Bonus episode: The Disappearance of Amy Bradley

0:00 Hi. I'm Tina and I'm Rich. If there's one thing we've learned and over twenty years of marriage, it's. That some days you'll feel like killing your wife. And some days you'll feel like killing your husband. Welcome to a bonus episode of Love Mary Kill, Hey Rich, Hey Tina, how are you? I'm fabulous. How are you doing? You didn't you sounded a little tired there? No, I'm fabulous. Okay, good. I'm a little under the weather today. But this has been kicking around for a while, this case, and I thought I was gonna be a quick and easy one, but I keep adding to it every day.

0:45 I keep, you know, doing research. As you do. So yeah, so I had to I had to call it. So we are recording this episode. We're a little late to this case. I started doing this when the documentary came out on Netflix. Amy Bradley is miss saying but that we went on vacation and then Betty Broderick took forever. So anyway, story short, we're getting to it today. I know a lot of our podcast friends have already done this episode, So if you don't want to listen, that's okay. I totally understand. Not okay with me, But okay, everyone. Has to listen to this one. Probably we've probably already lost some people, could be I'm going to ask you a question that I know the answer to. But have you ever been out a cruise before?

1:27 I have not. Neither have I. We've done boat rides before, tourist type. Things, but never on a cruise. Dinner cruise a couple of times, things like that, but. But never a like a multi day cruise off of Port of Iarta or love boat type cruise. Would you want to take a cruise? You know, I think I would enjoy it, To be honest with you, I've heard so many horror stories about cruises that it's a little bit scary, But I don't know. I think I would enjoy just the relaxed nature of a crew. I know how relaxing it is. Really. There's thousands of people. It's like a floating village. They say, these the ships just keep getting bigger and bigger. Just this week. Actually, the largest cruise ship in the world today is Royal Caribbean's Icon of the Seas, joined by her sister Star of the Seas, and that's the one that took her maiden voyage this week and nearly twelve hundred feet long and weighing in it more than two hundred and forty eight thousand gross tons, she's essentially a floating city. The ship carries over seven thousand guests and more than two thousand crew spread across twenty decks. It's enormous, it really is. Yeah, And I'm sure there's places where you can find some peace and quiet, but it just sounds like it's probably really busy. Yeah, and you know, whenever you go to food get food, there's probably a lot of other Yeah, that.

2:50 Doesn't sound that appealing. And actually, like eating dinner with a bunch of strangers doesn't sound very appealing to me. I think that would be kind of fun. Yeah, yeah, but it is that these cruise ships have so many attractions. There's ice rinks, there's like you can see like the ice capades there, and there's plays and acrobatic shows, magic shows. You can we have the biggest water park at sea on this new ship. I mean, mini golf, you can. You can do it all, and it is pretty cool that it's all kind of right there, and then you get to stop off at the port cities. But I will ask you, when I'm done telling you about Ammy Amy Bradley's story, if you would take a cruise. Curious if your physician will change. Also this week in Turkey of a new, brand new, one million dollar yacht capsize.

3:42 Just did you see that? Just two hundred meters into her maiden voyage. It's called the doulce Vento. She was eighty feet long. There gratefully were no casualties, but you saw that. That was crazy. I felt so bad for the owner of that ship. Just it almost instantly you could tell the sooner does it got into the water like no one had checked to see if she'd float, and Kenny. Probably lost their job over that one. I would think, Well, what. I read online was a million dollars for a ship that large is dirt cheap? Yeah, so I know it sounds super expensive and it. Is cut some corners and the exactly. Probably should have been I don't know if you could afford a Yeah, you should probably pay more than a million dollars. Even though this is a bonus episode. I made you a snack. I'm really proud of you because these came out of the oven probably an hour and a half ago, and you have not touched them, and I did leave them on the.

4:37 Amazing Self Control. I don't know why you would be surprised. About that listener, but might not be true last week. Sorry, I know we're probably going along, but I'm gonna just tell this funny story. You saw the oreos reesis what do you call it? Collaboration, and you were really excited, and I was like, Honey, I love you. I am going to get those for you. I went to three different stories and I'm like, honey, I'm sory. I failed you. I felt really bad, but you went and found them and I haven't seen them since. One of those things that you want something done right, you gotta do ityl. Where did they go though? I haven't seen them there? They went into my tummytage. I might have finished them earlier today when I was having self control about not eating your cookies on the counter.

5:24 Because you're telling me was full full of cookies already. Baby. Oh he makes me laugh. Okay, Well, here is my favorite brown butter chocolate chip cookie. I put Eminem's in them, so they're folish. All colors, some orange Eminem's nice. Yes, well they're brown Eminem's too. But you can't see them. All right, try one. I sure do. Rate my cookie ten out of ten excellent. As always, you can only pack one cookie to go on the crew ruise ship. There's no cookies on the cruise ship. Do you take the oreo Reese's cookies or do you take my chocolate?

6:06 No, definitely your chocolative. Oh okay, yeah, well, I mean the oreos are good. Even regular oreos like double stuff are good, but they're not They don't compare it to your homemade brown buttered chocolate chip cookies. Yeah, but how did you feel about the Reese's oreos? They were good, but I think I would take regular oreos over the Reese's ones. When you first opened the package, you were really disappointed. Well, they weren't you. I didn't have quake. You're like click, honey, and you took you scraped. I made my own major. Yes, because you are an entrepreneur. That's right, I'm an innovator. In the early morning hours of March twenty fourth, nineteen ninety eight, as Royal Caribbean's newest showstopper, Rhapsody of the Seas, glided quietly through the dark vast ocean, nearing the shores of Ciasaw, the first streaks of sunlight broke across the horizon.

6:59 Inside the craw of room eight five six four, Ron and Iva Bradley slept alongside their twenty one year old son Brad. Ron startled awake at six am for reasons he's never been able to explain. His wife dozed next to him, and he could just make out Brad's shape on the pullout sofa in the dim light. But he wondered where was his twenty three year old daughter Amy. He peeked out onto the balcony and spotted only her sandals, sitting beneath the chair where he had last seen her, staring out at the endless sea. Believing that she had gone to watch the sunrise, Ron rose from bed and decided to join her. He searched the ship, but Amy was nowhere to be found. What began as an ordinary morning soon dissolved into a nightmare, a mystery that would haunt Iva, Ron and brad for the next twenty seven years.

7:51 So you have not watched the Netflix documentary, No, and you don't know anything about this case. No, I know nothing about it. I do know a lot of bad things happen on cruise ship, so it is a scary thought. There are larger, more impressive boats today. But when Royal Caribbeans Rhapsody of the Seas launched in May nineteen ninety seven, it was considered one of the most impressive luxurious cruise ships of its time. Spanning nine hundred feet long, one hundred feet wide and eleven stories tall, it was among the largest vessels in the fleet. The Rhapsody had capacity for over two thousand passengers and nearly eight hundred crew members. The ship had a variety of dining options, casual, formal, and of course endless all you can eat buffets that cruises are famous for. There was a nightclub, Calypso Disco, where guests could drink and dance the night away, a small casino of rock climbing wall, six whirlpools and two swimming pools. The Rhapsody of the Seas has since been refurbished and still sails today. In the nineteen nineties, cruise ships weren't as safe and monitored as they are today.

8:58 Security was lax. There were few, if any security cameras, and protocols weren't yet in place to deal with the dangers of unregulated international waters or a missing guest. Amy Lan Bradley was born on May twelfth, nineteen seventy four, to Ron and Iva Bradley in Petersburg, Virginia. Petersburg is a mid sized independent city in the southeastern part of the state, about twenty five miles south of Richmond, known for its significance during the Civil War and its diverse population. Amy has one sibling, a brother named Ronald Junior, also known as Brad, three years her junior. I think a lot of people don't realize that Brad is a nickname, and a lot of you know Brad Bradley, who names their kid Brad Bradley, but who is actually named after his dad. Sports were a big part of Amy's childhood.

9:48 She excelled at every sport she played volleyball, basketball, softball, soccer, and swimming. She lettered in all five sports in high school. Amy was a very strong swimmer, even working as a swim teacher and lifeguard. She graduated from Longwood College in Farmville, Virginia in nineteen ninety six, where she was on a full basketball scholarship. Averaging ten points a game. Amy set a school record when she shot seven to three pointers in one game. Can you imagine watching that game? That must have been so exciting. That's a lot of three pointers, right, Yeah, for sure. A former coach called Amy the best ball handler she'd ever seen. At Longwood, Amy majored in physical education.

10:30 After graduation, she lived with her parents while working as a waitress at Ruth's Chris Steakhouse. Everyone at the restaurant loved Amy, but after the cruise, Amy was excited to start a new job as a graphic designer and move into a new apartment. I think at this time it was harder to get a job as a teacher. I think the market was just saturated, and she really did want to be a teacher and a coach, but she couldn't find a job. So she took this job. I think it was a family friend and they hired her until she could find I think a job in the teaching field. Amy had also recently adopted a new English bulldog puppy that she'd named Bailey. Things were going well for Amy. She and her brother Brad were extremely close.

11:16 They considered each other best friends. Self expression was important to Amy. She wasn't afraid to stand out. She was confident in her own skin, her style bold and edgy, her ever changing hair color, her distinctive fashion sense to the music she loved. Amy also had several tattoos, each carried a special meaning to her. On her left shoulder was a purple baby Tasmanian devil also known as Dizzy Devil, spinning a basketball on its finger, a nod to her love of the game. Above her right ankle, she had a black Japanese symbol. On her lower back a primitive Japanese sund and around her belly button, where she also had a piercing curled a blue and green gecko. Each design was intentional, a small window into who Amy was.

12:03 Amy's story has long fascinated the true crime community, but it wasn't until the three part Netflix documentary Amy Bradley Is Missing that her sexuality became widely discussed. Whether it has any direct bearing on her disappearance is debatable, but it remains an important piece of the puzzle in understanding who Amy was. During her junior year of college, Amy began questioning her sexuality after developing feelings for her close friends Shannon kat Lovelace, a fellow basketball player and sweet mate. When their friendship deepened into a romantic relationship, Amy hesitated to share the truth with her family, worried their conservative values might lead to rejection. To keep up appearances, Amy and Kat dated brothers as boyfriends while secretly staying committed to each other.

12:52 I heard an interview with Kat and she said that these men or boys never even made it to first base with them. Amy even invited Kat to spend the summer with her family, under the guys that she needed a place to stay. The Bradleys warmly welcomed Kat as Amy's friend, but when Amy later revealed that Kat was actually her girlfriend, their opinion shifted. In this interview I heard with Kat, she talked about how much she loved the Bradleys and they were a really great family, but they just couldn't wrap their heads around Amy being gay. Okay, Ron Bradley went so far as to write Kat a three page letter expressing his disappointment. When Amy came out to her parents, Kat realized she should do the same and also chose to come out to her own family, but she had a much better experience. Despite the couple's love for each other, Amy's Family's disapproval weighed heavily on their relationship, and Kat would later say it played a part in their eventual breakup after two years. Kat on her substack described Amy as vibrant, magnetic, complicated, brave, fun, passionate, flawed.

14:02 She called their relationship a gift and a storm. Brad has done a lot of interviews and said that Amy was bisexual and had a boyfriend named Tom at the time of her disappearance, but friends say this isn't true. A journalist named James Renner interviewed Tom. Tom was a manager at Ruth Chris Steakhouse where Amy worked. He described their relationship as more of a buddy relationship. They would drink beers and shoot pool together. This man, James Renner, he has a YouTube channel and I watched a lot of his videos about this case. The Netflix documentary coincided with him writing a book about Amy. Okay, so at this time the same time, they're both doing this research and some of their sources overlap.

14:49 Okay. James Renner's book is not out until next summer, but he's done an extensive amount of research. Sounds like a pretty good guy. He sat down with the Bradley family. He had been exchanging emails and messages with them for months, and finally they invited him to their home, which was kind of a big deal for the Bradley family because they didn't trust every journalist been cautious understandably over the years. Well it should be an interesting read. So, like we said at the beginning of this section, Amy's sexuality had never really been discussed publicly, and when James Rudder went to meet with the Bradley family, he was very cautious about this because he was pretty sure that they didn't want to talk about it. But then he broached the subject, like right before he left, and he said, the mood completely changed in the room and Iva, who in the documentary, if you've watched it, really does seem like a nice woman who's very loving. But as soon as he brought up the thing, the rumors about Amy being gay, she shut him down.

15:52 Okay. In January nineteen ninety eight, Amy was dating a woman named Molly McClure. They were very much in love and planning a future together until Amy met and kissed another woman after a night of partying. It didn't mean anything and she instantly regretted it. Amy was racked with guilt when she admitted what happened to Molly. Molly ended the relationship. She told Amy she needed time and space to process the news, refusing to see her or talk to her on the phone. Amy was heartbroken and wanted to show Molly how important. She was to her. She decided to write her a love letter, a message in a bottle. It said, quote, Molly, I hurt you deeper than you can ever forget. I just wanted to ask you if you could find it in your heart to forgive me. I feel like there is an ocean between us, like I'm on a desert island, waiting for you to rescue me. A message in a bottle my only hope. I miss you, Molly, save me. Please stranded Amy.

16:51 So we can talk about the symbolism of her writing. Yeah, a letter in a bottle. That's quite a coincidence. Yeah it is is just a coincidence, but it is ironic. Yeah. She sent the letter a month before she disappeared. Molli was touched by the gesture, and they decided to reunite after the cruise and discuss their future. So it sounds like they were on the path to getting back together, but never had the opportunity. Sadly, yeah, I heard interviews with both Kat and Molly, and they both seem like lovely women who really cared about Amy very much. On March twenty first, nineteen ninety eight, the Bradley family left their home in Chesterfield, Virginia, and flew to San Juan, Puerto Rico, where they boarded the Rhapsody of the Seas to begin their seven day cruise, with port stops in Aruba, Curasau, and the Virgin Islands. Ron and Iva both worked for the insurance agency Illinois Mutual. The cruise was a reward trip for Illinois Mutual's top salespeople, with about two hundred employees and their families on board. Seizing the opportunity for a family trip, the Bradley paid extra so that Amy and Brad could join them. The trip, in part, was to celebrate the beginning of Amy's professional life. Amy and Brad took a slightly later flight than Iva and Ron.

18:12 Once they were all together, they were still too early to board the ship, so they went shopping. Amy bought fifteen rolls of film for her camera and some postcards that she sent before boarding the ship, so she was. Entering some sort of photo contest. I'm not sure if it was a contest that was going to be aboard the cruise or something after the cruise, but that was why she had bought so many rolls of film and was going to be taken a lot of pictures. Okay. The Bradley's cabin was on Deck eight, a prime location with nice views of the sea and a small balcony made of clear glass for unobstructed views of the ocean. It was close quarters, but the Bradleys didn't think sharing the state room would be a problem. With so much to explore on the ship and the port cities, they would only be in the room to sleep. Although Amy was a strong swim, her brother said she feared heights and deep water and avoided going near the railings.

19:05 So Brad and Amy were sharing the pullout sofa to sleep on. Oh, okay, that doesn't sound ideal. I think our kids are similar ages to the Bradley kids, and I can't imagine our kids sharing a pullout. Oh, they would not be cool with that. The Bradleys had a great time the first two days of the cruise. As two of the youngest passengers on board. Amy and Brad drew plenty of attention from the crew for their fun loving nature. On day three of the trip, March twenty third, the Rhapsody stopped in Aruba. The Bradleys rented a convertible to explore the island, but got lost for hours. Sunburned and exhausted, they barely made it back to the ship before departure. That evening aboard the ship was formal night, Amy and brad posed for pictures with the ship's professional photographer. After dinner, Iva and Amy searched for the photos but couldn't find them. The photographer said he had printed them, yet they had vanished from the display, though reprinted later. The incident was strange and unsettling. You always have to take your picture on all of these things.

20:11 Right whatever. You go on a ride, you go on a cruise, you go on. Whatever, in case it's your last ride cruise. Is that why they do it? Maybe I think they do it to make money, but it is a little bit, uh. It is funny like that happens to us all the time whenever I run one of these tourists trips, and a lot of times I'm a little rude and I just keep walking because there's no way I'm going to buy this picture, so let's save the film yep. After dinner, the Bradley's changed into more casual attire for a pool party. Brad surprised himself and his family when he won the limbo contest. He was given a crown as a surprise, which he promptly placed on Amy's head. At one am, Iva and Ron called it a night, just as the ship left Aruba's port for the next stop, Curosau, just seventy miles away. The family all in brace and exchanged I love yous before the elder Bradleys returned to their cabin. We'll be back after a break.

21:13 Amy and Brad were in no hurry to return to the tiny stateroom. Instead, they went to the Calypso Disco to dance and have a few drinks. Crew members were allowed to socialize with guests aboard the ship until about one am. Witnesses were called seeing Amy dancing and having a drink with a bass player for the ship's band, Blue Orchid Alistair Douglas was his name, although most people called him Yellow. He was dejaying that night, and Amy and Brad requested several songs. Between changing songs, he danced with Amy, sometimes grinding up against her, which definitely was against the rules. Amy and Brad were much younger than the typical guests on the cruise ship. They were both attractive, fun loving, and had good personalities. They became friendly with several members of the crew. The night before Amy disappeared, they even invited her to a bar, Carlos and Charlie's.

22:06 She declined the invitation, thinking it was a little odd. Carlos and Charlie's that is the bar in Aruba where Natalie Holloway was last seen. Oh around three am, Ron Bradley woke to find Brad and Amy missing and went to look for them to make sure they were okay. They told their dad that they would be back to the cabin soon. Do you think that's odd that he went to look for them a little bit? Yeah, I would think. You're on a cruise and you know they're young people. They are going to stay out till they stay out, Like, where are they going to go? Brad returned to the cabin about three thirty am and sat on the balcony. Amy followed ten minutes later and joined Brad outside. So in this entire case. The only objective data that we have is that Amy returned to the room at three forty. And we know this because you had to swipe your key to get into the room, gotcha.

23:00 But there's no record when someone leaves the room. Right because you don't have to swipe your key, you know, you just exit the room, just like in a hotel. And Brad confirmed that Amy came in at three point forty and that they sat on the balcony together. Yes, so, Amy enjoyed sitting on the small balcony facing the sea, feeling the breeze while smoking. While sitting together, Amy confided to Brad that Yellow had made several unwelcome advances towards her, but she let it go and said it wasn't a big deal. They sat on the balcony, chatting and rehashing the night until Brad turned in a little after four am, leaving Amy outside. With a combination of the long day, the alcohol, and the fresh air, Brad quickly fell into a sound sleep. Amy stayed on the balcony. She was feeling a little nauseous and the cool sea breeze soothed her. At five point thirty, Ron jerked awake with alarm. Later, he said he didn't know what had aroused him. He quickly panned the room and noted Brad and Bed, but not Amy. He peered out onto the deck and saw Amy lounging on a deck chair and went back to sleep, satisfied that all was well.

24:04 But when he woke up again just after six am, he noticed that the sliding door to the deck was a jar about a foot. The small table had been pushed up against the railing. Amy's cigarettes and lighter were gone from the table, but her sandals were neatly lined up under her chair. The yellow polo show that Amy had worn to the nightclub was draped over a chair inside the cabin. Ron assumed that Amy had gone out to seek a cup of coffee, and then he left the room, hoping to find her and join her to watch the sunrise. When he didn't find her, he returned to the room to rouse Iva and Brad to help look for Amy. So he saw her at five thirty on the balcony, and then just a half hour later he came back and she was gone, and the door was ajar exactly.

24:48 That's a very narrow window of time, interesting. Very good observation, something that I'm wondering. So it's five thirty the first time, and he doesn't know what woke him up, but he said he saw Amy on on the balcony. But it's five thirty. The sun isn't going to rise until I think just after six, okay, so it must be pretty dark. The room is cramped and Brad is closer to the deck door than he is, so would he be able to how clearly would he be able to see onto the deck? I mean, I think it really depends on whether there was a full moon out. I mean, sometimes even before the sunrise moon okay, and sometimes even before the sun rise it starts to get at least a little bit lighter.

25:34 But at five thirty am, and it's in March, mean, I know it's you know, it's a different It's the Caribbean, so maybe it's a little different. Yeah, it's hard to say. Around six thirty am on Tuesday, March twenty fourth, Ron and Iva approached the purser's desk and inform them that Amy was missing and asked for their assistance. The staff didn't seem too concern, suggesting that she may be eating breakfast or sleeping on a deck chair. Someone we don't know who called Yellow's room to see if Amy was there. She wasn't. I get the impression that Yellow bringing a woman back to his room. It might be a frequent occurrence, okay, even though he had a roommate. Later, Yellow's room and the rooms of his fellow bandmates were searched, but nothing was found. The crew told the Bradleys to keep looking and to let them know if Amy didn't turn up.

26:24 Soon. The Bradleys took another lap around the boat, but there was still no sign of Amy. It's a little surprising to me that they reported her missing so quickly. I would think it would be very possible that she was just up getting a cup of coffee or taking a walk to see the sunrise. And also I would think there are probably a lot of nooks and crannies on a ship like that that it would be very difficult to find someone just by walking around the ship. I think there were a fair number of places that she could have been, but they checked them all fairly quickly, okay. The Bradleys went door to door, pleading with fellow passengers and asking them to search their rooms. Their desperate efforts were halted after security stepped in and ordered them to stop.

27:06 The boat was about to dock and Ciros out for the day. Cirisau was an island of the Netherlands about forty miles north of Venezuela. Passengers lined up excitedly to explore the port city, Willemstad. The Bradleys knew Amy wouldn't have gotten off the boat without telling them something was definitely wrong. It was unlike Amy to worry her family. Iva told People magazine quote, She's not going to leave the room and not come back without leaving a note. My intuition was something is terribly wrong. They pleaded with the staff of the Rhapsody to lock the ship down, make an announcement, and not to let anyone off the vessel until Amy was found, but disembarkation continued. Helplessly. They watched as hundreds of passengers streamed off the ship, no records kept, no effort made to track who or how many left for the day or who returned.

28:02 That's really surprising to me. I would think if there's a passenger missing, even if they haven't been missing for that long, you would want to make sure everyone was accounted for. If they did let people off the ship, I would think they would be really careful to track exactly who was leaving the ship as well. I wish you would have been in charge of security. Yeah too, Yeah. I think today you have bracelets or badges that you know, they keep track of and they know who is on and off the ship at all times. But back in nineteen ninety eight that was not the case. It was infuriating. Iva said in an interview. They didn't act like this was an emergency. They acted like we were an inconvenience cruise.

28:42 Director Kirk Dattweiler said in the Netflix documentary, We're not going to stap everybody's cruise because there was a missing girl. That's one family's unfortunate incident. But we still have twenty four hundred people who paid a lot of money. And as cold as that sounds, that's the reality. We still had a couple of thousand people to entertain feed. They were still on vacation, so we went back to you know, normal operating procedure. Life goes on cruises go on. Oh, he's right, that sounds pretty cold. When I was watching the documentary and he said that, my jaw like hit the floor. I couldn't believe how cold hearted he was. I think he is one of those situations where he was interviewed for hours. I feel a little bit of empathy for him because I think they just took that one chunk out of his interview and he got to say a few other things in the documentary, but he I think he's gotten a lot of hate online, understandably so for what he said.

29:38 But I think so too. I mean, and may be part of its hindsight because at this time they didn't know that anything serious was wrong, right, but still, if somebody's missing, I would think you would take that very very seriously. If we were on a cruise and a passenger was missing, I would say, inconvenience me, it's okay, exactly Like you know, finding Amy was more important than anything else. Yep. By nine am there was still no sign of Amy. The crew agreed to page her finally, and they initiated a Charlie drill, which is a full scale search in which, in theory, every inch of the ship is combed. For an hour, crew members scoured every inch of the vessel, but there was still no sign of Amy. Although later the Bradleys learned that it really wasn't a full scaled Charlie drill. They did not search the guests cabins.

30:28 Oh yeah, I would think every inch of the ship would include the guest cabins. I think, yeah, most of the ship is the guest cabins. Right. The captain delivered devastating news to Iva Ron and brad He was sure that Amy was no longer on board. Panic set in. It made no sense. The Bradleys were beyond frustrated that a lockdown hadn't been ordered. Anyone could have slipped off the ship unnoticed. Amy could have been smuggled away as a prisoner in a suitcase or a garbage bag, or you know, there's so many things are coming on and off the ship. You know, at every port they take the garbage off, and you know they're getting an influx of you know, supply and food and so any of those carts they could have hidden Amy.

31:13 Ron watched helplessly as people came and went all day long hoping to see Amy. From early on, the Bradleys were sure that she had been kidnapped and taken off the boat. They did not believe that she went overboard accidentally or intentionally adamantly denying Amy would have taken her own life. Quote she didn't vanish into thin air. Ron said someone knows something and we are going to find out. And odd interaction occurred when Yellow approached Brad that morning and said, well, I'm sorry to hear about your sister, And that was before I had really been announced that she was missing. Yellow quickly became suspect number one. And I I'm not sure why he would say this to Brad if he did something to Amy.

31:56 Well, and didn't you say earlier that someone called him early that morning when they started looking for Yeah, yeah, so he would have known. So he would have known. But I don't think maybe Brad didn't realize that someone had called him at that point. I don't know. But he has been very and he has had some suspicious behavior. Too, Okay. It took local authorities in Kurrasau at least twelve hours to be informed about amy vanishing. Helicopters, boats, dive teams and scent dogs were dispatched to search the waters and coastlines between Aruba and Curasau, about two hundred square nautical miles. It was up to twenty hours after Amy had disappeared that the search got underway.

32:37 So that's almost a full day after Amy disappeared until these searches were started. Yeah, once again, does not seem to be the level of urgency that. I would expect. We're going to talk about this in just a minute, but I think a big problem was jurisdiction. Oh, because they are at sea. It was the largest air and water search ever performed in Curasau. The Navy, the Marines, the Venezuelan Coast Guard, and even local fishermen joined the search. Authorities believed that if Amy had jumped or been pushed off of the boat, her body would have eventually washed ashore due to the strong current. Even if a shark had gotten to her, clothing or body parts would be left behind.

33:19 Although I think there aren't many sharks in these waters. The Rhapsody of the Seas was sailing in international waters when Amy disappeared, a place where no single nation has jurisdiction. The ship flew under the flag of the Bahamas, which meant US law enforcement like the FBI, had no automatic authority on board to conduct searches, interviews, or even board the vessel. They first needed cooperation from both Royal Caribbean and Bahamian officials that red tape caused delays during the critical first hours of the investigation. Cruise ships carry security personnel but no sworn law enforcement officers, leaving initial control in the cruise line's hands. When the FBI finally boarded the next day, they began interviewing staff, but their scope was limited. With a foreign flagged ship and an international crew, much of the investigation depended on the cooperation of the very people employed by the cruise line. The waters were scoured for five days before the search was eventually called off.

34:23 Royal Caribbean charted a boat and continued to search for an additional twenty four hours to no avail. Rumors aboard the ship began to circulate about a missing passenger. Some people claimed they saw Amy disembark the ship at the Kirasau port with a beach bag in her hand, although she had not brought a beach bag with her. Some guests believed she had jumped intentionally, while others thought she might have tried to swim ashore given her athleticism. Swimming ashore makes no sense because even like those, cruise ships are so high up that jumping off of a cruise ship, you would be killed, right. I think that's a really good point. And people don't realize that that, you know, she was jumping from the eighth or ninth floor or whatever it was, And yeah, I think most you would die from that impact hitting the water, right.

35:10 Yeah, it's like jumping on the concrete when you're jumping from that high into water. Two young teenage passengers swore that sometime between five point thirty and six am, they saw Amy with Yellow in the ship's class elevator. About fifteen minutes later, they claimed that they saw only Yellow walk by them in a hurry, and he didn't acknowledge them. So it's impossible to corroborate this time. And it's nineteen ninety eight. We don't have cell phones in our pocket, you know, So like now, I feel like I have a good sense of what time it is all the time because i'm you know, either well, I have a watch, but you know a lot of people don't. But you always have your cell phone with you. But I wonder if they have this time wrong, right, And.

35:54 These are teenagers. They may have had watches, but they a lot of teenagers probably didn't wear watches at that point, and they're on a cruise ship right. Right, And staff should not have been on the glass elevator at any time. There was a special staff elevator. And I guess Yellow did break some other rules because he wasn't supposed to be, you know, with a guest after one am, and he was definitely dancing with Amy after one am, so he could have been in the glass elevator. But I do question the timing of this because it was never corroborated. The girls when they went back to the room. I think they were eighteen years old, okay, And they went back to the room, like one of their moms let them into the cabin and she said that it was after six am. But I just I question it because they didn't have to swipe their card, is what I was trying to get at there.

36:40 Okay. Well, like we see in so many stories when someone gets reported missing, you know, I always think back to the Lacy Peterson case, all of a sudden, you know, all these people come. Out of the woodwork. Well I think I saw her, you know, I saw this person. And they're always very specific with their information, and it's just you know, not that I doubt them, but. A lot of times his testimony is weakest evidence. You want to have seen her, and so you tell yourself that you saw her. Well, hold onto your hat, because we have a whole lot more of that coming up. Oh boy. The Royal Caribbean didn't announce Amy's disappearance or distribute flyers with her picture to passengers until forty eight hours after her disappearance. News reached the US by the next morning.

37:23 Amy's friends and family were shocked and felt helpless. The crew were adamant that the crew is needed to continue for the sake of the other passengers. The Bradleys were encouraged to disembark in Curasau in case Amy turned up. Iva and Ron's boss rented them a hotel room. The Rhapsody sailed off as planned on the evening of March twenty fourth. To Saint Thomas, it was a surreal feeling for the family. I can imagine how surreal that would be. It's like, you. Don't know is she on the ship, is she in the water? Is she on curasaw In. The heartbreaking and Royal Caribbean did seem they were like, uh, yeah, you guys should probably get off the ship and wait, I'm sure they're going to find her, so you want to be here in Kiras out.

38:08 They just wanted to be done with it and move on. Many guests weren't even aware that a passenger had gone missing when they awoke the next morning. The Bradleys began having second thoughts and decided to fly to Saint Martin to meet the Rhapsody at its next location to search the ship more thoroughly and ask more questions. They were met by Royal Caribbean executives. Although the ship had forty surveillance cameras, they were only used for live monitoring. They didn't record, leaving no footage to review after Amy vanished. Super frustrating, right yeah. The morning after Amy disappeared, Dutch authorities and the FBI came aboard the ship to begin their investigation, but by then the Bradley's cabin had been cleaned. There were no fingerprints on the Bradley's deck railing.

38:56 Which is crazy to think about, right, Yeah, I think that there would be. It would surprise me that they would clean the room and then they would go out to the deck and clean the deck. Yeah, that does seem like I. Would think that the balcony would get cleaned every now and then, but not every. Day, right, that is very strange. Although journalist James Renner claims that there were some palm prints on the railings and maybe some footprints on the door. So if you think if Amy was sleeping on the deck, like to sleep in a chair is really uncomfortable, Like, I think you would have to prop your legs up on something. So I would think that she would, you know, prop them up on the railing or you know, like maybe on the door or something.

39:39 Yellow was questioned, but authorities didn't believe he had anything to do with Amy's disappearance. He said that he returned to his room around three thirty am and went to bed. His key card confirmed. This, although originally he claimed that he was back to his room at one am. If you remember, it was the ship's rules that all staff should be back in their rooms by one am and not socializing with guests any long. Okay, So there were definitely some things that he was dishonest about. Yeah. However, because the ship was in international waters, the FBI had no domain on the Rhapsody and couldn't detain anyone and could only question people who agreed to cooperate. Yellow did pass a lie detector.

40:24 I read varying reports that it was either inconclusive or he passed. Okay, Iva, Ron, and brad were all interviewed by the FBI and quickly eliminated as suspects. We'll be back after a break. On March twenty eighth, the Bradley's left the cruise ship early and flew home from Saint Thomas on a private plane chartered by Iva and Ron's boss. I don't know this man's name, but he really helped the family. Oh yeah, where Royal Caribbean should have been stepping up to the place and helping them, But you know, Ron's boss really made sure. Yeah, it really seems that way.

41:04 Yeah. Back in Virginia, neighbors had adorned the trees in the Bradley's neighborhood with yellow ribbons for amy. Once they were home, they set up a command center in their house. Friends and family pulled their money together to offer a one hundred thousand dollar reward. Eventually it was I think over two hundred thousand dollars for any information. Royal Caribbean has also offered a two hundred thousand dollar reward for information, and the FBI two have offered a twenty five thousand dollars cash reward. The Bradleys also set up the Find the Amy Bradley Fund, accepting donations from community members and people around the world. A man named Wayne Brightagg stayed in the room next to the Bradleys and shared their balcony.

41:47 He enjoyed traveling alone and often observed the world around him, including Amy as she sat outside smoking. He had been at the ship's nightclub that night, quietly watching others rather than joining in. Gators considered him unusual, but ultimately he was cleared. When you say the balcony was shared between the two rooms, was there like any kind of barrier, like a wall between them or was it truly open between It was not open. There was something between the two balconies, but they would like, you know, kind of peer around the little partition. Okay, but it wouldn't be easy to go from one balcony to the other, or possibly even I.

42:29 Think it would be possible, but definitely my sage. Okay, gotcha. Another passenger, Chris Fenwick, had been hired to document the trip for a different company. Aboard the ship, Fenwick had about fifteen to twenty hours of video footage. After Amy's disappearance, he went through the tapes hoping that he had caught her on video, and sure enough, he found the video from the nightclub that captured Amy dancing with Yellow. Someone claiming to be with the boat security called him and told him that they needed his master copyfus we used to turn over the tapes. Good for him, However, he made a copy and handed it over to the FBI. Did they have that footage on the Netflix documentary? They did? Okay, interesting to see yeah.

43:11 Two weeks after Amy's disappearance, on April fourth, her father, brother, uncles, and her alleged boyfriend Tom returned to Carousau for a week. They held a press conference to spread the word about Amy and distributed over seven five hundred flyers with her picture. They met with police, hospitals, Morgue's, churches, and the media. It was during this trip that they met a cab driver named Dshi. We'll come to this in a few minutes. Royal Caribbean was under fire, but they tried to skirt responsibility and keep Amy's disappearance out of the media. A missing passenger was very bad for business. The Bradleys believed they knew more than they shared with them, and they were slow to provide them with a passenger manifest or surveillance video. Ron said, we were met with more concerned for their reputation than for our daughter. That ship sailed before anyone even lifted a finger, and that does seem to be the case. It quickly became a nightmare to investigate because international laws limited US involvement. We felt like we were screaming into the wind. Iva said. One agency would say we can't do anything, it's not our territory.

44:22 Another would say, we're waiting for permission from the cruise line, and meanwhile our daughter was missing. Ah so frustrating. In February nineteen ninety nine, a judge declared Amy legally dead so the Bradleys could pursue two lawsuits against Royal Caribbean, one for negligence and the other for wrongful death. The case, however, was later dismissed after the family was accused of fraud. The family had concealed eyewitness statements suggesting that Amy was alive and well, and instead presented only three accounts that supported the narrative that she had gone overboard. So these states that she suggesting she was alive, and well you mean after she disappeared. Yeah, oh okay, like where were they, where did they see her?

45:10 We're going to get to that, Okay. In twenty ten, a jawbone with one wisdom tooth attached washed ashore on a beach in Aruba. Authorities said the bone belonged to a Caucasian female, at first thought to belong to American Natalie Holloway, who vanished in two thousand and five during her senior class trip to Aruba. The Bradleys provided Amy's dental records to the FBI, but it's unclear in my research if the jawbone was ever tested. The bone may have been too degraded to test. Okay, Since I wrote that, my research has actually told me that that jawbone was tested and it was not Amy's. Okay. So the Bradleys are sure that Amy met a foul play and seemed to actively dispute any evidence that she fell or jumped overboard, but they are seemingly able to accept that she may have been thrown overboard. In the years following Amy Bradley's disappearance from the Rhapsody of the seas in March nineteen ninety eight. There have been numerous reported sightings. Just weeks after Amy vanished, her father, brother, uncle's and alleged boyfriend returned to Carrousaw. That's when they received their first disturbing lead. A taxi driver named Deshi claimed that he had seen a young woman matching Amy's description visibly distressed not long after the ship docked in Cairosaw, wearing jeans and a white T shirt, which her family thought was what she would be wearing. The woman asked him where to find a payphone. He pointed to the payphone, but she went in the opposite direction. Dashi pointed them

46:42 to a couple of points on the island where he thought Amy could have been taken, including a luxury hotel called the Coral Reef, but they began to suspect that Deshi was sending them on a wild goose chase. During that desperate search, Brad thought he heard someone calling his name from a car in traffic on the street. It's haunted him ever since. He swears that it was Amy's voice. They tried to follow the car, but when the car stopped, Amy was not inside. Amy's case went cold until five months later, when Canadian engineer David Carmichael reported seeing a woman escorted by two men on a Kirasou beach. He thought that one of the men was Yellow. She looked brightened, like she was about to say something when one of the guys motioned her away. Carmichael said he even remembered her two distinctive tattoos, a gecko and a Tasmanian devil, which match ones Amy had. Quote, if the man had not stared at me, I would have forgotten everything. But I can't. I think about this every day. There isn't a day that goes by when I don't. After Carmichael spotted them, he said that Amy and the two men went to eat an outdoor cafe. While investigators immediately went back to search, they found no trace of Amy, so he said that one of the men looked like Yellow, but at this time Yellow was still working for Royal Caribbeans and he was on a ship in interesting A member of the US Navy reported seeing Amy and Kirosow

48:15 brothel in nineteen ninety nine, although he didn't report it until years later after he'd left his job in the military. Quote, she told me she got off that ship and she left on her own because she was going to score drugs. She said, well, me and my brother were partying and I went ashore to get drugs, and now I'm stuck here with these guys. The woman told him that her name was Amy before she was escorted away. Amy's family said that she drank, but she never took drugs, so they did not believe that part of the story. Oh and yeah, she was an athlete too, right, So not that that doesn't mean you can't take drugs if you're an athlete, but I think a lot of athletes they really want to take care of their body, so.

48:56 Right, But in nineteen ninety eight, she had already graduated college and she. Wasn't really she can move down from that, yeah. Another sighting occurred in two thousand and five, when an American tourist, Judy Mauer, claimed to have met a distraught woman in a department store restroom in Barbados. She said that the woman told her that her name was Amy and that she was from West Virginia a needed help before two men barged into the restroom and whisked the woman away. You said West Virginia, but Amy was from Virginia, right exactly. The most chilling lead came in two thousand and five as well, when a series of photographs were sent to Amy's family by a tipster. The images, published on a Caribbean adult website, adult vacation dot Com, appeared to show a woman named Jazz with a striking resemblance to Amy in a sexual exploitation setting. Even the FBI could not rule out that this was Amy. Oh, I'm going to show you the picture really quick and then you can give me your opinion. Okay, I forgot that. I sent this picture to our family chata.

50:03 Yeah you did, and I. Think everyone in her family chat was like it, it's gonna be the same person. It's intriguing. I mean, I can definitely see the resemblance, and it looks like you know, I think when you sent the picture, I said, it looks like it could be the same person after several hard years in between. And that's a really good point, because it's been seven years in two thousand and five since Amy's been missing. To me, she looks older than Amy would be thirty, right, she looks older than thirty to me, And yeah, I mean, you know, if she was in this sexual exploitation business. That would aid you quickly, for sure. But the facial structure, like just her cheek bones, and there is definitely a strong resemblance there there is.

50:47 Iva said, when I first looked at the picture, it wasn't the Amy. I know, the picture looks like a harsh and tormented Amy, but it was still something for the Bradleys to hang on to and give them hope that Amy was still alive. People online have identified Jazz as a woman named Susan from Daytona. There are other pictures of her where she looks less like Amy, and I've heard some people say that her ear lobes are attached and Amy's appear unattached, or vice versa. And in the pictures of Jazz, you can't see the tattoos. And if they're from two thousand and five, like our photoshop abilities what they are today. And the picture is grainy, so I can't see any evidence of the tattoos. It doesn't mean that they aren't there. This Susan from Daytona is just like a couple of people have said this, it's not We've never found this woman. It does make me wonder though all these sightings of Amy. Could they have been this other woman. We've maintained from the beginning that someone saw Amy and took Amy from that ship in some way, Ron told NBC. Well, none of these sightings have ever been conved eclusively verified. The consistency of reports over the years has fueled suspicions that Amy was abducted and forced into sex trafficking, keeping her case painfully alive.

52:10 Decades later, a man named Frank Vernon Jones Junior was arrested and charged with mail and wire fraud. He told the Bradleys and the Nation's Missing Children Organization that he was a former US Army Green Beret Special Forces officer and would help them find Amy. Between September twenty eighth, nineteen ninety nine and July twenty eighth, two thousand, the Bradley sent him a total of two hundred and ten thousand dollars to pay for costs associated with finding Amy. At one point, Joan sent the Bradley's a photo he claimed was of Amy. The woman was actually an acquaintance of his, and the photos had been taken on a Florida beach, complete with temporary tattoos matching Amy's he'd lied and claimed that his team had engaged in a gunfight with Amy's captors, killing some of them.

53:00 That's so disgusting. Take advantage of a family like that, that's disgusting. I think most of the people who reported seeing Amy had the best intention. Yeah, I'm sure, but we talk about this all the time. That I witness testimony is the least convincing testimony, right, Yeah, So what happened to Amy Bradley. I'm going to go over when I racked my brain, like all the possibilities that I thought of, she jumped intentionally meaning to take her own life. I don't think that's the case. I think that things were going pretty well in her life. There's something called the call of the void. Have you heard of this turn before?

53:42 Totally? Yeah, I totally know that. What that feeling too. It freaks me out, really yeah, I had that feeling. All the time, Like really, yes, when I'm like when I used to work in downtown Detroit. You were in like a building and I would be on the fifteenth floor and there was a balcony. I couldn't stand on that balcony because not that I thought I was going to do it, but you just like you just have this feeling like what if I did what if I just I could just jump over that right now, and it just freaks you out. It's a really weird feeling. Okay, Well, I don't know if I've ever had that. That's good. And some people think that, you know, Amy could have had that experience. She fell overboard accidentally while she was trying to vomit. The room was really cramped, and if she was feeling ill, you know, the combined effects of being at sea and you know, having had several drinks.

54:35 So I don't think I have said this yet. She either had six or seven light beers between dinnertime, which was at six pm until she went back to the room, like on the Bradley's bill. That's how many drinks that she had. I don't think that doesn't mean that someone could could have bought her drinks or shots or something. And Amy was friendly with the bartender, so I think it's possible that she had more to drink. Yeah, and the room was really close quarters, and if she could have like, you know, vomited overboard rather than you know, like gone back to the bathroom and then everyone would have heard her. Sure, you know, it's possible that she could have done that. The railings did come up pretty high.

55:15 I think they were forty two inches and Amy was five feet six, so a lot of people say that, yeah. And but there wasn't like the ship. The side of the ship seemed like a straight like there wasn't any like decks that were protruding. So she you know, could have had a direct shot if she leaned over far enough and the table was depending on who you believe, the table was pushed up to the railings. So in my head, you know, I think it's possible that she could have like been kneeling on the table or used the table to like, you know, get up a little higher. Remember Amy in the fifteen rolls of a film Sunrise was at six thirty seven am that morning. You know, could could she have been trying to get a picture of the sunrise, although rad said her camera was in the room in the safe Okay. Could someone have slipped something into Amy's drink and caused her to hallucinate and she would have ended up overboard? Could something have happened between Brad and Amy on the balcony or did Amy wilfully walk off the ship, wanting to start a new life.

56:19 Was she murdered and taken off the ship in a suitcase? Was she taken against her will off the ship and sold into sex trafficking. A lot of people think that is the most plausible thing that happened to Amy. One more possibility that I haven't mentioned yet. During Amy's last night aboard the ship, she was seen in conversation with two black women wearing uniforms that didn't match the ship's crew navy skirts with light blue, buttoned up shirts. Her brother Brad later researched and noted that these matched the attire of staff from the Sea Org ship Free Winds, docked nearby and operated by the Church of Scientology. After Amy's disappearance, two officials from Scientology knocked on the Bradley's hotel room door, introduced themselves as from the Free Winds, and asked strangely specific questions about Amy, details like her favorite snacks, cigarettes, and drinks. Brad initially entertained theories that Amy might have been lured aboard the Free Winds, but after speaking with former Sea Org members, he recanted, acknowledging that involvement was extremely unlikely. One last possibility is could Amy have been used in a drug trade? Did someone on the ship convince her to deliver a package to someone?

57:40 In my head, this seems like maybe a fairly likely scenario. She was very familiar with a lot of the crew members. Remember they asked her to go to the bar with them, and she would sit at the bar and talk to the bartenders. And then she was friendly with the yellow guy. And I feel like, you know, she was just starting her life. They could have offered her, you know, a pretty good amount of money to take a package and delivered to someone. Maybe she could have been killed during a drug trade. Interesting, So let me just make sure I understand the timeline here. So she disappeared at around six am something like that, Right, her dad got up and she wasn't there at six am? Right, the ship was docked in Curous Out at that time or not not yet.

58:30 That's a good question. The doc it was reaching Curius Out was almost to cure us out at six am. I think by seven am they were docked and that's when passengers were getting people. Were starting to get off, like, yeah, seven okay. Interesting because I was just thinking that her family started searching for her right away, so before the ship was actually docked, So she would have had to have been if she left the ship voluntarily for whatever reason, she would have been evading them during that time, basically trying to make it so they wouldn't find her. Yeah, that's a really good point. She would have had to have been in someone's room. Yeah, probably hiding. Okay. Interesting. The Bradleys are adamant that Amy is alive. Quote. We think what happened to Amy was that she was targeted.

59:14 She was seen, taken and removed from the ship, and we believe she was trafficked into some kind of sex trade situation. Iva Bradley said Amy was the kind of kid who knew who she was even when she was little. She had this spark iner. She was strong, not just physically but mentally. Amy loved to dance, to create, and be active. She was fiercely loyal and looked out for her friends and family. She was adventurous in the life of the party. Iva said that she wakes up every day and thinks, maybe today is the day they will find Amy. Each night before she goes to bed, Iva and Ron say to each other, maybe tomorrow. Amy's car, her red mos Demata remains in the Bradley's garage, where Ron still maintains it not just missing, Iva WinCE said she's missed. The Raleys have appeared on numerous TV shows over the years, including Oprah, Doctor Phil, Unsolved Mysteries, and America's Most Wanted. In hopes of getting Amy's picture and story out to the public, they've pledged to never stop looking for her as long as they are alive. The Crew's Vessel Security and Safety Act was signed into law in twenty ten. It was created to improve safety standards and transparency within the cruise industry after a series of high profile disappearances and crimes at sea. It enforces safety regulations on ships operating outside of the US. It states that incidents that occur aboard cruise ships must be reported immediately.

1:00:42 The law requires cruise ships that dock at US ports to implement specific safety measures, such as higher guard rails, peep holes and cabin doors, and security latches. It also mandates that ships maintain equipment for the prompt preservation of evidence in cases of serious crimes, and provide medical staff trained to treat sexual assault victims. In addition, cruise lines must report alleged crimes to the FBI and the US Coast Guard, and those reports are made available to the public. Cruise ships must also report crimes to the Department of Transportation to maintain statistics. The Act was designed to protect passengers, ensure better accountability from cruise companies, and give families and investigators more access to critical information when crimes or accidents occurre at sea, but with ships sailing under a variety of foreign flags, investigating crimes is still often difficult. It shouldn't take such a tragedy to make people safe, Ron Bradley said, But if Amy's story helped just prevent just one more family from going through this, then she didn't disappear for nothing.

1:01:51 Definitely seems long overdue to have those kind of regulations. Absolutely. I mean, like you mentioned at the beginning, these ships are basically floating cities, and so there's going to be crime, there's going to be accidents, there's going. To be medical issues. They really need to be prepared for those things. Yes, most cruise ships today have overboard detection systems. According to an article in USA Today, between twenty nine and twenty nineteen, there were two hundred and twelve overboard incidents globally involving passengers and crew, and only forty eight of these people were rescued. Do you remember the story just this summer. I think it was a Disney cruise line when a little girl fell overboard. Yeah. Wow, make me cry thinking about her father jumped overboard and I think treaded water for twenty minutes until they were rescued. And they were both rescued and safe, and that was a wonderful story.

1:02:41 Yeah. So, Brad Bradley, now forty eight, told People magazine people can't understand the level of hope that we've maintained. We're still waiting for that call. Brad has been tireless, especially since this Netflix documentary came out. There's just a click around on YouTube. He's given so many interviews. Really is hopeful that she's out there. And heartbreaking not knowing. Yeah, so what do you think happened to Amy? Boy? I wish, I wish I knew. It's such a mystery. I mean it, it seems to me like when I think about it, the most likely scenario is that she somehow went overboard, either fell or was pushed overboard. Because just the fact that she hasn't been seen. I mean, I know there have been a lot of sightings, but.

1:03:27 The best one was in two thousand and five. Yeah, that's interesting, but. I just don't, you know, I just don't know how many of those are really credible. The photo that you that you looked at was the one I was like, Oh, that really looks like you're with them. You mentioned the tattoos and everything. Even though you can't be one hundred percent sure, it does seem like it's maybe not so likely that that was her. But I don't know, I really it's a real mystery for sure. The whole the thought of her being trafficked. A high profile American from you know, a relatively wealthy family isn't taken off a cruise ship to be trafficked. Yeah. I don't know a lot about sex trafficking and how that normally works and how common that is. But that was my first thought as well, is that it just doesn't seem that likely to me. But I really don't feel like I know enough about how these people go about what they do and who they target and things like that to really have a valid opinion on that.

1:04:25 Most people forced into sexual exploitation don't look like Amy Bradley. Traffickers prey on the vulnerable, children, women in poverty, people without support systems, who can be easily manipulated and controlled. Victims are usually isolated, stripped of identification, and watched constantly. They aren't free to stroll through shops or cafes, places where they could be recognized or ask for help, and, practically speaking, without a passport or papers, moving them across borders is nearly impossible. So Amy allegedly has been seen in Kirasau, Barbados, Aruba. Yeah, I don't know how you know she would get from place to place. Yeah, it does seem a little unlikely.

1:05:06 Amy was twenty three, healthy, educated and deeply loved by her family. Women aren't plucked from cruise ships and forced into sex trafficking. It's too high profile. Amy was strong. She would have not gone quietly eat Over the years, witnesses swore they saw her in hotels, cafes, even begging strangers for help. None of this fits how trafficking works. She didn't match the profile, and her supposed captors didn't behave like traffickers. That's what makes her disappearance so unsettling. Nothing about it makes sense amy sandals were under her chair, and the balcony table against the railing suggests that she was barefoot, leaning or sitting on the edge. With only minutes between when her brother went to bed and when her father noticed that she was gone, it's hard to believe that she wandered the ship. The ship or was taken during this time. Just seems like it's too convenient, right.

1:05:56 The simplest answer to me is there was an accident. She slipped overboard, unseen and unheard before anyone realized it. If Amy's still alive today, she would be fifty one, and I think that she would have aged out of sex trafficking. I think it's highly unlikely that she's never tried to contact her family in all of these years. It's far more compelling to believe Amy is still alive, whether traffic are living somewhere in secrecy, than to accept that she slipped into the sea nearly thirty years ago. But holding onto that hope can also be cruel, keeping her family suspended between possibility and loss, unable to fully grieve, move forward, or find peace in their remaining years. That's what breaks my heart about this case is that her family is just clinging to hope that she's alive. And the Bradleys are I think in their mid seventies now, and you know, I just wish that they could have some peace.

1:06:51 Yeah, it would be great for them to have closure in one way or another. I tend to agree with you that that seems to be the most logical explanation that she somehow went overboard, maybe accidentally, because like you said, the window of time is narrow, and when people fall overboard on a cruise ship, you're. Out at sea. It's a huge. Area and it's pretty likely that you're not going to be found. I know they said that. You know, even if there were sharks or whatever, there would be clothing. But you know, the sea is a really big place. It really is. Although the boat was nearing the shore of Curras how Yeah, so it was more limited in its scope. But almost twenty four hours had passed until you know, they got into the water and search for it, right, So I do.

1:07:38 It does seem weird though. It does seem like it would be hard to accidentally fall overboard as well, you know, just because the railings are fairly high, you know, and I can't I can't imagine you would get up on a table, you know, next to the balcony to try to lean over and get a better picture, so that I don't know. It's really really baffling to me. One piece of the story that I have a hard time with is people believe that Yellow had something to do with Amy being trafficked. She'd already rebuffed his advances in the club the night before. I don't think that she would have gone up to meet him at six am. Yes, I was thinking the same thing she was seen at five thirty am. Their night had ended a few hours earlier. So yeah, it doesn't It doesn't make any sense that she would go see him, or that he would you know, he couldn't have come into their room.

1:08:28 Some people said that, well, maybe he was going to show her the best place to take a picture of the showers of Kirasau. It's a beautiful port. Yeah, and maybe he but I yeah, that's hard to believe. It hard to believe. I haven't mentioned this yet. There was a female bartender that Amy enjoyed talking to, and her name was Caitlin, So I could see that more as a pool like maybe she wanted to meet Caitlin. But even that seems unlikely because if Amy wanted to see Caitlin, I think that they would just would have stayed. Yeah, like to go back to her rooms. I'll meet you in three hours at six am. Mostly for an out. Yeah. I have a hard time with you too. Do you think that Royal Caribbean is culpable somewhat?

1:09:11 Yeah? I think they really did not have good procedures in place to handle this when somebody went missing, Like we talked about it earlier, But someone goes missing, even if you're even if it's only for a short time, you should stop everything. You know, you shouldn't let people off the ship. You shouldn't it. People could be a little inconvenienced for a short time before you find someone. I imagine if you were on that trip, you would have a little PTSD from being involved in that, and you know, racking your brain. Did I see Amy? You know what? What could I have known? Yeah? Absolutely? I would hate the fact that she's never been found and it was because you know, I have to go off on the port city.

1:09:54 Yeah, I think that. I think Royal Caribbean definitely did a very poor job of managing this situation. Well, let us know what you think about this baffling case. It's one of those cases that, sadly, I don't think we will ever truly know what happened to Amy Bradley, but we're thinking of her family and friends. And I didn't want to say rest in peace because you know she still might be out there. Had a hard time if I should use present tents or past tense, but you know, I hope that she has found someday. Yes, so I'm going to ask you again, would you like to go on a cruise? Well, I wouldn't let that this story deter me so much, but when you talked about the fact that cruise ships are so crowded and so many people, that that did give me a little more pause because I prefer vacation.

1:10:46 Where you're a little bit, you know, away from people, not in huge crowds of people. So I don't know, I would still consider it if it went to some cool places. But yeah, I think like a Nordic cruise would be fun, or on a lee ask a cruise. I don't know if I would go on a cruise to the Caribbean. Yeah, yeah, I would probably prefer one of those other options. As well. We didn't talk about this a ton, but I think the cruise ships. I don't know if they still are, but they were used for a lot of drug trafficking because it was very close to Venezuela. Yeah. I never would have thought that, but it makes total sense. Yeah. Yeah. So the other day I was I was heading out.

1:11:26 I was just going to go, I think, to some some shops and things like that, and I really didn't feel like getting ready, sweing my hair and making myself look decent. And I started thinking about the Jetson's. Not where I figured you were going with that, but you watch. The jets I love it. It's so funny. I was thinking about George Jetson and how they were really pretty much the same person. Were they? I never really thought about that, I guess. Similar, But I just started think about Jane and how she used to have like. Jane his wife, Yeah do you want to. Just no, okay, But she had this like it was like a zoom call essentially, huh right, and then she had like a mask that she could like slip on.

1:12:16 And I guess we have filters for zoom calls, but I wish that I, you know, could have just like this filter that I could wear all the time, and it would and maybe we're going to get there someday. Probably we will. Yeah, but everyone has to agree to wear you know, like their Google Google glasses or whatever, and we can all just like look better to each other. That's probably what will happen, is everyone will have you know, these kind of Google glasses are. Probably like a chip in her brain, right. Or likely yes, And so yeah, you'll be able to turn on a filter so everybody looking. You'll probably have to pay for it, so it'll be a description, it'll be a subscription thing. You'll have to pay for it. It'll cost forty nine cents for the first three months and then nineteen United for Yeah.

1:13:01 Yeah, I think you nailed that. I think what year was the Jetson set in? Do you want to guess? I have just twenty twenty five. Twenty sixty two, Okay, so we're not too far off. And I again thinking about the Jetsons, like, how close are we to the Jetsons? I think we some things are really close. I don't remember much of the details about it. I just remember the whole sort of vibe of the show more so than specific technologies that they had. Well, they had their flying cars. Yeah, we're not really there yet, No, not quite. They had Rosie the robot, which we have were probably but it's not a Rosy right.

1:13:42 So yeah, would you like a flying car? Yeah, totally. Ever since I was a kid. When I was a kid, I read in some magazine about these ultra light planes, which are they still have them, but they're really small, like they basically dangerous. Oh they're super dangerou but they have like a lawnmower engine essentially. When I saw that, I was like, oh my god, I want one of those someday so bad. And I still would love that, but the safety factor turns me off. Maybe you should take flying lessons. A lot of people take flying lessons. Do you think you would do that. I have like a fear of flying, but I have a fascination and all the flying at the same time, and I don't think I would trust myself to fly a plane.

1:14:24 I just what's the Nathan Fielder Show? Oh the rehearsal. Yeah, did we talk about that on the podcast? We might talk a little bit. Yeah, but that if you haven't watched that, that was a very interesting show. And yeah, at the end of it, like he was taking he was really scared of flying too, right, and he took flying lessons. I don't know if he was scared of flying or he was just fascinated by flying and the risks and things like that. And he, yeah, he became a pilot, like not just a small plane pilot, but right, commercial airliner type pilot. So just for a bit, yeah, I mean he took it, took it to extremes, which pretty impressive. One more thing before we go. I think we have a good shot at winning the lottery this weekend. It's like almost like one point five Actually it's probably closer to two billion dollars right now.

1:15:13 Well, after taxes, it will only be you know, probably one billion. Right, So how are we going to spend our money? When you say you think we have a pretty good shot, what why do. You believe that? I think, well, I told the universe and actually you were present for this conversation, huh. I put it up in the universe that we would donate probably more than fifty percent of the proceeds to charities. That's one of the people I admire most is Jeff Bezos first wife number one. Uh huh, Mackenzie Scott. She has donated so much, but she got a lot of money in their divorce and she has done Her goal is to donate, like, you know, billions of dollars to charity, and I feel like I would really love to donate a lot of money to charity too. We donate every month to charity.

1:16:01 So you think that will increase our odds of winning the lottery because you put that. To the universe. Okay, Yeah, I mean I think we would donate a lot, a lot, a lot of it. I mean, yeah, if you want a billion dollars, you could easily donate more than half of that and be really comfortable. With the rest of Honest to god, I only want like, and this still sounds really greedy, like five to ten million, and the rest I would probably. Yeah, I'm good with that too. Sure, Okay, So what are we going to do with with our proceeds? Well, I think we've we've talked about it enough. I think we're going to buy a nice house on Lake Michigan. Just one, yep, Well, we probably have two. I'd probably keep a house here in one and it wouldn't have to be fancy. We're not really fancy people Like if I could have like three pair of your leggings rather than one for joggers, I'd be out.

1:16:50 That would be good. You know, I'm pretty simple. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's fair and. Lying because I would buy probably a lot more things. But I would probably get see and tickets to the Tigers. It's just going to say that Tigers. That's a lot of games, man, I know, sorry to buy some friends to go with you too. Half their games are at other stadiums. Yeah, and I might travel to some of those on occasion to go to games as well. But so it's not quite as you know, as extreme as you think. It's only like eighty eighty one home games a year, okay, and then of course you add in the eight or nine Lions home games a. Year, so right you would you would need to do that? Of course? Yeah, you could afford to pay someone to go to the games and tell you that happens.

1:17:34 Doesn't seem quite the same. Yeah, but I guess I could. We could hire Keith Morrison to come to the podcast with good. You think, Yeah, that would be pretty cool. Who would you want? Would you want Keith? Or who's your favorite dateline person? I mean, we're just going off on too many tangents right now. Oh we are. It's Keith. Everyone everyone knows if you're going to pick one Dateline host. No offense to the others. They're all lovely, but Keith. Only you like him as much as Keith. No way, I mean it's close. Really, I haven't actually, we haven't watched Dayline in a while. Well, thank you so much for listening to this episode. We hope you enjoyed it. Well. I enjoyed it. I thought it was fascinating and I had no knowledge of this case before.

1:18:17 Will you watch the Netflix documentary? I would like to watch it. Yeah, I told you everything in it, but go ahead. If you don't trust me, check check your. Well. Please rate, review, follow and subscribe. Find us on social media, or send us an email at Lovemrykill at gmail dot com. Consider supporting us on Patreon dot com slash love Marykill. We have one tier five dollars a month. You get early ad free access plus a monthly bonus. Episode until next time. Don't kill your wife and Don't kill your husband.

1:19:04 The topick To the