Aug. 3, 2026

Betty and Allan Gore/Candy and Pat Montgomery - Part 1 of 3

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In 1980, Betty and Allan Gore and Candy and Pat Montgomery seemed to have much in common. They were raising young families, active in the same small Methodist church, and navigating the pressures of marriage, careers, and parenthood in the growing suburbs north of Dallas. This three-part series follows the relationships that developed between the two couples, the affair that changed all of their lives, and the investigation and trial that became one of the most talked-about murder cases in Texas history.

Listen to all three parts today on Patreon

Today's snack: Assorted candy (Bottle Caps, Zots, Bubs, Gummy Cluster Nerds and Hi-Chew)

Sources:

WEBVTT

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Hi. I'm Tina and I'm Rich. There's one thing that

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we've learned in over twenty years of marriage.

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It's that some days you'll feel like killing.

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Your wife, and some days you'll feel like killing your husband.

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Welcome to love, Mary Kill, Hey Rich, Hey Tina?

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How are you?

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I am good. How are you doing?

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I'm doing pretty well. Do you regret the way that

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we start and end our podcast?

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I don't.

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You had to do it over again? Would you not

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do it?

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I probably would do the start differently. The end i'd like.

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I still like, but the start comes off a little bit. Yeah.

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Yeah, I have a little bit of regret because I

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never want to make it sound like we're being too casual.

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Should we change it up? Should we good?

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No, maybe we should. So it's August.

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I can't believe it's August already.

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And we will be on vacation soon. Are you excited

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for that?

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I'm very excited. I always like vacation. Vacation is much

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better than working.

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Guess how many places I have reserved for vacation so far.

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I'm going to go with zero.

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That is true, and I'm feeling a little tense about that.

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But I'm sure we'll figure it out always, but we weren't

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sure who would be able to join us where and when.

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So getting complicated.

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Yeah, I think we're staying here in Michigan. We really

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do love our state. It's a great state to visit.

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It's a great state.

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So I have a weird question for you, But would

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you want to know how you were going to die?

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And on the day that you were going to die?

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If that was a service that you could pay for,

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would you pay for that service?

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You mean you would only find out about it on

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the day that you die, like you would.

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No, you would be able to find out out to be.

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Able to find out you were going to die at

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seventy five years old on the state.

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Oh gosh, I hope you have more time than that,

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not that you're anywhere near seventy five.

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That's a great question. I don't I guess no. Oh,

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I don't think I would.

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I don't think i'd want to know either.

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That's a hard question though, because part of me is like, well, yeah,

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of course you would want to know, but I don't

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think it would be a good thing.

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I just finished a book by Alice Feeney called My

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Husband's Wife. It's not a major plot point. It's just

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one of the characters in the book. He's like a

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tech a guy, and he has this software or whatever

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that he developed. Okay, that can tell you, you know,

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based on a lot of different you know, like how insurance,

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what do you actually actually Yeah, based on that kind

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of evidence. So just got me to thinking that, gosh,

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I don't think i'd want to know.

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Yeah, I think it would not be good for you.

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The book started off so strong. I loved it so much.

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I was such a page turner. But it's a good book.

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I recommend it with a little bit of reservation. A

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lot of suspense novels, I think you've read a few

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like this where they just kind of go off the

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rails by the end, Like there's so many different twists

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and turns, and some of them don't always make sense

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or it's just taking.

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A step too far. But I think it's really hard

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to maintain a good suspense novel the whole way through.

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You know, it really is on vacation, are you going

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to be Is there anything on your to be read?

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I mean I have a ton of things on my

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to read list. So that's a very good point. Is

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that for vacation. Yeah, I definitely want to make sure

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I pick out a really good.

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Book, but I don't know what you have any great recommendations.

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A couple of people have recommended Freedom McFadden. I think

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that's the author's name, and I have not read one

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of her books, so I think I will pick one

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of those up for a vacation. Let us know if

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you have any other reads, and we do. Maybe in

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one of the ends of one of these episodes we'll

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talk about things that we've read recently that are good.

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That sounds good. I'm in the middle of a couple

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of books right now, so I need to finish those

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up before we go on vacation so I can pick

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up something fresh.

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We're so fun, that's the thing we're most excited about it.

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I'm sure we're good vacation read. Yeah.

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I'm sure we'll do a lot more than just read

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on vacation, though we'll probably eat.

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We're going to go to a ghost town too, That's

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what I'm excited about.

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I'm going to admit something to you. I haven't really

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looked at the itinerary. Yeah, so rich maybe itinerary and

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that I was supposed to like reserve airbnbs and hotels

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and stuff, and one of our kids is going to

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join us at one end and the other at the

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other end. I'm not really sure if we figured that

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out yet. We'll figure it out, but anyway, you know,

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I love a true crime classic, and that is what

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we are going to tell you today.

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I'm excited to hear it.

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I think a lot of you probably already know the

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story of Betty Gore and Candy Montgomery from this show's

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Candy and Love and Death from HBO, but hopefully we

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will tell you some things that you don't know. So

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we just got back from the gas station. We both

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got a soda, We got some chicken for later, and

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we got some candy.

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We are ready.

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That is today's snack. So you picked out some and

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I picked out some. You picked out bottle caps and

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and zots, and I picked out bubbs, bubbs, gummy cluster

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nerds and hichu and we're going to eat them real quick.

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I think I'm going to enjoy mine a lot more

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than I know.

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I think I'm an enjoy my mind more than yours.

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They'll be right back. That was a lot of chewing, a.

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Lot of sugar. I'm all hopped up on sugar.

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Now I needed some sugar. I was feeling very tired,

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so hopefully I won't crash out in the middle of

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the episode. I liked all of them except for one.

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Yeah, which one didn't you like?

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Well? I rated them. I did the Bobs, which I

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hadn't had until a couple of weeks ago, and I

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really like them, wow. And then I did High to

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the Grape Zot, then the Nerds Cluster, and then the

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bottle Cap. I didn't really love the bottle cap. I

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don't think I've ever had those before. I think those

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were like a favorite of yours from childhood.

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We are so different. I think my rating is almost

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the opposite order of yours.

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That's really fun.

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Bottle cap is number one. I actually like. The Nerds

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were probably my number two, and then I think I

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like the Zots, and then the High Choos, and then

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the Bobbs was probably funny.

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That is, it's exactly I really like sour candy. Like

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to me, I don't want I don't even really want

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the candy unless it has a sour flavor to it.

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But you're the opposite.

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That's really fun. Just the very sweet guy.

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You are you are. You are the sweetest. You did

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something very nice to me for me today that that

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we're not going to talk about it, but as well,

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you made me lunch, which was really nice because I

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was like, oh my god, I have so much to do,

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and yeah, you were a hero, as you are quite frequently.

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I do my best.

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Today, I'm going to tell you the story of Betty

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Gore and Candy Montgomery. It was June thirteenth, nineteen eighty

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Friday the thirteenth, a scorcher one hundred degrees before noon.

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It would become one of the hottest summers on record

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in Colin County, Texas. The county was made up of

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ten small, amorphous towns, among them Lucas, about thirty miles

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northeast of Dallas. The lives of four Colin County residents,

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Candy and Pat Montgomery and Betty and Alan Gore, were

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inextricably intertwined. Each couple had two children. Candy and Pat

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were parents to seven year old Jenny and five year

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old Ian. Betty and Allen were parents to six year

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old Alisa and eleven month old Bethany. They were all

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active members and leaders at First United Methodist Church of

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Lucas the church was the cornerstone of their lives. It

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was the last day of vacation Bible School. The day

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would end with the parents attending a Noah's ar parade

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and a handmade puppet show. It was meant to be

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a fun week for the children, if not a little

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stressful for the parents running the summer camp, including Candy Montgomery.

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She wasn't the most beautiful or stylish woman, but people

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were drawn to Candy. She wore oversized glasses and sported

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a tight, short perm. She was famous for wearing flip

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flops year round. She had boundless energy and an infectious

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enthusiasm for life. Her daughter Jenny and her best friend

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Elisa had talked their parents into having a rare two

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nights sleepover. Later that night, Candy and Pat were taking

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the girls and Ian to see the Empire Strikes Back

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was palpable. Betty Gore had agreed to the sleepover on

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the condition that Alisa not missed her swim lesson. But

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her swimsuit hadn't been packed. Candy said it was no problem,

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she'd run over and pick it up, despite the long

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list of errands she had to do that day. That

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was Candy always willing to help out a friend or

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have an extra kid tag along. Candy loved the rural

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community where she lived with her husband and two children.

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She was proud of the life that she and Pat

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had carved out as leaders of the area, especially in

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their church. After performing the morning parable for the children,

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Candy told Barbara Green that she was going to run

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over to Betty Gore's house to pick up Alisa's swimsuit

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and then grab Father's Day cards at Target. She'd be

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back in an hour an hour and a half tops.

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She climbed into her aging white station wagon and sped

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off to the Gore's home in nearby Wilie. Betty Gore

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was almost the polar opposite of Candy. Soft spoken, deeply sensitive, introverted,

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and often reserved. Betty was an elementary school teacher who

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possessed a quiet warmth that revealed itself when she felt

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comfortable in your presence. Where Candy was always loud and bubbly,

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Betty was reflective and guarded. But Betty was biting a

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heavy and visible battle, struggling with deep isolation, intense anxiety,

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and the suffocating weight of postpartum depression. After the birth

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of their second daughter. Betty was caught off guard when

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Candy appeared at her doorstep that morning. She hadn't been

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expecting her, but she welcomed her in and gave her

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a cup of coffee while they played with the Gore's

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new puppy, Cheeto. Bethany was down for a nap. Ninety

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minutes later, Candy still wasn't back and had missed the

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children's parade. She had lost track of time during her

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visit with Betty. But Candy's head was a blur. What

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had just happened? Why was her hair dripping? And why

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was her clothing wet? The deep cut on her toe

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was throbbing and bleeding, making a mess of her car

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and flip flops. How to explain that? Oh, write the

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storm door. She stubbed her toe on the ragged metal.

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Why hadn't Pat fick that damn door yet? She'd give

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him an earful about it later. She'd asked him to

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fix it a million times. Candy didn't have time, but

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she needed to go home and change and shower. She

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barreled down the gravel driveway, unbuttoning her shirt as she

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walked into the house. I was lucky that she'd worn

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a burgundy top that day. She ran it under cold

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water before she threw it in the dryer, ran up

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the stairs and jumped in the shower, rinsing out her

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curly hair. She tightly bandaged her wounded toe and quickly

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put on a fresh pair of light blue jeans and

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grabbed her still moist top from the dryer. The blistering

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Texas air would dry it on her ride back to

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the church. Before she headed out the door, Candy traded

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her worn flip flops for a pair of blue keads.

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She drove as fast as she could down the dusty

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country roads back to the church, knowing her quiet little

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Guy would be sad that she'd missed his performance. She

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looked into the mirror and noticed that the cut on

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her forehead, right near her hair line, was still bleeding.

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She fluffed her hair and hoped that no one would

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see it, and then said to her reflection, Betty, I

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just got to talking and I lost track of time,

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and then I went down to the target and plano.

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When I got there, I realized my watch had stopped.

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And then I felt like I had been gone too long,

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so I didn't even go in. I just came right

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back here. Moments later, Candy breezily walked through the church

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doors with a warm, sheepish smile on her face, slipping

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seamlessly back into the role of a devoted church mom,

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doing everything in her power not to limp on the

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foot where Betty Gore had nearly severed her toe with

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an axe. Is it all coming back to you?

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00:11:31.639 --> 00:11:34.759
Yeah? In my head, I'm picturing the camera, which I

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00:11:34.759 --> 00:11:36.960
guess it was Candy, the one with Jessica Bielle. Yeah,

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so I'm picturing those actors in my head as you're

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talking through it, And yes, it is coming back to me.

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Betty Eileen Pomeroy was born on January ninth, nineteen fifty

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to Bertha and Bob in Harper, Kansas. The pomroy Is

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married after a two week courtship. Bob was a mountain

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of a man at six foot three and two hundred

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and sixty pounds, A hard worker and a pillar of

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the community. He owned the standard oil station in town.

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While he didn't care much for organized religion, he believed

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in a higher power. Betty had two brothers, Ronnie four

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years younger and Richard eight years younger. The family lived

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in a tiny house on a one hundred and sixty

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acre farm with only an outhouse in Norwich, Kansas, a

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town so tiny that in twenty twenty there were still

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only four hundred and forty residents. When Betty was three,

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her mother entered her into the Most Popular Baby contest,

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which she won.

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I don't know how one becomes a popular baby, but

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Betty wasn't.

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It's really funny. Betty was an easy child, smart and kind,

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happy to help out on the farm and drive the

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tractor or bail hay. She was a girl scout and

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a top student. She wasn't a beauty in the traditional sense,

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but Betty always turned heads and remained popular through high school,

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where she played the clarinet, ran track, and played on

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the basketball team. Like so many girls in the nineteen sixties,

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Betty watched the Beatles' first historic performance on The Ed

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Sullivan Show from her living room. Friends from the time

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remember that she always had a boyfriend, and sometimes more

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than one. She never complained or rebelled, but she had

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a remote aloofness that prevented anyone from getting too close,

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perhaps the reason why she cycled through so many boyfriends.

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Some considered Betty cold, but she was shy, anxious, and reserved.

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Growing up in rural Kansas, the social upheaval of the

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nineteen sixties felt a world away. While college campuses erupted

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with anti war protests and the Civil rights movement reshaped

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the nation, life in rural Kansas changed at a much

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slower pace. For local teenagers, excitement meant piling into cars

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and riding around with friends, cooling off at the local

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swimming hole, attending school dances, or spending an evening at

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the roller rink. It was, by most accounts, a wholesome

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place to grow up, except maybe for what happened in

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the back seats of those parked cars. Did you ever

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go to the roller rink when you were a kid? Oh? Yeah,

295
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I did too. Yeah, it was actually a really good time.

296
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Well, I don't know why they don't picture you as

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a roller skater. Were you a good rollers It wasn't

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00:14:10.960 --> 00:14:13.240
a good roll roller skated ever together?

299
00:14:13.440 --> 00:14:15.320
No, I probably only went a couple of times, but

300
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it was it was like it was a thing to do.

301
00:14:17.600 --> 00:14:19.919
So my parents were divorced, so my dad went to

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the Yeah, but riding around in cars, which we used

303
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to call cruising because I also grew up in a

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small town. Yeah, like, that's what you did. On the

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00:14:31.200 --> 00:14:33.720
weekend she went cruising, did you too? Oh?

306
00:14:33.799 --> 00:14:37.879
Yeah absolutely. In nineteen sixty eight, Betty attended college at

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Southwestern College in Winfield, Kansas, after winning an eight hundred

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dollars scholarship. Her whole life, she'd wanted to be a teacher.

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During her first semester at college, she met Alan Gore,

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four years her senior. He was the teaching assistant for

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her calculus class. Math was her least favorite subject. After

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struggling to understand the advanced material, she asked Alan to

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be her tutor. Betty had caught his eye since the

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first day in class, but he thought it was inappropriate

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00:15:05.440 --> 00:15:07.639
to ask her out. But he jumped at the chance

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to be her tutor. The sessions gave them a chance

317
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to get to know each other, and Alan was quickly

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smitten with Betty's shy sweetness. The following semester, they began

319
00:15:17.159 --> 00:15:20.919
dating and became inseparable. Betty was the first woman that

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00:15:21.000 --> 00:15:23.639
Alan fell in love with, but not the last.

321
00:15:24.039 --> 00:15:27.120
Haven't you told me before that you thought calculus was fun?

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00:15:27.399 --> 00:15:28.320
I love calculus?

323
00:15:28.399 --> 00:15:31.080
Yeah, you're the only one.

324
00:15:30.200 --> 00:15:32.840
Alan Gore grew up on a six hundred acre farm

325
00:15:32.879 --> 00:15:36.039
not far from Betty and her family. His father worked

326
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from sun up to sundown, passing his work ethic and

327
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serious demeanor onto his son, who was the second of

328
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five children. Alan was highly intelligent, but not the best student.

329
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He was easily bored. He played basketball, but as a

330
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farm kid. His main activity growing up was helping out

331
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on the farm and working with the four h community

332
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raising livestock and other community projects. A highlight of his

333
00:16:00.200 --> 00:16:03.639
young life was winning the Grand Championship Wheat Production Award

334
00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:06.960
at the Kansas State Fair. He was presented a plaque

335
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by Senator Bob Dole. He worked hard to pay his

336
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way through Southwestern College, where he was a math major.

337
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He was mostly a loner until he met Betty Pomeroy.

338
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After all the boys Betty had dated, she had never

339
00:16:19.799 --> 00:16:23.440
really fallen head over heels for anyone until she met Alan.

340
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She liked that he was a little older and more mature,

341
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and she loved his intelligence. Theirs was a quiet romance.

342
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They were just happy to be in each other's company,

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even if it was a night at the library studying together.

344
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When Betty brought Alan home, her family and friends were

345
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more than a little surprised. He was average looking, wore

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thick glasses, had little interest in sports, and at just

347
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twenty one, his hairlines best days were already behind him.

348
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He struggled to make eye contact and hold a conversation,

349
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but by the way Betty looked at him, it was

350
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obvious that she was in love and her family was

351
00:16:59.600 --> 00:17:03.000
happy for her. What Betty may have valued most wasn't

352
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Allan's appearance, but his character. He was calm, loyal and dependable, steadfast,

353
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the kind of person who made her feel safe. Betty

354
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was naturally a bit anxious. Alan had a calming effect

355
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on her. He reassured her that she was loved and

356
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that he would always be there for her. In May

357
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nineteen sixty nine, they became engaged. Betty transferred to Kansas

358
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State University to be with Alan while he pursued his

359
00:17:28.160 --> 00:17:32.000
master's degree in computer science and she continued working toward

360
00:17:32.079 --> 00:17:35.799
her degree in elementary education. They both picked up odd

361
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jobs wherever they could. They were very poor, but they

362
00:17:38.960 --> 00:17:42.079
didn't care. They knew they were building a bright future together.

363
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Betty and Allan married on January twenty fifth, nineteen seventy

364
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in Betty's hometown church, Norwich Methodist. They settled into married

365
00:17:50.720 --> 00:17:54.720
life in a small, sparsely finished basement apartment near the university.

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Betty had always strived for perfection, but now that she

367
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and Alan were married, the need for structure, predictability, and

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00:18:02.119 --> 00:18:05.720
planning went into overdrive. She had an intense need to

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00:18:05.759 --> 00:18:09.000
know what was coming next as Alan was finishing his

370
00:18:09.079 --> 00:18:11.880
degree and was unsure of what the future held. It

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drove Betty mad with worry to the point that she

372
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couldn't eat and developed an ulcer. In nineteen seventy one,

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Alan took a job working for the government in Las Cruces,

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New Mexico, developing computer software used to oversee the construction

375
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of the Safeguard missile defense system. Betty again transferred to

376
00:18:30.200 --> 00:18:33.680
the local university. When Alan had to leave for six

377
00:18:33.720 --> 00:18:37.160
weeks on a special assignment in Switzerland, Betty fell apart.

378
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She missed Alan and her family terribly. She was hundreds

379
00:18:41.200 --> 00:18:44.720
of miles away from home and incredibly lonely. Whether it

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00:18:44.759 --> 00:18:47.799
was a calculated move, an act of defiance, or just

381
00:18:47.839 --> 00:18:51.279
a lapse in judgment because of her deep loneliness, one night,

382
00:18:51.319 --> 00:18:54.160
Betty brought a fellow's student home and spent the night

383
00:18:54.200 --> 00:18:57.519
with him. She admitted her transgression to Alan, and he

384
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forgave her immediately feeling response because he'd been away for

385
00:19:01.440 --> 00:19:01.920
so long.

386
00:19:02.480 --> 00:19:05.799
I think that after Betty left Kansas, she really struggled

387
00:19:06.079 --> 00:19:09.240
feeling at home wherever they lived. They moved around a

388
00:19:09.279 --> 00:19:12.319
lot in those first years of their marriage. She deeply

389
00:19:12.400 --> 00:19:16.039
missed her family, especially her mother, and I think her

390
00:19:16.079 --> 00:19:19.359
sense of security if Alan wasn't there, was just gone.

391
00:19:19.640 --> 00:19:21.920
Yeah. Yeah, it sounds like she had a lot of

392
00:19:21.960 --> 00:19:25.359
anxiety and was kind of insecure in a lot of ways.

393
00:19:25.400 --> 00:19:27.559
I know, hope I'm not painting her as too much

394
00:19:27.559 --> 00:19:30.240
of a pill, but I think she really had a

395
00:19:30.359 --> 00:19:31.680
hard time with her mental health.

396
00:19:31.759 --> 00:19:34.240
Yeah, it sounds like it. In the spring of nineteen

397
00:19:34.279 --> 00:19:37.839
seventy three, Betty graduated with high honors, becoming the first

398
00:19:37.880 --> 00:19:40.799
person in her family to earn a college degree. Her

399
00:19:40.839 --> 00:19:44.680
proud parents attended the ceremony alongside Alan. They were thrilled

400
00:19:44.680 --> 00:19:47.960
by Betty's accomplishment, though they still couldn't quite figure out

401
00:19:48.240 --> 00:19:50.240
their quiet reserved son in law.

402
00:19:50.839 --> 00:19:53.720
Alan is an engineer, and you have an engineering background.

403
00:19:53.759 --> 00:19:56.079
I wonder if you at all identify with him.

404
00:19:56.519 --> 00:19:59.319
Well, I can't relate to his receding hairline. But I

405
00:19:59.400 --> 00:20:00.720
do relate a little bit.

406
00:20:00.599 --> 00:20:03.240
Too feeling lovely ahead of it. Oh thank you.

407
00:20:03.400 --> 00:20:05.119
I do relate a little bit to feeling, you know,

408
00:20:05.240 --> 00:20:08.359
socially awkward, maybe a little bit back, more so back

409
00:20:08.400 --> 00:20:09.559
when you were young younger.

410
00:20:09.680 --> 00:20:11.880
Yeah, yeah, I should mention that everyone in the stories

411
00:20:11.960 --> 00:20:14.240
so far, they're really young. They're in their early twenties.

412
00:20:14.240 --> 00:20:15.519
He's a little older than Betty.

413
00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:18.240
But yeah, well so far, you know, just getting to

414
00:20:18.279 --> 00:20:20.960
know Betty and Allan a little bit, I see them

415
00:20:21.039 --> 00:20:24.240
as just a regular couple with their They've each got,

416
00:20:24.279 --> 00:20:26.039
you know, their issues, but they don't seem to have

417
00:20:26.039 --> 00:20:29.160
anything that can't be overcome or that couldn't turn into

418
00:20:29.480 --> 00:20:30.599
a fine life together.

419
00:20:31.039 --> 00:20:33.359
One thing I always say about Alan is he's very

420
00:20:33.440 --> 00:20:36.519
and the same about you too, is he's like he

421
00:20:36.599 --> 00:20:39.920
makes her feel very secure and loved, and he's loyal

422
00:20:40.240 --> 00:20:43.599
and dependable, which you know you are the same way.

423
00:20:44.119 --> 00:20:46.119
Oh thank you, that's very kind of you to say.

424
00:20:46.319 --> 00:20:47.680
I just speak the truth, sir.

425
00:20:48.319 --> 00:20:49.880
We'll be back after a break.

426
00:20:56.839 --> 00:20:59.839
After living in New Mexico for three years, Alan accepted

427
00:20:59.880 --> 00:21:03.119
a job with Collins Radio, the company that would later

428
00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:07.759
become part of Rockwell International. In Richardson, Texas. His fourteen

429
00:21:07.799 --> 00:21:10.680
thousand dollars salary allowed the couple to purchase a home

430
00:21:10.960 --> 00:21:14.240
in a new development in Plano. Betty found work as

431
00:21:14.240 --> 00:21:17.000
a substitute teacher because it was too late to find

432
00:21:17.079 --> 00:21:20.200
a permanent teaching job for the year. This bothered her

433
00:21:20.200 --> 00:21:23.480
a great deal. She longed to have her own classroom

434
00:21:23.519 --> 00:21:28.160
and friendships with colleagues. Betty supplemented their income by selling Avon,

435
00:21:28.480 --> 00:21:31.319
a job that pushed her well outside of her comfort zone.

436
00:21:31.519 --> 00:21:35.359
Because of her natural shy personality, The stressors of everyday

437
00:21:35.400 --> 00:21:38.119
life caused Betty to become a frequent visitor to the

438
00:21:38.160 --> 00:21:41.759
doctor's office. She struggled with a variety of chronic but

439
00:21:41.880 --> 00:21:46.680
minor health problems allergies, headaches, and stomach issues. Then came

440
00:21:46.680 --> 00:21:50.400
a doctor's appointment for a much happier reason. Betty discovered

441
00:21:50.440 --> 00:21:53.960
she was pregnant. While she and Alan were overjoyed, Betty

442
00:21:54.039 --> 00:21:57.920
was stricken with severe mourning, sickness, fainting spells, and then

443
00:21:58.079 --> 00:22:01.160
a deep depression settled over her her unlike anything that

444
00:22:01.279 --> 00:22:04.559
she had experienced before. Throughout her life, Betty had done

445
00:22:04.559 --> 00:22:07.759
her best to present herself as cheerful and optimistic, but

446
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:11.160
Beneath the service surface, she often struggled with self doubt

447
00:22:11.240 --> 00:22:15.880
and anxiety. Pregnancy seemed to magnify those feelings, leaving her

448
00:22:15.920 --> 00:22:19.240
emotionally overwhelmed at a time she had expected to be

449
00:22:19.240 --> 00:22:21.799
one of the happiest of her life. She worried about

450
00:22:21.799 --> 00:22:24.319
her appearance, She felt as big as a house, and

451
00:22:24.480 --> 00:22:26.960
was worried that she would never get her figure back.

452
00:22:27.440 --> 00:22:30.799
The Gores joined at church Briarwood Methodist, which was a

453
00:22:30.799 --> 00:22:34.160
good social outlet for Betty with her anxiety, she had

454
00:22:34.200 --> 00:22:37.799
difficulty relaxing in the new environment and sometimes came off

455
00:22:37.839 --> 00:22:41.480
as prickly. While Allan, previously the more introverted of the pair,

456
00:22:41.880 --> 00:22:45.279
threw himself into both the social and business aspects of

457
00:22:45.319 --> 00:22:48.079
the church. When he wasn't traveling for work, he had

458
00:22:48.160 --> 00:22:51.319
meetings several nights a week. Betty was envious at the

459
00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:53.720
ease at which Allan embraced the church and all it

460
00:22:53.759 --> 00:22:56.519
had to offer, but she was more comfortable staying at

461
00:22:56.519 --> 00:23:00.720
home most nights. When Elisa was born in nineteen seventy four,

462
00:23:01.000 --> 00:23:04.279
Betty shined in her role as mother. Routine and schedule

463
00:23:04.319 --> 00:23:06.720
were her strong suits, and she doted on the baby.

464
00:23:07.240 --> 00:23:09.200
In the fall, she got a job as a second

465
00:23:09.200 --> 00:23:12.480
grade teacher. Betty was excited to have her own classroom,

466
00:23:12.640 --> 00:23:16.400
but the school's open classroom team teaching approach was not

467
00:23:16.640 --> 00:23:19.319
a good fit for her. She loathed it because the

468
00:23:19.400 --> 00:23:22.480
children were given more freedom, and she felt there was

469
00:23:22.519 --> 00:23:26.440
an inherent lack of discipline and control. Other teachers said

470
00:23:26.480 --> 00:23:29.720
that Betty was too stern for second grade. The stress

471
00:23:29.720 --> 00:23:32.839
of teaching in an environment that didn't suit her, combined

472
00:23:32.839 --> 00:23:37.799
with Alan's busy schedule, frequent travel, and church obligations, became overwhelming.

473
00:23:38.319 --> 00:23:41.599
Betty needed his attention and support, but she often struggled

474
00:23:41.640 --> 00:23:46.160
to express what she was feeling. Instead, her frustration quietly grew,

475
00:23:46.319 --> 00:23:49.480
and over time she became increasingly bitter towards Allan.

476
00:23:49.920 --> 00:23:52.079
I've always thought that teaching second grade would be one

477
00:23:52.119 --> 00:23:53.640
of the toughest grades to teach.

478
00:23:53.960 --> 00:23:55.680
I think third grade is the heart. I don't know

479
00:23:56.319 --> 00:23:57.440
none of them as.

480
00:23:57.799 --> 00:23:59.599
It's probably very true. I guess I just remember our

481
00:23:59.599 --> 00:24:02.799
own kids. It's second grade seemed to be a challenging

482
00:24:02.880 --> 00:24:05.200
time just I don't know. Kids are getting older, they're

483
00:24:05.200 --> 00:24:08.480
getting more of an attitude, and just seems like a

484
00:24:08.480 --> 00:24:12.240
little harder control. Not ours, but they're classmates.

485
00:24:13.759 --> 00:24:16.359
For me. I remember third grade was hard because of

486
00:24:16.440 --> 00:24:20.000
multiplication and division, like long multiplication divisions.

487
00:24:20.119 --> 00:24:20.640
Yeah, oh boy.

488
00:24:20.920 --> 00:24:24.720
Anyway, Betty went to the doctor complaining of feeling deeply depressed, anxious,

489
00:24:24.759 --> 00:24:28.319
and generally overwhelmed by life. Her doctor diagnosed her with

490
00:24:28.440 --> 00:24:32.839
postpartum depression and prescribed estrogen and valuume. According to the

491
00:24:32.880 --> 00:24:35.880
book Evidence of Love, for the next year, Betty returned

492
00:24:35.920 --> 00:24:39.200
to her doctor several times a month. Her symptoms included

493
00:24:39.440 --> 00:24:45.240
nervous stomach, sinus troubles, sore throat, swollen glands, tiredness, fear

494
00:24:45.279 --> 00:24:52.839
of pregnancy, next soreness, chess soreness, award a spasms, vaginal itching, laryngitis,

495
00:24:53.119 --> 00:24:57.759
rest soreness, fever, earache, sinus problems, and tingling in her

496
00:24:57.839 --> 00:24:58.400
left arm.

497
00:24:58.759 --> 00:25:00.359
That's a lot of issue, hmm.

498
00:25:01.119 --> 00:25:04.400
Her doctor was sympathetic to Betty's health issues. Despite the

499
00:25:04.480 --> 00:25:09.039
various medications he prescribed, Betty continued to have troubling symptoms.

500
00:25:09.319 --> 00:25:12.079
The doctor thought that Betty were brought on by stress

501
00:25:12.119 --> 00:25:16.160
and anxiety. To add to Betty's discontent, her teaching contract

502
00:25:16.279 --> 00:25:19.440
wasn't renewed and she lost her job. She stayed home

503
00:25:19.440 --> 00:25:21.880
with the baby for a semester and then after substitute

504
00:25:21.920 --> 00:25:25.079
teaching for the nearby Wiley School district, she was offered

505
00:25:25.160 --> 00:25:28.559
a job teaching sixth grade. Allan had also taken a

506
00:25:28.599 --> 00:25:32.319
new job that required more travel. Betty almost lost her

507
00:25:32.359 --> 00:25:34.240
mind when he told her that he had to travel

508
00:25:34.279 --> 00:25:37.920
to Switzerland for six weeks and that he'd miss Thanksgiving

509
00:25:38.319 --> 00:25:40.559
to make it up to her. After Christmas, he took

510
00:25:40.599 --> 00:25:42.880
her there and they had the time of their lives.

511
00:25:43.119 --> 00:25:46.319
Betty had never been happier. When we're talking about all

512
00:25:46.319 --> 00:25:49.319
these problems that Betty's having with her health, remember it's

513
00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:52.480
the late nineteen seventies, and I don't think people talked

514
00:25:52.480 --> 00:25:54.640
about depression as much, and I think a lot of

515
00:25:54.680 --> 00:25:59.279
her symptoms were based on just the manifestations of anxiety

516
00:25:59.359 --> 00:26:00.559
and depression her body.

517
00:26:00.680 --> 00:26:03.000
Yeah, definitely seems that way. And I think around that

518
00:26:03.079 --> 00:26:07.000
time is when you know, people started doctors started prescribing

519
00:26:07.240 --> 00:26:09.960
drugs like thallium and what was the other thing that

520
00:26:10.079 --> 00:26:12.720
she was on, estrogen? Estrogen. I think a lot of

521
00:26:12.759 --> 00:26:16.000
times they when they heard about these kind of random problems,

522
00:26:16.039 --> 00:26:19.799
they would just prescribe something and didn't necessarily treat the

523
00:26:19.839 --> 00:26:20.599
real rude of.

524
00:26:20.640 --> 00:26:24.039
The good of the air Betty's contentment was short lived.

525
00:26:24.200 --> 00:26:27.759
In nineteen seventy seven, tired of his constant traveling, Betty

526
00:26:27.839 --> 00:26:31.519
called Allen's boss and requested that he'd be excused altogether

527
00:26:31.559 --> 00:26:34.000
from traveling because he had a wife and a young

528
00:26:34.079 --> 00:26:38.079
child at home. He'd about died from embarrassment. Feeling the

529
00:26:38.119 --> 00:26:41.400
pressure from Betty, Allen requested a new position that didn't

530
00:26:41.440 --> 00:26:44.680
require travel. They sold their house in Plano and moved

531
00:26:44.720 --> 00:26:46.960
to Wiley so Betty could be closer to the school

532
00:26:46.960 --> 00:26:50.119
where she taught. The goers bought a tidy brick ranch

533
00:26:50.160 --> 00:26:53.599
on Dogwood Drive in one of the town's new subdivisions.

534
00:26:53.880 --> 00:26:56.319
When a new pastor was brought into their church with

535
00:26:56.519 --> 00:27:00.920
old world autocratic views of the Methodist ideology, the goers,

536
00:27:00.960 --> 00:27:04.160
among others, were unhappy and left the congregation to look

537
00:27:04.200 --> 00:27:07.480
for a new place to worship. Eventually, on the advice

538
00:27:07.519 --> 00:27:11.079
of a friend, they landed at the first United Methodist

539
00:27:11.160 --> 00:27:14.319
Church of Lucas, where the goers would meet Candy and

540
00:27:14.359 --> 00:27:15.480
Pat Montgomery.

541
00:27:16.079 --> 00:27:18.440
I can't even tell you how mortified I would be

542
00:27:18.599 --> 00:27:20.680
if you were to call my boss and tell them

543
00:27:20.960 --> 00:27:23.200
that you didn't want me to travel. That would be

544
00:27:23.240 --> 00:27:24.640
a hard one for me to get past.

545
00:27:25.039 --> 00:27:27.279
I'm thinking about calling your boss and asking if you

546
00:27:27.319 --> 00:27:31.119
can travel more. Actually, but I think that she did

547
00:27:31.119 --> 00:27:33.960
this more than once, and yet he was not happy

548
00:27:33.960 --> 00:27:37.960
about it. About thirty miles northeast of Dallas, set Lucas

549
00:27:38.039 --> 00:27:42.079
and Wiley, Texas. Today they are sprawling, affluent suburbs, packed

550
00:27:42.079 --> 00:27:45.039
with new housing developments, top rated schools, and tens of

551
00:27:45.039 --> 00:27:48.039
thousands of commuters. But back in nineteen eighty, they were

552
00:27:48.039 --> 00:27:51.799
two quiet, closely connected rural communities where life moved at

553
00:27:51.799 --> 00:27:55.119
a much slower pace. Wiley was the hub, a small

554
00:27:55.200 --> 00:27:58.119
railroad town of under nine thousand with a few blocks

555
00:27:58.119 --> 00:28:02.519
of historic downtown aabring. Lucas was even smaller, a tiny

556
00:28:02.559 --> 00:28:06.200
farming patch of just fifteen hundred people, framed by cotton fields,

557
00:28:06.440 --> 00:28:10.319
corn crops, and dirt roads. Lucas residents ran their errands,

558
00:28:10.400 --> 00:28:12.920
shopped and went to church and wilie. It was a

559
00:28:12.920 --> 00:28:16.119
place where kids rode their bikes until dark, gossip traveled

560
00:28:16.119 --> 00:28:19.160
at lightning speeds, and no one bothered to lock their

561
00:28:19.160 --> 00:28:23.079
front doors. Born on November fifteenth, nineteen forty nine, Candace

562
00:28:23.160 --> 00:28:27.759
Lynn Wheeler Candy grew up on army bases around the world. Georgia,

563
00:28:27.839 --> 00:28:33.880
San Antonio, France for three years, Virginia, Al Paso, West Germany, Washington,

564
00:28:33.960 --> 00:28:37.440
d c. And Maryland. Her fondest memories were from her

565
00:28:37.480 --> 00:28:39.880
time on the west coast of France, living in a

566
00:28:39.920 --> 00:28:43.599
big stone house in a quaint village with cobblestone streets

567
00:28:43.720 --> 00:28:47.400
with her mother, father, and older sister Joy. Her father

568
00:28:47.519 --> 00:28:50.519
worked as a radar technician. Candy was a bit of

569
00:28:50.559 --> 00:28:54.279
a hellion growing up. She was bright, friendly, strong willed,

570
00:28:54.319 --> 00:28:58.240
and boy crazy from a young age. When Candy was fourteen,

571
00:28:58.400 --> 00:29:00.799
she and a friend decided to run away, but they

572
00:29:00.799 --> 00:29:03.640
didn't get too far. They were found the next afternoon

573
00:29:03.680 --> 00:29:06.359
at the shopping mall. She had no particular reason for

574
00:29:06.440 --> 00:29:10.519
running away. She just craved free will and independence. She

575
00:29:10.640 --> 00:29:13.599
clashed frequently with her mother over the things most teen

576
00:29:13.640 --> 00:29:18.240
girls fight about, curfews, dating, makeup, and clothing. Candy wanted

577
00:29:18.279 --> 00:29:21.680
to experience it all. Finally, when she was sixteen, when

578
00:29:21.720 --> 00:29:25.000
her parents allowed her to date, she got her first boyfriend,

579
00:29:25.200 --> 00:29:28.640
a senior named Chris. Quote. We had dated for a

580
00:29:28.680 --> 00:29:30.759
couple of months before I went to bed with him.

581
00:29:31.079 --> 00:29:33.599
Actually went to car with him would be more appropriate,

582
00:29:33.720 --> 00:29:36.119
since it was in the back of his ford. I

583
00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:39.440
was very disappointed from all the trashy novels I'd read,

584
00:29:39.480 --> 00:29:42.920
I expected fireworks and explosions, and to be all aquiver

585
00:29:43.079 --> 00:29:46.359
with lust. Candy was in love with Chris, but when

586
00:29:46.519 --> 00:29:49.359
he wanted to give her an engagement ring, she sobered

587
00:29:49.400 --> 00:29:52.799
and realized that she was too young for marriage.

588
00:29:52.920 --> 00:29:57.000
Candy met her future husband's mother, Marie Montgomery, first while

589
00:29:57.000 --> 00:29:59.759
working at a furniture factory. She set them up on

590
00:29:59.799 --> 00:30:03.119
the eight. Pat, five years older than Candy, was a

591
00:30:03.160 --> 00:30:06.799
brilliant engineer working for Texas Instruments. He had grown up

592
00:30:06.799 --> 00:30:11.200
in El Paso. He was intelligent, disciplined, and academically gifted.

593
00:30:11.720 --> 00:30:14.359
In high school, he excelled both in the classroom and

594
00:30:14.480 --> 00:30:18.440
as an accomplished trumpet player, earning all city honors. He

595
00:30:18.519 --> 00:30:22.240
later attended Texas Western University, where he left behind his

596
00:30:22.359 --> 00:30:26.640
dreams of becoming a professional musician and instead studied engineering.

597
00:30:27.119 --> 00:30:30.920
After graduation, he began pursuing a PhD at the University

598
00:30:30.960 --> 00:30:35.680
of Colorado on a prestigious NASA fellowship specializing in cutting

599
00:30:35.759 --> 00:30:41.039
edge electromagnetic research. After President Richard Nixon ended student draft

600
00:30:41.079 --> 00:30:44.759
deferments during the Vietnam War, concerned he could be drafted,

601
00:30:45.000 --> 00:30:49.000
Pat accepted a position at Texas Instruments. His work on

602
00:30:49.119 --> 00:30:53.480
military related technology qualified him for a draft exemption. His

603
00:30:53.640 --> 00:30:57.079
research was so advanced that the University of Colorado allowed

604
00:30:57.160 --> 00:31:00.519
him to continue working toward his doctorate remotely until he

605
00:31:00.559 --> 00:31:04.480
could return to campus. To Candy, Pat was average, looking

606
00:31:04.640 --> 00:31:07.799
awkward and quiet. On their first date, they went to

607
00:31:07.799 --> 00:31:10.200
dinner at a nice restaurant and then to the theater

608
00:31:10.359 --> 00:31:13.640
to see the movie Airplane. Candy called it the dullest

609
00:31:13.720 --> 00:31:16.279
date of her life, but when Pat requested a second

610
00:31:16.359 --> 00:31:18.839
date the following night, Candy agreed to it.

611
00:31:19.200 --> 00:31:21.799
How could seeing airfla be the dullest date of area?

612
00:31:21.920 --> 00:31:24.119
You took the words right out of my mouth. They

613
00:31:24.160 --> 00:31:27.240
had a fine time, but Candy was surprised when Pat

614
00:31:27.240 --> 00:31:29.200
put his hands in her pants at the end of

615
00:31:29.240 --> 00:31:32.440
the date. She agreed to a third date, but, still

616
00:31:32.480 --> 00:31:35.079
shaken by the events of the previous night, she stood

617
00:31:35.160 --> 00:31:38.000
him up. He didn't take the hint, though. Instead he

618
00:31:38.119 --> 00:31:41.000
sent her a dozen roses, winning her over once again,

619
00:31:41.359 --> 00:31:44.599
and she decided to give him another chance. Candy was

620
00:31:44.640 --> 00:31:47.519
glad she did. As she got to know him, Pat

621
00:31:47.559 --> 00:31:50.240
grew more comfortable in her presence, and as she peeled

622
00:31:50.240 --> 00:31:54.519
his layers away, she found him smart, funny, introspective, gentle,

623
00:31:54.599 --> 00:31:57.519
and kind not to mention his earning potential.

624
00:31:58.000 --> 00:31:59.680
I don't know if I've made it clear here, but

625
00:31:59.720 --> 00:32:02.319
they we don't live in the same area, so he

626
00:32:02.400 --> 00:32:04.880
was in town visiting, so for several nights in a

627
00:32:04.960 --> 00:32:06.160
row they went out.

628
00:32:06.319 --> 00:32:09.599
Gotcha. She hated her job and wanted to settle down,

629
00:32:09.680 --> 00:32:13.400
buy a house, ideally a farm, and have children. But

630
00:32:13.440 --> 00:32:16.279
Pat lived in Dallas and Candy nine hours away in

631
00:32:16.319 --> 00:32:19.200
El Paso. They wrote letters to each other to fill

632
00:32:19.240 --> 00:32:22.559
the absences. After just two months of dating and visiting

633
00:32:22.599 --> 00:32:27.039
each other on only four weekends, Pat proposed, Candy wondered what

634
00:32:27.160 --> 00:32:30.559
had taken him so long. Days before their wedding, Pat

635
00:32:30.599 --> 00:32:35.599
wrote Candy the following letter, Darling, Candy, next Tuesday seems

636
00:32:35.680 --> 00:32:38.960
like always, and yet tomorrow I'll be forever happy. On

637
00:32:39.000 --> 00:32:41.559
that day. We'll be together for as long as we

638
00:32:41.599 --> 00:32:44.079
both shall live, and what we make of the rest

639
00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:46.480
of our lives will depend on the magnitude of our

640
00:32:46.480 --> 00:32:49.079
love for one another and the product of our love.

641
00:32:49.519 --> 00:32:51.799
I can think of nothing more worthy of my life

642
00:32:51.920 --> 00:32:54.759
than spending it with you. I've often wondered what an

643
00:32:54.799 --> 00:32:57.799
all consuming love such as ours would be like. It's

644
00:32:57.839 --> 00:33:02.039
a never ending anxiety and all consuming emotion and awareness

645
00:33:02.079 --> 00:33:05.720
of everything beautiful. And you are beautiful in countless ways.

646
00:33:06.200 --> 00:33:08.960
I hope I'll always make you happy. I know that

647
00:33:09.000 --> 00:33:12.920
you've already made me overly joyous. I love you. I'm

648
00:33:12.920 --> 00:33:15.359
looking forward to being the father of your babies and

649
00:33:15.440 --> 00:33:18.400
teaching them what we both believe to be right. I'd

650
00:33:18.440 --> 00:33:20.680
like for us to be the best parents any child

651
00:33:20.680 --> 00:33:23.359
would ever desire. I long for you to be at

652
00:33:23.359 --> 00:33:25.799
my side on a cold winter morning so that we

653
00:33:25.880 --> 00:33:29.079
might warm one another's bodies and souls. I want you

654
00:33:29.119 --> 00:33:31.599
at my side on warm summer nights so I can

655
00:33:31.640 --> 00:33:33.799
love you in a manner so that when I'm gone,

656
00:33:33.920 --> 00:33:37.880
you'll always remember Candice. I love you all of my

657
00:33:38.000 --> 00:33:38.920
love forever.

658
00:33:39.440 --> 00:33:42.119
Pat, It's beautiful. Do you need a tissue?

659
00:33:43.319 --> 00:33:45.839
I think Pat is maybe a good engineer, but not

660
00:33:45.960 --> 00:33:49.160
the best poet in the world. In return, Candy wrote,

661
00:33:49.359 --> 00:33:52.200
dear Pat, this is the very last time I'll ever

662
00:33:52.240 --> 00:33:55.079
write you, because pretty soon you'll be with me forever

663
00:33:55.160 --> 00:33:57.960
and always. I just wanted to put this little note

664
00:33:57.960 --> 00:33:59.960
in your letter to tell you that I truly love you,

665
00:34:00.440 --> 00:34:02.799
and I will continue to do so till I die,

666
00:34:03.200 --> 00:34:05.480
and even though I don't see how it could be possible,

667
00:34:05.720 --> 00:34:08.039
I'm sure I'll love you even more when we're old

668
00:34:08.079 --> 00:34:12.559
and gray. I do love you so much, Pat, Always Yours, Candy.

669
00:34:13.199 --> 00:34:17.440
Candy's note was not quite as filled with romance, and yeah, I.

670
00:34:17.440 --> 00:34:19.159
Should look up some of the old letters that you

671
00:34:19.239 --> 00:34:23.039
wrote me, and now that's not they were very sweet.

672
00:34:23.639 --> 00:34:26.360
After they were married, Candy moved to Dallas, but she

673
00:34:26.519 --> 00:34:30.400
hated it, missing her family and friends horribly. Soon after,

674
00:34:30.480 --> 00:34:33.679
Pat decided to return to Colorado to finish his PhD.

675
00:34:34.480 --> 00:34:37.599
Candy took a job working at an insurance agency while

676
00:34:37.639 --> 00:34:40.760
Pat worked for the National Bureau of Standards and as

677
00:34:40.760 --> 00:34:45.320
a research assistant. But money was tight again. Candy was unhappy,

678
00:34:45.519 --> 00:34:49.159
unaccustomed to the colder climate and high altitude of Colorado,

679
00:34:49.639 --> 00:34:52.880
But in September nineteen seventy two, Candy and Pat were

680
00:34:52.920 --> 00:34:57.079
thrilled when their first child, Jenny, arrived. Soon after, Pat

681
00:34:57.119 --> 00:35:02.519
finished his dissertation to great acclaim electromagnetic boundary value problems

682
00:35:02.559 --> 00:35:07.320
based upon a modification of residue calculus and function theoretic techniques.

683
00:35:08.119 --> 00:35:12.400
About twelve people understood his work. Nothing makes me feel

684
00:35:12.519 --> 00:35:14.320
dumber than when I hear the title of.

685
00:35:14.239 --> 00:35:19.159
Someone'sation that one is quite something. The next year they

686
00:35:19.239 --> 00:35:23.000
returned to Texas, where Pat returned to Texas Instruments, working

687
00:35:23.039 --> 00:35:27.119
on military radar projects for the government. They moved frequently

688
00:35:27.159 --> 00:35:31.320
in those first years, Dallas, Boulder, then back to Texas, Richardson,

689
00:35:31.360 --> 00:35:35.360
then Plano. In October nineteen seventy four, Candy and Pat

690
00:35:35.400 --> 00:35:39.320
welcomed their second child, a son Ian. After his birth,

691
00:35:39.440 --> 00:35:43.679
Candy had a tubal ligation. In February nineteen seventy seven,

692
00:35:43.800 --> 00:35:46.880
the Montgomerys built their dream house in Lucas, out in

693
00:35:46.920 --> 00:35:50.159
the country for seventy thousand dollars. It was a modern

694
00:35:50.199 --> 00:35:54.559
house with an open floor plan featuring exposed beams and skylights.

695
00:35:55.000 --> 00:35:58.280
The house was called the best party house in Collin County.

696
00:35:58.840 --> 00:36:01.199
It was the life that Candy always dreamed of, but

697
00:36:01.360 --> 00:36:04.719
it still felt like something was missing. Despite she and

698
00:36:04.760 --> 00:36:08.360
Pat both claiming they were agnostic, Candy began looking for

699
00:36:08.400 --> 00:36:11.679
a church to meet people and serve their new community.

700
00:36:12.079 --> 00:36:15.199
They joined the United Methodist Church in Lucas. Soon after

701
00:36:15.239 --> 00:36:17.920
they had welcomed a new pastor, Jackie Ponder.

702
00:36:18.400 --> 00:36:20.559
I just want to talk really quick about this area

703
00:36:20.639 --> 00:36:24.400
of Texas. In the nineteen eighties, similar to the Silicon

704
00:36:24.519 --> 00:36:28.320
Valley in California was called the Silicon Prairie, and it was,

705
00:36:28.360 --> 00:36:31.800
you know, the Dallas area where Texas Instruments and other

706
00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:35.039
major companies Where was IBM was IBM in Texas.

707
00:36:35.079 --> 00:36:37.519
No, IBM was based in New York, but I worked

708
00:36:37.519 --> 00:36:40.400
for EDS, which was based in Plano, Texas.

709
00:36:40.400 --> 00:36:43.400
We will mention EDS here in a minute too. Yeah,

710
00:36:43.639 --> 00:36:46.400
just a burgeoning field. You know. The tech industry was

711
00:36:46.440 --> 00:36:49.880
really just huge, and Texas was a big part of it.

712
00:36:50.000 --> 00:36:53.119
Yeah, it was an exciting time. I in hearing this story,

713
00:36:53.239 --> 00:36:55.159
it's taking me back a little bit. I'm not as

714
00:36:55.199 --> 00:36:57.360
old as these the folks in here, but i was

715
00:36:57.360 --> 00:36:59.760
in technology a little bit after that, and I'm a

716
00:36:59.760 --> 00:37:03.039
little bit jealous in a way because things were it

717
00:37:03.159 --> 00:37:06.159
was like a wide open possibilities, Like this stuff was

718
00:37:06.199 --> 00:37:09.239
all brand new, and you know, people are doing really

719
00:37:09.239 --> 00:37:11.360
interesting things. It was just wide open.

720
00:37:11.599 --> 00:37:15.280
When we talked a little bit about like just their potential,

721
00:37:15.320 --> 00:37:20.880
earning potential, like they both Allen and Pat were brilliant. Yeah,

722
00:37:21.360 --> 00:37:23.559
they could write their own tickets, it sounded like. And it,

723
00:37:23.760 --> 00:37:25.559
like you said, it was a really exciting time.

724
00:37:25.679 --> 00:37:28.719
Yeah, in rural Texas, the church is at the heart

725
00:37:28.760 --> 00:37:33.079
of the community. It's where parishioners come together to worship, volunteer,

726
00:37:33.360 --> 00:37:37.199
support those in need, and grow as individuals. It's where

727
00:37:37.239 --> 00:37:40.360
friendships are built and ties to the community are strengthened.

728
00:37:40.800 --> 00:37:44.480
But in a town where everyone knows everyone, news travels fast.

729
00:37:45.039 --> 00:37:48.880
Despite people's best intentions. Gossip is part of human nature,

730
00:37:49.199 --> 00:37:52.400
and judgments can sometimes spread more quickly than acts of

731
00:37:52.480 --> 00:37:56.039
kindness and support. This rang true for the first United

732
00:37:56.079 --> 00:38:00.239
Methodist church in Lucas, Texas. The church itself wasn't much

733
00:38:00.239 --> 00:38:03.079
to look at, with its peeling paint and rusted steeple

734
00:38:03.400 --> 00:38:06.599
surrounded by wheat fields on three sides, but there was

735
00:38:06.639 --> 00:38:09.719
a simple beauty to the church's austerity that allowed the

736
00:38:09.719 --> 00:38:14.159
parishioners to feel God's presence without distraction and absorbed the

737
00:38:14.199 --> 00:38:17.639
message of the sermon each week. The congregation was small,

738
00:38:17.800 --> 00:38:21.079
one hundred members if everyone showed up on any given Sunday,

739
00:38:21.159 --> 00:38:24.239
but they never all showed up. They dreamt of improving

740
00:38:24.280 --> 00:38:26.719
the structure or building a new one, but it just

741
00:38:26.880 --> 00:38:30.719
wasn't in their budget. Pastors cycled through the church frequently.

742
00:38:31.360 --> 00:38:34.000
Young preachers, wanting to get their feet wet, began their

743
00:38:34.000 --> 00:38:36.840
careers at the small church, but then moved on quickly

744
00:38:36.920 --> 00:38:41.400
to bigger churches. But in nineteen seventy six, when a charismatic, black,

745
00:38:41.559 --> 00:38:45.000
liberal leaning feminist named Jackie Ponder came to the church,

746
00:38:45.320 --> 00:38:49.079
she was there to stay, or so she hoped. Jackie,

747
00:38:49.119 --> 00:38:52.280
married to a doctor with two children, had once proclaimed

748
00:38:52.280 --> 00:38:55.960
herself to be an atheist. After experiencing what she called

749
00:38:55.960 --> 00:38:59.360
a mystical experience in her mid thirties, she was drawn

750
00:38:59.400 --> 00:39:02.840
to the ministry. With her tall frame and booming voice,

751
00:39:03.039 --> 00:39:06.559
she was a force to be reckoned, with Jackie's philosophy

752
00:39:06.559 --> 00:39:09.719
of religion boiled down simply to love God with all

753
00:39:09.760 --> 00:39:13.400
your heart, mind, and soul. Her arrival caused a divide

754
00:39:13.400 --> 00:39:17.159
in the church and in her personal life. Jackie's husband, Bill,

755
00:39:17.400 --> 00:39:20.719
wasn't supportive of her new career in the ministry, especially

756
00:39:20.719 --> 00:39:23.480
when he and their children were expected to reside in

757
00:39:23.519 --> 00:39:27.400
the dilapidated parsonage. After a few months, he threw in

758
00:39:27.440 --> 00:39:30.639
the towel and asked Jackie for a divorce. Waves of

759
00:39:30.679 --> 00:39:34.639
gossip rippled through the church. Not everyone embraced the church's

760
00:39:34.719 --> 00:39:39.079
new progressive direction under a divorced female pastor, especially when

761
00:39:39.119 --> 00:39:43.440
she began dating Some objected to Jackie's marital status, while

762
00:39:43.480 --> 00:39:46.840
others simply didn't believe a woman belonged behind the pulpit.

763
00:39:47.400 --> 00:39:50.840
Before Long Sunday Attendants had dwindled to about twenty five

764
00:39:50.920 --> 00:39:55.360
regular worshippers, although a loyal group stood by Jackie. But

765
00:39:55.440 --> 00:39:59.800
when Candy Montgomery joined First United Methodists, they became fast friends.

766
00:40:00.440 --> 00:40:04.519
Candy was Jackie's biggest supporter. They frequently spent time together

767
00:40:04.559 --> 00:40:09.599
outside of church, having philosophical conversations about religion, motherhood, and

768
00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:14.039
the hardships of being a woman. Despite their differing religious beliefs,

769
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:17.760
Jackie welcomed Candy's perspective and the two developed a deep,

770
00:40:17.920 --> 00:40:23.119
meaningful friendship. Together. They became a powerhouse with Candy's spearheading committees,

771
00:40:23.320 --> 00:40:26.559
Sunday school, and whatever else she could do to support

772
00:40:26.599 --> 00:40:31.119
her friend and enrich First United Methodists. With Candy's enthusiasm

773
00:40:31.199 --> 00:40:34.199
and boundless energy, she rapidly became a leader in the

774
00:40:34.280 --> 00:40:37.840
church and a champion for Jackie, inspiring other women to

775
00:40:37.960 --> 00:40:41.559
rally behind her as well. As more women became involved,

776
00:40:41.719 --> 00:40:45.559
the church encouraged them to share their gifts, talents, and creativity,

777
00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:50.280
fostering a stronger sense of community and purpose. After her divorce,

778
00:40:50.480 --> 00:40:53.599
Jackie was devastated and leaned heavily on Candy to get

779
00:40:53.639 --> 00:40:57.280
through the difficult time. Candy encouraged her to embrace her

780
00:40:57.320 --> 00:41:00.840
new single status as a fresh beginning. She booked speaking

781
00:41:00.920 --> 00:41:04.679
engagements at nearby churches, where Jackie spoke about her unique

782
00:41:04.719 --> 00:41:08.159
role as a woman leading a ministry. Jackie was a

783
00:41:08.199 --> 00:41:12.280
magnetic presence, and before long, several young families were inspired

784
00:41:12.280 --> 00:41:16.199
by her message and joined First United Methodist. Among them

785
00:41:16.360 --> 00:41:20.679
were Betty and Alan Gore. So Candy finding religion, it

786
00:41:20.719 --> 00:41:22.719
sounds like maybe it was more about like just being

787
00:41:22.800 --> 00:41:25.559
part of the community and being active rather than a

788
00:41:25.639 --> 00:41:27.079
deep belief in the religion.

789
00:41:27.599 --> 00:41:30.920
I believe that was the case. But she was inspired

790
00:41:31.239 --> 00:41:36.920
by Jackie and Jackie's feminism and Jackie's mission, And when

791
00:41:36.960 --> 00:41:40.559
Betty joined the church, she also is very inspired by Jackie.

792
00:41:40.719 --> 00:41:43.679
They were both feminists, and I think in Texas in

793
00:41:43.760 --> 00:41:47.039
nineteen eighty, you know, it wasn't as common to have

794
00:41:47.199 --> 00:41:49.679
women that were strongly supporting other women.

795
00:41:50.400 --> 00:41:51.880
We'll be back after a break.

796
00:41:58.159 --> 00:42:00.480
When a congregant came to jack In offered to be

797
00:42:00.599 --> 00:42:03.760
choir director, something the small church had never had before.

798
00:42:04.039 --> 00:42:08.360
Jackie happily agreed. The group, including the Gores and the Montgomerys,

799
00:42:08.440 --> 00:42:12.960
became a cornerstone of the church's leadership. Pat Montgomery soon

800
00:42:13.039 --> 00:42:16.199
rose to the top of the choir with his strong voice.

801
00:42:16.559 --> 00:42:19.519
Realizing that people needed more reasons to come to church

802
00:42:19.599 --> 00:42:23.079
during the week, Jackie encouraged new groups and social committees

803
00:42:23.119 --> 00:42:27.480
to form. Pat and Allen organized softball and volleyball teams,

804
00:42:27.519 --> 00:42:31.480
along with foreign missions. Candy taught Sunday school, and Betty

805
00:42:31.639 --> 00:42:35.400
organized a youth group. But no matter how hard she tried,

806
00:42:35.599 --> 00:42:38.800
Betty Gore wasn't like the Queen Bee moms and Candy's click.

807
00:42:39.280 --> 00:42:42.320
Many viewed her as cold and distant. When the other

808
00:42:42.360 --> 00:42:45.480
women were speaking openly about their sex lives and using

809
00:42:45.559 --> 00:42:48.960
strong language, if Betty walked into the room, the playful

810
00:42:49.039 --> 00:42:52.760
banter abruptly stopped. She was more buttoned up and reserved

811
00:42:52.760 --> 00:42:55.159
than many of the other women, but her anxiety and

812
00:42:55.199 --> 00:42:59.360
shy nature prevented her from relaxing and letting her guard down.

813
00:43:00.079 --> 00:43:03.440
Because she worked as a teacher, she was often excluded

814
00:43:03.480 --> 00:43:06.880
from the morning coffee dates, luncheons, and church meetings many

815
00:43:06.880 --> 00:43:09.880
of the other women were immersed in. In the spring

816
00:43:09.920 --> 00:43:12.960
of nineteen seventy eight, Betty decided that she and Alan

817
00:43:13.039 --> 00:43:16.079
shed become foster parents because they had so much love

818
00:43:16.159 --> 00:43:19.000
to give. The first child they welcomed into their home

819
00:43:19.159 --> 00:43:21.639
was a six year old boy who stayed for only

820
00:43:21.679 --> 00:43:25.119
two weeks. After he left, Betty asked that only girls

821
00:43:25.159 --> 00:43:26.239
be placed with them.

822
00:43:26.519 --> 00:43:28.280
So it sounds like the boy only stayed for two

823
00:43:28.320 --> 00:43:30.679
weeks because he was trouble, and so Betty think he.

824
00:43:30.760 --> 00:43:34.159
Was difficult, and Betty had kind of in her mind

825
00:43:34.239 --> 00:43:37.199
these rigid ideas of what a child should be like,

826
00:43:37.519 --> 00:43:40.559
even though she was a teacher. It's hard to talk

827
00:43:40.599 --> 00:43:43.800
about Betty without making her sound like she was this

828
00:43:44.000 --> 00:43:46.599
very austere woman, because I don't think she was. I

829
00:43:46.599 --> 00:43:49.159
think she could be warm and lovely, but you know,

830
00:43:49.239 --> 00:43:52.239
she had a lot going on. When a three year

831
00:43:52.239 --> 00:43:56.280
old girl arrived, Betty excitedly took her to meet Pastor Jackie,

832
00:43:56.559 --> 00:44:00.280
seemingly eager to impress her. But despite being a tea Maor,

833
00:44:00.280 --> 00:44:03.800
Betty sometimes struggled to connect with young children. Her instinct

834
00:44:03.960 --> 00:44:08.840
was to punish behavior she viewed as naughty, rather than redirecting, distracting,

835
00:44:09.000 --> 00:44:12.280
or engaging them through play. When she failed to form

836
00:44:12.400 --> 00:44:14.760
the bond that she had hoped for with the children

837
00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:18.400
they fostered. She fell into a depression, convinced that she

838
00:44:18.480 --> 00:44:22.559
had failed. Twenty eight year old Candy Montgomery was also

839
00:44:22.639 --> 00:44:26.679
feeling unsettled that summer. Despite her full schedule. She was

840
00:44:26.719 --> 00:44:29.440
a woman who got bored easily. She joked with her

841
00:44:29.480 --> 00:44:32.559
friends about leaving her husband, but under the joke was

842
00:44:32.599 --> 00:44:37.159
a kernel of truth. She wanted fireworks, and Pat well

843
00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:40.719
he no longer made her see fireworks if he ever had.

844
00:44:41.519 --> 00:44:44.719
Candy shuttled her kids around town, took writing classes, and

845
00:44:44.840 --> 00:44:48.599
volunteered constantly at church and in the community. She and

846
00:44:48.679 --> 00:44:51.559
her best friend Sherry were even launching a painting and

847
00:44:51.599 --> 00:44:55.400
wallpaper business that they were calling cover Girls. But despite

848
00:44:55.440 --> 00:44:59.199
her busy life, Candy felt hopelessly bored, especially in her

849
00:44:59.199 --> 00:45:02.840
marriage to Pass and the restlessness had started to needle her.

850
00:45:03.599 --> 00:45:06.079
He came home from work every day and parked himself

851
00:45:06.079 --> 00:45:08.679
in front of the television. He never asked her about

852
00:45:08.679 --> 00:45:12.159
her writing or other projects. Other than going to church,

853
00:45:12.239 --> 00:45:15.760
he rarely did anything outside the house. Candy didn't want

854
00:45:15.800 --> 00:45:18.199
to leave him, She just wanted to spice things up

855
00:45:18.239 --> 00:45:21.280
a little. It wasn't until one night in the fall

856
00:45:21.320 --> 00:45:24.239
of nineteen seventy eight, when she was playing volleyball at

857
00:45:24.239 --> 00:45:26.840
the church, that it came to her when she and

858
00:45:26.960 --> 00:45:30.639
Alan Gore collided, their bodies came closer than they had

859
00:45:30.679 --> 00:45:33.800
ever been before, and when Candy caught a whiff of him,

860
00:45:34.239 --> 00:45:39.400
she liked it. Pheromones are powerful stuff. Could ponche Alan

861
00:45:39.480 --> 00:45:43.159
Gore give her fireworks. She later told Sherry that she

862
00:45:43.280 --> 00:45:47.119
was attracted to him. He smelled sexy. Sherry thought that

863
00:45:47.199 --> 00:45:50.039
she was nuts. Candy and Allen had grown to be

864
00:45:50.079 --> 00:45:52.440
friends in the past year, singing in the choir and

865
00:45:52.519 --> 00:45:56.079
working together on other church committees. He was funny when

866
00:45:56.119 --> 00:45:58.360
she got to know him, and always willing to lend

867
00:45:58.360 --> 00:46:02.079
a helping hand. He had seen his eyes linger on her,

868
00:46:02.320 --> 00:46:05.559
and he always smiled broadly when he saw her. She'd

869
00:46:05.599 --> 00:46:08.639
bet her bottom dollar that he was secretly attracted to

870
00:46:08.679 --> 00:46:13.679
her too. She found herself daydreaming about him constantly. One night,

871
00:46:13.719 --> 00:46:17.840
after choir practice, Candy felt embolden. She leaned into his

872
00:46:17.880 --> 00:46:20.360
car and said, Alan, I want to talk to you

873
00:46:20.440 --> 00:46:22.960
sometime about something that has been bothering me.

874
00:46:23.480 --> 00:46:25.199
Oh, how about right now.

875
00:46:25.599 --> 00:46:27.679
I've been thinking about you a lot, and it's really

876
00:46:27.719 --> 00:46:30.079
bothering me, and I don't know whether I want you

877
00:46:30.119 --> 00:46:33.239
to do anything about it or not. I'm very attracted

878
00:46:33.239 --> 00:46:35.440
to you, and I'm tired of thinking about it, so

879
00:46:35.559 --> 00:46:38.960
I wanted to tell you. Alan wasn't able to form

880
00:46:39.000 --> 00:46:43.440
any words. Embarrassed, Candy got into her car and drove home.

881
00:46:44.280 --> 00:46:47.280
But Candy's words awoke something in Alan that he hadn't

882
00:46:47.320 --> 00:46:51.320
known was there. Now. He too couldn't stop thinking about Candy.

883
00:46:52.079 --> 00:46:54.599
He had always been attracted to her and her funny,

884
00:46:54.599 --> 00:46:58.400
outgoing personality. A week later, after a volleyball, as they

885
00:46:58.440 --> 00:47:01.159
walked to their cars, All and ask Candy what she

886
00:47:01.320 --> 00:47:05.480
specifically had in mind. Would you be interested in having

887
00:47:05.519 --> 00:47:07.840
an affair? Candy asked brazenly.

888
00:47:08.559 --> 00:47:10.119
I don't know what to say.

889
00:47:10.719 --> 00:47:13.360
Alan told Candy that Betty had just found out that

890
00:47:13.440 --> 00:47:16.079
she was pregnant with her second child, and he didn't

891
00:47:16.079 --> 00:47:18.719
think that he could do that to her. He loved her,

892
00:47:19.480 --> 00:47:22.519
But before he left her, Alan reached over and gave

893
00:47:22.599 --> 00:47:25.679
Candy a gentle kiss on the lips that they'd both

894
00:47:25.719 --> 00:47:30.400
think about over and over the next week. And that's

895
00:47:30.599 --> 00:47:32.320
where we are going to end part one.

896
00:47:32.880 --> 00:47:34.840
Well, that is an intriguing note to end on.

897
00:47:35.000 --> 00:47:35.360
Mm hmm.

898
00:47:35.679 --> 00:47:39.320
It almost feels like Candy approaching Alan here. And this

899
00:47:39.320 --> 00:47:41.079
This was the sense I got when we watched the

900
00:47:41.679 --> 00:47:44.400
show Candy as well, is that it was almost very

901
00:47:44.440 --> 00:47:48.039
like practical on her end, Like it wasn't driven by like,

902
00:47:48.480 --> 00:47:50.599
you know, some mad lust or anything like that. It

903
00:47:50.679 --> 00:47:53.199
was just sort of like I need spice in my life,

904
00:47:53.639 --> 00:47:56.119
and here's a guy that I think, you know, is sort.

905
00:47:55.960 --> 00:47:57.559
Of probably into me a little bit.

906
00:47:57.760 --> 00:48:01.960
Yeah, yeah, it but it almost seems like Alan seems

907
00:48:02.079 --> 00:48:05.360
very similar to Pat to me as well. It's very true, Yeah,

908
00:48:05.559 --> 00:48:07.039
based on what I know about the two of them.

909
00:48:07.079 --> 00:48:10.119
So it's almost like she's going from her husband to

910
00:48:10.360 --> 00:48:12.400
this guy who seems very similar.

911
00:48:12.639 --> 00:48:14.599
We'll talk more about this in part two, but it

912
00:48:14.679 --> 00:48:18.639
is interesting how we'll planned out this whole situation will become.

913
00:48:18.800 --> 00:48:23.079
Yeah, it seems like very very fitting with Candy's personality

914
00:48:23.280 --> 00:48:23.840
in general.

915
00:48:24.079 --> 00:48:26.079
I'm not trying to trap you, but how do you

916
00:48:26.079 --> 00:48:28.679
think most affairs start. I think most affairs would start

917
00:48:28.679 --> 00:48:32.960
with like a kiss, right, and not the vocalization of hey,

918
00:48:32.960 --> 00:48:33.840
maybe we should have an.

919
00:48:33.760 --> 00:48:37.519
Affair, yeah exactly, or or just becoming more intimate, like

920
00:48:37.599 --> 00:48:40.880
your discussion is becoming more intimate, like getting into more

921
00:48:40.920 --> 00:48:43.280
personal details of your life and before you know it,

922
00:48:43.320 --> 00:48:47.079
you're like involved in more like, you know, intimate conversations.

923
00:48:47.199 --> 00:48:49.239
I think they might have done that a little bit,

924
00:48:49.400 --> 00:48:51.880
but Alan was pretty buttoned up too. I don't think

925
00:48:51.920 --> 00:48:53.519
he ever complained about his wife.

926
00:48:53.679 --> 00:48:55.920
Yeah, I wouldn't imagine, but you know, they.

927
00:48:56.159 --> 00:48:58.199
Were in the choir together and as a.

928
00:48:58.239 --> 00:49:01.519
Volleyball team, so they definitely spent some time together.

929
00:49:01.679 --> 00:49:05.320
But that one night when they collided into each other,

930
00:49:05.880 --> 00:49:07.280
their spouses were not there.

931
00:49:07.599 --> 00:49:10.679
Yeah, okay, it's interesting too. She talked about his smell.

932
00:49:11.280 --> 00:49:13.719
I always hear this sort of thing that like, pheromones

933
00:49:13.760 --> 00:49:15.719
are really powerful, and I've.

934
00:49:15.639 --> 00:49:16.840
Never made a sense of smell.

935
00:49:16.880 --> 00:49:19.400
I don't think I was gonna say, I like, I've

936
00:49:19.440 --> 00:49:23.000
never consciously noticed any smell of another person.

937
00:49:23.360 --> 00:49:25.000
But are pheromones conscious?

938
00:49:25.039 --> 00:49:27.679
As That's what I always thought. It was like more

939
00:49:27.679 --> 00:49:30.400
of an unconscious thing, But it sounds like for Candy

940
00:49:30.440 --> 00:49:31.639
it was more conscious.

941
00:49:31.840 --> 00:49:35.000
Were you surprised that Candy and Pat, like after two

942
00:49:35.079 --> 00:49:38.480
months of dating, only seeing each other in person a

943
00:49:38.519 --> 00:49:41.239
handful of times, that they became engaged.

944
00:49:41.519 --> 00:49:44.840
Yeah, kind of, especially with Candy's personality, just seems like

945
00:49:45.000 --> 00:49:48.559
she wants to experience everything and she wants to try,

946
00:49:48.760 --> 00:49:51.079
you know, all these different things, and so to agree

947
00:49:51.119 --> 00:49:53.519
to settle down that quickly seems a little bit out

948
00:49:53.559 --> 00:49:56.480
of character, but it was also a different time as well.

949
00:49:56.800 --> 00:49:59.960
So out of the four people in this story, Candy

950
00:50:00.119 --> 00:50:02.239
is the only one that didn't go to college. But

951
00:50:02.840 --> 00:50:05.880
obviously she is an intelligent woman. She has a lot

952
00:50:05.920 --> 00:50:08.679
of Yeah, she's driven, and she has a lot of curiosity.

953
00:50:08.920 --> 00:50:12.159
And I think that she had a regret that, you know,

954
00:50:12.199 --> 00:50:14.719
that she didn't nurture that part of her life as much.

955
00:50:15.239 --> 00:50:18.440
But I think she wanted to be married and have kids, right.

956
00:50:18.559 --> 00:50:21.880
You know, in the seventies, you know, it was more

957
00:50:21.920 --> 00:50:24.400
common to just once you were married, well that was

958
00:50:24.400 --> 00:50:27.199
your choice, and you were, you know, a housewife and

959
00:50:27.239 --> 00:50:27.599
a mom.

960
00:50:27.760 --> 00:50:30.119
Yeah. So she never really sewed her wild oats in

961
00:50:30.159 --> 00:50:32.000
her younger years or as much.

962
00:50:32.079 --> 00:50:34.599
But well, I think she she did not as much

963
00:50:34.599 --> 00:50:38.039
as maybe she well, although she might have sewed, but

964
00:50:38.159 --> 00:50:40.039
I think she wanted more out of life. She wanted

965
00:50:40.199 --> 00:50:42.400
I think she would have had a good career. Yeah,

966
00:50:42.920 --> 00:50:45.559
after two months of knowing each other, would you have

967
00:50:45.599 --> 00:50:46.039
married me?

968
00:50:47.400 --> 00:50:50.400
I think I knew pretty quick with you, So yeah,

969
00:50:50.440 --> 00:50:53.519
I think I didn't propose to you until after a year,

970
00:50:53.599 --> 00:50:56.039
But I think I knew deep down that it was

971
00:50:56.119 --> 00:50:59.199
going to work out between us. How about you?

972
00:51:01.119 --> 00:51:03.719
I think I was always a little more gunshy than

973
00:51:03.760 --> 00:51:06.840
you because you were a little more a little more,

974
00:51:07.079 --> 00:51:10.199
you were a little older, and maybe you had a

975
00:51:10.199 --> 00:51:13.639
better idea of what you wanted. And I think you

976
00:51:13.760 --> 00:51:17.840
being older and you were already in your engineering career

977
00:51:17.880 --> 00:51:20.239
and you were going back to school for MBA and

978
00:51:20.360 --> 00:51:22.960
I was still going to college too, I think I

979
00:51:23.039 --> 00:51:25.000
just wasn't sure where life was going to go.

980
00:51:25.320 --> 00:51:27.880
It's understandable. I was probably a little more settled into

981
00:51:27.920 --> 00:51:29.880
my path than you were at the time.

982
00:51:30.119 --> 00:51:31.920
And I think because you lived in Michigan and I

983
00:51:31.960 --> 00:51:36.159
lived in Illinois, I just wasn't sure how that was

984
00:51:36.159 --> 00:51:37.280
going to end up working out.

985
00:51:37.280 --> 00:51:40.480
But here we are, Here we are.

986
00:51:42.000 --> 00:51:45.199
Betty Gore was out going and friendly in high school.

987
00:51:45.320 --> 00:51:47.440
I think I forgot to mention this, but she was

988
00:51:47.480 --> 00:51:49.039
even elected homecoming queen.

989
00:51:49.119 --> 00:51:50.480
Oh wow. And she was most popular.

990
00:51:52.639 --> 00:51:55.800
She sure was. But by the time that she married Alan,

991
00:51:55.960 --> 00:51:59.400
she was riddled with insecurities. What do you think happened?

992
00:52:00.079 --> 00:52:02.039
Sometimes just as you get older. I don't know if

993
00:52:02.039 --> 00:52:06.079
it's you know, if it's chemical or hormonal or whatever

994
00:52:06.079 --> 00:52:07.960
it is. But I think sometimes as you get older,

995
00:52:08.079 --> 00:52:13.599
you know, you develop more insecurities and anxieties and things

996
00:52:13.679 --> 00:52:16.199
like that. So maybe that's just kind of what happened.

997
00:52:16.440 --> 00:52:19.960
I think some people are really comfortable in their small hometown,

998
00:52:20.199 --> 00:52:22.880
and when they leave that comfort, I think that she

999
00:52:23.480 --> 00:52:25.960
never really felt secure again. And I do think that

1000
00:52:26.079 --> 00:52:30.360
it was also depression and postpartum depression.

1001
00:52:30.599 --> 00:52:33.639
Yeah, sounds like it. Yeah. Do you think that Alan

1002
00:52:33.880 --> 00:52:38.760
was open to an affair with Candy because of Betty's challenges,

1003
00:52:38.800 --> 00:52:41.400
her insecurities, her mental health struggles. Do you think that

1004
00:52:41.559 --> 00:52:45.199
caused him to be more willing to kind of entertain

1005
00:52:45.239 --> 00:52:47.079
this possibility or do you think it was just that

1006
00:52:47.119 --> 00:52:48.159
he was attracted to her.

1007
00:52:48.800 --> 00:52:51.719
I think that's a really good question, and I think, yeah,

1008
00:52:51.840 --> 00:52:55.440
to some extent, that's probably true. He tried really hard

1009
00:52:55.559 --> 00:52:58.079
to comfort her and be there for her, but it

1010
00:52:58.119 --> 00:53:02.880
was overwhelming sometimes. Yeah, like when she called his boss, like,

1011
00:53:03.079 --> 00:53:05.559
I can't even imagine how angry you would have been

1012
00:53:05.559 --> 00:53:07.199
with me if I would have done something like that.

1013
00:53:07.800 --> 00:53:09.960
But in Betty's mind, she was like, well, maybe your

1014
00:53:10.000 --> 00:53:12.719
boss doesn't know that you have, you know, a wife

1015
00:53:12.719 --> 00:53:14.960
who really wants you at home and a young baby,

1016
00:53:15.039 --> 00:53:15.639
and you know.

1017
00:53:15.800 --> 00:53:19.000
Yeah, so Alan may have felt like he was like

1018
00:53:19.039 --> 00:53:22.159
he was very supportive of Betty, but maybe maybe he

1019
00:53:22.239 --> 00:53:24.800
resented that after a certain amount of time and felt like,

1020
00:53:25.000 --> 00:53:28.159
you know, I want my own right Yeah.

1021
00:53:28.239 --> 00:53:31.840
Yeah. And the way Candy presented herself. She was always

1022
00:53:31.840 --> 00:53:35.679
a lot of fun and gregarious and things didn't weigh

1023
00:53:35.679 --> 00:53:38.280
on her as heavily as they did on Betty.

1024
00:53:38.400 --> 00:53:39.360
Yeah that makes sense.

1025
00:53:39.960 --> 00:53:41.599
Do you think you're a Betty or a Candy?

1026
00:53:43.920 --> 00:53:46.440
I think somewhere in between. I I don't think I'm

1027
00:53:46.800 --> 00:53:49.199
too close to either of them. Yeah, how about you.

1028
00:53:49.320 --> 00:53:52.119
Well, you tell me. I don't know. I think I'm

1029
00:53:52.400 --> 00:53:55.400
a little bit of both. When we were talking about

1030
00:53:55.440 --> 00:53:58.199
all of Betty's little health issues like her headaches and

1031
00:53:58.199 --> 00:54:00.199
her allergies, and I'm like, oh my god, you're going

1032
00:54:00.239 --> 00:54:03.480
to think that's me, because, especially in the summertime, I'm

1033
00:54:03.519 --> 00:54:04.800
just a whiny mass.

1034
00:54:05.880 --> 00:54:07.960
You have had a lot of melodies this summer.

1035
00:54:08.039 --> 00:54:11.559
But yeah, but I don't know. There were all dynamic women,

1036
00:54:11.880 --> 00:54:13.960
and I just don't want to paint Betty in a

1037
00:54:14.000 --> 00:54:18.880
certain way. But definitely the shows that I've watched and

1038
00:54:19.000 --> 00:54:21.760
the book that I read paint her in a certain way,

1039
00:54:22.039 --> 00:54:24.400
but I definitely have a lot of empathy for what

1040
00:54:24.519 --> 00:54:25.320
she was going through.

1041
00:54:25.440 --> 00:54:26.760
Yeah. Well, I think that's one of the things that

1042
00:54:26.800 --> 00:54:31.000
makes this story so fascinating is the different personalities involved

1043
00:54:31.000 --> 00:54:34.280
of like the four main people in this story, They're

1044
00:54:34.320 --> 00:54:35.440
all very different and.

1045
00:54:35.360 --> 00:54:38.000
They all have Well, the guys are pretty SMA guys.

1046
00:54:37.719 --> 00:54:41.159
Maybe similar, yeah, but definitely Candy and Betty are very

1047
00:54:41.360 --> 00:54:41.880
very different.

1048
00:54:42.440 --> 00:54:51.599
Well, please come back for part two and part three.

1049
00:54:51.920 --> 00:54:55.000
This case takes place in nineteen eighty and as we

1050
00:54:54.880 --> 00:54:58.599
were talking about, and I was a TV kid, yeah,

1051
00:54:58.840 --> 00:55:01.639
and I were you. I think I was more than you.

1052
00:55:01.599 --> 00:55:03.519
Were as a TV kid, definitely.

1053
00:55:03.559 --> 00:55:06.039
Okay, So we thought it would be fun, and I

1054
00:55:06.119 --> 00:55:09.639
think you made this for me, yes, to play some

1055
00:55:09.760 --> 00:55:12.400
TV theme songs and see how good I am at

1056
00:55:12.440 --> 00:55:12.960
guessing them.

1057
00:55:13.039 --> 00:55:16.320
Yes, And I took TV shows that were on in

1058
00:55:16.400 --> 00:55:20.000
nineteen eighty, like shows that were generally pretty popular in

1059
00:55:20.079 --> 00:55:22.679
nineteen eighty. So, yeah, I've got a bunch of them here.

1060
00:55:22.719 --> 00:55:23.920
So let's okay, Wait.

1061
00:55:23.800 --> 00:55:25.239
Do you want me to like hit? I'll hit this

1062
00:55:25.480 --> 00:55:27.360
stabler when I know it, So I'm going to try

1063
00:55:27.400 --> 00:55:29.199
to get him as fast as I can okay.

1064
00:55:29.000 --> 00:55:38.159
Sounds good. Here here's the first one. Yes, Tina Vernon Shirley,

1065
00:55:38.400 --> 00:55:44.719
I'm very good. All right, let's give this one a try, Yes,

1066
00:55:44.920 --> 00:55:53.440
TAXI very good. All right, you're ready for the next one? God?

1067
00:55:53.679 --> 00:55:56.000
Yes, w KP in Cincinnati.

1068
00:55:56.119 --> 00:55:57.800
That's a great show. I love that show.

1069
00:55:58.119 --> 00:55:59.639
I did not like that show. I think it was

1070
00:55:59.679 --> 00:55:59.960
too young.

1071
00:56:02.800 --> 00:56:10.480
All right, here's the next one. Oh quick, Dallas. Very good.

1072
00:56:10.519 --> 00:56:13.239
I don't think I would have recognized this from that early.

1073
00:56:13.480 --> 00:56:18.400
It's been on my mind because between Betty's house and

1074
00:56:18.559 --> 00:56:23.360
Candy's house was south Fork Ranch. Oh Betty, I know.

1075
00:56:24.039 --> 00:56:29.079
Candy actually drove past south Fork Ranch on her way.

1076
00:56:29.360 --> 00:56:32.000
I didn't realize that was a real place. And her

1077
00:56:32.039 --> 00:56:33.679
really watched Dallas. Did you watch Dallas?

1078
00:56:34.079 --> 00:56:35.079
Oh? Not really?

1079
00:56:35.159 --> 00:56:37.119
No, it wasn't big into that one. All right, let's

1080
00:56:37.159 --> 00:56:39.079
try one maybe a little trickier.

1081
00:56:42.960 --> 00:56:46.480
Yes, shoot, I know, but I can't think of it.

1082
00:56:46.519 --> 00:56:47.440
Is it magnum p I?

1083
00:56:48.039 --> 00:56:51.079
No, it's a good guess though. It's about a couple

1084
00:56:51.440 --> 00:56:56.519
very much like us No Heart Tartar Heart, Robert Wagner

1085
00:56:57.280 --> 00:57:01.559
and who Stephanie Stephanie Powers. Yeah. I always looked at

1086
00:57:01.960 --> 00:57:06.039
Robert Wagner as like the ideal American man. He was

1087
00:57:06.039 --> 00:57:07.599
like what I aspired to be before you.

1088
00:57:07.519 --> 00:57:10.119
Read the Natalie story.

1089
00:57:10.480 --> 00:57:12.199
Yeah, maybe not so much at high.

1090
00:57:12.400 --> 00:57:13.079
On that story.

1091
00:57:13.079 --> 00:57:15.920
We probably know we probably all right, you're ready for

1092
00:57:15.920 --> 00:57:22.159
the next one? Yeah, yes, there you go. Yeah, you

1093
00:57:22.199 --> 00:57:24.079
guessed it on the last one. I wouldn't have known

1094
00:57:24.119 --> 00:57:25.400
that one. Yeah.

1095
00:57:25.840 --> 00:57:27.599
I thought you were going to do more like Facts

1096
00:57:27.639 --> 00:57:29.800
of Life, and because I would get that one.

1097
00:57:29.599 --> 00:57:32.280
In because it has the words facts of.

1098
00:57:32.239 --> 00:57:34.880
The But it was like my favorite theme song, was it?

1099
00:57:35.079 --> 00:57:37.639
I'm sorry I missed that one. All right, let's try

1100
00:57:38.159 --> 00:57:39.280
this one.

1101
00:57:46.119 --> 00:57:47.320
Yes, Fantasy Island.

1102
00:57:47.440 --> 00:57:52.400
Fantasy Island, I'm so old. I loved Fantasy Island.

1103
00:57:52.719 --> 00:57:53.719
The island was creepy.

1104
00:57:53.760 --> 00:57:55.559
It was creepy. That's why I loved it. It had like

1105
00:57:55.599 --> 00:57:59.679
this dark, foreboding feel about it, like something terrible was

1106
00:57:59.679 --> 00:58:00.320
going to have happened.

1107
00:58:00.559 --> 00:58:03.199
Well, yeah, and sometimes they were. They were pretty scary.

1108
00:58:03.360 --> 00:58:08.920
Yeah, all right, let's try this. Taking a long time

1109
00:58:08.960 --> 00:58:10.719
to fade up, all right, let's try this one.

1110
00:58:11.880 --> 00:58:15.519
You're rats. Yes, I can't believe I know this one,

1111
00:58:15.519 --> 00:58:16.239
but Alice, I.

1112
00:58:16.280 --> 00:58:18.000
Can't believe you don't either. I thought that would be.

1113
00:58:17.960 --> 00:58:20.360
A hard one, I think because Linda lavin May she

1114
00:58:20.440 --> 00:58:23.159
Rest in peace died with in the last year or so,

1115
00:58:23.199 --> 00:58:27.079
and I think I listened to her singing this on YouTube.

1116
00:58:27.119 --> 00:58:28.559
Oh really, thank you, that's.

1117
00:58:28.440 --> 00:58:30.239
What you said. Here comes my favorite part of this though,

1118
00:58:32.079 --> 00:58:39.719
right right here is a new girl in towns. She's

1119
00:58:39.920 --> 00:58:55.280
looking good. All right, one more. I don't know we're

1120
00:58:55.320 --> 00:58:56.239
gonna have a tricky on.

1121
00:58:59.400 --> 00:58:59.559
Is it?

1122
00:58:59.760 --> 00:59:04.159
Very very popular show, very popular comedy sitcom.

1123
00:59:04.280 --> 00:59:06.079
I thought you were gonna do ones where like there

1124
00:59:06.119 --> 00:59:09.800
was a theme song Nash's music, So I don't think I.

1125
00:59:09.760 --> 00:59:11.519
Know this one that's Morgan Mindy.

1126
00:59:12.039 --> 00:59:16.559
Oh yeah, I don't remember that one at all. Sadly today,

1127
00:59:16.840 --> 00:59:20.639
I don't think there are many shows with recognizable themes.

1128
00:59:20.800 --> 00:59:23.119
If there, if there even is a theme song, it's

1129
00:59:23.159 --> 00:59:26.239
so short, it's like ten to fifteen seconds. Like people

1130
00:59:26.320 --> 00:59:27.639
just don't have the I mean maybe.

1131
00:59:27.480 --> 00:59:29.280
There are, I just can't think of them. But other

1132
00:59:29.360 --> 00:59:32.800
than Succession, that was obviously the Piano.

1133
00:59:32.960 --> 00:59:35.440
I actually have that on my Spotify playlist because I

1134
00:59:35.440 --> 00:59:36.519
love that song so much.

1135
00:59:38.519 --> 00:59:40.199
What was your favorite show growing up?

1136
00:59:40.760 --> 00:59:44.079
Well, Get Smart was? I mean it depended on what age.

1137
00:59:43.800 --> 00:59:46.480
I was, but I was thinking, like, oh, he's gonna

1138
00:59:46.480 --> 00:59:48.800
play Get Smart. That tune that's.

1139
00:59:48.599 --> 00:59:53.639
Way before nineteen eighty. But yeah, that was a great, great.

1140
00:59:53.440 --> 00:59:56.000
I surely watched a lot of these shows as reruns,

1141
00:59:57.440 --> 01:00:00.239
you know, in syndication. Yeah, so I think I think

1142
01:00:00.320 --> 01:00:01.480
I mean Brady Bunch of you.

1143
01:00:01.400 --> 01:00:04.920
Were Ay, I love everyone loved the Brady Bunch, Gilligan's

1144
01:00:04.920 --> 01:00:06.800
Island I was a big fan of for a while.

1145
01:00:07.079 --> 01:00:09.079
I just love to sitcom I still I still do,

1146
01:00:09.280 --> 01:00:11.960
kind of, but sitcoms. There's just TV is just so

1147
01:00:12.000 --> 01:00:14.599
different than it was when we were growing up. There's

1148
01:00:14.639 --> 01:00:18.280
so many different platforms to watch TV on. And if

1149
01:00:18.320 --> 01:00:20.519
we've talked about this before, but I think the only

1150
01:00:20.599 --> 01:00:24.239
show that we watch it's on regular TV is Survivor.

1151
01:00:24.599 --> 01:00:28.519
Yeah, I think you're right, or yeah, I think so. Well,

1152
01:00:28.559 --> 01:00:30.800
it's kind of weird, Like I know people talk about

1153
01:00:30.800 --> 01:00:32.599
this all the time, but there is no sort of

1154
01:00:32.719 --> 01:00:37.280
shared experience of you know, everybody watched Dallas, the season

1155
01:00:37.320 --> 01:00:40.519
finale of Dallas, you know who shot JR? Type of thing.

1156
01:00:40.679 --> 01:00:43.519
We just don't have those kind of cultural moments with

1157
01:00:43.599 --> 01:00:44.840
TV shows very rarely.

1158
01:00:45.400 --> 01:00:49.039
Yeah that's not actually true. There are some like even

1159
01:00:49.079 --> 01:00:51.400
like the Scott Peterson documentary that we were talking about

1160
01:00:51.440 --> 01:00:53.440
in our last episode, like a lot of people watch that,

1161
01:00:53.719 --> 01:00:57.800
or I don't know, Tiger King, what was Tiger? Yeah,

1162
01:00:58.079 --> 01:00:59.079
like everyone watched.

1163
01:00:58.880 --> 01:01:01.679
That or well that's true. Occasionally a show does sort

1164
01:01:01.679 --> 01:01:04.639
of rise to that level of you know, awareness that

1165
01:01:04.719 --> 01:01:06.559
becomes it almost becomes like viral.

1166
01:01:06.880 --> 01:01:12.119
Remember Making a Murderer it's Stephen Avery. Yeah, like collectively

1167
01:01:12.280 --> 01:01:14.079
we were all very obsessed with that case.

1168
01:01:14.440 --> 01:01:16.000
It's a huge true crime one.

1169
01:01:16.079 --> 01:01:19.960
Yeah, quickly before we go, I wanted to talk about pheromones.

1170
01:01:20.239 --> 01:01:23.440
Do you know that you can go by like pheromones

1171
01:01:23.639 --> 01:01:27.519
on Amazon? There's different colones that are supposed to make

1172
01:01:27.559 --> 01:01:30.480
you more attractive to I don't know if it's the

1173
01:01:30.519 --> 01:01:31.480
opposite sex.

1174
01:01:31.280 --> 01:01:33.239
But just make you more people.

1175
01:01:33.760 --> 01:01:38.000
Scientists really have not for humans, been able to narrow

1176
01:01:38.119 --> 01:01:41.800
down what we're actually attracted to. So by these colones,

1177
01:01:41.960 --> 01:01:44.880
it works for animals and insects, but not in humans.

1178
01:01:44.920 --> 01:01:47.639
And so these are actually like colognes that smell like

1179
01:01:47.679 --> 01:01:50.280
they smell nice, but they also have pheromones.

1180
01:01:51.800 --> 01:01:54.119
Pheromone colones. Yeah, there's a lot of them out there,

1181
01:01:54.840 --> 01:01:57.840
But yeah, you don't need those because you know, we're

1182
01:01:57.960 --> 01:01:59.840
attractive just the way you are. But do you have

1183
01:01:59.880 --> 01:02:02.280
any smells that are like your favorite smells, or at

1184
01:02:02.320 --> 01:02:03.320
least favorite smells.

1185
01:02:03.440 --> 01:02:05.719
I well, you know, I know, you.

1186
01:02:05.639 --> 01:02:08.559
Know, when I'm cooking something.

1187
01:02:08.280 --> 01:02:10.320
For Yeah, but I wouldn't want you to smell like

1188
01:02:10.400 --> 01:02:13.280
garlic and onions. But like vanilla. You know, I really

1189
01:02:13.360 --> 01:02:14.920
love the smell of vanilla. I used to buy you.

1190
01:02:14.960 --> 01:02:16.719
I think, like lotions that were vanilla.

1191
01:02:17.000 --> 01:02:20.719
I said, please start buying me lotions that smell like food. Yeah,

1192
01:02:20.800 --> 01:02:22.800
but what smells don't you like?

1193
01:02:23.000 --> 01:02:24.400
What smells don't I like?

1194
01:02:25.159 --> 01:02:26.800
I don't garbage.

1195
01:02:27.639 --> 01:02:30.079
I know there's a ton of spells, but I don't like.

1196
01:02:30.119 --> 01:02:32.519
I wouldn't expect you to like things that other people

1197
01:02:32.639 --> 01:02:35.119
might like that you don't like. Can you think of.

1198
01:02:35.079 --> 01:02:38.800
Any maybe sort of like overly flowery kind of fragrances,

1199
01:02:38.880 --> 01:02:41.760
like you know sometimes like you smell lotions that are

1200
01:02:42.199 --> 01:02:46.519
flowery or rose scented or lavender, those kind of things

1201
01:02:46.559 --> 01:02:47.760
I don't necessarily love.

1202
01:02:48.360 --> 01:02:50.199
I spread on her bed all the time. Yeah.

1203
01:02:50.239 --> 01:02:52.800
I mean, I wouldn't say that I don't like them,

1204
01:02:52.840 --> 01:02:54.599
but I just don't. I don't know, they don't appeal

1205
01:02:54.679 --> 01:02:54.920
to me.

1206
01:02:55.159 --> 01:02:55.880
Interesting.

1207
01:02:56.159 --> 01:02:56.840
What about you?

1208
01:02:57.400 --> 01:02:59.880
We don't you when you walk into someone's house and

1209
01:03:00.079 --> 01:03:03.400
it just smells like really musty especially this time of year. Yeah,

1210
01:03:03.400 --> 01:03:07.280
I hate that smell, but I like the smell of cookies,

1211
01:03:09.079 --> 01:03:12.119
chocolate chip cookies, some homemade bread, you know, all the

1212
01:03:12.159 --> 01:03:12.559
things that.

1213
01:03:12.519 --> 01:03:14.400
You like to Yeah, those are very good smells.

1214
01:03:14.519 --> 01:03:17.119
All right, Well, you have wasted a perfectly good hour

1215
01:03:17.360 --> 01:03:20.559
listening to our podcast. If you would like to listen

1216
01:03:20.599 --> 01:03:22.639
to parts two, and I'm pretty sure there's going to

1217
01:03:22.719 --> 01:03:26.400
be a third Part two, please consider joining us on Patreon.

1218
01:03:26.639 --> 01:03:30.719
Go to patreon dot com slash love Marykill. For only

1219
01:03:30.760 --> 01:03:33.719
five dollars a month. You get early add free access

1220
01:03:33.800 --> 01:03:36.440
and a monthly bonus episode.

1221
01:03:36.679 --> 01:03:39.440
Find us on social media or on the internet at

1222
01:03:39.480 --> 01:03:43.480
Lovemarykill dot com, send us an email at Lovemarykill at

1223
01:03:43.480 --> 01:03:46.000
gmail dot com, or fill out the contact form on

1224
01:03:46.039 --> 01:03:48.119
our website or leave us a voicemail as well.

1225
01:03:48.239 --> 01:03:51.360
Wow, love so many options, so many options, And if

1226
01:03:51.440 --> 01:03:54.039
you haven't subscribed to her a YouTube channel, it would

1227
01:03:54.079 --> 01:03:57.599
be fabulous if you would. Until next time, don't kill

1228
01:03:57.639 --> 01:04:27.559
your wife and don't kill your husband.

1229
01:04:12.840 --> 01:04:35.360
The Companion with tat