Faith and Gregory Green

0:00 Hi, I'm Rich and I'm Tina. And if there's one thing we've learned in over twenty years of marriage, some days you'll feel like killing your husband and some days you'll feel like killing your wife. Welcome to love, Mary kill he Tina, Hey, Rich, how are you? I'm great? How are you great? I have a feeling I'm not going to be great after I hear this story, though, No, you're not. It's a really it's a bad one. A listener requested this case probably like a year ago, and I think I was coming off of the Chris and Shanan Watts case and I was like, no, I can't. That's a little spoiler alert. I was like, I can't do that. And then when you said you were doing it, I was like, oh boy, yeah, I know it's in store for us. Yeah. It's definitely right up there with the Chris and Shnan Watts case in terms of how horrible and Saturday is.

1:00 And it does involve children. So I did want to put out a little bit of a warning before we get into the story that it is one of our more disturbing stories, so listen with care. Many months ago, we talked about we were going to start featuring a missing person's case every month and we have failed to do so, but I did today. So at the end of this story, I'm going to tell you about a missing person that's in danger. Great, well, stay tuned for that. We have two special guests today. Oh yes, we're joining us in our recording room. Their names are Cosmo and Clover. Yeah, they are up to Shenanigan's today. Somedings they just get a little mischievous, Yeah, a little feral almost, and they're like right now, Cosmo is the boy cat, the dominant cat, and he was standing at the door and not wanting Clover to come in. Rustlings, that's our okay, always good to have them here.

1:57 So because today's case is a Detroit based case, Yeah, I see what you have over there. What do I have? Well, you have two glasses and I know that probably means you brought burners, which we've had before. No, I didn't bring burners, but I did bring a Detroit based snacks, so you did bring Okay. I was nervous that there wasn't any food. It was just gonna be a drink. There is food, so here, here we go. We got some snacks. These are I brought a little variety, okay. I brought some pop Daddy garlic parmesan pretzel sticks. Oh okay, that's that's what I want to eat at a Sunday morning. I brought some germac Motown energy nut mix. And I brought some Sanders Sea salt and dark chocolate caramels well that I can get behind. And I also brought a beverage. Wait did you bring the Sanders? Uh?

2:49 Did you buy them? Or do you just know? I just grabbed them? Where did you grab them from the cupboards? The Secret Chocolate Covers always has some the Sanders. Sanders chocolate is the best and the sea salt caramel. I think they're available at Costco's nationwide. I'm not sure, but I always get like a big thing of them at Costco and they're the best. Yeah, if you have a chocolate hankering, they're They're really good. And oh, okay you brought no, I brought a fay go. Oh I'm sorry, rock and Rye. So that's ah. That's a pop okay from Detroit. I actually have some. Never you never say pop. I don't say pop, but we grew up saying pop in Michigan. We did too.

3:31 We've talked about it. Somewhere we transferred to soda. I think soda just sounds well. I actually found an interesting map that showed what people said in like the nineteen forties versus what they say now, and soda is taking over. Some people still say pop me. Some people in the in the South still say coke, which boggles my mind. Well don't some people even say r c oh? I don't know. Maybe Okay, listeners, let us know, because I'm pretty sure, like depending you know, maybe where the near As Bottling Company is, that's maybe what you said back in the day. Maybe, But soda is taking over. Like that's the bottom line here. So yeah, let's have Uh. I don't like it, You're gonna try it, That's all right. This is the whole thing. You sometimes have to try things, all right, Yes, you don't like I'm really picky about drinks. Yeah, I'll tell you like water a little bit about fago when we come back after our bath. Okay, did you enjoy your Detroit based Smorgas sport of snacks? Well, I mean some of them.

4:35 I really don't like the fagos. I don't like flavored soda, so no, But if you do. I think it's probably delicious. It's pretty Yeah, I think it's pretty good. Rock and around. I have Fago candles. I don't think I think I've bought one for a gift before. But yeah, so I have a little bit of a couple of tidbits about Fagos. A fago if you grew up in the Detroit area, it was a big soda. I think you can get it most play now. I'm not really sure, but we should leave the state of Michigans. We should. But Fago was founded in Detroit, Michigan, in nineteen oh seven by the Faginson brothers. They were Russian baker immigrants, Ben and Perry Faginson. The original flavors of Fago were fruit punch, strawberry, and grape, which were based on cake frosting recipes used by the Fagansons when they were in Russia during Prohibition. They expanded into new varieties, including rock and Rye, which was my favorite growing up. But I never really knew what it was, but it I guess it was based on a cocktail which was rye whiskey, rock candy, citrus and herbs. Rock and Yeah, but rock and Rye is really just kind of a cream soda with a hint of cherry flavor.

5:47 Yeah, that's what I would. Yeah. And the last thing I have to say about Fago is that the Detroit hip hop group Insane Clown Posse often references Fago and their song and they spray their live audiences with Fago showers. Oh I would not. I would enjoy it. I watched a video and like everybody in the crowd has like a two liter bottle of Fago and everyone's just, oh my god, spraying it everywhere and it sounds like it's super sticky. Yeah. The band, the Insane Clown Posse band, has expressed interest in collaborating on a limited edition product run with Fago, but Fago has not reciprocated the interest because they want to keep a healthy distance from the group.

6:28 Oh have you ever seen Insane Clink? I don't think I have. Yeah, you probably don't want to. Oh really, what do you mean? They're just a little they're insane, and they're clowns. They're they're kind of scary. Okay, I get I mean not everyone loves clowns. No, I don't have a problem with clowns. But my last thing about Fago is growing up. If you turned down the TV, this is what you often heard. It's a nice little jing uh huh. Comic books and rubber rubber bands. You probably didn't get these in Chicago. It's a nice commercial.

7:12 I won't play the whole big though, it's like a minute long. Very nice. All right, you are very thoroughser enough Fago talk. So we talk about today's case. Well you didn't talk about town Club, but maybe we'll save that for another episode Detroit. So you have a lot of affection for town Club soda as well. Yeah, oh yeah. The other snacks were pop Daddy was was quite tasty, and the Germac mix was very nice. And you went to Bushes. Bushes is I would say, an upscale market in the ann Arbor area, and I used to work for that and lovely it was a great place. I have a lot of good snacks, but I used to work with the Germac people and good, good, nice, yeah, fresh nuts. Okay, well we've delayed long enough.

8:07 Let's talk about the case of Faith and Gregory Green. So the first time Faith Harris laid eyes on Gregory Green, she was only fourteen years old. It was a Sunday morning in nineteen ninety one, Faith was sitting in a pew at Church of the Risen Christ in Detroit, the church that her father, pastor Fred Harris, had founded several years earlier. At twenty four, greg Green was ten years older than Faith. She thought he was cute and developed an instant crush on him. She didn't talk to him, though, she just admired him from afar. He was there attending church for a while, and then one day he wasn't there anymore. Faith didn't think much of it. By that time, she was getting close to starting high school and she was busy with friends and other activities. The next time she saw Gregory was seventeen years later, when she was thirty one and he was forty one.

8:56 Suddenly he was there in church again. He was just as hands and well dressed as she remembered him to be, and she felt the same butterflies in her stomach that she had felt all those years earlier. This time she wasn't shy, and she spoke to him after the service. She had heard that he'd been in prison, but she didn't know what for. It didn't raise any red flags for her. After all, quite a few people in her dad's church, including the assistant pastor and some of the deacons, had been incarcerated at some point. Her dad had himself been incarcerated more than once, mainly for civil rights activism during the sixties and seventies, but he had also battled drug and alcohol addiction, and he often spoke in his sermons about his own past mistakes and how important it was to give people second chances.

9:41 He welcomed former prisoners to the church just like he did everyone else, with open arms. Faith Harris was born in Connecticut. When she was just a baby, Fred moved to Detroit to enter a faith based recovery program to try and get his addictions under control and keep his family together. After he got so into the programme, Fred's wife Kathleen packed up their two children, Elijah and baby Faith, and moved to Detroit to be with him. Once he finished the program, he started working as a counselor at a Christian guidance center, counseling other men who were in treatment for addiction. That work led him to the ministry and starting a church with Kathleen. Faith's upbringing was strict and dominated by her father. He made the family get up every morning to pray, and once he became a pastor, they had to attend church six or seven days a week. It was all consuming. I'll say Faith was never comfortable when her dad was around. He would lose patience with kids easily, and she never felt like she could voice her own opinions. Her mother and father had marital issues and didn't always set the best example of how to deal with those issues, but they did stay together. There are a lot of rules at home that Faith had to follow. She wasn't allowed to listen to secular music or to attend school dances. Faith's mom, Kathleen, loved garden and taught Faith how to cook. She ran a daycare out of her home, which inspired Faith's love for children. Faith loved to play outside, and she loved to ride her bike to the park. In the tenth grade,

11:11 Faith took up jogging partly as a reason to get out of the house and away from her dad, but she grew to love it. Her algebra teacher, who was also the boy's track coach, saw her out jogging one day and encouraged her to try out for the cross country team, which she did during her senior year. Her dad took an interest in her sport, which made her feel good. He attended all of her cross country meets and cheered the team on. It was the first time she felt like he showed his love and support for her. Remember cross country, I really miss that. Yeah. Our sun did cross country for I think sixth grade on and it was it was fun just going to the meets and being outdoors in the fall weather. The fall weather. Yeah, that was a lot of fun.

11:54 In tenth grade, Faith met Shadney Allen, who became her high school sweetheart. She wasn't allowed to date, of course, but she would sneak out at night to see him. Oh Faith. They were still together when she graduated from high school and she got pregnant at age nineteen. Their son, named Shadney after his father, was born in August of nineteen ninety seven, and almost two years later, in April of nineteen ninety nine, a girl was born, Kara. Faith was in love with Chadney Senior, but after Kara's birth, things started to go bad. They were both young, just getting started and the stress of having two young children made things tough. They got married eventually, but the marriage only lasted for a year. They stayed on good terms, though Chadney Senior saw the kids regularly, although their time together became more sporadic once the kids started school. By the time thirty one year old Faith met Gregory again at her dad's church in two thousand and eight, she was single and her kids, Shadney and Kara, were ten and eight, respectively. Faith and greg started talking regularly and eventually started dating.

12:58 Sheked him about his incarceration. He told her there had been an incident with his first wife. They had gotten into a fight and she physically attacked him, and trying to defend himself, she ended up falling, hitting her head, and unfortunately she died. Do you think that's that's how it went down. Well, we'll learn more in a bit, but it is amazing how these stories are always like, oh, yeah, she just fell and hit her head and died. It's just almost never happens that way to exactly. You can tell him a little suspicious. Faith saw that he was uncomfortable talking about it, so she didn't push him, and she took him at his word. He seemed very kind and he was going to church regularly. She trusted him and had no reason to believe that his first wife's death was anything other than a tragic accident. Faith and Greg soon moved in together, but within a couple of months of living together, Faith felt like something was off with him. She couldn't explain it. He was nice, but something just seemed not quite right, and she decided to break things off. They didn't talk for nearly a year after that, until December of two thousand and nine, when Greg called her up to ask what Chadney and Kara wanted for Christmas.

14:11 That started them talking again, and gradually they reconnected and rekindled their romance. Within a couple of months, Faith found out she was pregnant. Greg was ecstatic when he heard the news. He went with her to all her doctor's appointments and bought her anything she needed. Any doubts that she might have had about him disappeared. Their daughter, Coy, was born in October of twenty ten. Coy Koi. Greg was smitten with his new baby girl. After she was born, Greg and Faith decided to get married. Faith's dad performed the ceremony on December eighteenth of twenty ten. While Coy was a baby, Greg started displaying some warning signs of things to come. He would criticize whatever Faith did in taking care of the baby, how she held her, how she nursed her, and so on. He didn't want Faith to go anywhere or do anything without baby Koi. If she had to run an errand he would insist that she take Coy with her. Faith wanted to stop nursing and switch to bottle feeding because she was exhausted, but Greg pressured her to keep nursing. Faith got a job at Target stocking shelves from four am to ten am. It would help bring in some extra money, but more importantly, it gave her a break from the stress of her marriage and parenting.

15:24 She was exhausted all the time, both mentally and physically. You imagine getting a job where the hours are four am to ten am because you want you need a break, you know, Yeah, that's impossible. She started to think about leaving Greg again, but in early twenty twelve, she found out she was once again pregnant. Another girl, Kaylee, was born in September of twenty twelve. Because of the bad experience Faith had in nursing Koi, mainly because of the pressure Greg had put on her, she decided that she wanted to bottle feed Kaylee. She knew that Greg would not be happy about this, so she put off telling him, but she finally called him to tell him of her decision while she was still in the hospital. He tried to talk her into nursing, but she was firm in her decision. She asked him to go to the store and buy some formula because the store would be closed by the time she got discharged from the hospital. That set him off, and he started yelling at her. They had been living with Faith's parents up to this point to try and save some money. Once Kaylee was born, they finally had enough to get a place of their own. They moved in right after Faith came home from the hospital with their new baby.

16:33 Their new home was in Dearborn Heights, which is a small bedroom community bordering Detroit. It's generally considered a nice place to live, low crime rate, and better than average schools. Their house was about a thousand square feet on a small lot, three bedrooms, two baths, with a detached garage in the back and a carport along the side. They paid eighty six thousand dollars for it. By this time, Chadney was in high school and Kara was in middle school. Faith stayed home for a time to take care of Coy, who was too and baby Kayley. Greg's behavior continued to deteriorate after they moved into their new home. While he could be very kind and fun, he continued to criticize everything that Faith did the nerve. He also would be strangely quiet at times, refusing to speak. Faith soon learned that when he would get in these moods, there was nothing she could do. She would try talking to him and getting him to communicate with her regarding what was bothering him, but he would just stare at her with a cold, hard look in the eyes. At other times, he would get extremely angry. Something would set him off, and she would have no idea what it was.

17:40 She assumed the stress of having two young children was getting to him, and would end up just leaving him alone when he would get like that. While Greg had been smitten with Koy after she was born, he was completely different with Kaylee. He was distant and had no interest in engaging with her or helping her out. That's really sad, that really is. When Faith said something to him about this, he said it was because he wanted a boy. Faith said, quote, well, you have a girl and she's here now, so what are you going to do? You can't act like that. Faith went back to work after a time, which forced Greg to engage more with Kaylee. Things got a little better between them, but it still wasn't like his relationship with Cooi. One time, he slapped Kaylee, who was just a toddler, for accidentally smushing a loaf of bread. This made Faith furious. She yelled at him, if you ever put your fucking hands on her again, I will fuck you up. You are not going to hit her over some bread. She's a baby. Things continued getting worse between Faith and Greg, and to the point where Faith started sleeping on the couch.

18:41 One night, she was sleeping on the couch with Kaylee and she woke up with Greg yelling at her. She had no idea what he was mad about, but he seemed out of control. She told him to stop because the children were sleeping, which set him off further and he started violently kicking the couch. At one point, he wouldn't got koy from her room. Faith was scared that he was going to hurt her and begged him to put her down, which he eventually did and finally retreated back to the bedroom, faithfully awake the rest of the night, thinking about what she needed to do to get herself and the kids away from Greg. Poor faith, that sounds horrible. The next day, she left for work early, but not so early as to make Greg suspicious. She went to the police station to file a complaint, but it was closed when she got there. She went back again a few days later, but the police officer told her she needed to go to a different location. She took an extended lunch break to go there and filed paperwork to request a personal protection order or PPO. However, she was told that there had to be multiple incidents in order to grant a PPO, so she was denied. So they made it really hard. That's her horrible and she had it. Yeah, she went to multiple locations, got turned away, then finally filed this and they're like, oh, sorry, there's not enough there. And this guy had been in prison before too.

19:57 We'll talk about why he was in as it eventually. But it's really it really makes me any. It's just so sad, like you have to be have more than one incident for them to take notice. Yeah, like, oh yeah, it's just not right. One day, Faith came home from work and smelled an odor of gas. She went to the kitchen and saw that all the knobs on the stove were turned on. She turned them off and went to the living room, where she found Greg sitting on the couch with Koy and Kaylee. She asked him, didn't he smell the gas. He tried to blame it on Kara or Chadney, but she knew that they hadn't used the stove before they'd left for school. Then he tried to blame Koi, but again she knew Koy wouldn't play with the stove. Later, he admitted that he had been thinking about killing himself. Faith saved as much money as she could and decided to move out on the last day of school in June of twenty thirteen. She had arranged for a moving company to show up shortly after Greg left for work. They helped their packer things, and then she went and picked the kids up from school. They moved back in with her parents until she could find a place of her own, and Faith started divorce proceedings. Greg was furious when he found out she was gone, but he calmed down and he and Faith kept in communication to coordinate the schedules of Coy and Kaylee. Faith and Greg agreed that Greg would take them every other weekend and sometimes additional days when he was off work. At first, Greg's sister would be the intermediary, picking the kids up and shuttling them back and forth between Faith and Greg, but after a couple of months, Greg

21:30 and Faith started meeting on their own to make the hand off. This led to them gradually starting to talk again. Greg started making an effort to communicate and showed a willingness to discuss their problems. In the meantime, Faith found a new place to live, but she was having a hard time making ends meet. In the summer of twenty fifteen, two years after she had moved out, her water got shut off because she couldn't pay the utility bill. For the entire summer, she and the kids would go back to her parents' place to take showers, and she would have to buy bottled water for use at home. She and Greg were getting along much better this time, so in September of twenty fifteen, Greg said, why don't you just move back in. Faith really did want to make it work, and knowing that she couldn't keep living without water. As the weather got cold, she agreed.

22:18 Everything was great again. For the first few months, Greg seemed to have control over his mood swings. He was sweet, and Faith still loved him. They had a nice Christmas in New Year's but not surprisingly, things started going bad again as twenty sixteen got underway. Without any reason for it, Greg started accusing Faith of cheating on him. He would also get irrationally upset when Kara, who was sixteen at this point, would close her bedroom door. Faith couldn't figure out what made him so upset. She wondered if the sound of the door closing reminded him of being in prison or something. One day, Faith came home to find that Greg took the door knob off of Kara's door. He also went back to picking on Kaylee and showing favoritism toward Ki. He would do things like watch TV with Ki, but not allow Kaylee to come in the room with them. Coy was in kindergarten by this time, and on days that Faith was working and he was in charge of getting her to school, he would tell her she didn't have to go if she didn't want to. She started falling behind because she had so many absences, Faith realized that she needed to get out, this time for good.

23:26 She told her parents she was planning to leave, but her dad told her she couldn't come stay with them again. That was fine with Faith because she wanted to get her own place anyway. In August of twenty sixteen, she started looking for a full time job. She filed for divorce again and told the kids they were going to move out soon. She told Greg that she was going to divorce him. He wanted to go to counseling, but they had been down this road before. She knew that even if she set up appointments for them to get counseling, that he wouldn't go. When the process server came to their house give Greg the divorce papers, he threw them down on the ground and started yelling and swearing. After that, things got more uncomfortable in the home. Faith would come home from work and Greg would leave right away. She would cook dinner, but he wouldn't eat. He would leave the house for hours at a time. She didn't know where. He wouldn't speak to Faith at all unless he had to about something to do with the kids' schedule. In the fall of twenty sixteen, Coy started first grade and Kaylee, who had just turned four, started in the head Start program.

24:30 Faith was looking for a new place to live and was hoping they could move out within a week or two. Unfortunately they never got the chance. Poor Faith, this just sounds exhausting. Yeah, you don't want to give up on your marriage, and you know it's better for your kids to be in a two parent home, but he just sounds so unstable. Right, Yeah, we'll be back after a break. Now we're going to get into the night of Tuesday, September twentieth, and I'm just going to repeat my warning from earlier. This is where things are going to start to get disturbing, so please listen with care. On Tuesday, September twentieth of twenty sixteen, Faith came home from work and could immediately see that Greg was in one of his moods. He was upset about something, but she knew from past history that he would be unwilling to talk about it, so she didn't even try. She spent some time with Coy and Kaylee, made them dinner, then later helped them take their baths and put them to bed. Then she left to pick up Kara from work and brought her back home. When they returned, Greg was still stewing on the couch about whatever it was that he was mad about. He looked up at her and he said, you know you fucked up right. She ignored him, knowing it would only start a fight. She also knew the way Greg's moods worked, and she knew that he would wake her up later that night to fight about whatever it was that had set him off this time. Sure enough, soon after she went to sleep, around ten thirty, there was Greg waking her up. She knew

26:03 it was probably going to be a long night of arguing, so she dragged herself out of bed and followed Greg to the living room. She was surprised when she got there to find Chadney, who was nineteen by this time, sitting on the couch looking sleepy. She thought, why did you wake chad up? Greg said he wanted to talk to them about something, so she sat down on the couch next to her son. Greg then pulled out a big bag of zip ties and told Chadney to tie his mom's hands behind her back. Chadney tried to reason with him, but Greg pulled a gun out and pointed it at him. Faith had no idea where the gun had come from. As far as she knew, they didn't have a gun in the house. She told Chadney to just do what Greg asked him to do, and so he loosely put the zip ties around her wrists behind her back.

26:49 Greg then tied Chadney's wrists together behind his back with zip ties and tightened the zip ties on Faith's wrists. While this was going on, Kara, who was seventeen at the time, was in the shower getting ready for bed. She finished showering and Greg yelled through the bathroom door, telling her to come out to the living room. She walked in to find her mom and older brother sitting on the couch with their hands tied behind their back and Greg with a gun. Greg zip tied her wrists together as well and made her join them on the couch. He then told them all to go to the basement, where he made them lay on the floor. Then he put duct tape over their mouths, around their ankles, knees, and wrists. He was talking the entire time, but he was strangely calm. Faith wasn't really hearing what he was saying. Her mind was racing trying to figure out how to get them out of this. At one point, she heard him tell Chadney and Kara that their mom had been cheating on him, which was not true, and he said quote, I don't want the girls, meaning Coy and Kaylee, the younger two, being raised by anyone in your family. I don't want them to be like Kara. Faith thought that Greg was planning to abduct Coy and Kaylee and leave Faith and the two older kids. At one point, he went upstairs, leaving the three of them tied up on the floor. Faith kept listening for the front door to close so she could start working on getting them free to call nine one one from the basement phone, but he didn't leave. He kept coming down to the basement and then going back up, talking the whole time. Eventually he removed the duct tape from

28:21 their mouths, but their hands were still bound together behind their backs, and their ankles and knees were still taped together. He picked up Faith like a rag doll and set her on the couch. All she could do was watch and scream as he pointed the gun at Kara's back and without hesitation, fired two bullets at her. Killing her instantly. He then turned the gun on Chadney, but struggled to pull the trigger. Faith could tell that he didn't want to kill Chadney. He pointed the gun several times and then lowered it, but finally he pulled the trigger, killing him as well. Then he walked over to Faith, pointing the gun at her. She braced herself, thinking she was about to die, but instead he shot her in the foot.

29:03 He then pulled out a box cutter, grabbed her face and cut her cheek from ear to near her chin, and then he did the same across her other cheek. Then he put the box cutter and the gun down and walked over to the basement phone. He made a call, not sure to whom. It went to voicemail. The phone was loud enough that Faith could hear the other end of the line. He then called his niece and calmly told her quote, the girls are no longer here there in heaven unquote. Faith could hear his niece on the other end of the line, asking what he did, and asking to speak with Faith. He put the phone up to Faith's ear, and all she could say through her tears was he killed the kids. Greg then went upstairs, and she could hear him on the phone up there, calling nine to one one, calmly and with no emotion, telling the operator what he did. He hung up and waited for the police to arrive. He was upstairs and Faith was still in the ba basement.

30:00 She pretended she was dead, just in case he came back down again, but he didn't. The police soon showed up and shouted down to the basement. Faith answered, telling them that she was tied up down there. Nothing could be done for Chadney and Kara, but EMTs put Faith into an ambulance and rushed her to the hospital. At that point, Faith believed that her younger children, Coy who was almost six, and Kaylee, who had just turned four, had been sleeping in their beds throughout the ordeal. It was only after she got to the hospital that she learned that Greg had taken the sleeping girls out to the car, hooked up a hose from the exhaust, and fed it back through the car window, and killed them with carbon monoxide. EMTs had tried to revive them when they got to the scene, but sadly they weren't able to. Oh my goodness, that is horrible.

30:49 It is It's yeah, it really is a horrible, horrible story. I'm speechless. While she was in the hospital recovering from her her injuries, the media picked up on the horrific story. From the media reports, Faith learned some additional things that she hadn't known before. First, Greg's story of what happened with his first wife was a lie. It hadn't been an accident. He killed Tanya Green by stabbing her multiple times with a stake knife. Not only that, but she was around six months pregnant with their child at the time. The crime had happened in nineteen ninety one, and just like the more recent killings, after he stabbed her, he calmly called nine one one and waited for the police to arrive. He pleaded guilty to second degree murder and was sentenced to fifteen to twenty five years in prison. Another shocking revelation Faith learned about the news was that her father had actually written multiple letters in support of greg getting paroled. After four unsuccessful parole hearings, greg was paroled in two thousand and eight after serving only sixteen years. Faith's dad wrote, Gregory and I were friends before his misas happened, He was incarcerated, he was a member of our church. I feel he has paid for his unfortunate lack of self control and the damage he has caused as much as possible, and is sorry. If he was to be released, he would be welcomed as part of our church community, and whatever we could do to help him adjust, we would. And approving his parole, the parole board said,

32:22 quote, reasonable assurance exists that the prisoner will not become a menace to society or to the public safety. Was he ever evaluated by a psychiatrist? The only thing I know of is when after he killed his first wife and was going to stand trial, he was evaluated and was found competent to stand trial. But I'm not aware of any other psychological evaluation that was done. In hindsight, that should have been done. Yeah, a lot of things should have been done. And the four earlier hearings where he had been denied parole, however, the parole board at the time said that he showed quote no remorse for his crime, had not gained adequate insight, and had a lack of empathy end quote. He had also blamed his victim for his actions, saying that it was Tanya's fault, that, oh God, that he had killed her because she had mistreated him. Even if he hadn't been paroled in two thousand and eight, Greg probably would have been released by twenty twelve at the latest due to points he had earned for good behavior, but those four years might have made all the difference for faith in her kids. Yeah, it's just shocking to me that he killed his pregnant wife and their unborn child and blamed first of all. Yeah, first of all, he only got fifteen to twenty five years in prison for that, which seems well, did he not get time for killing the baby? I don't know about that.

33:40 It's a good question. I'm not sure. The laws are different different places, so I don't know. But yeah, fifteen to twenty five years for that seems really inadequate. And then getting out after only sixteen years just yeah, Well, and not giving him a psychological evaluation upon his release, it's like a little bit of a mess. Yeah. Although the killings of Chadney, Kara Coy, and Kayley were clearly premeditated, there was video of Greg purchasing supplies at home depot a week before the killings. They struck a plea deal with him for second degree murder in order to avoid a trial with Faith approval second degree murder. He pleaded guilty to second degree murder, torture, and assault with intent to do great bodily harm, and was sentenced to forty seven to one hundred and two years in prison. Still doesn't sound so again, Yeah, isn't that forty seven years? The judge wanted to give him a longer sentence, but was bound by the terms of the plea agreement.

34:38 He'll be ninety seven by the time he's eligible for parole, so it's very unlikely that he'll ever leave prison alive. At his sentencing hearing, Gregory said, quote, it's in God's hands only. God can judge. I'm sorry this happened. God knows the heart, he knows how regretful, how sorry I am. Not one day goes by that I don't think of girls. I pray that God be with Chadney and Kara. I feel bad how this has deeply impacted everyone. May God help them, help me, help us all end quote. Oh that makes me sick. I know me too. Faith also appeared at the sentencing, speaking directly to greg for the last time.

35:19 She said quote, you are a con artist, You are a monster. You are a devil in disguise. You are now forever exposed. Not even torture and death would be justice. Your justice will come when you burn in hell for all eternity for murdering four innocent children, all because you're insecure. I will not suffer as you intended. What you did did not work. While I stand up here trembling with fear, I put on my bravest face to be in the same room with the man who murdered all four of my children. End quote. God, I can't imagine how much mo a woman. I mean, I can't imagine having to see him again. And it must have been hard for her not to murder him or just unspeakable horror.

36:06 Yep. After the loss of her kid's faith struggled. As you can imagine, there was a major void in her life. She went on medication for depression and started drinking a lot and partying a lot as a distraction to fill the void. She had physical scars on her face and she suffered from depression, post traumatic stress disorder, and short term memory loss. I bet she did. Nighttime was especially hard. She started sleeping with some type of weapon under her pillow, a piece of wood or a mallet. She would sometimes go to sleep in the closet or the bathroom. She started dating someone, but when he became possessive, she dropped him, which made her more lonely. She then reconnected with a guy who she had been childhood friends with.

36:49 They started dating and got married a few months later, but she found herself redirecting her anger at Greg toward her new husband, and their marriage lasted only a year. In Hindis, she realized she was nowhere near ready for that. Going back to work helped to take her mind off of things, but at a certain point she realized the drinking and the medication had to stop. She started seeing a psychiatrist every week, along with a domestic violence counselor. She learned how to meditate to help deal with her stress and anxiety. She hasn't been back to church in a long time, although she still believes in a higher power, but she struggles with the faith community's role in welcoming formally incarcerated individuals back into the fold. She still believes in second chances, but it's hard to know if someone has truly changed, and so she's less trusting. Now. If you look at social media about this case, you'll see a lot of people blame Faith for what happened. You'll see comments like how could she let this man who killed his first wife an unborn child into her life? And of course Faith regrets not looking more closely into Gregg's past, but she was brought up to be trusting. She also saw the way her parents dealt with marital conflict, and she did the best she could with how she was raised. Can I just interject here that, I mean, Faith is a last person that should be receiving any blame here at all.

38:09 She lost her four children, and it makes me so disgusted when people want to blame the victim. Yeah not okay, comment I ever saw like that just made me so angry. This woman has suffered enough. Leave her alone. Faith also points out the fact that no one else told her about what really happened with Gregory's first wife. I'm sure that someone in the church or someone who knew her must have known the truth, but no one told her. After the tragedy, one of Greg's close friends apologized to Faith, telling her that greg had said something about doing what he did a couple of years before he did it, but the friend thought Greg was just blowing off steam, so he never took any action. She's also angry about being denied the personal Protection Order when she applied for it. They had to have known or they could have easily found out about Greg's past murder conviction. The PPO should never have been denied. The system really failed Faith and her kids absolutely.

39:05 And then there's Faith's dad, who wrote letters to support Greg's parole After a few years past. She asked her dad about the letters and whether he knew the truth about Greg's first wife. Her dad said that Greg had told him the same thing he had told Faith, that it had been an accident. At the end of the day, Faith doesn't feel like she got the answers she was looking for from her dad regarding the extent of his relationship with Gregory when he was in prison the first time. Her dad was eighty two by the time they had this conversation and his memory was fading. But Faith also wonders if her father knew more, but is unwilling to face the fact that he helped get a man released who ended up killing four of his grandchildren.

39:45 Faith later said quote it does hurt. I don't even know how to feel about my dad. I'm not here to bash him or anything. At this point in my life, I don't really deal with my dad. I don't know how I should feel about him. End quote. In the end, she felt like Greg deceived her whole family, including her dad, Faith, who now goes by Faith. Brown is forty six years old. She has tried to keep the memory of her kids alive through charity work and by sharing her story in hopes that other women can learn the warning signs and get help. She volunteers at a local women's shelter in Detroit and regularly speaks at nonprofit events in support of domestic violence and mental health awareness. At an event last year, she said, quote, I want to encourage all women to just be encouraged, reach out and take that first step. A lot of times you're stronger than you think. Even though that's a cliche phrase, we really are. We shouldn't have to be that strong, but a lot of times we're put in positions where we have to be. But you can get through it if you get the right help and get with the right people. Unquote.

40:49 On Friday, September thirtieth, of twenty sixteen, more than a thousand people gathered in a Detroit church to say a final farewell to Faith's four children, Chadney Allen nineteen, Kara Allen seventeen, Coy Green, five, and four year old Kaylee Green. In her book published in August of twenty twenty three, Faith shared some of her memories of her children, and I'd like for us to read these directly in Faith's words. Oh boy, my son was an artist. He was creative at an early age, and he was good at putting things together. One of his favorite things to do was to play paintball, and he also liked airsoft. Chadney was always concerned about me.

41:30 He was my protector. Sometimes we would do silly things around the house. He liked to hide in a corner and then jump out and scare me. We watched Marvel movies together. He was really funny and a cool kid to hang around with. He was an introvert and kept to himself, but he was starting to come out of his shell more. He had graduated from Specs Howard School of Media Arts and was just starting his own graphic design business. He sounds kind of like her son. Yeah, Kara was creative too. She was one who wanted to try everything. She was on the honor roll ever since she started school. She was goal oriented. I never had to tell her to do her homework. She was focused on school and her grades and wanted to be an obgyn. She was into cheerleading and track and helped tutor kids. She was making plans for prom and was about to enroll in a medical program, something I did not find out about until after the tragedy. Kara was a caring person and she loved her family a lot.

42:29 Cooy had just started first grade. We had moved her to a private school and she was liking it a lot. I could see how her mindset was changing. She had overheard some Arab women speaking one day and asked me why they were talking differently. I said, that's their culture. It's good to learn more than one language because it will help you talk to your friends and it will help you later in life. After that, she wanted to learn a language, so I enrolled her in a Spanish class. She adored her big sister and wanted to be just like Kara. Coy was funny and we would always have to tell her, push your glasses up. We would tell her that she looked like an old church lady because she liked her dresses and wanted to wear tights. She did not care if it was ninety degrees outside.

43:14 She wanted to wear tights and dresses all the time. Kaylee liked carrying her little purse. First it was Kara's purse, and then it was Coy's before Kaylee had it. Kaylee would put her hand sanitizer and her lip gloss inside it and carry that purse with her faithfully. She liked makeup and would always play with my eyeshadow. She loved being outside at the park. She could stay outside day and night. She was the youngest, so she was the one that would cling to me. If I turned around, she would be right there. She was lovable and funny in her own way. And I just miss it. My kids were all in different stages of life and they did not get the chance to fully blossom. That is what hurts, not being able to see their personalities develop and see who they will have become.

43:57 I miss my kids and I wanted to touch them. I want to feel them. Faith still struggles with PTSD, but she's learned to take care of herself and allow herself to have downtime. She likes to travel and she likes being outdoors, kayaking and visiting parks. I'd like to finish by reading the last couple of paragraphs of Faith's book. I am in a good place today. This is the most piece I have felt since my kids passed, and I stay away from anyone or anything that threatens that. I know now that when I feel a certain way, I need to talk about it with someone and get my feelings out. Substance abuse is not the solution. It did not get me anywhere, and it won't get you anywhere either. People can get stuck there and lose ten, fifteen, twenty years. I did not want that to be me. Find that faith in yourself and push through, because even when you are out of the abusive situation, sometimes you still feel hopeless. Reach out and talk to someone. That is what has helped me the most. My strength today comes from that moment in the basement, and it comes from thinking of about my kids. I know they would not want me to be sad. They would want me to be happy. So I have to think about that a lot, even though it is bittersweet, because I want my kids and I can't have them, but there's still life after exhausting evil things happen to us. I am living proof. I will not suffer. I am not broken. I mentioned earlier Faith's book that she wrote about this, and that was one of the main sources for the case, and I just I'm just so amazed and grateful at like the strength that

45:30 it has taken her to tell her story, both in the book but also speaking with different groups. She's been on different TV shows as well, So it's just to me, it's just amazing to be able to come back from what she's done through and it's a testament to her her strength and courage and her character is it's amazing. We talk about this a lot, but yeah, victims that become advocates are the most amazing people in my opinion. Yeah. I did have a question about Greg's relationship with Kara, like why she sounds like a wonderful young woman and why did he have such an issue. Yeah, I mean I have no idea. Obviously Greg had major, major issues, so I really don't know why he had an issue with Karen.

46:17 I had an issue with anyone, just obviously a sick man. Yeah, rest in Peace. Chadney, Kara Coy and Kaylee. We've failed to talk about this at the top of the episode, but since we worked on the Peterson project together, we decided that we were going to present the cases together. One of us is doing the research, but then we were both going to present it. So as we're reading the story, I don't know what's going to happen next necessarily, and you know, when it's the episode I've researched, you don't know what's going on. So that's why sometimes I'm like, you know, I didn't know that was going to happen. Yeah, Ever, so we figured it would be good to mix it up a little bit and you could hear more of both of our voices during each episode.

47:07 Do you want to tell us about the missing person's case you researched? Sure. First of all, I wanted to give a big thank you to our friend Kylie at Primetime Crime Crime with a K. Kylie lives in the area where this person disappeared, and she has an hour over an hour episode with Margaret kay Alana Turner's mom, which was fabulous, So I would encourage you to go listen to Kylie's episode. Margaret Kaylana Turner twenty eight, was last seen in Tumble, Texas, on March tenth, twenty twenty three. She has long brown hair and blue eyes. She has five feet four inches tall and one hundred ten pounds. She was last seen wearing a long pink dress.

47:52 Kay Alana was born with a heart condition called ventricular septle defect with aphib Kaylana also saw suffers from PTSD, and at the time her disappearance was under the care of a psychiatrist. On February twentieth, twenty twenty three, Kayalana's doctor had recently changed her medications, adding zoloft and Riddlin, which counteracted with her heart medication and rendered her sleepless for several days. Kayalana's mother, Rosa Calhoun, is heartbroken and desperately searching for answers. She is very proud of her daughter. She's the light of her life. Kaylana is kind, intelligent, resourceful, and talented. She speaks three languages fluently, unlike myself, I can't even speak one language fluently, English, Spanish and French. And she's very talented musically. Her mother told a story about how Kaylana is homeless.

48:47 People would put their phones in her mailbox and she would charge their phones for them, very kind. Kaylana had been staying with her friend Brittany after she'd had a bedbug infestation at her apartment. She found herself locked out of Britney's house, and she'd stayed with Brittany on many occasions and she knew the code to open the door. The footage from Britney's ring camera shows a confused and disoriented kay Alanna unsuccessfully trying to get back into the house. Brittany received a cryptic text two word text message that said no help. Her mother said that Kaylena does not look like herself in the video, and under normal circumstances, she would have been able to open the door and get back into the house. Kaylana left Britney's house and drove to the Holly Creek Trail's neighborhood in this confused and disoriented state. And she hadn't slept for days, and this was because of the change in her medication to medications, just and not having sleeping for days. That can really mess you up to me, right, She pulled into a stranger's driveway. We don't know why. Again, she was probably just lost and disoriented, and she fell asleep in the car.

49:58 And it's unclear why time this was that she fell asleep. But the next morning, the homeowner noticed Kaylana's car in her driveway at five twenty five am. They tried to wake her up, but she was out cold. Kaylana was having a mental health breakdown as well as a cardiac event. The homeowner called the police. They thought that she may be dead. When the police arrived, kay Alana awoke and she was startled and frightened. She locked the car doors. And Kaylana owns a vintage clothing business and her car was full of clothing that she'd recently watched at the laundry map because of the bed bug and PlayStation, so her car is full of these clothes and the police just assume that she is a homeless drug addict living out of her car, which whether she was or wasn't, she still should have been treated with kindness and respect. While she was still in the car, a police officer grabbed a two by four and rammed her window. The window shattered, covering kay Alana in glass and scaring her. She was able to escape by slowly driving her car away from the house, and I'm unclear of what happened here, but it sounds like she ran through multiple people's fences and she ended up in this pasture that was by some woods. Her car became stuck in a bog and Kaylana escaped her car and she ran into the woods. There was a creek and she crossed the creek, and when she crossed the creek, she entered

51:29 into Montgomery County, the next county. Her father later followed the tracks and thought that he saw her footsteps on the other side of the creek, so they believed that she made it to the other side of the creek. They found Kaylana's shoes, which were filled with glass, her phone, and her purse. Kaylana had attended south By Southwest in the past, and her mom thought that maybe she could have been headed there. She called a friend of Kailanas who lived in Austin, and he confirmed that he had talked to her the day before and she had said I'm coming to Austin. Mother and father filed a missing person's report, but the police told them they were going to file and a rest warrant for her because she had escaped from them. Despite her mental and physical condition. Okay. The Calhouns contacted Texas Equa SARCH and they agreed to help look for a Kailana, but costing them that once there was an arrest warrant filed, their hands were tied and they wouldn't be able to continue their search. They searched the woods where Kaylana had disappeared, but no trace of her was found. Helicopters and heat seeking radar were used and there was no trace. Kaylana was then classified as a fugitive from justice rather than a missing person, which prevented search efforts and media exposure in the precious early days of her disappearance. Rose had to fight hard to get her reclassified as a missing person. You can see there's, you know, like a difference. Yeah, it's strange. I mean, but when you first said that they had an arrest warrant, my first thought was, Oh, that's

52:59 probably good because that would be more likely that they're gonna actively try to find her. But I guess I was thinking about that really the wrong way, right. Kaylana was charged with three felony warrants and two misdemeanor warrens due to her escape and property damage the police are more concerned with finding her and arresting her than bringing her home safely to her family. There have been no sightings of Kaylana. Her family hopes that she could have been picked up by someone. Rosa Calhoun says her family still hasn't received any help or answers from the Harris County Sheriff's Department and that the body cam footage they've requested has yet to be released despite their pleas to view the footage. So frustrating, So frustrating, the Harris County Sheriff's office auctioned off Kayalaana's car without her family's knowledge.

53:47 They were told they had no rights to the vehicle because it was in Kaylana's name. I mean, it hasn't been a year since she disappeared. There could be evidence. I'm not sure what happened to the belongings in her car. That's mind boggling. As we near the one year anniversary we have Kayalana's disappearance, we send our love to her family and hope they are able to get some new leads and bring her home. If you have any information, please call the Texas equiserch Hotline at two eight one three zero nine nine five zero zero and again thanks to our friend Kylie at Primetime Crime Crime with a K. Go listen to Kylie's episode. She has a wonderful interview with Kayalana's mom. Yeah, let's hope for the best. On Facebook, Kalana's mom posts daily, I think, sometimes multiple times a day about her daughter and memories and pictures, and it's heartbreaking. And I you know, just imagine every every night you go to sleep, you're thinking of your daughter and praying that she has found. Yeah, for sure. Just so many people go missing, and I hope we can continue to feature missing people well as always.

54:58 Thank you all for listening. We appreciate each and every one of you. Please rate, review, follow and subscribe. Find us on social media, or send us an email at Lovemarykill at gmail dot com, and please consider supporting us on Patreon dot com slash Lovemrykill. We have one tier five dollars a month for early ad free access and a monthly bonus episode. If you'd like to send us a snack, you can send it to LMK podcast at pobox one one one Dexter, Michigan four eight one three zero. Is that right? That's right? All right, until next time, don't kill your husband and don't kill your wife. Back to the