360 --> 00:52:44.880
his boats and cars, and saw guns more as a

1001
00:52:45.000 --> 00:52:48.800
neat little curio than a tool of death. Brynn, through

1002
00:52:48.840 --> 00:52:53.360
Phil's connections, landed an occasional role. She delivered one line

1003
00:52:53.400 --> 00:52:57.039
in Rob Reiner's nineteen ninety four film North. This was

1004
00:52:57.119 --> 00:53:00.400
bound to be a great foothold for her had been

1005
00:53:00.480 --> 00:53:04.480
on a legendary run, pumping out several nineteen eighties masterpieces,

1006
00:53:04.559 --> 00:53:08.000
including This Is Spinal Tap, stand By Me, The Princess Bride,

1007
00:53:08.000 --> 00:53:11.239
When Harry Met Sally, Misery, and a few good Men.

1008
00:53:11.440 --> 00:53:12.880
This was like a pretty incredible run.

1009
00:53:13.199 --> 00:53:16.119
It's like the whole nineteen eighties, like every film right there.

1010
00:53:16.719 --> 00:53:19.400
Few expected the reception of North to be as chilly

1011
00:53:19.440 --> 00:53:22.760
as it was. The film tanked both critically and financially,

1012
00:53:23.119 --> 00:53:26.920
making only twelve million dollars after it cost forty million

1013
00:53:27.000 --> 00:53:30.719
dollars to produce. Oh today, it still has a reputation

1014
00:53:30.880 --> 00:53:34.119
for being one of the worst Hollywood movies ever made.

1015
00:53:34.719 --> 00:53:38.079
Brynn failed to land any more acting jobs. The Stink

1016
00:53:38.159 --> 00:53:41.519
of North's failure was a factor, but to be frank,

1017
00:53:41.880 --> 00:53:45.880
Brinn was not a particularly talented actress. She was just

1018
00:53:45.960 --> 00:53:49.159
another person in Los Angeles who lacked star power, but

1019
00:53:49.400 --> 00:53:52.119
she was married to a guy who was really making it.

1020
00:53:52.599 --> 00:53:55.039
Instead of being happy for her husband and enjoying the

1021
00:53:55.079 --> 00:53:58.480
fruits of his labor, she was angry, jealous, and frustrated.

1022
00:53:58.960 --> 00:54:02.000
She wanted to be as she kind of sounds like

1023
00:54:02.119 --> 00:54:02.880
Lucy Ricardo.

1024
00:54:04.000 --> 00:54:06.119
Okay, steal ball, Yeah, yeah.

1025
00:54:05.960 --> 00:54:08.119
I love Lucy. He always wanted to be a star.

1026
00:54:08.679 --> 00:54:11.400
Oh, I guess I've for I guess I had forgotten

1027
00:54:11.440 --> 00:54:14.320
about the theme of that show, But now I remember.

1028
00:54:14.960 --> 00:54:18.119
Phil left SNL in nineteen ninety four after eight years.

1029
00:54:18.559 --> 00:54:20.719
He was getting less screen time and felt like he

1030
00:54:20.880 --> 00:54:23.960
was being pushed out by the younger cast members. He'd

1031
00:54:23.960 --> 00:54:27.000
appeared in one hundred and fifty three shows, a record

1032
00:54:27.079 --> 00:54:30.039
that has since been broken. Do you know who broke

1033
00:54:30.079 --> 00:54:30.519
that record?

1034
00:54:30.719 --> 00:54:32.360
I'm gonna guess Keenan Thompson.

1035
00:54:32.599 --> 00:54:35.719
Yes, I don't know the exact number of episodes that

1036
00:54:35.760 --> 00:54:38.320
he's been in, but he's been in over fifteen hundred

1037
00:54:38.440 --> 00:54:41.320
sketches and he's been on the show for over twenty years.

1038
00:54:41.400 --> 00:54:42.519
Wow, that's amazing.

1039
00:54:42.800 --> 00:54:46.440
Yeah. At Phil's final show, he was presented with a

1040
00:54:46.599 --> 00:54:50.000
bottle of clearwood glue secured to a small pedestal as

1041
00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:50.719
a parting gift.

1042
00:54:51.440 --> 00:54:54.719
He was very touched, as were you apparently, also.

1043
00:54:56.880 --> 00:54:58.159
We'll be back after a break.

1044
00:55:05.480 --> 00:55:08.760
Phil began making a huge amount of money doing voiceover work.

1045
00:55:09.079 --> 00:55:12.360
His largest single paycheck was one point two million dollars

1046
00:55:12.440 --> 00:55:15.320
for his work with McDonald's. That is a pretty good paycheck.

1047
00:55:16.400 --> 00:55:19.320
He bought a mansion in Encino and began amassing a

1048
00:55:19.400 --> 00:55:23.039
collection of boats. He also purchased a plane, a single

1049
00:55:23.119 --> 00:55:27.000
prop TB two hundred Tobago XL, which I'm told is

1050
00:55:27.039 --> 00:55:31.119
a very nice plane. Now free of SNL's long hours

1051
00:55:31.159 --> 00:55:34.119
and heavy workload, and with millions of dollars in his pockets,

1052
00:55:34.239 --> 00:55:36.559
he had more time to spend with Brinn and the kids,

1053
00:55:36.920 --> 00:55:40.280
at least in theory. While he wasn't an absent father,

1054
00:55:40.480 --> 00:55:43.039
he wasn't around anywhere near as much as Brynn would

1055
00:55:43.079 --> 00:55:46.679
have liked. She was lonely. Phil was always out surfing

1056
00:55:46.880 --> 00:55:49.400
or flying his plane, which he described as a way

1057
00:55:49.480 --> 00:55:52.079
to get away from it all. When Phil was at home,

1058
00:55:52.159 --> 00:55:56.800
he retreated, needing time alone. Brynn considered divorced. During this time,

1059
00:55:57.519 --> 00:55:59.800
a lawyer friend talked her out of it. He told

1060
00:55:59.840 --> 00:56:02.079
her to wait until the marriage was ten years old.

1061
00:56:02.400 --> 00:56:06.800
This would supposedly ensure a more substantial settlement. That does

1062
00:56:06.880 --> 00:56:08.920
not seem like the best reason to stay in a

1063
00:56:09.000 --> 00:56:09.599
marriage to me.

1064
00:56:10.480 --> 00:56:12.039
I do think she really loved Phil.

1065
00:56:13.039 --> 00:56:16.119
Post SNL, Phil was trying to make an eponymous pilot,

1066
00:56:16.239 --> 00:56:19.000
but it was proving more challenging than he had anticipated.

1067
00:56:19.599 --> 00:56:22.920
After NBC passed on The Phil Show, he decided to

1068
00:56:22.960 --> 00:56:26.039
take a role on a promising new show, News Radio,

1069
00:56:26.519 --> 00:56:29.440
created by Phil Simms, who had written for Letterman and

1070
00:56:29.599 --> 00:56:32.920
The Larry Sanders Show. One of your all time favorite shows, right.

1071
00:56:34.079 --> 00:56:36.880
You're thinking of the Gary Shandling. Oh, that's the one

1072
00:56:36.920 --> 00:56:39.480
that I really loved. But the Larry Sanders Show was

1073
00:56:39.480 --> 00:56:40.280
also really great.

1074
00:56:40.360 --> 00:56:45.280
Gotcha? Phil played arrogant, bombastic newscaster Bill McNeil.

1075
00:56:46.239 --> 00:56:48.000
There's really nothing they can do but the fact that

1076
00:56:48.039 --> 00:56:49.480
we're snowed in, So why don't we just sit down

1077
00:56:49.519 --> 00:56:50.280
and wait patiently?

1078
00:56:50.639 --> 00:56:52.880
Sorry, my friend, I don't play that game.

1079
00:56:54.880 --> 00:56:57.480
Please don't make a scene. We're not in New York.

1080
00:56:57.840 --> 00:57:01.920
We're not You're kidding, And I almost mistook the museum

1081
00:57:02.000 --> 00:57:03.760
of yarn for the Guggenheim.

1082
00:57:05.280 --> 00:57:06.960
Have you ever heard the expression that when life gives

1083
00:57:06.960 --> 00:57:08.840
you lemons, you should just make lemonade?

1084
00:57:09.639 --> 00:57:09.920
Great?

1085
00:57:10.280 --> 00:57:12.440
I knew it four days in the Midwest, and you've

1086
00:57:12.480 --> 00:57:14.000
already reverted right back to.

1087
00:57:14.079 --> 00:57:15.280
What you were Now.

1088
00:57:15.480 --> 00:57:19.000
This is who I am, though I'm a polite, reasonable,

1089
00:57:19.119 --> 00:57:19.920
friendly person.

1090
00:57:20.440 --> 00:57:23.079
You're like one of those trained police attack dogs they

1091
00:57:23.159 --> 00:57:25.159
set loose in the wild and it goes all soft

1092
00:57:25.199 --> 00:57:29.440
and gets eaten by a deer or something. What Have

1093
00:57:29.559 --> 00:57:32.320
you ever heard the expression, when life gives you lemons,

1094
00:57:32.440 --> 00:57:34.360
make lemonade and then toss it in the face of

1095
00:57:34.400 --> 00:57:36.039
the person who gave you the lemons until they give

1096
00:57:36.079 --> 00:57:38.079
you the oranges you asked for in the first place.

1097
00:57:40.280 --> 00:57:42.800
I just I wish you could be here long enough

1098
00:57:42.840 --> 00:57:44.480
to get the full Midwestern experience.

1099
00:57:44.760 --> 00:57:47.079
Maybe another time that would be great. I think I

1100
00:57:47.159 --> 00:57:49.400
think a good hunting accident would really open up your mind.

1101
00:57:51.519 --> 00:57:52.480
It was such a great show.

1102
00:57:52.519 --> 00:57:53.639
It's a really good show.

1103
00:57:53.719 --> 00:57:56.920
I love Dave Foley too, so he wasn't the lead,

1104
00:57:57.039 --> 00:57:59.920
but Phil got the best laughs each episode by delivering

1105
00:58:00.239 --> 00:58:04.719
devastatingly witty one liners and insults. At forty seven, Phil

1106
00:58:04.880 --> 00:58:08.199
was ready to have a more predictable schedule. Again, Phil

1107
00:58:08.280 --> 00:58:11.599
found himself as the elder statesman of the cast. He

1108
00:58:11.760 --> 00:58:15.079
served as therapist, financial advisor, and dad to some of

1109
00:58:15.119 --> 00:58:18.639
the younger cast members, who he adored. He said, quote,

1110
00:58:18.760 --> 00:58:20.840
not since Taxi has there been a show with so

1111
00:58:20.960 --> 00:58:24.400
many performers capable of just waltzing out there and swatting

1112
00:58:24.480 --> 00:58:26.840
one out of the park. There's a lot of affection

1113
00:58:27.000 --> 00:58:29.360
between the cast members too, which is another thing you

1114
00:58:29.480 --> 00:58:33.000
can't take for granted. Everyone seems to genuinely like and

1115
00:58:33.119 --> 00:58:36.079
respect each other, so it's a very pleasant work environment.

1116
00:58:37.679 --> 00:58:41.039
After working on ultra competitive SNL for many years, he

1117
00:58:41.239 --> 00:58:45.320
enjoyed working together with an ensemble cast. Brinn began to

1118
00:58:45.400 --> 00:58:48.880
suspect Phil was having an affair. He always pulled away

1119
00:58:48.960 --> 00:58:52.079
whenever she initiated sex, a problem he had also had

1120
00:58:52.199 --> 00:58:55.480
with his second wife, Lisa. He made no secret of

1121
00:58:55.519 --> 00:58:59.559
his attraction to other women. According to Steve Small, Phil's

1122
00:58:59.599 --> 00:59:02.840
friend and lawyer who had handled his previous two divorces,

1123
00:59:03.519 --> 00:59:05.840
Phil once mentioned that Brynn was mad at him for

1124
00:59:05.920 --> 00:59:09.440
an offhand comment. A female neighbor had stopped by to

1125
00:59:09.559 --> 00:59:13.599
chit chat. After she left, Phil turned to Brynn and said, wow,

1126
00:59:13.800 --> 00:59:18.280
she has great looking tits. Steve Small was astounded why

1127
00:59:18.360 --> 00:59:21.400
on earth would Phil say that? Indeed, why on earth

1128
00:59:21.400 --> 00:59:26.199
would Phil say that? Phil began taking regular weekend trips

1129
00:59:26.239 --> 00:59:29.880
to Catalina with his friend Britt Maren Brynn hired a

1130
00:59:29.960 --> 00:59:33.639
private investigator to follow them. She suspected that they were

1131
00:59:33.679 --> 00:59:37.239
either seeing women on Catalina or maybe sleeping with each other.

1132
00:59:38.000 --> 00:59:41.199
That would have explained why he seemed so uninterested in her.

1133
00:59:42.199 --> 00:59:45.159
The PI trailed them all weekend, took photos and so on,

1134
00:59:45.440 --> 00:59:48.760
but he found no evidence of any infidelity on Phil's part,

1135
00:59:49.199 --> 00:59:53.239
neither with women nor with men. Phil's brother John said

1136
00:59:53.280 --> 00:59:56.880
he never had an affair on Conan O'Brien. Phil once

1137
00:59:57.000 --> 00:59:59.920
said quote, I'm up to my elbows in a midlife crisis.

1138
01:00:00.079 --> 01:00:02.960
Let's be honest. I can't cheat on my wife. She's psychic.

1139
01:00:03.440 --> 01:00:05.880
If I look at another woman, she comes home and says,

1140
01:00:06.199 --> 01:00:09.880
who's Laura? I go, I didn't get a name. She's

1141
01:00:09.920 --> 01:00:15.320
a Sagittarius, you know, so I buy toys. Unquote snl

1142
01:00:15.400 --> 01:00:19.159
alum Julia Sweeney said quote, I think eventually Phil didn't

1143
01:00:19.199 --> 01:00:22.039
care as much. He wasn't looking at her anymore. It

1144
01:00:22.119 --> 01:00:25.320
happens in any marriage. You're not going, oh my god anymore,

1145
01:00:25.840 --> 01:00:28.360
And along with other things, that was a really painful

1146
01:00:28.440 --> 01:00:31.000
thing for her. He wasn't as excited to be with

1147
01:00:31.119 --> 01:00:34.519
her as he had been, and I just felt so sad. Also,

1148
01:00:34.679 --> 01:00:37.480
I thought, God, Phil doesn't even see that Brinn is

1149
01:00:37.519 --> 01:00:40.159
also one of those girls who is also pretty interesting.

1150
01:00:40.800 --> 01:00:43.400
You'd think he's got a gold mine because he married

1151
01:00:43.440 --> 01:00:45.800
her for her looks, and not even so much for

1152
01:00:45.880 --> 01:00:48.239
her looks, but for how the world looked at him

1153
01:00:48.280 --> 01:00:50.679
when he was with her, and when that wears off,

1154
01:00:50.800 --> 01:00:53.480
because it wears off. If it were me, i'd go,

1155
01:00:53.719 --> 01:00:57.320
oh my god, and I accidentally also married an interesting person.

1156
01:00:57.679 --> 01:01:00.800
But I don't think he could see that. Unquote, at

1157
01:01:00.840 --> 01:01:03.199
this point, you might be saying to yourself, these two

1158
01:01:03.280 --> 01:01:06.079
don't seem very compatible, so why are they staying together.

1159
01:01:06.760 --> 01:01:10.719
There were a multitude of potential reasons. There were financial ones.

1160
01:01:11.119 --> 01:01:13.719
Brynn was trying to stick around until ten years went

1161
01:01:13.800 --> 01:01:16.840
by so she could potentially get more of their joint holdings.

1162
01:01:17.440 --> 01:01:20.159
Phil had already been divorced twice, but both of the

1163
01:01:20.239 --> 01:01:24.320
previous times he was comparably quite poor. This time he

1164
01:01:24.400 --> 01:01:27.360
had a lot more to lose. They had kids, which

1165
01:01:27.440 --> 01:01:30.960
is a complicating factor in divorce proceedings. They were both vain,

1166
01:01:31.679 --> 01:01:34.639
divorce would be tabloid fodder, and they wanted to keep

1167
01:01:34.719 --> 01:01:39.079
up appearances. Divorce would be admitting to failure. This would

1168
01:01:39.119 --> 01:01:42.760
be Brynn's second and Phil's third, and while Phil was

1169
01:01:42.840 --> 01:01:45.920
no longer a practicing Catholic, perhaps he still felt guilty

1170
01:01:45.960 --> 01:01:49.480
about that. Both adored their kids and both wanted a

1171
01:01:49.559 --> 01:01:52.719
place in their lives. The Hartman's employed a nanny, but

1172
01:01:52.880 --> 01:01:56.760
Brynn was Shan and Bergen's primary caregiver. By all accounts,

1173
01:01:56.840 --> 01:02:00.280
she was a fantastic mother. Friends described her as payatient,

1174
01:02:00.519 --> 01:02:04.199
loving and engaged. She volunteered at their schools and was

1175
01:02:04.360 --> 01:02:07.400
very sweet with them. Phil loved being a dad, but

1176
01:02:07.639 --> 01:02:09.960
much like being a husband, he was a dad when

1177
01:02:10.039 --> 01:02:13.679
it fit into his schedule. His work, hobbies, and downtime

1178
01:02:13.880 --> 01:02:16.960
came first. Do you know if they had a prenup.

1179
01:02:17.760 --> 01:02:21.079
I don't know, But Phil had already been divorced twice

1180
01:02:21.719 --> 01:02:24.400
and he was starting to become you know, he had

1181
01:02:24.440 --> 01:02:28.039
more assets, so I would guess they probably did. Yeah,

1182
01:02:28.039 --> 01:02:30.199
I would think, because she kind of wanted to wait

1183
01:02:30.480 --> 01:02:33.679
for ten years. That tells me that maybe there was

1184
01:02:33.719 --> 01:02:35.880
something in the prenup. Look after seven years, you get

1185
01:02:35.920 --> 01:02:36.840
this much after ten.

1186
01:02:36.840 --> 01:02:38.400
Years, right, Yeah, that would make sense.

1187
01:02:38.440 --> 01:02:40.400
I think our prenup was like you said, like after

1188
01:02:40.519 --> 01:02:46.239
seventy five years. Yes, we should note a few things

1189
01:02:46.239 --> 01:02:49.679
about Bryn's addiction. She did not just recklessly decide one

1190
01:02:49.760 --> 01:02:52.239
day that she was going to get drunk and snort cocaine. Again.

1191
01:02:52.639 --> 01:02:55.679
Brinn was privileged and had access to resources that not

1192
01:02:55.880 --> 01:02:59.559
every recovering attict does. But even in her position, it's

1193
01:02:59.599 --> 01:03:02.440
not easy to shake addiction. It had a firm grasp

1194
01:03:02.519 --> 01:03:06.880
on her, and she was insecure, depressed, anxious, frustrated, and

1195
01:03:07.039 --> 01:03:10.239
bored living in Fill's shadow. She yearned to feel better,

1196
01:03:10.400 --> 01:03:14.239
but her partner was frequently absent, both physically and emotionally,

1197
01:03:14.440 --> 01:03:18.000
and failed to support her. She was often invisible to Fill.

1198
01:03:18.800 --> 01:03:21.599
He was providing for her financially, but he didn't realize

1199
01:03:21.639 --> 01:03:25.280
her needs were greater. When someone relapses, it's usually because

1200
01:03:25.320 --> 01:03:27.760
they are driven to it by the conditions they're living in.

1201
01:03:28.599 --> 01:03:31.719
For many, drugs serve as a way to escape their reality.

1202
01:03:32.599 --> 01:03:36.119
All is to say that Brynn relapsed. Her sister Kathy Wright,

1203
01:03:36.320 --> 01:03:39.199
said that in nineteen ninety seven, Brinn spoke with her

1204
01:03:39.280 --> 01:03:42.440
on the phone. She had mentioned that she slipped, and

1205
01:03:42.679 --> 01:03:45.599
Kathy knew what that meant. Brinn started slow for she

1206
01:03:45.719 --> 01:03:48.480
started drinking again, just one drink here or there socially,

1207
01:03:48.920 --> 01:03:52.719
but one drink soon became two or more. Then Brynn

1208
01:03:52.760 --> 01:03:55.920
fell off the wagon completely and began steadily using cocaine again.

1209
01:03:56.400 --> 01:03:59.320
On Mother's Day in nineteen ninety seven, this became apparent

1210
01:03:59.440 --> 01:04:03.000
to fill. Bryn vanished without a trace. She returned the

1211
01:04:03.039 --> 01:04:05.840
next morning, Hi is a Kite. Phil told her that

1212
01:04:05.960 --> 01:04:07.920
she needed to go to rehab, and so she did.

1213
01:04:08.719 --> 01:04:12.480
Gren briefly stayed at the Sierra Tucson Treatment Center in Arizona,

1214
01:04:13.320 --> 01:04:16.239
but she was not able to maintain her sobriety. The

1215
01:04:16.320 --> 01:04:19.679
following period was the worst of Phil and Brinn's relationship.

1216
01:04:20.119 --> 01:04:24.159
Bren's hostility towards Phil became outwardly visible to everybody in

1217
01:04:24.199 --> 01:04:26.920
their lives. He started sleeping on his boat, and he

1218
01:04:26.960 --> 01:04:29.280
would show up to work with scratches on his face.

1219
01:04:29.920 --> 01:04:33.360
Joe Rogan, Phil's news radio castmate, was there to witness

1220
01:04:33.400 --> 01:04:37.119
Phil and Brin's tenuous relationship in person. Here he is

1221
01:04:37.360 --> 01:04:39.199
on his podcast talking about them.

1222
01:04:39.639 --> 01:04:42.159
I tried to get him to divorce that lady. A

1223
01:04:42.239 --> 01:04:44.639
bunch of times. I was working with him, yeah, because

1224
01:04:45.039 --> 01:04:47.320
they would fight, like crazy fights where he would just

1225
01:04:47.519 --> 01:04:49.440
disappear for a couple he would leave the house. And

1226
01:04:50.159 --> 01:04:51.719
he was telling me he wanted to get divorced, but

1227
01:04:51.800 --> 01:04:54.559
he did want the lawyers to take a third because.

1228
01:04:54.280 --> 01:04:56.480
It's like I was, I just care, how about just half?

1229
01:04:56.800 --> 01:05:00.239
No? No, no, it's two thirds. So the lawyer takes

1230
01:05:00.280 --> 01:05:01.840
a This is what he was telling me. It's like,

1231
01:05:02.079 --> 01:05:03.639
I go, just give her half. You're always going to

1232
01:05:03.719 --> 01:05:07.039
make money. Just get out, be free, just be you know.

1233
01:05:07.360 --> 01:05:09.760
And he was terrified of that. He was terrified of leaving.

1234
01:05:10.239 --> 01:05:13.159
They hated each other. They loved each other, and they

1235
01:05:13.199 --> 01:05:15.119
hated each other. You know, it's one of those deals.

1236
01:05:15.280 --> 01:05:18.679
Like she would insult him publicly. It was it was

1237
01:05:18.880 --> 01:05:22.840
rough man, and you know, I was just saying, like

1238
01:05:23.480 --> 01:05:25.719
you're a great guy, Like you don't need to be

1239
01:05:25.800 --> 01:05:28.199
going through this. Yeah, like you need to get divorced

1240
01:05:28.280 --> 01:05:32.079
and have you know, share custody your kids and try

1241
01:05:32.159 --> 01:05:35.079
to set an example and just not you can't do this.

1242
01:05:35.800 --> 01:05:38.800
Like the fighting was so bad, it was and he

1243
01:05:38.880 --> 01:05:40.519
hated it. He didn't want to be married to her.

1244
01:05:40.599 --> 01:05:41.920
He was he was stuck.

1245
01:05:42.719 --> 01:05:44.840
I wish that Phil had listened to Joe Rogan.

1246
01:05:45.840 --> 01:05:49.000
However you feel about Joe Rogan. He was close friends

1247
01:05:49.039 --> 01:05:52.280
with Phil Hartman, and I watched a lot of clips

1248
01:05:52.320 --> 01:05:55.760
of Joe and he you can tell, really cared for Phil,

1249
01:05:55.920 --> 01:05:57.920
and a lot of the clips he got really emotional

1250
01:05:58.000 --> 01:05:59.320
and he was he was crying.

1251
01:05:59.599 --> 01:06:01.039
Yeah, I'm sure that's true.

1252
01:06:01.880 --> 01:06:05.280
Julia Sweeney said that Phil and Brinn's already rocky communication

1253
01:06:05.519 --> 01:06:09.920
was made worse by their dependency on their substances of choice. Quote.

1254
01:06:10.320 --> 01:06:13.800
She was definitely high energy, and this is without doing coke.

1255
01:06:14.239 --> 01:06:16.519
She kind of had a nervous, brimming edge to her

1256
01:06:16.599 --> 01:06:20.000
and Phil was like, hey man, it's all gonna be fine.

1257
01:06:21.000 --> 01:06:23.440
And then when they got frustrated with each other, Phil

1258
01:06:23.480 --> 01:06:26.880
would smoke pot and she would do cocaine. So just

1259
01:06:27.079 --> 01:06:31.440
imagine and to quote. On New Year's Eve nineteen ninety seven,

1260
01:06:31.480 --> 01:06:34.559
there was a particularly dramatic incident at the Hartman's New

1261
01:06:34.639 --> 01:06:38.800
Year's Eve bash. Andy Dick, notorious creep and Predator, was

1262
01:06:38.920 --> 01:06:42.199
among the attendees. As a fellow cast member of News Radio,

1263
01:06:43.199 --> 01:06:46.760
Andy was publicly known for his substance abuse issues. Sometime

1264
01:06:46.840 --> 01:06:49.840
during the party, Brand and Andy slipped into the bathroom together.

1265
01:06:50.039 --> 01:06:53.199
They locked the door behind them. They proceeded to snort

1266
01:06:53.280 --> 01:06:56.639
lines of cocaine. When other partygoers banged down the door

1267
01:06:56.679 --> 01:06:59.880
and screamed begging Brenda come out, she did not acknowledge them.

1268
01:07:00.480 --> 01:07:03.760
Andy Dick has been characterized as a bad influence on Brinn,

1269
01:07:04.480 --> 01:07:07.639
but when prompted to look back on that night, he says, quote,

1270
01:07:07.840 --> 01:07:10.400
she is somebody that that night wanted to get high.

1271
01:07:10.559 --> 01:07:13.000
I don't know anything about her past. I don't know

1272
01:07:13.079 --> 01:07:16.519
any of that end quote. Andy was hardly an evil

1273
01:07:16.599 --> 01:07:20.039
mastermind luring her back to coke. She was likely already using,

1274
01:07:20.519 --> 01:07:23.480
but he was a catalyst and what eventually culminated in

1275
01:07:23.639 --> 01:07:24.920
Brn's mental breakdown.

1276
01:07:25.119 --> 01:07:25.320
Yeah.

1277
01:07:25.320 --> 01:07:27.880
I get the feeling that Andy Dick is a bad

1278
01:07:27.920 --> 01:07:30.760
influence on probably pretty much anybody he hangs out with.

1279
01:07:31.239 --> 01:07:35.519
Yeah, there's Reddit threads about Andy and people that have

1280
01:07:35.679 --> 01:07:40.239
had negative experiences with him in and around Los Angeles,

1281
01:07:40.360 --> 01:07:44.039
and I think he's been homeless here and there. Yeah,

1282
01:07:44.079 --> 01:07:49.159
he's definitely struggled with substance abuse and just horrible behavior

1283
01:07:49.239 --> 01:07:53.280
and violence and aggression. And I have to say, though

1284
01:07:53.320 --> 01:07:56.440
on news radio, though he was super funny, he is

1285
01:07:56.679 --> 01:07:59.039
very funny. He's very talented. It's really sad.

1286
01:07:59.199 --> 01:07:59.400
Yeah.

1287
01:08:00.280 --> 01:08:03.000
Phil's friend Steve Small said quote Phil had made it

1288
01:08:03.199 --> 01:08:05.679
very clear that if she started using drugs again that

1289
01:08:05.760 --> 01:08:08.400
he would end the relationship. She had to get amped

1290
01:08:08.480 --> 01:08:10.679
up to get his attention, and when she got amped up,

1291
01:08:11.000 --> 01:08:14.039
he would simply go to sleep. He would withdraw, and

1292
01:08:14.159 --> 01:08:16.880
in the morning he'd wake up and everything would be fine.

1293
01:08:18.000 --> 01:08:21.439
In April, Brynn began to take Zoloft, prescribed by her psychiatrist,

1294
01:08:21.560 --> 01:08:28.199
doctor Arthur Cireski. Zoloft, an ssri, or selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor,

1295
01:08:28.920 --> 01:08:33.760
is typically used to treat clinical depression, anxiety, and or OCD.

1296
01:08:34.359 --> 01:08:38.039
In Brynn's case, she was prescribed Zoloft for symptoms of depression.

1297
01:08:38.840 --> 01:08:42.159
It's unknown if Seroski knew that Brynn was using cocaine

1298
01:08:42.199 --> 01:08:46.119
and drinking alcohol. Likely he did not know. SSRIs can

1299
01:08:46.359 --> 01:08:49.840
have side effects of varying degree depending on the neurochemistry

1300
01:08:50.239 --> 01:08:53.920
of the person taking them. They should definitely not be

1301
01:08:54.119 --> 01:08:58.439
used with hard drugs and alcohol. SSRIs can interact with

1302
01:08:58.520 --> 01:09:02.880
drugs and unforeseen ways, sometimes amplifying their effects. Brin took

1303
01:09:02.960 --> 01:09:05.720
Zoloft for a week, but stopped due to the side effects,

1304
01:09:05.760 --> 01:09:10.520
including intense nausea and insomnia, both of which are relatively

1305
01:09:10.640 --> 01:09:15.279
common for people first starting to take SSRIs. In early

1306
01:09:15.359 --> 01:09:17.880
May nineteen ninety eight, Brynn tried to get into rehab

1307
01:09:17.960 --> 01:09:21.079
once again. This time she wanted to go to Promises.

1308
01:09:21.239 --> 01:09:25.800
The luxury rehab facility in Malibu, California, favored by celebrities

1309
01:09:25.880 --> 01:09:29.720
and the wealthy. Promises only loosely meets the definition of

1310
01:09:29.800 --> 01:09:33.600
a recovery program that follows what is called the Malibu model.

1311
01:09:34.319 --> 01:09:37.680
Patients can leave the facility for meetings or haircuts. There

1312
01:09:37.720 --> 01:09:41.000
are no limits on visitors and no peer groups. Most

1313
01:09:41.079 --> 01:09:44.920
rehab facilities, by contrast, are very strict about visitors and

1314
01:09:45.039 --> 01:09:47.560
mandate you stay for a minimum of twenty eight days

1315
01:09:47.920 --> 01:09:51.680
and emphasize peer groups as a key part of recovery.

1316
01:09:52.479 --> 01:09:54.960
But Brynn couldn't get into Promises. They were filled to

1317
01:09:55.000 --> 01:09:59.000
the brim with celebrity clientele. Phil's father had died a

1318
01:09:59.119 --> 01:10:02.079
month earlier, and he was dealing with his grief, caring

1319
01:10:02.159 --> 01:10:05.560
for his mother, and making a movie, so he may

1320
01:10:05.640 --> 01:10:08.079
not have been as tuned into Brynn's needs as he

1321
01:10:08.159 --> 01:10:11.840
could have been. As usual. A month after Brynn quit

1322
01:10:11.960 --> 01:10:14.520
taking Zola for the first time. She again complained to

1323
01:10:14.640 --> 01:10:18.760
doctor Sarowski about depression. He recommended that she try a

1324
01:10:18.840 --> 01:10:21.880
half dose. In the final days of his life, Feeling

1325
01:10:21.960 --> 01:10:26.119
introspective and prescient, while talking to his friend Cassandra Peterson,

1326
01:10:26.159 --> 01:10:29.479
Phil said quote, if I die tomorrow, I would know

1327
01:10:29.760 --> 01:10:31.840
that I have had a better life than anyone could

1328
01:10:31.880 --> 01:10:35.279
have ever dreamed of having. It has so far outweighed

1329
01:10:35.319 --> 01:10:39.119
my expectations. I've got a beautiful wife, two beautiful children,

1330
01:10:39.479 --> 01:10:41.039
and I'm the luckiest man alive.

1331
01:10:41.279 --> 01:10:44.239
Oh that makes me very sad to hear that. And

1332
01:10:44.479 --> 01:10:47.319
now we're back where we started. The evening of Wednesday,

1333
01:10:47.439 --> 01:10:51.199
May twenty seventh, nineteen ninety eight, Phil, as was often

1334
01:10:51.239 --> 01:10:53.800
the case, wasn't home. He was out at the Van

1335
01:10:53.920 --> 01:10:57.479
Nuys Airport playing with his plane. Wrinn left the children

1336
01:10:57.560 --> 01:10:59.159
in the care of the nanny, then went out for

1337
01:10:59.279 --> 01:11:02.399
drinks with her friend Christine Xander, a writer on Third

1338
01:11:02.520 --> 01:11:05.920
Rock from the Sun, at Buca di Beppo. Brynn drank

1339
01:11:06.000 --> 01:11:09.680
two cosmopolitans and half of a beer. She didn't eat anything.

1340
01:11:10.279 --> 01:11:13.399
The women gossiped for two hours before Christine called it

1341
01:11:13.479 --> 01:11:17.000
a night. Brynn was just getting started, She called Ron

1342
01:11:17.079 --> 01:11:19.760
Douglas to see if he wanted to hang out. Brynn

1343
01:11:19.880 --> 01:11:22.680
arrived at ten fifteen PM and had a few more beers.

1344
01:11:23.199 --> 01:11:26.439
She left at twelve forty five. At some point during

1345
01:11:26.520 --> 01:11:29.079
Bryn's night out, Phil had returned home and sent the

1346
01:11:29.199 --> 01:11:32.880
nanny on her way. Neighbors report that Brynn made it

1347
01:11:32.960 --> 01:11:36.840
home sometime around one am. They heard yelling from inside

1348
01:11:36.840 --> 01:11:39.880
of the house and one word repeated over and over again.

1349
01:11:40.239 --> 01:11:45.239
It was a woman's voice, sorry, sorry, sorry. Sometime between

1350
01:11:45.279 --> 01:11:49.039
the hours of one am and three AM, Brynn snorted cocaine,

1351
01:11:49.439 --> 01:11:52.600
likely had more to drink, and made a very reckless choice.

1352
01:11:52.680 --> 01:11:56.680
While under the influence, She retrieved Phil's Smith and Wesson

1353
01:11:56.760 --> 01:12:00.560
revolver from the lock box, aimed it, cocked it, and

1354
01:12:00.920 --> 01:12:04.239
tragically shot Phil three times while he slept in their bed.

1355
01:12:05.239 --> 01:12:08.359
The bullets ripped through his neck, chest and skull. Death

1356
01:12:08.520 --> 01:12:12.800
was instant. Phil probably didn't even feel it. Brynn panicked

1357
01:12:12.840 --> 01:12:15.640
as adrenaline course through her body and forced her out

1358
01:12:15.680 --> 01:12:20.119
of her drug induced mania shoelss. Devastated and confused, Bryn

1359
01:12:20.319 --> 01:12:23.359
drove back to Ron Douglas's house and practically broke his

1360
01:12:23.479 --> 01:12:26.119
door down at four a m. Shouting that she had

1361
01:12:26.199 --> 01:12:30.279
just killed her husband. Ron thought that Bryn must be delusional,

1362
01:12:30.479 --> 01:12:32.800
or perhaps she was using the word kill in some

1363
01:12:33.000 --> 01:12:36.359
sort of metaphorical way. He didn't think that Brynn could

1364
01:12:36.439 --> 01:12:40.399
kill anybody, much less her husband. Before Ron could question

1365
01:12:40.560 --> 01:12:43.680
Bryn further, she passed out on the floor, overwhelmed by

1366
01:12:43.720 --> 01:12:46.520
the amount of drugs in her body. He shook her

1367
01:12:46.560 --> 01:12:49.000
awake and tried to keep her that way, concerned that

1368
01:12:49.119 --> 01:12:52.199
she would choke on her vomit if she remained unconscious,

1369
01:12:52.920 --> 01:12:55.920
a wise choice, as Brynn did vomit quite a lot.

1370
01:12:56.680 --> 01:12:59.039
She spent the next two hours emptying her stomach in

1371
01:12:59.119 --> 01:13:01.720
the bathroom while Ron brought her mugs of hot tea

1372
01:13:01.840 --> 01:13:07.239
to sober her up. Brynn, slightly sobered, went to her purse. Fumbling,

1373
01:13:07.399 --> 01:13:10.560
not completely in control of her fine motor skills, she

1374
01:13:10.680 --> 01:13:14.000
spilled the contents, including a smith and Wesson pistol, out

1375
01:13:14.119 --> 01:13:18.920
onto the floor. They both stared at the gun. Brynn shouted, see,

1376
01:13:19.119 --> 01:13:22.920
I told you I killed Phil. Ron snatched up the weapon.

1377
01:13:23.520 --> 01:13:26.600
He understood that Brynn was in no condition to handle firearms.

1378
01:13:27.119 --> 01:13:29.800
He still didn't let himself believe her words, but his

1379
01:13:30.000 --> 01:13:34.159
concern was growing. After she had sobered up slightly, around

1380
01:13:34.199 --> 01:13:37.720
six a m. Brynn drove home, while Ron followed closely

1381
01:13:37.840 --> 01:13:40.800
right behind her. He dreaded what he might find in

1382
01:13:40.880 --> 01:13:44.479
the Hartman's house. She drove with the reckless abandon you

1383
01:13:44.600 --> 01:13:48.439
might expect from somebody who's just murdered their spouse. Traffic

1384
01:13:48.520 --> 01:13:52.000
lights and lanes were not acknowledged. Using her cell phone,

1385
01:13:52.039 --> 01:13:55.920
Brynn called her friend Judy. Brynn said, I just killed Phil.

1386
01:13:56.680 --> 01:13:59.800
Judy asked, where are you. Brynn said, I don't know,

1387
01:14:00.039 --> 01:14:03.800
I don't know. My life is over. Ron parked down

1388
01:14:03.840 --> 01:14:06.359
the street then met Brynn, who let him inside the

1389
01:14:06.399 --> 01:14:09.319
house through the garage door. He followed her to the

1390
01:14:09.359 --> 01:14:12.520
primary bedroom, where Phil was, indeed, as Brynn had been

1391
01:14:12.600 --> 01:14:17.079
telling him dead. Brynn again yelled, oh my god, he's dead.

1392
01:14:17.199 --> 01:14:17.640
I told you.

1393
01:14:17.760 --> 01:14:18.039
I did.

1394
01:14:18.119 --> 01:14:20.319
I told you I did. I killed him. I killed him.

1395
01:14:20.359 --> 01:14:23.920
I don't know why. Unsure of what to do, Ron

1396
01:14:24.079 --> 01:14:27.680
used the home phone and dialed nine one one. Meanwhile,

1397
01:14:27.840 --> 01:14:30.560
Brynn locked herself in the bedroom with Phil's dead body

1398
01:14:30.720 --> 01:14:34.760
and started calling people. She dialed her neighbors Steve and Marcy,

1399
01:14:34.840 --> 01:14:39.239
who lived three doors down. I killed Phil. Then her sister, Kathy,

1400
01:14:40.079 --> 01:14:44.039
Phil is dead. Kathy asked what happened. Brynn said, I

1401
01:14:44.119 --> 01:14:46.760
don't know. I'm sick. I don't remember. Tell the children

1402
01:14:46.840 --> 01:14:50.119
I love them. When Kathy asked whether Brynn had called

1403
01:14:50.199 --> 01:14:54.359
nine one one, Brynn just started screaming and crying. Kathy

1404
01:14:54.439 --> 01:14:57.439
did a good job keeping it together. She asked whether

1405
01:14:57.479 --> 01:14:59.279
there was anyone else in the house that she could

1406
01:14:59.319 --> 01:15:01.520
talk to. She needed to make sure that Sean and

1407
01:15:01.600 --> 01:15:06.119
Bergen were okay. Brynn just said, I gotta go. Kathy's

1408
01:15:06.159 --> 01:15:08.560
heart sank when she heard the deafening dial tone as

1409
01:15:08.640 --> 01:15:13.000
Brynn ended the call, The police department called Brynn's home line.

1410
01:15:13.039 --> 01:15:16.640
Shortly after. The officer asked, is there someone who's been

1411
01:15:16.640 --> 01:15:20.439
shot there? Brinn answered yes. How many people are inside

1412
01:15:20.479 --> 01:15:24.479
the house, Brynn just said, help me. The officer said, ma'am,

1413
01:15:24.560 --> 01:15:27.920
how many people are inside the house right now? Brynn answered,

1414
01:15:28.000 --> 01:15:28.520
I don't know.

1415
01:15:29.520 --> 01:15:31.560
I don't know why the police just didn't go to

1416
01:15:31.640 --> 01:15:32.039
their house.

1417
01:15:32.199 --> 01:15:34.399
Yeah, that's really weird. So he called nine one.

1418
01:15:34.399 --> 01:15:36.479
One, and Ron called nine one one. I think he

1419
01:15:36.600 --> 01:15:37.640
called from the house phone.

1420
01:15:37.760 --> 01:15:38.239
Mm hmmm.

1421
01:15:38.720 --> 01:15:41.000
Yeah, it was nine. Yeah, he definitely called from the

1422
01:15:41.039 --> 01:15:43.199
house phone, So it just doesn't make any sense why

1423
01:15:43.239 --> 01:15:44.039
they didn't just come.

1424
01:15:44.279 --> 01:15:48.319
Yeah, that's very odd. Ron knocked on Brin's locked bedroom door.

1425
01:15:48.560 --> 01:15:50.319
He tried to reason with her to get her to

1426
01:15:50.399 --> 01:15:54.760
let him inside, but she didn't answer him. Frustrated and anxious,

1427
01:15:54.840 --> 01:15:57.119
he wished he could just leave the chaotic scene. But

1428
01:15:57.239 --> 01:15:59.600
he knew he couldn't just leave the house. He was

1429
01:15:59.600 --> 01:16:02.119
a witness to a crime, and he had already called

1430
01:16:02.159 --> 01:16:05.279
the police, and he needed to protect the kids who

1431
01:16:05.319 --> 01:16:07.960
were in the house too. He couldn't leave them there

1432
01:16:08.039 --> 01:16:11.720
with Brynn in her current unhinged state. Plus, the doors

1433
01:16:11.760 --> 01:16:13.800
were all locked and Brynn was the only one with

1434
01:16:13.880 --> 01:16:16.239
the key. He couldn't even leave if he wanted to.

1435
01:16:17.479 --> 01:16:20.800
Ron retrieved Brinn and Phil's son Sean from his room.

1436
01:16:21.439 --> 01:16:23.039
He asked him if he knew a way out of

1437
01:16:23.079 --> 01:16:26.279
the house. Sean pointed Ron to a hiding spot where

1438
01:16:26.279 --> 01:16:29.199
they kept the key for the back door. Ron took

1439
01:16:29.239 --> 01:16:31.720
the key, used it to unlock the door, and helped

1440
01:16:31.800 --> 01:16:34.640
Sean out of the house just as police had arrived

1441
01:16:34.680 --> 01:16:38.079
at about six am. Sean was now in the custody

1442
01:16:38.119 --> 01:16:41.680
of the police. Ron told the officers that Bergen was

1443
01:16:41.720 --> 01:16:44.560
still inside, then handed them the smith and wesson which

1444
01:16:44.640 --> 01:16:47.560
Brinn used to kill Phil. It's kind of weird like

1445
01:16:47.640 --> 01:16:49.960
their house. The locks were like.

1446
01:16:52.119 --> 01:16:54.239
And I think Brinn had locked all the doors. Yeah,

1447
01:16:54.239 --> 01:16:56.000
and they must be locked with the key.

1448
01:16:56.239 --> 01:16:59.399
Yeah, that's unusual. Back in the bedroom, Brynn was on

1449
01:16:59.479 --> 01:17:02.720
the phone with Kathy again. She kept repeating, over and over,

1450
01:17:03.199 --> 01:17:06.920
take care of my children. Five officers entered the home

1451
01:17:07.000 --> 01:17:10.880
and situated themselves outside of the primary bedroom, not entirely

1452
01:17:11.000 --> 01:17:13.840
sure what awaited them or if Bynn was a threat,

1453
01:17:14.479 --> 01:17:17.600
they called her name. That was her cue. Time was up.

1454
01:17:18.119 --> 01:17:20.039
She knew that she couldn't go to jail, and she

1455
01:17:20.119 --> 01:17:22.800
couldn't go on living with what she had done. She

1456
01:17:23.039 --> 01:17:26.199
ended her conversation with Kathy, hung up, went to the

1457
01:17:26.279 --> 01:17:29.119
lock box and retrieved her own gun, the Charter Arms

1458
01:17:29.159 --> 01:17:32.119
thirty eight caliber. She sat down on the bed right

1459
01:17:32.239 --> 01:17:34.920
next to Phil, stuck the barrel into her mouth, and

1460
01:17:35.039 --> 01:17:38.520
pulled the trigger. The officers heard a single gun shot

1461
01:17:38.560 --> 01:17:41.399
from inside the bedroom. They didn't realize that Brynn had

1462
01:17:41.439 --> 01:17:44.720
another gun. The officers cleared the rest of the house,

1463
01:17:45.079 --> 01:17:48.760
They found Bergen and rushed her outside for their own safety.

1464
01:17:48.880 --> 01:17:52.319
They assumed that Brynn was hostile. They shouted from outside.

1465
01:17:52.560 --> 01:17:55.119
Los Angeles Police Department come out with their hands up.

1466
01:17:55.840 --> 01:17:59.319
After no reaction, the officers charged into the primary bedroom,

1467
01:17:59.680 --> 01:18:02.039
where they were met with the shocking sight of Phil

1468
01:18:02.239 --> 01:18:06.279
forty nine and Brynn forty, both dead, lying on top

1469
01:18:06.359 --> 01:18:10.079
of each other. The toxicology report later revealed that Brin

1470
01:18:10.199 --> 01:18:13.479
Hartman had cocaine in her system, as well as zoloft

1471
01:18:13.920 --> 01:18:16.239
and the blood alcohol level of point one two.

1472
01:18:17.640 --> 01:18:21.520
Soon, the Encino house was swarmed with reporters and television cameras,

1473
01:18:21.800 --> 01:18:24.960
all seeking confirmation of the terrible news. What happened? Was

1474
01:18:25.000 --> 01:18:26.479
Phil Hartman dead? Why?

1475
01:18:26.840 --> 01:18:27.079
How?

1476
01:18:27.720 --> 01:18:30.199
The same happened at the coroner's office, which received an

1477
01:18:30.199 --> 01:18:33.800
avalanche of calls looking for the juicy details. The first

1478
01:18:33.880 --> 01:18:36.600
to receive confirmation of the couple's death was not the

1479
01:18:36.680 --> 01:18:39.399
press or even family, but the people who shut up

1480
01:18:39.439 --> 01:18:42.960
after Brynn called them, Brynn's friend Judy, and their neighbors

1481
01:18:43.039 --> 01:18:45.960
Steve and Marcy. The next to hear were the Hartman's

1482
01:18:45.960 --> 01:18:50.079
closest immediate relatives, John Hartman. Phil's brother, rushed over to

1483
01:18:50.159 --> 01:18:53.199
take care of the kids. That morning, there was supposed

1484
01:18:53.199 --> 01:18:55.840
to be a table read for The Simpsons. The showrunner,

1485
01:18:55.960 --> 01:18:58.880
Mike Scully, found out about Phil's death moments before the

1486
01:18:59.000 --> 01:19:02.199
red was about to start. Solemnly, he announced the news.

1487
01:19:02.600 --> 01:19:04.680
Everybody in the room thought it was a joke at first.

1488
01:19:05.159 --> 01:19:08.399
Uncomfortable light chuckles and looks of confusion gave way to

1489
01:19:08.520 --> 01:19:11.760
frozen looks of horror as it became clear that Scully

1490
01:19:12.000 --> 01:19:15.840
was not joking. The news spread quickly after that. Everybody

1491
01:19:15.920 --> 01:19:19.239
in Phil and Brinne's immediate circle, family, friends, co workers.

1492
01:19:19.279 --> 01:19:22.880
They were all just devastated. Ed Beggley Junior, after hearing

1493
01:19:22.920 --> 01:19:26.640
about the incident, immediately disposed of his shotgun. He decided

1494
01:19:26.680 --> 01:19:28.720
he could no longer live with a gun in his home.

1495
01:19:29.479 --> 01:19:31.680
He took it to the nearest police station and handed

1496
01:19:31.680 --> 01:19:34.039
it over to them, saying he no longer wanted it.

1497
01:19:35.039 --> 01:19:37.159
John Hartman had the hardest job of any one in

1498
01:19:37.239 --> 01:19:39.279
Phil and Brynne's lives. He was the one who had

1499
01:19:39.319 --> 01:19:40.960
to break the news to Seawan and Burke and who

1500
01:19:41.000 --> 01:19:43.760
were both confused by the events that had taken place

1501
01:19:43.800 --> 01:19:47.439
in their home hours earlier. The kids reacted how you

1502
01:19:47.439 --> 01:19:49.439
would expect any kid to react to the news that

1503
01:19:49.520 --> 01:19:52.760
mommy and daddy are dead. Later that day, Sean, having

1504
01:19:52.840 --> 01:19:56.239
thought more about what had happened, put the puzzle pieces together.

1505
01:19:56.560 --> 01:19:59.319
He said, I think mommy did it to his uncle John.

1506
01:20:00.640 --> 01:20:01.000
But why?

1507
01:20:01.199 --> 01:20:03.760
Why had Brinn done it? Even though she'd been behaving

1508
01:20:03.840 --> 01:20:07.840
more radically than usual, This was not like her. Gregomdahl,

1509
01:20:07.920 --> 01:20:10.840
Brynn's brother blamed the zoloft and filed a wrongful death

1510
01:20:11.039 --> 01:20:15.680
lawsuit against Pfiser and doctor Sarowsky for aggressively marketing it

1511
01:20:15.800 --> 01:20:19.560
to her. Weiser settled the lawsuit for one hundred thousand dollars,

1512
01:20:19.760 --> 01:20:23.840
most likely in an effort to avoid bad press. Had

1513
01:20:23.920 --> 01:20:26.479
it gone to court, it's very likely that Pfiser would

1514
01:20:26.560 --> 01:20:29.960
have won. While Zoloft may have interacted with the cocaine

1515
01:20:30.000 --> 01:20:32.520
and the alcohol in some negative way, there is no

1516
01:20:32.720 --> 01:20:36.880
conclusive scientific evidence that it was the main contributing factor

1517
01:20:37.359 --> 01:20:40.239
in any sort of psychotic break. The amount of zolof

1518
01:20:40.319 --> 01:20:43.439
found in Brin's body was very low. Studies showed that

1519
01:20:43.520 --> 01:20:46.760
alcohol and cocaine, on the other hand, when both ingested

1520
01:20:46.840 --> 01:20:49.239
at once, mix in the body and they create a

1521
01:20:49.319 --> 01:20:53.560
new chemical coca ethylene, which causes an even more extreme

1522
01:20:53.680 --> 01:20:58.600
psychoactive effect. Alcohol and cocaine, and resentment and frustration and

1523
01:20:58.760 --> 01:21:03.039
jealousy are what made Brynn pull that trigger. The press

1524
01:21:03.119 --> 01:21:06.239
did not respect the Hartmann family's privacy. They waited in

1525
01:21:06.279 --> 01:21:10.479
the dryways of all involved. This made John especially very angry.

1526
01:21:11.000 --> 01:21:14.159
Quote this awful, ugly idea they have a right to

1527
01:21:14.279 --> 01:21:16.840
know is absurd. I do not want to see Bergen

1528
01:21:16.880 --> 01:21:19.680
and Shawn one day go seeking the heritage of this,

1529
01:21:19.920 --> 01:21:22.920
the legacy of this, and find my mom crying, my

1530
01:21:23.039 --> 01:21:25.520
brother hating their mother on TV and all that stuff.

1531
01:21:26.520 --> 01:21:29.359
End quote. Both families retreated to a hotel in an

1532
01:21:29.439 --> 01:21:31.239
attempt to avoid the cameras.

1533
01:21:31.600 --> 01:21:35.439
Remind me how old Bergan and Shawn were at this point, six.

1534
01:21:35.359 --> 01:21:37.760
And nine, So they were very young.

1535
01:21:38.000 --> 01:21:38.159
Yeah.

1536
01:21:39.119 --> 01:21:42.720
On June third, organized by Lorraine Newman, the former Groundlings

1537
01:21:42.760 --> 01:21:46.319
and other friends of Phil's, including Paul Rubins, Lauren Michaels,

1538
01:21:46.359 --> 01:21:49.680
and Steve Martin, gathered at the Groundlings Theater to honor Phil.

1539
01:21:50.880 --> 01:21:53.199
The funeral for the Hartmans was held on June fourth

1540
01:21:53.279 --> 01:21:57.359
at Forest Lawn Memorial Park cemetery, famous for celebrity burials.

1541
01:21:57.760 --> 01:22:01.239
Brinn and Phil were both cremated. The funeral opened and

1542
01:22:01.319 --> 01:22:04.880
closed with acoustic performances. By Graham Nash of Crosbie, Stills

1543
01:22:04.920 --> 01:22:09.000
and Nash. The presiding friar, kept hammering a point home.

1544
01:22:09.279 --> 01:22:12.159
Both Phil and Byne were at peace in heaven, he said.

1545
01:22:12.640 --> 01:22:15.560
Many in the crowd stirred they weren't sure that both

1546
01:22:15.680 --> 01:22:18.720
of them were in heaven. Their ashes were scattered in

1547
01:22:18.800 --> 01:22:22.199
the Santa Catalina Islands, a favorite vacation spot of the Hartman's.

1548
01:22:22.600 --> 01:22:24.840
Close friends of Phil's were given small amounts of his

1549
01:22:24.960 --> 01:22:27.600
remains to be scattered at a place of their discretion.

1550
01:22:28.399 --> 01:22:30.720
Phil was scattered under the Golden Gate Bridge on a

1551
01:22:30.800 --> 01:22:35.800
Malibu beach and a top California mountains. Greg Almdahl said quote,

1552
01:22:35.840 --> 01:22:38.199
I've lost a sister that was such a wonderful person

1553
01:22:38.640 --> 01:22:41.079
and a brother in law who was wonderful. It's like

1554
01:22:41.199 --> 01:22:43.479
getting punched in the gut because I knew my sister

1555
01:22:43.840 --> 01:22:46.800
would never murder any one. It's such a hard thing

1556
01:22:46.920 --> 01:22:51.199
to face. Later, at another memorial, John Hartman implored people

1557
01:22:51.279 --> 01:22:54.720
to give Bryn grace. Quote, they were victims of the

1558
01:22:54.800 --> 01:22:57.279
same accident. There is no one to hate and no

1559
01:22:57.479 --> 01:22:59.880
blame to be laid. I beg you to forgive her,

1560
01:23:00.479 --> 01:23:03.560
So put this incident in your past and close the door,

1561
01:23:04.039 --> 01:23:05.119
forget if you can.

1562
01:23:05.960 --> 01:23:08.159
I understand the point he's making, but that's a really

1563
01:23:08.359 --> 01:23:10.960
that's a really big ask to ask somebody to forgive that.

1564
01:23:11.119 --> 01:23:14.680
I think I was surprised that their funerals were held together.

1565
01:23:14.840 --> 01:23:16.039
Yeah, it is a little unusual.

1566
01:23:16.279 --> 01:23:19.279
Phil's brother, John was several years older than him, and

1567
01:23:19.359 --> 01:23:22.039
he was very successful in his own right, and I

1568
01:23:22.119 --> 01:23:24.560
think he was kind of aggressive, and he was aggressive

1569
01:23:24.640 --> 01:23:28.279
with the family members, and he locked them down and

1570
01:23:29.319 --> 01:23:31.439
only wanted them to say good things and wanted to

1571
01:23:31.479 --> 01:23:34.239
make sure that everyone was on the same page and

1572
01:23:34.319 --> 01:23:37.119
that no one said anything bad about Brn or bad

1573
01:23:37.159 --> 01:23:39.039
about Phil or about their marriage.

1574
01:23:39.319 --> 01:23:41.680
Interesting. I mean, I guess I understand the point. I mean,

1575
01:23:41.760 --> 01:23:43.920
at that point, there's nothing else you can do. They're

1576
01:23:44.000 --> 01:23:48.079
both gone and you can't change that. So I understand

1577
01:23:48.119 --> 01:23:51.239
his point, but it's also just hard to imagine myself

1578
01:23:51.760 --> 01:23:54.000
forgiving someone who had done that to someone that was

1579
01:23:54.039 --> 01:23:54.520
close to me.

1580
01:23:54.760 --> 01:23:58.640
Right on Phil's fiftieth birthday, friends and family members chartered

1581
01:23:58.680 --> 01:24:01.239
a yacht and scattered the remain of his and Bryn's

1582
01:24:01.279 --> 01:24:05.239
ashes and the waters off of Santa Catalina Island. The

1583
01:24:05.319 --> 01:24:08.680
Hartman's last will and testament appointed Kathy Wright, Brinn's sister,

1584
01:24:08.840 --> 01:24:10.920
as the legal guardians of nine year old Shawn and

1585
01:24:10.920 --> 01:24:13.520
six year old Bergen. Some of Phil's side of the

1586
01:24:13.600 --> 01:24:16.560
family were uncomfortable with this with the children under the

1587
01:24:16.600 --> 01:24:19.600
control of Brin's side of the family given what Brynn

1588
01:24:19.640 --> 01:24:22.520
had done, but for the sake of the children's well being,

1589
01:24:22.840 --> 01:24:26.520
nobody fought the decision. They were moved to Wisconsin and

1590
01:24:26.640 --> 01:24:29.039
their last name was changed, and they were loved and

1591
01:24:29.159 --> 01:24:29.800
well cared for.

1592
01:24:31.000 --> 01:24:34.039
The characters of Lionel Huts and Troy McClure were both

1593
01:24:34.079 --> 01:24:36.600
written off of The Simpsons as a tribute to Phil.

1594
01:24:37.239 --> 01:24:39.800
Matt Groining and the rest of the cast were devastated

1595
01:24:39.880 --> 01:24:42.880
to lose him. Phil was set to lend his voice

1596
01:24:42.920 --> 01:24:46.760
to another Matt Groening character, Zapp Bram again on Futurama.

1597
01:24:46.960 --> 01:24:50.079
Before his death. He was also working with Graining on

1598
01:24:50.159 --> 01:24:53.840
an animated full length feature film about Troy McClure, Phil's

1599
01:24:53.880 --> 01:24:58.720
all time favorite character, John Lovettz, Phil's longtime friend and

1600
01:24:58.840 --> 01:25:01.760
fellow SNL cast member, was shattered by the loss of

1601
01:25:01.840 --> 01:25:05.439
his friend. Here he is talking with Howard Stern about Phil.

1602
01:25:05.800 --> 01:25:08.720
He could do anything, I mean, Plus, he was the

1603
01:25:08.880 --> 01:25:10.359
nicest guy in the humblest guy.

1604
01:25:10.439 --> 01:25:12.840
You know, it's amazing to me, the guy that talented

1605
01:25:12.880 --> 01:25:16.000
and confident goes to see the Groundlings and somehow has

1606
01:25:16.039 --> 01:25:18.479
the balls to walk up on stage during an intermission

1607
01:25:18.600 --> 01:25:21.960
when he's never really performed and start entertaining people. I mean,

1608
01:25:22.079 --> 01:25:24.119
I wish I could see what he did. I mean,

1609
01:25:24.159 --> 01:25:24.840
that's insane.

1610
01:25:24.840 --> 01:25:27.239
I mean too, Yeah, everybody loved him. You know, he

1611
01:25:27.359 --> 01:25:29.920
was the only guy I know that in every group

1612
01:25:30.000 --> 01:25:32.680
he was in. Everyone loved him. From the Groundlings to

1613
01:25:32.880 --> 01:25:35.960
Saturday Night Live to news Radio, you know, and comedians

1614
01:25:36.000 --> 01:25:38.960
they are they're very, very competitive, you know, and Zamba

1615
01:25:39.039 --> 01:25:41.880
always has a problem with somebody, but not Phil.

1616
01:25:42.960 --> 01:25:45.880
John replaced Phil on the next season of News Radio,

1617
01:25:46.039 --> 01:25:48.600
which was its last. The show had been in a

1618
01:25:48.720 --> 01:25:51.520
ratings slump for years and had nearly been canceled, and

1619
01:25:51.760 --> 01:25:54.960
with Phil gone, the show took its last gasp before

1620
01:25:55.039 --> 01:25:59.760
being permanently canceled. Season five opens with Bill McNeil's funeral

1621
01:26:00.199 --> 01:26:03.680
a heart attack. Clever writing of the episode gave voice

1622
01:26:03.760 --> 01:26:07.079
to Phil or Bill one last time, as each cast

1623
01:26:07.199 --> 01:26:09.680
member was read a letter from him full of his

1624
01:26:09.880 --> 01:26:14.439
usual on point insults. Bad blood began to build between

1625
01:26:14.560 --> 01:26:17.640
John and Andy Dick, as Lovittz blamed Dick for the

1626
01:26:17.720 --> 01:26:21.000
death of his friend. This led to a legendary feud

1627
01:26:21.079 --> 01:26:24.159
which culminated at the Los Angeles comedy club the Laugh

1628
01:26:24.279 --> 01:26:27.920
Factory in two thousand and seven. Andy Dick cracked an

1629
01:26:28.000 --> 01:26:31.319
indelicate joke about the subject to John and he snapped.

1630
01:26:32.039 --> 01:26:35.319
Andy allegedly said quote, I put the Phil Hartman hex

1631
01:26:35.359 --> 01:26:38.399
on you. You're the next one to die. Unquote. Oh,

1632
01:26:38.439 --> 01:26:42.199
what horrible thing to say. According to Laugh Factory owner

1633
01:26:42.319 --> 01:26:45.439
Jamie Masada, John Lovetz picked Andy up by the head

1634
01:26:45.520 --> 01:26:48.159
and smashed him into the bar four or five times,

1635
01:26:48.520 --> 01:26:51.840
and blood started pouring out of his nose. When asked

1636
01:26:51.840 --> 01:26:54.560
about it, Lovett said quote, I would have kept going,

1637
01:26:54.680 --> 01:26:58.199
but the doorman broke it up. Unquotew I don't blame him.

1638
01:26:59.239 --> 01:27:02.439
I was really touched reading about John Lovetts and Phil's friendship.

1639
01:27:02.640 --> 01:27:02.840
Yeah.

1640
01:27:03.680 --> 01:27:05.800
Sean Hartman is now thirty five years old and a

1641
01:27:05.840 --> 01:27:09.239
graphic designer, taking after his father. Bergen is thirty two

1642
01:27:09.479 --> 01:27:12.079
and has a career in education. Both seem to be

1643
01:27:12.159 --> 01:27:15.119
doing well despite all the tragedy they faced early in

1644
01:27:15.199 --> 01:27:18.920
their lives. In twenty fifteen, Bergen attended the Saturday Night

1645
01:27:19.000 --> 01:27:24.079
Live fortieth anniversary celebration special to honor her father. She said, quote,

1646
01:27:24.439 --> 01:27:27.239
it's just heartwarming for me to see after all these years,

1647
01:27:27.520 --> 01:27:31.000
that he is still remembered and admired. Her Instagram is

1648
01:27:31.079 --> 01:27:32.960
public and I was able to see pictures of her.

1649
01:27:33.119 --> 01:27:38.319
She's stunning. She looks really happy and she was recently married.

1650
01:27:38.760 --> 01:27:41.159
That's good. I'm so glad to hear that they're doing well.

1651
01:27:42.079 --> 01:27:45.479
Rest in peace, Phil and Brnn. Phil Hartman, the Master

1652
01:27:45.600 --> 01:27:47.960
of a Thousand Voices, had the gift of charisma and

1653
01:27:48.079 --> 01:27:52.279
talent that only a handful of performers in each generation possess.

1654
01:27:53.079 --> 01:27:55.920
Similar to legends like Jim Carrey and Robin Williams, Phil

1655
01:27:56.000 --> 01:27:59.640
had the ability to slip effortlessly into any character and

1656
01:28:00.119 --> 01:28:03.199
devate audiences and offer them and escape from the weight

1657
01:28:03.279 --> 01:28:06.439
of their own struggles, if only for a moment. Phil

1658
01:28:06.560 --> 01:28:09.039
was generous, sensible, and kind, grounded in a way that

1659
01:28:09.159 --> 01:28:12.119
many great artists are not. But Phil's dedication to his

1660
01:28:12.199 --> 01:28:15.239
work came at a great cost. He had little of

1661
01:28:15.319 --> 01:28:18.039
himself to give where it mattered most, at home with

1662
01:28:18.119 --> 01:28:21.520
his wife and children. Could Phil have saved Brinn, We'll

1663
01:28:21.560 --> 01:28:25.399
never know, but she saw his attention and approval. Phil's

1664
01:28:25.439 --> 01:28:28.279
legacy lives on in countless characters he brought to life

1665
01:28:28.359 --> 01:28:30.760
and the joy and laughter he gave to so many.

1666
01:28:32.079 --> 01:28:34.319
After learning more about Phil Hartman, how do you feel

1667
01:28:34.359 --> 01:28:34.920
about him now?

1668
01:28:35.359 --> 01:28:36.960
Well, it is interesting because I didn't really know a

1669
01:28:37.039 --> 01:28:40.359
lot about Phil Hartman other than his characters on TV

1670
01:28:40.640 --> 01:28:42.680
and things like that. And you know, I think he

1671
01:28:43.439 --> 01:28:45.840
was it just seemed like he was such a likable guy.

1672
01:28:46.199 --> 01:28:50.279
It seemed like everyone loved him. It actually reminds me

1673
01:28:50.279 --> 01:28:52.439
a lot of Robin Williams, like nobody really has a

1674
01:28:52.479 --> 01:28:54.600
bad thing to say about him, But I do, at

1675
01:28:54.640 --> 01:28:58.319
the same time understand, you know, after going through the

1676
01:28:58.399 --> 01:29:01.760
story that he probably wasn't the partner, wasn't the best spouse.

1677
01:29:01.840 --> 01:29:04.319
He was pretty wrapped up in his own in his

1678
01:29:04.439 --> 01:29:08.840
own world. But that obviously doesn't excuse what Brynn did.

1679
01:29:09.119 --> 01:29:11.880
But well, comparing him to Robin Williams, I think is

1680
01:29:12.479 --> 01:29:15.680
poignant because they both gave so much. Yeah, and that

1681
01:29:15.840 --> 01:29:17.399
takes a lot out of you. No one could be

1682
01:29:17.520 --> 01:29:20.359
on twenty four hours a day, right, And sadly, you know,

1683
01:29:20.520 --> 01:29:22.479
because he was such a good performer he had, he

1684
01:29:22.520 --> 01:29:24.399
didn't have as much to give it home Yeah.

1685
01:29:24.600 --> 01:29:26.560
It kind of sense like they both had like this

1686
01:29:27.279 --> 01:29:31.079
sadness inside of them. You know, they had this funny outward,

1687
01:29:31.239 --> 01:29:33.399
you know, mask that they would put on for people,

1688
01:29:33.520 --> 01:29:36.159
but deep down they were probably a little sad.

1689
01:29:36.640 --> 01:29:38.600
Yeah, most comedians, you know do have that.

1690
01:29:38.960 --> 01:29:39.159
Yeah.

1691
01:29:40.039 --> 01:29:43.640
Phil almost quit Saturday Night Live once for the opportunity

1692
01:29:43.720 --> 01:29:47.399
to be this sidekick of j Letto on the Tonight Show. Really, however,

1693
01:29:48.000 --> 01:29:49.399
Ja Leto denies this.

1694
01:29:50.520 --> 01:29:53.319
Who I can't even think who was Jay Leno's sidekick?

1695
01:29:53.399 --> 01:29:56.920
Did he have a sidekick? I don't know, I never watched.

1696
01:29:56.920 --> 01:30:01.439
I always prefer David Letterman j let And Phil was

1697
01:30:01.479 --> 01:30:05.279
also offered the job of an announcer on The Prices Right,

1698
01:30:05.640 --> 01:30:08.560
oh okay, which would be a pretty funny job for

1699
01:30:08.720 --> 01:30:11.760
him to take. Phil wrote a dark comedy called Mister

1700
01:30:11.920 --> 01:30:14.359
fix It that he wanted to star in. He most

1701
01:30:14.479 --> 01:30:18.680
enjoyed being fully immersed in a character. He compared the

1702
01:30:18.760 --> 01:30:21.640
mood of Mister fix It to beetlejuice. It was never

1703
01:30:21.800 --> 01:30:25.039
made and it sits on a studio shelf somewhere in Hollywood.

1704
01:30:25.079 --> 01:30:28.600
I bet it's probably really funny. Phil's ultimate dream was

1705
01:30:28.680 --> 01:30:30.880
to use Saturday Night Live as a jumping off point

1706
01:30:30.920 --> 01:30:33.159
to write movies for himself and then star in them,

1707
01:30:33.199 --> 01:30:35.760
and sadly he was never able to.

1708
01:30:35.960 --> 01:30:36.800
Yeah, that's too bad.

1709
01:30:38.119 --> 01:30:40.039
Before we go, we want to pay tribute to Lauren

1710
01:30:40.079 --> 01:30:44.319
Michaels as Saturday Night Live celebrates its fiftieth season. Lauren

1711
01:30:44.359 --> 01:30:46.199
has been at the Helm for all but five of

1712
01:30:46.279 --> 01:30:47.840
those years. Did you know that he took a five

1713
01:30:47.920 --> 01:30:49.079
year highda you know now that you.

1714
01:30:49.119 --> 01:30:51.319
Say that, I remember he did, but yeah, I'd forgotten that.

1715
01:30:51.720 --> 01:30:54.479
Lauren, like Phil is Canadian born in Toronto. Before he

1716
01:30:54.600 --> 01:30:58.159
created Saturday Night Live, he worked for CBC Radio as

1717
01:30:58.199 --> 01:31:01.079
a writer. In nineteen sixty, he moved to la to

1718
01:31:01.159 --> 01:31:03.920
work as a writer for Rowan and Martin's Laughin and

1719
01:31:04.119 --> 01:31:08.079
the Beautiful Philis Diller Show. Lauren appeared in the show

1720
01:31:08.239 --> 01:31:11.199
during its first season, where he offered the Beatles. Sometimes

1721
01:31:11.239 --> 01:31:13.439
I just say these things like I'm writing this actually

1722
01:31:13.520 --> 01:31:17.399
for you, share my audience, and you know you're my love.

1723
01:31:18.119 --> 01:31:20.640
Rich loves the Beatles, no one. I don't know if

1724
01:31:20.640 --> 01:31:23.039
we've talked about that before, but Lauren appeared on the

1725
01:31:23.039 --> 01:31:25.319
show during the first season where he offered the Beatles

1726
01:31:25.399 --> 01:31:29.920
three thousand dollars, a deliberately paltry sum to reunite on

1727
01:31:30.000 --> 01:31:33.119
the show. He later increased his offer to thirty two

1728
01:31:33.239 --> 01:31:36.600
hundred dollars, but the money was never claimed. According to

1729
01:31:36.680 --> 01:31:40.039
an interview with John Lennon and Playboy magazine, Lennon and

1730
01:31:40.079 --> 01:31:42.960
Paul McCartney were in New York City that night and

1731
01:31:43.119 --> 01:31:46.359
wanted to see the show. They decided against it as

1732
01:31:46.479 --> 01:31:48.520
it was too late to get there in time and

1733
01:31:48.640 --> 01:31:51.560
they were both tired. This near reunion was the basis

1734
01:31:51.600 --> 01:31:55.159
for the TV movie The Two of Us. On the

1735
01:31:55.319 --> 01:31:59.960
November twentieth, nineteen seventy six show, musical guest George Harrison appeared,

1736
01:32:00.760 --> 01:32:03.520
but Lauren told them told him that the offer was

1737
01:32:03.600 --> 01:32:07.079
conditional on all four members of the group showing up.

1738
01:32:07.359 --> 01:32:08.119
That's really funny.

1739
01:32:08.199 --> 01:32:08.960
Did you know that story?

1740
01:32:09.199 --> 01:32:11.960
I knew the part of it where he made the offer,

1741
01:32:12.079 --> 01:32:13.800
and that John and Paul had been hanging out in

1742
01:32:13.840 --> 01:32:15.720
New York and talked about going down there.

1743
01:32:15.960 --> 01:32:20.319
You imagine if they would have shot. Lauren also produced

1744
01:32:20.520 --> 01:32:23.439
The Kids in the Hall and a show called The

1745
01:32:23.560 --> 01:32:27.119
New Show. He left SNL in nineteen eighty informed his

1746
01:32:27.199 --> 01:32:30.840
own production company, Broadway Video, and still continues to produce

1747
01:32:31.039 --> 01:32:33.720
many shows, including The Tonight Show and The Jimmy Fallon

1748
01:32:33.760 --> 01:32:37.199
Show and also The Late Show with Seth Myers. Lauren's

1749
01:32:37.239 --> 01:32:40.800
production company also has a film division, and he has

1750
01:32:40.880 --> 01:32:44.119
developed and produced many films by former Saturday Night Live

1751
01:32:44.199 --> 01:32:48.159
cast members, including Mean Girls, Tommy Boy, and Wayne's World.

1752
01:32:48.800 --> 01:32:53.439
Lauren will celebrate his eightieth birthday on November seventeenth. Since

1753
01:32:53.479 --> 01:32:56.560
he has no plans to retire, Wow, he is worth

1754
01:32:56.600 --> 01:33:01.479
an estimated five hundred million dollars. That's it, five hundred million.

1755
01:33:02.319 --> 01:33:03.600
I would have thought it would be more than that

1756
01:33:03.720 --> 01:33:06.199
five hundred million. I mean, I know, five hundred millions

1757
01:33:06.199 --> 01:33:07.520
a lot, but I would have thought more.

1758
01:33:08.039 --> 01:33:09.279
It was just like a, I don't know.

1759
01:33:09.520 --> 01:33:12.000
Yeah, he's had an amazing career.

1760
01:33:11.800 --> 01:33:14.800
Though, Cana. It's insane to me, like he's been at

1761
01:33:14.840 --> 01:33:18.239
the show almost the entire time, Yeah, for years, fifty years,

1762
01:33:18.319 --> 01:33:20.199
Like the amount of egos that he has had to

1763
01:33:20.319 --> 01:33:23.399
deal with and fires he had to put out. Yeah,

1764
01:33:23.840 --> 01:33:27.560
last weekend, in preparation for this, we saw what was

1765
01:33:27.640 --> 01:33:31.800
Saturday Night Saturday Night, and it was it was wild.

1766
01:33:32.079 --> 01:33:33.920
It was really good. Yeah, I mean it was good.

1767
01:33:34.000 --> 01:33:34.199
Yeah.

1768
01:33:34.399 --> 01:33:36.800
Not to not reveal it too many spoilers, but it

1769
01:33:36.920 --> 01:33:41.039
was basically a movie about the first night that Saturday

1770
01:33:41.119 --> 01:33:41.840
Night Live came on.

1771
01:33:42.239 --> 01:33:44.159
Yeah, it's kind of like an episode of twenty four

1772
01:33:44.359 --> 01:33:46.880
it's like in real time. I didn't know. I didn't.

1773
01:33:47.199 --> 01:33:47.399
Yeah.

1774
01:33:47.479 --> 01:33:49.720
Yeah, the movie opened like an hour and a half

1775
01:33:49.840 --> 01:33:52.359
before Saturday Night Live. It's set to air for the

1776
01:33:52.399 --> 01:33:54.359
first time, and it was It was really interesting.

1777
01:33:54.840 --> 01:33:57.479
The casting I thought was brilliant. Yeah, it was really

1778
01:33:58.039 --> 01:34:01.800
very I definitely recommend it. It was very frenetic, and

1779
01:34:02.359 --> 01:34:04.680
sometimes I don't enjoy that. I think it took me

1780
01:34:04.760 --> 01:34:06.720
a while to kind of settle into the pace of it.

1781
01:34:06.880 --> 01:34:09.319
Yeah, sometimes things like that make me a little anxious,

1782
01:34:09.399 --> 01:34:12.359
like watching The Bear on TV. Sometimes that that show

1783
01:34:12.399 --> 01:34:13.880
can make me a little bit stressed out.

1784
01:34:14.039 --> 01:34:14.600
Yeah, it was.

1785
01:34:14.840 --> 01:34:15.680
It was well done, though.

1786
01:34:22.319 --> 01:34:23.520
Hey, how was your lunch today?

1787
01:34:24.960 --> 01:34:27.479
My lunch was just fine. How was your lunch today?

1788
01:34:27.520 --> 01:34:29.319
Oh it was a little lonely because you weren't here,

1789
01:34:30.159 --> 01:34:33.560
So listeners, dear listeners. Last night, Rich said, oh, hey,

1790
01:34:33.600 --> 01:34:35.640
I forgot to mention that I have a lunch date today.

1791
01:34:35.680 --> 01:34:37.560
I was like, oh, okay, cool. He said he was

1792
01:34:37.600 --> 01:34:40.079
meeting a colleague. I said, who is the colleague? And

1793
01:34:40.600 --> 01:34:43.640
you've just acted slightly shady about it, and I instantly

1794
01:34:43.720 --> 01:34:45.840
knew it was with a woman, even though you didn't

1795
01:34:45.880 --> 01:34:49.199
tell me, and so you had a nice time. I

1796
01:34:49.279 --> 01:34:50.720
did have a nice flowers.

1797
01:34:50.920 --> 01:34:51.960
No, I did not bring her.

1798
01:34:52.600 --> 01:34:53.680
I have so many questions.

1799
01:34:54.000 --> 01:34:56.680
No, I did not pay. She was a colleague and

1800
01:34:56.920 --> 01:34:59.760
I treated her as I would any colleague, male or

1801
01:34:59.840 --> 01:35:04.319
f Okay, yes, I actually have one colleague that lives

1802
01:35:04.399 --> 01:35:07.680
in the same area that we do. So, yeah, a

1803
01:35:07.800 --> 01:35:08.239
nice lunch.

1804
01:35:08.479 --> 01:35:11.079
Well, I hope you guys have many more lives just together.

1805
01:35:11.199 --> 01:35:12.359
I'm just kidding.

1806
01:35:12.439 --> 01:35:14.479
I'm not a jealous person, and I know it was

1807
01:35:15.000 --> 01:35:17.319
all above board. You were just kind of like you

1808
01:35:17.399 --> 01:35:19.960
didn't lead with, oh, I'm having lunch with you know,

1809
01:35:20.640 --> 01:35:21.840
Sally or whoever?

1810
01:35:22.199 --> 01:35:24.640
Right, I know, it's just it is a little bit

1811
01:35:24.680 --> 01:35:26.239
of an awkward situation, you know.

1812
01:35:26.439 --> 01:35:27.479
But but I do.

1813
01:35:27.800 --> 01:35:28.600
I do trust you.

1814
01:35:28.800 --> 01:35:29.399
I know you do.

1815
01:35:30.279 --> 01:35:30.439
Well.

1816
01:35:30.439 --> 01:35:34.560
I hope you guys enjoyed today's episode. Despite the tragic circumstances.

1817
01:35:35.279 --> 01:35:37.560
It was a lot of fun to look up all

1818
01:35:37.640 --> 01:35:40.119
these old clips and Phil was He just really was

1819
01:35:40.159 --> 01:35:44.399
such a talented guy. Saturday Night Live holds a very

1820
01:35:44.439 --> 01:35:45.560
special place in my heart.

1821
01:35:45.640 --> 01:35:47.760
Yeah, same here. I've been watching it most.

1822
01:35:47.560 --> 01:35:50.800
Of my life, and comedy is just it's what's going

1823
01:35:50.840 --> 01:35:53.079
to get us through the hard times? And I remember,

1824
01:35:53.640 --> 01:35:56.840
you know, in the darkest days of my life, you know,

1825
01:35:56.960 --> 01:35:59.600
I always tried to laugh still and have a sense

1826
01:35:59.600 --> 01:35:59.920
of humor.

1827
01:36:00.159 --> 01:36:02.199
So yeah, it's really important.

1828
01:36:01.880 --> 01:36:04.800
Really grateful to have so many talented comedians out there

1829
01:36:04.840 --> 01:36:08.760
that are doing their best and making us laugh. Yep, well,

1830
01:36:08.800 --> 01:36:10.960
we hope we made it through the whole episode. We

1831
01:36:11.039 --> 01:36:13.359
weren't sure if we should make this into two episodes,

1832
01:36:13.359 --> 01:36:15.760
but we decided to just do it all in one.

1833
01:36:16.920 --> 01:36:19.159
In an effort to save our sanity and give us

1834
01:36:19.279 --> 01:36:23.399
slightly more free time, we have hired some writers. This

1835
01:36:23.600 --> 01:36:26.800
episode was written by our friend Owen with Sorik. If

1836
01:36:26.880 --> 01:36:28.600
you have a podcast or you need a writer for

1837
01:36:28.680 --> 01:36:31.319
any reason, you can reach out to Owen. He is available.

1838
01:36:31.560 --> 01:36:34.079
We will put his contact information in our show notes.

1839
01:36:34.640 --> 01:36:37.840
He did a great job writing this episode with a

1840
01:36:37.840 --> 01:36:38.520
little help from me.

1841
01:36:38.720 --> 01:36:39.399
Yeah, thanks, Sollen.

1842
01:36:40.319 --> 01:36:43.119
The main source for this episode was a book called

1843
01:36:43.439 --> 01:36:46.079
You Might Remember Me, The Life and Times of Phil Hartman,

1844
01:36:46.560 --> 01:36:49.680
written by Mike Thomas. It was a great book, super

1845
01:36:49.960 --> 01:36:54.359
interesting and informative. And also last night I was digging

1846
01:36:54.920 --> 01:36:59.159
through clips and I found Phil's Saturday Night Live audition tape,

1847
01:36:59.279 --> 01:37:02.560
which is great. We'll put that in our show notes

1848
01:37:02.600 --> 01:37:05.359
too as source number one if anyone wants to watch that.

1849
01:37:05.600 --> 01:37:09.520
But click around on YouTube. There's so many great Phil

1850
01:37:09.600 --> 01:37:10.600
Hartman clips out there.

1851
01:37:10.720 --> 01:37:13.760
Yeah, we mentioned it at the beginning of the episode,

1852
01:37:13.800 --> 01:37:16.800
but just a reminder that we will have merch coming

1853
01:37:16.880 --> 01:37:19.840
out soon, probably within the next couple of weeks. We'll

1854
01:37:19.880 --> 01:37:24.520
have t shirts, sweatshirts, hoodies, coffee mugs, a variety of

1855
01:37:24.640 --> 01:37:27.399
things with I think really cute design them.

1856
01:37:27.399 --> 01:37:28.920
I think it's pretty cute. It's supposed to be us,

1857
01:37:29.079 --> 01:37:29.560
just so you know.

1858
01:37:30.199 --> 01:37:33.079
Yeah, So that'll be out probably by the end of November.

1859
01:37:33.399 --> 01:37:35.119
If you want to order, you should be able to

1860
01:37:35.199 --> 01:37:38.560
get anything in time for Christmas, and we will it

1861
01:37:38.600 --> 01:37:42.479
will be available for international listeners as well. So yeah,

1862
01:37:43.159 --> 01:37:44.520
very exciting. I'm excited about it.

1863
01:37:44.640 --> 01:37:47.239
I'm excited about it too. Thank you all so much

1864
01:37:47.439 --> 01:37:50.479
for your support, for your friendship, for your kind messages.

1865
01:37:51.119 --> 01:37:54.159
We appreciate it so so much. The only reason that

1866
01:37:54.279 --> 01:37:57.359
there is a podcast is because you keep listening and

1867
01:37:57.560 --> 01:38:02.479
encouraging us and supporting us so sily. Thank you. Please rate, review,

1868
01:38:02.600 --> 01:38:05.359
follow and subscribe, find us on social media, or send

1869
01:38:05.439 --> 01:38:09.600
us an email at Lovemarykill at gmail dot com, and

1870
01:38:09.720 --> 01:38:13.680
please consider supporting us on patreon dot com slash Lovemrykill.

1871
01:38:14.159 --> 01:38:16.560
We have one tier for five dollars a month for

1872
01:38:16.840 --> 01:38:22.399
early ad free access and a monthly bonus episode until

1873
01:38:22.520 --> 01:38:22.960
next time.

1874
01:38:23.399 --> 01:38:24.520
Don't kill your wife.

1875
01:38:24.359 --> 01:38:27.000
And don't kill your husband? Play us out, phil.

1876
01:38:27.239 --> 01:38:29.720
Well, Sir, there's nothing on earth like a genuine bona

1877
01:38:29.760 --> 01:38:34.199
fide electrified six car monorail. What I say, monorail? What's

1878
01:38:34.239 --> 01:38:37.079
it called? That's right, monorail?

1879
01:38:40.319 --> 01:38:42.279
I hear those things are awfully loud.

1880
01:38:42.399 --> 01:38:44.199
It glides as softly as a cloud.

1881
01:38:44.520 --> 01:38:46.239
Is that a chance the track could pend?

1882
01:38:46.560 --> 01:38:48.239
Not on your life, my Hindu friend?

1883
01:38:48.520 --> 01:38:49.239
What about us?

1884
01:38:49.319 --> 01:38:53.279
Brenda slobs? You'll be given cushy jobs? Were you sent

1885
01:38:53.399 --> 01:38:56.279
here by the devil? No good, sir, I'm on the level.

1886
01:38:56.439 --> 01:38:57.920
The ring came off my pudding.

1887
01:38:58.039 --> 01:39:01.119
Can take my penknife, My good man, I swear at

1888
01:39:01.159 --> 01:39:04.439
Springfield's only choice. Thumb up your hands and raise your voice.

1889
01:39:05.600 --> 01:39:06.359
What's it called?

1890
01:39:07.720 --> 01:39:08.399
Once again?

1891
01:39:12.840 --> 01:39:13.359
Matrios?

1892
01:39:13.399 --> 01:39:15.560
To walk rack the broken Sorry mom?

1893
01:39:15.720 --> 01:39:17.119
The mom spoken.

1894
01:39:25.479 --> 01:39:25.800
Mono.

1895
01:39:26.640 --> 01:39:29.920
Don't hey, homie, I can see your doodle.

1896
01:39:30.119 --> 01:39:31.079
Shut up. Flanders