April 7, 2025

Maria and Rob Marshall, the Blind Faith murder

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The Marshall family seemed to have it all—wealth, status, and a picture-perfect life in Toms River, New Jersey. But on Thursday, September 7, 1984, tragedy struck when Maria Marshall, a beloved 42-year-old mother of three, was murdered in a parking area off the Garden State Parkway.

What first appeared to be a random robbery quickly unraveled into something far more sinister. As investigators dug deeper, they uncovered a troubled marriage, financial troubles, a torrid love affair, and a murder plot that crossed state lines. The case became one of the most notorious crimes in New Jersey, later documented in Joe McGinniss’s best-selling book and movie Blind Faith.

Today's snack: Butterscotch bars

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Sources:

WEBVTT

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Hi, I'm Tina and I'm Rich. And if there's one

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thing we've learned in over twenty years of marriage.

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It's that some days you'll feel like killing your wife.

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And some days you'll feel like killing your husband.

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Welcome to love, Mary Kill, Hey Rich, Hey Tina, How

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are you. I'm doing great? How are you?

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You know?

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I've I've had a hard week. Yeah, things have been

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a little dark and gloomy here, and the state of

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the world is kind of bothering me a little bit.

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Things kind of feel like just dark and uncertain. And

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we have a lot I think, I don't know it,

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like twenty five percent of our listeners are probably international listeners.

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Yeah, close to that.

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And a lot of people have reached out and said, hey,

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are you guys okay, what's going on over there?

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Yeah? I think a lot of people are feeling that way.

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Yeah, but everything's good personally, but you know, it's hard

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not to let certain things impact you.

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Yeah, for sure.

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And I haven't been sleeping as good last night. I

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stayed up too late working on this case. But I

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am excited to tell you about Maria and Rob Marshall today.

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Well, I'm excited to hear about it our cats are

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fighting right now, though they're having a all out wrestling match.

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They're such sweet, like loving characters, but every now and

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then you see, oh, they're actually animals. Because Cosmo's teeth

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were bare and he looked he looked like he was

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down for the count though, because Clover was looming over him. Recently,

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someone there was like an older I think they must

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have been listening to an older episode and they said

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that we talked about our cats for eight minutes. Oh,

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that was true. I really do apologize. We do mention

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our cats a lot. I asked chat gpt to tell

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me a joke, okay, and I think it's a pretty

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good one.

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Oka.

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Ready, Yeah, A man walked into a library and asked

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the librarian do you have any books on paranoia? She whispered,

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they're right behind you.

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That's pretty good. Do you think chat gpt actually made

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that joke up?

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No, I think that's probably a classic joke. Oh, I

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have another one. I told my wife she should embrace

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her mistakes. She gave me a hut.

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I could see that one coming.

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Alright, Well, I did bring you a snack, and I

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think you are gonna like it a lot. Okay, because

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I might have already had some.

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All right, I'm looking forward to it.

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Maria Marshall, the mom in her case, was known for

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her butter scotch bars, so I'm sure these are not

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as good as Maria Marshall's. But I made you butterscotch. Oh,

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and butterscotch is just so delicious. I like butterscotch sometimes

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I think I like chocolate so much, but butterscotch really

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is delicious.

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Those look really good. Are they sort of like like

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chocolate chip cookie bars but with butterscotch instead?

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Yeah?

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Pretty much nice. I'd love to try those.

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What did you think of the butterscotch bars.

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I thought they were so good, great flavor and really

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like moist and chewy, kind of almost a brownie like

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texture and yummy.

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Well it's a blondie with butterscotch chips in it. The

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recipe will be posted in our show notes. And I

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did double the butter scotch chips because I just can't

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how you do we've a recipe alone. And I also

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added half a bag of heath. I had some heath chips,

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and I don't know if that really added anything to

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it or not.

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It's a nice touch, yeah, Before we get into today's case,

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I wanted to let everyone know that we are now

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on YouTube. I don't know what people like to listen

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to podcasts on YouTube. Sometimes I didn't. I never really

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knew that, Yeah, but apparently they do. So we've started

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creating some videos. They're not the most exciting videos, but

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we were using the pictures that we normally post on

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social media and posting the cases on YouTube, so if

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you want to listen there.

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We are not posting ourselves recording the episodes though, so

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I'm sorry. I know people really would like that.

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But I don't know why people like that, but they would.

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But yeah, go check it out on YouTube. Just search

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for Love Mary Kill.

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And You and it would be great if you could

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subscribe to our YouTube channel.

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Yes, that would be great. We would appreciate that.

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To time stamp this episode, we are recording on Saturday,

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March twenty ninth, at about three pm. This episode will

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be released on Monday, April seventh, which is the day

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of the Final four or no, I'm sorry, the final

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will be that day, right, right? So do you want

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to give your prediction?

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Well, I'm going to predict that our son is going

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to win our family bracket competition. Yes, as far.

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Ahead of that bracket is way busted.

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My bracket's not looking so good either. But I predict

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Duke is going to win it all. I know it's

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a safe prediction.

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They're probably who would they play in the final?

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I think they will play Auburn is what I have

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in my bracket. I believe.

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Is that what pretty much everyone is saying.

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I think a lot of people are saying Duke is

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going to win Auburn.

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I'm going to can Michigan State be in there?

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Michigan State could definitely be in there. Yeah, with Duke,

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they could be.

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That's my prediction. Then know who's going to win Michigan State? Okay,

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we were last night Michigan, so we are right outside

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of Anna ARBORSA. Normally we route for University of Michigan,

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but Michigan State usually has a pretty good basketball team.

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They do, so I'm okay with rooting for them.

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Yeah, I guess I am too.

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But yeah, our son has not a perfect bracket.

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But picked he picked the elite eight complete.

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Yeah, all correpressive, right, it's really impressive. All right, Well

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let's get to our case. Okay, let's our greatest glory

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is not in never failing, but in rising every time

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we fall, a quote left by Maria Marshall that her

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son found after her death.

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It's a very good quote.

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At their twentieth anniversary party, surrounded by family and friends,

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Rob Marshall stood beside his wife Maria and presented her

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with a bouquet of twenty teen white roses, one for

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each year of our blissfully happy marriage, he said. Then

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he handed her three red roses, and one for each

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of our three wonderful sons, whom she has raised with

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love and devotion. Maria, moved by the gesture, wiped away

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happy tears, her smile radiant. But among the guests was

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a woman she despised, someone who within six months, would

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help unravel her marriage, shatter her family, and set events

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into motion that would lead to Maria's tragic death. At nineteen,

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Robbie Marshall was home for a semester after getting suspended

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from Villanova University, much to his parents frustration. He'd rather

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be at school, but it wasn't all bad. His mom's

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cooking was a huge upgrade from dorm food, and she

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liked to spoil him each morning with her fluffy pancakes,

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He had extra time with his high school girlfriend and

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mornings where he could sleep in. Robbie lived with his parents,

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Rob Senior, forty five and Maria forty two, and his

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younger brothers, Chris eighteen and John fourteen. Chris, the studious one,

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had just left for his freshman year at Lehigh University. Robbie,

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a former high school swimschamp, had spent the summer life

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guarding at Whortley Beach in their hometown of Tom's River,

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New Jersey. On September sixth, nineteen eighty four, Maria woke

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Robbie up around eleven a m. And asked if he

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wanted to grab blunch with her and his dad at

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the club. He agreed, god of bed and hit the shower.

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Robbie adored his mom, and so did his brothers. Maria

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was the heart of their family. She loved her boys

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fiercely and was their biggest cheerleader. She'd decorate the house

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with streamers and their school colors before their swim meets.

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She'd been voted swim team's Mother of the Year. His dad,

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Rob Senior, was a big deal in town. Tom's River's

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top insurance agent, successful charming. People joked that he and

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Maria looked like Kennon Barbie. He was also a proud

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of Villanova alum, which made robbie suspension sting even more.

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Marie and Robbie waited for Rob Senior, growing impatient as

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the minutes ticked by. He was late. When he finally

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pulled into the driveway, he rushed inside to change. Just

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as they were about to head out, a car pulled up.

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A man named Phil Gerard stepped out. Rob introduced him

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to Maria and Robbie, then took him into his office

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and closed the door. A few minutes later, Gerard emerged,

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flashed a polite smile, and said something that left Maria

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and Robbie puzzled. Enjoy your vacation. Later that evening, Maria

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and Rob left for dinner and gambling lat jack, specifically

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in Atlantic City, about forty minutes away. Rob was a

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high roller. His boat was named Double Down. He started

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a local black jack club called the Winter Circle. The

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group chartered a bus twice a month and traveled to

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Atlantic City together, but to night was just an evening

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for Maria and Rob. Robbie complimented Maria before she left.

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She looked beautiful as usual, in her designer dress, heels,

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soft blonde curls, and sun kis skin. It was the

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last time he saw his beloved mother alive. Robbi bid

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them a good night, then watched a movie until he

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went to bed at midnight. Several hours later, Robbie was

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jolted awake by a harsh light that flooded his room.

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Rob stumbled through the doorway, frantic and crying, soaked in blood.

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Father mulkay he their priest from Saint Joseph's Church, by

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his side. John, the youngest Marshal, awoke and came into

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the room. Startled. He sat on Robbie's bed while Rob

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delivered the horrible news through ragged sobs. Their beautiful, kind, loving,

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perfect mother had been killed. They all cried together, not

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sure how they would go on without the center of

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their world. Danny O'Brien, the county homicide sergeant, along with

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two state troopers, arrived at the Marshall home around five

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a m Rob was still dressed in his suit coat

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and dress pants. He welcomed the officers in and offered

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them a drink. O'Brien later said quote he didn't look

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like a man whose wife had just been murdered. He

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looked like a man on his way to his yacht.

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At about six a m. The officers brought Rob to

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the State Police s Barracks to be interviewed. While waiting

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for the interview to get started, Rob fell asleep on

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the couch.

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He fell asleep.

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His wife had just been killed, and you croll up

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on the sofa.

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Like a god reaction.

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The interview didn't go well for Rob. He denied having

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a fair he was. He said he loved his wife,

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but they'd been having some marital issues stemming from their

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financial situation. Rob said that Maria was causing them to

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be in great debt because of her spending problem. Rob

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told police that Maria had fallen asleep on the way

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home from Atlantic City with her head in his lap.

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As they drove along the Garden State Parkway. He woke

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Maria to tell her that he needed to check a tire.

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Rob pulled off the highway into the Oyster Creek picnic area,

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just ten miles from their home somewhere between midnight and

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one am. Maria popped the trunk so that Rob could

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get the spare tire. When he got out of his

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Cadillac to check the tire. Another car pulled up behind him,

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killed its engine and turned off their lights. Rob assumed

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they were there just to sleep, but while he was

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rifling around in the trunk looking for a flashlight, he

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was hit on the back of his head and knocked unconscious.

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He explained to the police that he must have been

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followed from the casino where they'd won six thousand dollars

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playing blackjack that night. So this takes place in nineteen

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eighty four, and I think in several places, I'll tell

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you what the value of the money is adjusted for inflation,

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but if I don't, just it's about three times. So

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they wont approximately eighteen thousand dollars.

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That's a good night playing black jack, right, right. He

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said he was a high roller, right, so that is

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definitely possible.

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In his two thousand and two book Tunnel Vision, Trial

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and Error, Marshall recalled the night of September sixth quote.

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After a pleasant dinner at Harrah's Meadows restaurant in Atlantic City,

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Rob and Maria Marshall played blackjack for a couple of

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hours and walked away with over six thousand dollars. They

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paid off two small credit markers, then headed home. When

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he regained consciousness, the money was missing. He found Maria

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00:11:58.480 --> 00:12:01.159
slumped over dead in the front seat with two bullet

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00:12:01.159 --> 00:12:04.320
wounds to the back. Rob waved down a passing motorist

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and asked them to call the police. Quote I started

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to shake, so I got my coat and that was

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hanging in the back of the car and sat on

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the front seat beside her. I sat there and cried

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and cried until the police came. The picnic area is

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surrounded by woods, is unlit, and parking is forbidden after dark.

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On the night of September seventh, it was completely dark.

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Police searched the rest area and surrounding forests for clues,

249
00:12:29.679 --> 00:12:33.200
but came up empty. Divers searched Oyster Creek, which runs

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00:12:33.200 --> 00:12:36.159
behind the picnic area, for the murder weapon, believed to

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be a forty five caliber handgun. A mile or so

252
00:12:39.159 --> 00:12:41.320
up the road was a well lit hole plaza, and

253
00:12:41.360 --> 00:12:44.480
a few miles further was a Roy Rogers restaurant, So

254
00:12:44.600 --> 00:12:47.639
it was unclear why Rob would have picked this dark

255
00:12:47.720 --> 00:12:49.399
rest area to stop.

256
00:12:49.639 --> 00:12:50.919
Yeah, that seems a little odd.

257
00:12:51.159 --> 00:12:53.480
The tire appeared to have been damaged with a knife.

258
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The detectives noted a clean, straight cut about an inch

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00:12:56.759 --> 00:12:59.399
and a half long on the sidewall just above where

260
00:12:59.440 --> 00:13:03.639
it rested on them. The tire had obviously been slashed recently.

261
00:13:04.000 --> 00:13:05.960
And you said they were only ten minutes from home,

262
00:13:06.240 --> 00:13:08.240
and it was a forty minute drive from the casino.

263
00:13:08.320 --> 00:13:11.840
So obviously it wasn't somebody that did this at the casino.

264
00:13:11.639 --> 00:13:13.720
Right, There's no way that he could have driven on

265
00:13:13.759 --> 00:13:16.759
that tire for thirty miles or whatever. An ambulance was

266
00:13:16.759 --> 00:13:18.440
called to the scene and Rob was taken to the

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hospital for a cut above his left eye that required

268
00:13:21.320 --> 00:13:24.679
five stitches. When Rob asked if he was a suspect,

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O'Brien responded, quote, as much as anyone who rode up

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00:13:28.200 --> 00:13:31.440
or down the parkway last night. The interview was brief.

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When O'Brien drove Rob home, he fell asleep again in

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the car.

273
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Oh really tired.

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As residents of Tom's River awoke the next morning, the

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news of Maria's murder was blasted on the radio, and

276
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soon the Marsha's home was flooded with bereaved friends and neighbors.

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Even before a family members, including Maria's parents and Chris,

278
00:13:50.519 --> 00:13:52.600
the middle son, were notified of her death.

279
00:13:53.200 --> 00:13:56.919
Maria Puzinski grew up in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, with her Polish

280
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Catholic parents, Helen and Vincent. When he was just nine

281
00:14:00.240 --> 00:14:02.759
years old, Vincent lost his mother and brother in a

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plane crash. A pilot was getting rides in downtown Philadelphia

283
00:14:06.639 --> 00:14:10.360
on Roosevelt Avenue in a flying jenny plane for five dollars.

284
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Do you know what a flying jenny plane is?

285
00:14:12.320 --> 00:14:12.759
I don't.

286
00:14:13.240 --> 00:14:15.000
It's like an old timey plane.

287
00:14:15.559 --> 00:14:17.600
Yes, I looked it up and it looks like to me,

288
00:14:17.720 --> 00:14:20.080
it looks like an old like Snoopy and Red Barren

289
00:14:20.240 --> 00:14:24.600
type plane exactly. In a moment of spontaneity, Missus Puzinski

290
00:14:24.679 --> 00:14:27.120
decided to go for a ride and took her youngest son.

291
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She smiled and waved to the crowd below until the

292
00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:34.399
plane rapidly descended and crashed. The incident deeply impacted Vincent,

293
00:14:34.519 --> 00:14:36.759
and from then on he was very cautious with his

294
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loved ones. He became a doctor who practiced out of

295
00:14:39.679 --> 00:14:43.600
his home. Maria was the Pazinski's only child. Growing up,

296
00:14:43.639 --> 00:14:46.600
she attended Catholic schools and was sheltered by her parents.

297
00:14:47.120 --> 00:14:50.879
She danced ballet and jazz after high school, Maria attended

298
00:14:50.960 --> 00:14:54.759
Chestnut Hill College, a private Catholic school in Philadelphia. She

299
00:14:54.840 --> 00:14:57.759
commuted by trolley car while still living at home. She

300
00:14:57.879 --> 00:15:00.159
met Rob Marshall when she was just fifteen, and then

301
00:15:00.200 --> 00:15:03.240
the pair secretly dated until she finally introduced him to

302
00:15:03.279 --> 00:15:06.879
her parents when she was in college. Robert Oakley Marshall

303
00:15:07.000 --> 00:15:10.399
was born on December sixteenth, nineteen thirty nine, in Queens,

304
00:15:10.440 --> 00:15:15.080
New York, to Howard Marshall and Oakley Valentine Weeks. Howard

305
00:15:15.120 --> 00:15:18.320
worked in the sporting goods department of Wanamaker's department store

306
00:15:18.320 --> 00:15:21.480
and gave tennis lessons on the side. Four more children

307
00:15:21.519 --> 00:15:24.600
were born, but it wasn't a happy family. Howard was

308
00:15:24.639 --> 00:15:27.639
an alcoholic and couldn't hold down a job for very long.

309
00:15:27.960 --> 00:15:30.639
The ugly disease got him fired every time he moved

310
00:15:30.639 --> 00:15:33.600
his family for a fresh start. They moved frequently and

311
00:15:33.639 --> 00:15:37.360
didn't have much money, which might explain Rob's insatiable appetite

312
00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:41.159
for material possessions later in life. They had moved ten

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00:15:41.240 --> 00:15:46.919
times by the time Rob was sixteen, New York, Connecticut, Michigan, Illinois, Wisconsin,

314
00:15:47.200 --> 00:15:51.399
and most recently Havertown, Pennsylvania. Rob grew tired of his

315
00:15:51.399 --> 00:15:55.000
family's nomadic life, he had failed to thrive academically or

316
00:15:55.080 --> 00:15:58.840
form any meaningful friendships along the way. In Havertown, Rob

317
00:15:58.919 --> 00:16:01.960
retreated to the basement of the Marshall's rented home, played

318
00:16:01.960 --> 00:16:04.840
his drums and sulked, wishing he was born to a

319
00:16:04.840 --> 00:16:08.320
wealthier family, But the summer of nineteen fifty five brought

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00:16:08.320 --> 00:16:11.080
happier times when he joined a band playing the drums

321
00:16:11.240 --> 00:16:14.440
and met fifteen year old Maria Puzinski, the cousin of

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00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:17.879
a bandmate. She was beautiful and sweet, with shiny, long

323
00:16:17.960 --> 00:16:20.919
blonde hair that cascaded down her back and eyes as

324
00:16:21.000 --> 00:16:24.039
blue as a cloudless day. Maria and Rob kept here.

325
00:16:24.720 --> 00:16:26.039
That was beautiful writing.

326
00:16:26.799 --> 00:16:31.440
That is beautiful writing, very evocative. Well done. Maria and

327
00:16:31.519 --> 00:16:34.559
Rob kept their relationship secret for several years because her

328
00:16:34.559 --> 00:16:37.320
parents didn't allow her to date, but eventually, when they

329
00:16:37.360 --> 00:16:40.559
met him, they weren't impressed. They continued to date. When

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00:16:40.639 --> 00:16:43.320
Rob went to college at Villanova, he had gotten in

331
00:16:43.360 --> 00:16:46.039
by the skin of his teeth. While at Villanova, he

332
00:16:46.120 --> 00:16:49.519
enrolled in the Navy ROTC program. As he was about

333
00:16:49.559 --> 00:16:52.799
to graduate in June nineteen sixty three, he realized his

334
00:16:52.919 --> 00:16:56.759
GPA was one point nine, which was one tenth lower

335
00:16:56.799 --> 00:17:00.960
than the requirement to enter Navy flight schoolpproached his marketing

336
00:17:00.960 --> 00:17:03.559
professor and convinced him to change his d to a C.

337
00:17:04.279 --> 00:17:07.480
He was a natural salesman. After he had completed flight

338
00:17:07.519 --> 00:17:10.160
training in Florida, he came home and married Maria in

339
00:17:10.200 --> 00:17:13.720
his dress uniform on December twenty eighth, nineteen sixty three,

340
00:17:14.160 --> 00:17:16.680
much to the chagrin of her parents, who didn't think

341
00:17:16.720 --> 00:17:19.079
he was good enough for their daughter, and they were right.

342
00:17:19.640 --> 00:17:21.960
Rob and Maria spent a year in Florida and then

343
00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:24.880
went overseas before he was assigned to the Naval Air

344
00:17:24.920 --> 00:17:28.119
Station in Lakehurst, New Jersey. He served as a Navy

345
00:17:28.160 --> 00:17:31.559
helicopter pilot from nineteen sixty four to nineteen sixty eight.

346
00:17:32.039 --> 00:17:35.079
Once his obligation to the Navy was satisfied, Rob became

347
00:17:35.119 --> 00:17:38.400
an insurance salesman in Tom's River, New Jersey. In his

348
00:17:38.440 --> 00:17:40.759
first year, he became a top earner for the company,

349
00:17:40.880 --> 00:17:44.599
selling over two million dollars in policies. Tom's River was

350
00:17:44.599 --> 00:17:48.000
growing rapidly. It was affordable, close to the beach, and

351
00:17:48.079 --> 00:17:51.079
not too far from Maria's family. It was the perfect

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00:17:51.119 --> 00:17:53.720
location for the young couple to start their life. Together.

353
00:17:54.279 --> 00:17:57.039
Tom's River was a town full of young up and comers,

354
00:17:57.119 --> 00:18:00.000
just like Rob. He and Maria bought their first home

355
00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:03.519
right before Robbie was born in nineteen sixty five. Rob

356
00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:05.960
was proud to be a homeowner, unlike his own father,

357
00:18:06.079 --> 00:18:09.160
who was always a renter. Chris came along a year

358
00:18:09.200 --> 00:18:12.519
after Robbie. When John, the youngest was born in nineteen

359
00:18:12.559 --> 00:18:15.039
seventy one, the Marshals moved to a bigger home in

360
00:18:15.119 --> 00:18:19.000
Tom's River. Rob's business continued to boom, and in nineteen

361
00:18:19.039 --> 00:18:22.440
seventy three, the Marshals once again moved to a brand new,

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00:18:22.519 --> 00:18:25.880
custom built home and joined the country Club. Rob saw

363
00:18:25.960 --> 00:18:29.119
everyone in the blossoming town as a potential client, and

364
00:18:29.160 --> 00:18:32.720
eventually he had sold most of the town insurance. Maria

365
00:18:32.759 --> 00:18:35.680
and Rob were always perfectly groomed and dressed, wearing the

366
00:18:35.759 --> 00:18:40.079
latest fashions, sparing no expense. Their three sons, too, were

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00:18:40.119 --> 00:18:45.160
seemingly perfect, polite, smart, good athletes, and always with fresh haircuts.

368
00:18:45.640 --> 00:18:47.559
Rob Marshall was the envy of a lot of men

369
00:18:47.599 --> 00:18:50.759
in Tom's River. He was a successful businessman, and he

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00:18:50.799 --> 00:18:53.920
and Maria ran in the right social circles. Rob was

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00:18:54.000 --> 00:18:57.079
active in the Rotary Club and served as fundraising chairman

372
00:18:57.160 --> 00:19:00.160
for Ocean City United Way from nineteen eighty two to

373
00:19:00.240 --> 00:19:02.880
nineteen eighty three, which was one of their best years

374
00:19:02.920 --> 00:19:06.400
to date. Maria Marshall was warm and friendly, but kept

375
00:19:06.400 --> 00:19:08.799
people at an arm's length. She didn't have a lot

376
00:19:08.799 --> 00:19:11.559
of close friends, but her husband and children meant everything

377
00:19:11.640 --> 00:19:15.400
to her. She maintained a very carefully curated image. She

378
00:19:15.480 --> 00:19:17.440
was never seen with a hair out of place and

379
00:19:17.519 --> 00:19:20.160
kept herself in good shape by playing tennis and teaching

380
00:19:20.200 --> 00:19:23.599
exercise classes at a local dance studio. It was almost

381
00:19:23.599 --> 00:19:25.759
like she was afraid to be seen as anything less

382
00:19:25.799 --> 00:19:29.440
than perfect. Maria was her son's number one cheerleader in life,

383
00:19:29.480 --> 00:19:33.720
but especially during their swim meets. Donning an enthusiastic foam finger,

384
00:19:34.160 --> 00:19:36.359
the Marshals loved to have the whole swim team over

385
00:19:36.440 --> 00:19:39.359
for pizza to watch the videos rob made of their meats.

386
00:19:39.720 --> 00:19:42.839
During Robbie's senior year, Maria was voted the swim team's

387
00:19:42.920 --> 00:19:45.960
mother of the Year. Maria was fun and stylish and

388
00:19:46.000 --> 00:19:47.759
loved to dress up for a night on the town,

389
00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:50.720
but when she was home, she was just mom, likely

390
00:19:50.759 --> 00:19:52.880
to be found on the couch in her blue bathrobe

391
00:19:52.880 --> 00:19:56.039
watching TV. And asking the boys to join her. She

392
00:19:56.160 --> 00:19:59.119
made the best crispy edged pancakes. She helped them with

393
00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:02.119
their homework and ca them on task. Her easy smile,

394
00:20:02.319 --> 00:20:05.000
warm hugs, and ever present home as she cooked or

395
00:20:05.000 --> 00:20:07.680
cleaned would be the things that her sons remembered and

396
00:20:07.720 --> 00:20:12.440
missed most. And her famous butterscotch blondies. Doris Jacobi, who

397
00:20:12.519 --> 00:20:15.920
owned the dance studio where Maria taught, said quote, people

398
00:20:15.920 --> 00:20:18.680
admired her because she seemed to have the ideal family

399
00:20:18.680 --> 00:20:21.680
and lifestyle, you know, like you'd see on TV. A

400
00:20:21.759 --> 00:20:25.680
nice home, everybody's healthy, real, all American. I guess that's

401
00:20:25.720 --> 00:20:28.319
why it's so shocking that sort of thing doesn't happen

402
00:20:28.359 --> 00:20:31.160
to people like that. You think. She was very involved

403
00:20:31.200 --> 00:20:35.160
with her children and her community. Another resident of Tom's River,

404
00:20:35.279 --> 00:20:39.680
Phyllis Bowden, said quote, everyone is shocked, just shocked. Maria

405
00:20:39.799 --> 00:20:41.359
is the type of person who would live to be

406
00:20:41.400 --> 00:20:44.480
eighty and enjoy every minute of it. She really enjoyed

407
00:20:44.519 --> 00:20:47.559
life and herself and being with her husband. She was

408
00:20:47.599 --> 00:20:50.359
a super perfect type of wife. I don't know anyone

409
00:20:50.359 --> 00:20:53.519
who would want to kill Maria. I don't understand. Maria

410
00:20:53.640 --> 00:20:56.720
was extremely outgoing and very friendly. I know she was

411
00:20:56.759 --> 00:20:59.480
active in the community. I know she was a busy woman.

412
00:21:00.079 --> 00:21:03.440
Love the family very much. We'll be back after a break.

413
00:21:11.599 --> 00:21:14.839
Suspecting Rob of having an affair, Maria hired a PI

414
00:21:15.079 --> 00:21:18.359
around Christmas time nineteen eighty three. She had also hired

415
00:21:18.400 --> 00:21:21.799
an attorney to help her with declaring bankruptcy. Rob hadn't

416
00:21:21.799 --> 00:21:25.480
been forthcoming about their financial situation, but Maria had recently

417
00:21:25.519 --> 00:21:28.759
discovered that Rob had gotten his family deeply into debt,

418
00:21:28.960 --> 00:21:31.599
and that he'd forged her signature on a one hundred

419
00:21:31.640 --> 00:21:34.599
thousand dollars home equity loan. She was not yet ready

420
00:21:34.640 --> 00:21:37.559
to file for divorce. She wanted to save her marriage.

421
00:21:37.759 --> 00:21:40.680
Maria's concerns about Rob and their family had escalated in

422
00:21:40.759 --> 00:21:44.319
ways she'd never imagined. She suspected he might be involved

423
00:21:44.319 --> 00:21:48.440
in organized crime and drug trafficking. Though she hadn't confronted

424
00:21:48.519 --> 00:21:51.279
him directly, she had seen enough to believe their family

425
00:21:51.359 --> 00:21:54.480
was in real danger. By July, Maria was through with

426
00:21:54.559 --> 00:21:58.279
her marriage and told her attorney to draw up divorce papers. However,

427
00:21:58.400 --> 00:22:00.720
by the end of the month, she'd changed her and

428
00:22:00.799 --> 00:22:02.599
decided to put the divorce on hold.

429
00:22:02.880 --> 00:22:04.880
That's really crazy. Do you have any idea. Why she

430
00:22:05.079 --> 00:22:08.640
thought he might be involved in organized crime and drug trafficking.

431
00:22:08.759 --> 00:22:10.920
I think because of the amount of debt he had,

432
00:22:11.000 --> 00:22:13.920
and because he was off to Atlantic City all the time,

433
00:22:14.039 --> 00:22:17.200
and I think organized crime had kind of started seeping

434
00:22:17.640 --> 00:22:21.119
into Tom's river a little bit. Okay, Chris Marshall was

435
00:22:21.160 --> 00:22:25.160
just setting into college life in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, at Lehigh University,

436
00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:28.599
about two hours from home. His mother worried about him constantly.

437
00:22:28.720 --> 00:22:31.480
She'd send him letters with instructions on how to do laundry.

438
00:22:31.640 --> 00:22:34.640
Always separate your laundry by color, she cautioned, and fold

439
00:22:34.640 --> 00:22:37.240
your clothes right away so they don't wrinkle. Maria was

440
00:22:37.400 --> 00:22:40.079
very happy when Chris was elected president of the dorm,

441
00:22:40.400 --> 00:22:43.240
proof that he was off to a good start in college.

442
00:22:43.599 --> 00:22:45.920
On the night of September sixth, while out to dinner

443
00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:48.440
at Harrah's, his parents called him to tell him how

444
00:22:48.559 --> 00:22:52.200
much they missed him. Sadly, hours later, his mother would

445
00:22:52.200 --> 00:22:55.880
be brutally murdered. Rob Marshall is kind of a showy guy,

446
00:22:56.000 --> 00:22:58.599
and he made like a big deal of like asking

447
00:22:58.640 --> 00:23:01.119
the waiter to bring a phone to the table, because

448
00:23:01.119 --> 00:23:04.319
it's nineteen eighty four, we don't have cell phones, so

449
00:23:04.359 --> 00:23:08.640
they call their son and it's really sad because I

450
00:23:08.680 --> 00:23:11.759
think you can see the writing on the wall what's

451
00:23:11.799 --> 00:23:14.839
going to happen. And it was like Rob was giving

452
00:23:14.880 --> 00:23:17.400
his son a chance to say about his mother. I

453
00:23:17.480 --> 00:23:20.640
mean yeah. The next day, September seventh, Chris was hanging

454
00:23:20.680 --> 00:23:23.079
out with friends in his room at about two pm

455
00:23:23.160 --> 00:23:26.319
when his father suddenly appeared in his doorway, looking somber

456
00:23:26.359 --> 00:23:28.880
and out of place. Rob was there to tell him

457
00:23:28.880 --> 00:23:32.559
about Maria's murder and bring him home. Chris was devastated,

458
00:23:32.599 --> 00:23:36.200
but he couldn't help wondering if his father was somehow involved.

459
00:23:36.640 --> 00:23:40.279
He felt incredibly guilty about having this thot and decided

460
00:23:40.359 --> 00:23:43.200
he needed to keep it to himself. When they returned

461
00:23:43.200 --> 00:23:45.960
to Tom's River, the house was filled with family and friends,

462
00:23:45.960 --> 00:23:49.799
including Maria's elderly parents, who Rob's brother in law, Jean,

463
00:23:50.000 --> 00:23:53.680
had picked up in his Mercedes. Jean Lahy thirty eight,

464
00:23:53.799 --> 00:23:56.880
was a lawyer in Wilmington, Delaware. He and the rest

465
00:23:56.880 --> 00:23:59.319
of the Marshall's relatives would stay at the house until

466
00:23:59.319 --> 00:24:02.759
the funeral. Rob's best friend Saal was answering the phone

467
00:24:02.799 --> 00:24:06.079
and taking messages for Rob in his absence. When Sale

468
00:24:06.119 --> 00:24:09.400
told Rob that Stanley Crouschar, the manager of a local

469
00:24:09.440 --> 00:24:13.359
auto dealership, had called. He became very nervous and demanded

470
00:24:13.480 --> 00:24:16.519
all of the details. Stanley and his wife, Sarah Anne

471
00:24:16.640 --> 00:24:19.279
were friends and neighbors of his and Maria's. Well, that's

472
00:24:19.319 --> 00:24:23.799
not actually true. Maria found Sarah Anne brash, overly sexual

473
00:24:24.000 --> 00:24:27.359
and attention seeking. Sarah Anne was a vice principal at

474
00:24:27.359 --> 00:24:31.240
a local high school. Rob began pacing nervously, concerned about

475
00:24:31.279 --> 00:24:33.920
the tone of Stanley's message, to the confusion of the

476
00:24:33.960 --> 00:24:37.160
people in the room, He told Sail to tell anyone

477
00:24:37.200 --> 00:24:40.519
else who called that he was not available. The next morning,

478
00:24:40.680 --> 00:24:43.279
Jean told Rob they needed to talk. They went out

479
00:24:43.279 --> 00:24:45.799
by the pool to have a serious man to man talk.

480
00:24:46.240 --> 00:24:48.480
Jean shocked Rob when he told him that Maria had

481
00:24:48.480 --> 00:24:51.559
confided to him that Rob had been carrying on a

482
00:24:51.640 --> 00:24:55.160
long term affair with Sarah Ann Crowshar, I'm sorry.

483
00:24:55.240 --> 00:24:56.839
Remind me again who Jean is.

484
00:24:57.480 --> 00:24:59.200
Jeane is married to Rob's sister.

485
00:24:59.319 --> 00:25:02.400
Okay, and he was close to Maria also.

486
00:25:02.640 --> 00:25:06.319
I think they were very close, and he was an attorney,

487
00:25:06.400 --> 00:25:09.200
so I think she felt comfortable confiding in him.

488
00:25:09.240 --> 00:25:09.480
Okay.

489
00:25:09.880 --> 00:25:12.480
Maria had hired a PI to trail Rob and had

490
00:25:12.519 --> 00:25:16.160
even drawn up divorce papers before Rob tried to deny it.

491
00:25:16.319 --> 00:25:19.240
Jean told him that Maria had shown him the receipts,

492
00:25:19.480 --> 00:25:23.119
his American expressed statement, phone bill, and the home equity

493
00:25:23.240 --> 00:25:27.599
loan with Maria's forge signature. Jeane continued. He told Rob

494
00:25:27.640 --> 00:25:31.240
that Maria planned to confront him the following Monday, and

495
00:25:31.279 --> 00:25:34.519
that she'd asked jean to be present. Rob was furious.

496
00:25:34.680 --> 00:25:36.880
He said that if he'd known Maria was on to him,

497
00:25:37.079 --> 00:25:39.920
he would have left her earlier and she might still

498
00:25:39.960 --> 00:25:42.880
be alive. He admitted to Jeanne that he had been

499
00:25:42.920 --> 00:25:46.119
involved with Sarah Anne for about fourteen months. They had

500
00:25:46.119 --> 00:25:48.519
even rented a beach house and were planning on leaving

501
00:25:48.519 --> 00:25:51.720
their spouses as soon as possible to start their life together.

502
00:25:52.119 --> 00:25:54.799
He told Jane, quote, you don't understand how much I

503
00:25:54.839 --> 00:25:57.519
love Sarah Anne. She makes me feel like I've never

504
00:25:57.599 --> 00:26:00.839
felt before. He explained that he and Marie were deep

505
00:26:00.880 --> 00:26:03.799
in debt because of her spending. She always had to

506
00:26:03.839 --> 00:26:06.279
have the best of everything. Rob tried to convince his

507
00:26:06.359 --> 00:26:09.359
brother in law. So Rob made about one hundred and

508
00:26:09.359 --> 00:26:12.799
twenty five thousand dollars and today that's three hundred and

509
00:26:12.799 --> 00:26:14.359
eighty thousand dollars.

510
00:26:14.200 --> 00:26:15.000
Pretty good income.

511
00:26:15.119 --> 00:26:18.559
That's a really good income. Yeah, and so they were

512
00:26:18.640 --> 00:26:21.599
pretty heavily in debt. Well we're going to get into

513
00:26:21.680 --> 00:26:24.599
that in a little bit, okay, but it's just crazy.

514
00:26:24.680 --> 00:26:26.319
So that was you know, they should have had plenty

515
00:26:26.359 --> 00:26:26.640
of money.

516
00:26:26.720 --> 00:26:29.000
Yeah, it definitely wasn't her spending that was putting them

517
00:26:29.039 --> 00:26:29.480
in debt.

518
00:26:29.720 --> 00:26:32.400
She pointed out in his lawyer like way that Rob

519
00:26:32.599 --> 00:26:35.759
was suspect number one in Maria's murder because he'd been

520
00:26:35.799 --> 00:26:39.119
having an affair. He was in dire financial trouble, he

521
00:26:39.240 --> 00:26:43.000
was planning on leaving his wife, and he'd taken out

522
00:26:43.039 --> 00:26:46.799
an exorbitant insurance policy on her, not to mention that

523
00:26:46.880 --> 00:26:50.319
she'd been murdered while he'd only suffered a minor injury

524
00:26:50.359 --> 00:26:53.519
to the head. Rob realized it looked very bad, but

525
00:26:53.680 --> 00:26:56.920
was adamant he'd love Maria and would never harm a

526
00:26:57.000 --> 00:26:59.279
hair on her head. Rob knew he had to get

527
00:26:59.279 --> 00:27:01.880
in front of the news about his relationship with Sarah Anne.

528
00:27:02.200 --> 00:27:04.160
He had to talk with two of his closest friends

529
00:27:04.240 --> 00:27:06.799
and told them that he was having an affair. His

530
00:27:06.839 --> 00:27:10.880
friends were incredulous and angry. I've never felt this way before.

531
00:27:11.200 --> 00:27:14.720
We are so in love, he told his friends. So

532
00:27:14.799 --> 00:27:18.000
this is, you know, days after Maria's death, and he's

533
00:27:18.319 --> 00:27:20.799
trying to tell people how in love he is with

534
00:27:20.839 --> 00:27:21.519
this other woman.

535
00:27:21.880 --> 00:27:24.319
I can't imagine how people would react to that. That

536
00:27:24.400 --> 00:27:27.519
knew him like that would be just really not good

537
00:27:27.559 --> 00:27:27.799
to hear.

538
00:27:28.799 --> 00:27:31.559
Later, he told his sons about his new relationship and

539
00:27:31.640 --> 00:27:35.119
told them how in love he was with Sarah Anne quote,

540
00:27:35.400 --> 00:27:37.440
I'm going to need to lean on her during this

541
00:27:37.480 --> 00:27:38.240
difficult time.

542
00:27:38.640 --> 00:27:41.279
I'm sure they were really really excited to hear about

543
00:27:41.279 --> 00:27:41.640
that too.

544
00:27:42.480 --> 00:27:46.000
They were disgusted by their father, but we're too emotionally

545
00:27:46.079 --> 00:27:50.279
exhausted to protest. Unlike their father, they were heartbroken over

546
00:27:50.319 --> 00:27:53.759
the loss of Maria, unable to stop crying with kids.

547
00:27:54.039 --> 00:27:57.680
They were really broken up. The Yeah, it's really heartbreaking

548
00:27:57.720 --> 00:28:01.200
because they really really loved their mother. Rob's lawyer was

549
00:28:01.200 --> 00:28:04.039
adamant he couldn't see Sarah Anne or contact her in

550
00:28:04.160 --> 00:28:08.279
any way. No calls, no letters, nothing, But Rob and

551
00:28:08.319 --> 00:28:11.480
Sarah Anne had built their relationship on secrecy and they

552
00:28:11.480 --> 00:28:14.440
weren't about to stop now. Throughout their affair, they had

553
00:28:14.559 --> 00:28:19.440
exchanged mixtapes, personal audio letters filled with declarations of love

554
00:28:19.839 --> 00:28:23.440
to keep their communication alive. Rob rented a safe deposit

555
00:28:23.559 --> 00:28:26.319
box and they began leaving cassette tapes for each other

556
00:28:26.400 --> 00:28:29.119
at the bank, slipping messages back and forth in a

557
00:28:29.160 --> 00:28:32.440
way they hoped no one would discover. Boy. So this

558
00:28:32.559 --> 00:28:35.680
was a really big story in New Jersey at the time,

559
00:28:36.079 --> 00:28:38.000
and the media was camped out in front of the

560
00:28:38.039 --> 00:28:40.920
Marshall house waiting for them to make a statement. Rob

561
00:28:41.000 --> 00:28:44.079
knew everything he said and did was under a microscope,

562
00:28:44.279 --> 00:28:46.759
so he told nineteen year old Robbie that it was

563
00:28:46.839 --> 00:28:51.039
his responsibility to be the family spokesperson. Poor grief stricken

564
00:28:51.160 --> 00:28:53.759
Robbie walked to the end of the driveway, choking back

565
00:28:53.839 --> 00:28:57.240
tears as he spoke to the media about his beloved mother. Quote,

566
00:28:57.640 --> 00:29:00.640
she wanted everyone to like her, and they all did.

567
00:29:01.000 --> 00:29:03.079
You really didn't have to know my mom to love her,

568
00:29:03.359 --> 00:29:05.799
You just had to know of her. She's one of

569
00:29:05.839 --> 00:29:08.279
a kind. How can I put it in words? We

570
00:29:08.359 --> 00:29:10.519
have friends in and out all day and it's like,

571
00:29:10.640 --> 00:29:13.279
even though my mom is gone, she's taking care of

572
00:29:13.359 --> 00:29:16.359
us through her friends because they loved her too. She

573
00:29:16.519 --> 00:29:19.559
was just a classy, beautiful lady. My father's still trying

574
00:29:19.599 --> 00:29:21.720
to get over the shock so my brothers and I

575
00:29:21.799 --> 00:29:25.000
have decided we're going to be tough for him. He

576
00:29:25.079 --> 00:29:27.079
needs it now. We're going to do as much as

577
00:29:27.079 --> 00:29:29.680
we can to take care of everything my mom would have.

578
00:29:30.160 --> 00:29:32.119
That was really well said by Robbie. But that's so

579
00:29:32.160 --> 00:29:34.599
horrible of his dad to put him in that position.

580
00:29:34.759 --> 00:29:37.240
Nineteen years old, he's still basically a kid. And yeah,

581
00:29:37.279 --> 00:29:38.359
you go talk to the media.

582
00:29:38.799 --> 00:29:42.000
Yeah. My impression of the boys, especially the two older boys,

583
00:29:42.079 --> 00:29:43.880
that they were just really great kids.

584
00:29:44.000 --> 00:29:44.440
Yeah.

585
00:29:44.640 --> 00:29:47.519
Maria's family offered a ten thousand dollar reward for any

586
00:29:47.559 --> 00:29:50.680
information about her death, but many in the Toms River

587
00:29:50.759 --> 00:29:53.960
area began to look to Rob as a suspect. Two

588
00:29:54.039 --> 00:29:57.359
questions loomed. Why did he stop in the dark picnicarya

589
00:29:57.440 --> 00:30:00.519
to check the tire? And why had Maria been shot

590
00:30:00.519 --> 00:30:01.359
and not him?

591
00:30:01.759 --> 00:30:04.279
Those are good questions, right, Yeah.

592
00:30:04.480 --> 00:30:07.880
On September thirteenth, nineteen eighty four, Rob told the Asbury

593
00:30:07.920 --> 00:30:12.400
Park Press quote, absolutely not. I did not hire anybody

594
00:30:12.440 --> 00:30:15.599
to kill my wife. She's so beautiful. She really was

595
00:30:15.640 --> 00:30:18.240
a good lady. I know she loved me terribly, and

596
00:30:18.319 --> 00:30:21.480
I loved her in spite of her problems. I loved her.

597
00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:25.559
Rob knew that public opinion was turning against him. His

598
00:30:25.720 --> 00:30:29.640
sister had been in town. She was in a dressing

599
00:30:29.720 --> 00:30:32.519
room and she heard like people in the dressing area

600
00:30:32.640 --> 00:30:36.240
like talking about Maria and Rob. And people were like, well,

601
00:30:36.319 --> 00:30:38.440
you know, he was having an affair and I'm sure

602
00:30:38.480 --> 00:30:41.000
he had her killed. Blah blah blah.

603
00:30:41.279 --> 00:30:44.279
An autopsy confirmed that Maria's death was caused by the

604
00:30:44.319 --> 00:30:47.000
two bullet wounds. She was shot once in the lung

605
00:30:47.079 --> 00:30:50.200
and once in the aorda. The two bullets were centimeters

606
00:30:50.240 --> 00:30:53.680
apart and at close range. The trajectory of the bullets

607
00:30:53.680 --> 00:30:56.119
indicated that she had been slumped over the seat when

608
00:30:56.119 --> 00:30:59.240
she was shot, and likely sleeping. It appeared to be

609
00:30:59.319 --> 00:31:00.440
a professional killing.

610
00:31:00.839 --> 00:31:04.039
I haven't heard anything about a toxicology report, but I

611
00:31:04.079 --> 00:31:06.559
wonder if she could have been drugged, because it would

612
00:31:06.559 --> 00:31:08.759
be surprising that she would be able to sleep through.

613
00:31:08.920 --> 00:31:09.119
Yeah.

614
00:31:09.200 --> 00:31:10.519
He pulled off the road.

615
00:31:10.359 --> 00:31:13.359
And many got out of the car. Yeah, so I

616
00:31:13.519 --> 00:31:15.079
think that he may have drugged her.

617
00:31:15.160 --> 00:31:19.359
Yeah, it sounds likely. Rob quickly began making funeral arrangements.

618
00:31:19.559 --> 00:31:23.119
He decided to have Maria's body cremated as quickly as possible.

619
00:31:23.160 --> 00:31:25.119
But that does seem to be a theme we hear

620
00:31:25.240 --> 00:31:27.400
over and over. He planned to have a mass at

621
00:31:27.400 --> 00:31:30.440
Saint Joseph's and then have a reception at the Marshall home.

622
00:31:30.880 --> 00:31:34.559
During the reception, Rob was almost festive, passing out drinks

623
00:31:34.559 --> 00:31:37.680
and food circulating the room. It was off putting to

624
00:31:37.759 --> 00:31:40.920
many of the mourners. The whispers started that maybe Rob

625
00:31:40.960 --> 00:31:43.519
had something to do with Maria's death. A friend of

626
00:31:43.559 --> 00:31:46.400
Maria's was heard yelling at Rob, you'd better not have

627
00:31:46.440 --> 00:31:49.160
had anything to do with this. She was bold enough

628
00:31:49.160 --> 00:31:51.640
to say what a lot of people were thinking. The

629
00:31:51.640 --> 00:31:55.200
police brought Sarah Ann Kraushawer in for questioning after pulling

630
00:31:55.200 --> 00:31:57.880
her over on the highway. She was read her rights

631
00:31:57.920 --> 00:32:01.720
and immediately asked for an attorney. Two attorneys actually. She

632
00:32:01.839 --> 00:32:04.079
admitted that she and Rob had been carrying on an

633
00:32:04.079 --> 00:32:07.119
affair for over a year. She told the detectives about

634
00:32:07.119 --> 00:32:09.720
the rented beach house and that they had even opened

635
00:32:09.720 --> 00:32:12.599
a joint checking account. The plan was that they would

636
00:32:12.599 --> 00:32:14.720
both tell their spouses they were leaving them in the

637
00:32:14.759 --> 00:32:18.799
next few days and start their life together. Her husband, Stanley,

638
00:32:19.039 --> 00:32:22.480
furious upon learning about the affair after Maria's death, kicked

639
00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:25.200
her out of their house. Sarah Anne was now living

640
00:32:25.200 --> 00:32:28.000
in the beach house on her own. Sarah Anne wasn't

641
00:32:28.039 --> 00:32:32.039
well liked by the women in Tom's River. She was flashy, haughty,

642
00:32:32.160 --> 00:32:34.880
and liked to be the center of attention. Maria, who

643
00:32:35.000 --> 00:32:39.400
liked everyone, actively disliked Sarah Anne. Despite strict warnings from

644
00:32:39.400 --> 00:32:42.279
both of their attorneys to sever all contact, Rob and

645
00:32:42.319 --> 00:32:45.480
Sarah Anne ignored the advice. Less than a week after

646
00:32:45.559 --> 00:32:49.440
Maria's murder, they resumed their affair, carrying on their relationship.

647
00:32:49.960 --> 00:32:53.079
So if he was truly planning on leaving Maria for

648
00:32:53.200 --> 00:32:55.480
Sarah Anne, that would seem to point in the direction

649
00:32:55.559 --> 00:32:57.720
that he did not do that, because if he was

650
00:32:57.759 --> 00:32:59.720
really planning on leaving her, why would he kill her.

651
00:33:00.200 --> 00:33:03.440
It's like, you haven't heard these stories one hundred and

652
00:33:03.519 --> 00:33:06.839
fifty times and you don't know that it could be

653
00:33:06.880 --> 00:33:08.880
for insurance reasons.

654
00:33:08.720 --> 00:33:10.720
I guess, so I just, yeah, I just don't get it.

655
00:33:10.759 --> 00:33:13.960
But yeah, there's kind of a wild story that Chris

656
00:33:14.000 --> 00:33:16.960
and Robbie were going to prom like you know, the

657
00:33:17.000 --> 00:33:20.559
previous May and the affair had already started, and Rob

658
00:33:20.599 --> 00:33:22.839
told them, why do you go see missus krousher? She

659
00:33:22.839 --> 00:33:25.200
would love to see you guys in their tuxes. They

660
00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:28.400
were like why, Like, why would why would she care?

661
00:33:28.519 --> 00:33:30.480
They've lived like a couple of blocks up the street.

662
00:33:30.559 --> 00:33:32.960
So the boys were like, all right, well we'll do that.

663
00:33:33.119 --> 00:33:35.240
And it's super awkward.

664
00:33:35.039 --> 00:33:38.480
Very bizarre and awkward. On Friday September twenty first, two

665
00:33:38.559 --> 00:33:42.480
weeks after Maria's murder, Rob started feeling good. Sarah Ann

666
00:33:42.599 --> 00:33:45.160
was by his side, and while his sons weren't happy,

667
00:33:45.319 --> 00:33:48.119
they were settling into a new normal. The police had

668
00:33:48.200 --> 00:33:50.880
left him alone since the night of Maria's murder, but

669
00:33:50.960 --> 00:33:53.799
on that Friday, two detectives showed up at his door.

670
00:33:54.200 --> 00:33:56.160
They asked him if he was acquainted with a man

671
00:33:56.279 --> 00:34:00.880
named James Davis from Shreveport, Louisiana. A slight tremor appeared

672
00:34:00.880 --> 00:34:03.839
in Rob's right hand that held his drink, rattling the

673
00:34:03.880 --> 00:34:07.400
ice cubes. Later, in his official report, the detective said

674
00:34:07.519 --> 00:34:10.840
Rob was visibly shaken, like a fellow who had just

675
00:34:10.880 --> 00:34:14.559
heard some very bad news. Upon hearing the name, how

676
00:34:14.599 --> 00:34:18.519
about Billy Wayne McKinnon, the detective pressed. Marshall refused to

677
00:34:18.519 --> 00:34:21.559
answer any questions and referred the detectives to his lawyer,

678
00:34:21.719 --> 00:34:25.840
John Russo. Unbeknownst to the officers, Russo had quit working

679
00:34:25.880 --> 00:34:29.079
for Rob five days earlier. The next day, he sought

680
00:34:29.119 --> 00:34:31.920
the counsel of a new attorney, Carl Seely, who was

681
00:34:32.000 --> 00:34:35.199
known for his work with mobsters. Rob sold his boat

682
00:34:35.239 --> 00:34:38.559
for six thousand dollars to pay his new attorney's retainer.

683
00:34:38.960 --> 00:34:42.920
The next day, James Davis called Rob's house. Robbie answered.

684
00:34:43.280 --> 00:34:45.760
Davis told Robbie that it was urgent that his father

685
00:34:45.880 --> 00:34:49.320
returned his call as soon as possible. Rob dismissed the

686
00:34:49.360 --> 00:34:52.199
call as nothing. To Robbie, he explained it away as

687
00:34:52.239 --> 00:34:54.519
a gambling debt and promised that he had paid it.

688
00:34:54.920 --> 00:34:56.960
A few days later, it was announced that a man

689
00:34:57.039 --> 00:35:00.000
named Robert Cumber was indicted by a grand jury form

690
00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:03.679
her conspiracy to commit the murder of Maria Marshall. Cumber

691
00:35:03.880 --> 00:35:07.760
was retired military and lived on the outskirts of Shreveport, Louisiana.

692
00:35:08.320 --> 00:35:10.960
He worked in a hardware store. It was unclear how

693
00:35:11.000 --> 00:35:14.159
this man was connected to New Jersey and the Marshals.

694
00:35:14.840 --> 00:35:17.800
After the arrest, Sarah Anne ended the affair with Rob.

695
00:35:18.320 --> 00:35:20.559
She had found out that he had been deceptive about

696
00:35:20.599 --> 00:35:25.039
his financial situation, among other things. She no longer trusted him.

697
00:35:25.519 --> 00:35:28.760
Now she was really ready to cooperate with the investigation,

698
00:35:29.639 --> 00:35:32.679
James Churchill, the lieutenant in charge of homicide, reached out

699
00:35:32.679 --> 00:35:35.719
to a detective in Shreveport, asking him to track down

700
00:35:35.800 --> 00:35:39.800
Robert Cumber. Investigators had connected Cumber to Rob Marshall through

701
00:35:39.840 --> 00:35:43.559
phone records, revealing that the two had exchanged thirty one

702
00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:46.760
calls since first meeting in June. They found him at

703
00:35:46.800 --> 00:35:50.000
the hardware store where he worked. When approached by the detective,

704
00:35:50.079 --> 00:35:53.519
Cumber was visibly on edge, so nervous he looked ready

705
00:35:53.559 --> 00:35:56.559
to jump out of his skin. Reluctantly, he admitted that

706
00:35:56.679 --> 00:35:59.239
he knew Rob Marshall. He explained that they had met

707
00:35:59.280 --> 00:36:02.159
at a birthday part for John Riccio, a man in

708
00:36:02.159 --> 00:36:06.519
the stanitation business with ties to organized crime. Cumber recalled

709
00:36:06.559 --> 00:36:10.360
sitting alone at the bar when Rob struck up a conversation. Rob,

710
00:36:10.400 --> 00:36:13.159
who had recently started a state planning, offered to help

711
00:36:13.199 --> 00:36:16.599
Cumber open an IRA, but then the conversation took a

712
00:36:16.679 --> 00:36:20.159
darker turn. Marshall asked if Cumber knew anyone who could

713
00:36:20.199 --> 00:36:22.239
help him investigate his wife, Maria.

714
00:36:22.719 --> 00:36:25.880
This Cumber guy, we don't really know why he was

715
00:36:25.920 --> 00:36:29.599
at this party. He was from Louisiana, and he said

716
00:36:29.639 --> 00:36:32.079
that he went to New Jersey for this birthday party

717
00:36:32.559 --> 00:36:34.679
and then he met Rob. He was sitting alone at

718
00:36:34.679 --> 00:36:39.079
the bar. So it's been kind of implied that someone

719
00:36:39.760 --> 00:36:43.519
must have sent him there, oh to help Rob with

720
00:36:43.599 --> 00:36:44.960
his quote investigation.

721
00:36:45.920 --> 00:36:47.440
Well, who would have sent him there?

722
00:36:47.920 --> 00:36:51.519
I don't know. It's been rumored that Sarah Anne, who

723
00:36:51.639 --> 00:36:55.400
had very good attorneys, could have helped arrange it, or

724
00:36:55.880 --> 00:36:59.519
maybe one of these guys who had ties to the

725
00:36:59.639 --> 00:37:03.360
organized crime families. It's unsure how this guy got there,

726
00:37:03.400 --> 00:37:06.840
but it didn't seem like he really knew the people

727
00:37:07.320 --> 00:37:11.119
who were having the birthday party, Okay, So yeah, it

728
00:37:11.159 --> 00:37:13.559
did seem like someone sent him there, like, oh, this

729
00:37:13.639 --> 00:37:16.480
guy needs help arranging this hit.

730
00:37:16.760 --> 00:37:21.800
Okay. On September eighteenth, three detectives Churchill, Mancuzo, and O'Brien

731
00:37:21.880 --> 00:37:25.800
traveled to Louisiana to meet with Robert Cumber. Investigators also

732
00:37:25.840 --> 00:37:28.280
stopped at the home of James Davis to ask why

733
00:37:28.320 --> 00:37:30.800
he had made two trips to New Jersey, one on

734
00:37:30.840 --> 00:37:33.519
the day that Maria Marshall had been killed. When he

735
00:37:33.599 --> 00:37:36.440
was less than forthcoming and denied ever having stepped foot

736
00:37:36.440 --> 00:37:38.480
in the state of New Jersey, they went to a

737
00:37:38.599 --> 00:37:41.119
judge for a search warrant. In a desk drawer at

738
00:37:41.199 --> 00:37:44.719
Davis's house, Mancuzo found a receipt for a Western Union

739
00:37:44.800 --> 00:37:48.119
money order sent to him from James McAllister in Tom's

740
00:37:48.199 --> 00:37:51.440
River on June twenty fifth. They also found a note

741
00:37:51.440 --> 00:37:53.840
on a piece of paper stamped with the hardware store

742
00:37:53.920 --> 00:37:57.840
logo where Cumber worked. The name James McAllister was written

743
00:37:57.840 --> 00:38:00.760
with his Philadelphia address and a note that said he

744
00:38:00.880 --> 00:38:04.119
was sending a three thousand dollars money order to James Davis.

745
00:38:04.400 --> 00:38:06.960
The New Jersey Detectives issued a search warrant on the

746
00:38:06.960 --> 00:38:10.920
Shreveport Western Union office for any money orders received by

747
00:38:11.000 --> 00:38:14.719
James Davis from Tom's River. He received two, one for

748
00:38:14.800 --> 00:38:18.599
three thousand dollars from James McAllister and one for twenty

749
00:38:18.599 --> 00:38:20.599
five hundred dollars from Rob Marshall.

750
00:38:21.159 --> 00:38:24.280
So this is very confusing, this whole part. The name

751
00:38:24.400 --> 00:38:27.760
James McAllister was an alias that Rob Marshall was using.

752
00:38:27.920 --> 00:38:29.000
Okay, the Rob.

753
00:38:28.840 --> 00:38:33.639
Marshall sent two money orders through Western Union from Tom's

754
00:38:33.719 --> 00:38:36.000
River to these people in Louisiana.

755
00:38:36.039 --> 00:38:38.360
But why would he send one from his own name

756
00:38:38.440 --> 00:38:39.840
and one from the alias?

757
00:38:40.320 --> 00:38:42.400
Because he's Tom all right.

758
00:38:42.400 --> 00:38:44.079
I just wanted to make sure it was clear on that.

759
00:38:44.320 --> 00:38:46.760
I think he was like he thought that he was

760
00:38:46.800 --> 00:38:48.320
going to get away with it, and then he realized,

761
00:38:48.320 --> 00:38:50.679
you know what, I should probably be a little craft.

762
00:38:50.400 --> 00:38:54.239
Here, okay. Davis's wife took the officers aside and told

763
00:38:54.239 --> 00:38:57.079
them to look into a former police officer named Billy

764
00:38:57.119 --> 00:39:00.320
Wayne McKinnon. He was friends with Davis and a bad

765
00:39:00.360 --> 00:39:03.960
man capable of murder. McKinnon had been fired after the

766
00:39:03.960 --> 00:39:06.880
theft of a truckload of plywood in an investigation he

767
00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:09.920
was involved in. Since his time as a police officer,

768
00:39:09.960 --> 00:39:13.079
he had been involved in illegal car sales and driven

769
00:39:13.119 --> 00:39:15.760
the getaway car in a few bank robberies, but had

770
00:39:15.800 --> 00:39:19.400
skirted the law thus far, possibly because he sometimes fed

771
00:39:19.440 --> 00:39:23.840
information to the police about his gang's activities. Davis claimed

772
00:39:23.880 --> 00:39:26.360
he was just an intermediary. He had nothing to do

773
00:39:26.480 --> 00:39:29.280
with Maria's death. We'll be back after a break.

774
00:39:37.719 --> 00:39:41.159
On September twenty seventh, nineteen eighty four, Rob Marshall checked

775
00:39:41.159 --> 00:39:44.920
into the Best Western Hotel in Lakewood, his preferred rendezvous

776
00:39:44.960 --> 00:39:49.760
spot with Sarah Anne. He requested Room sixteen, their special room.

777
00:39:50.079 --> 00:39:53.960
He opened fifty sleeping pill capsules, pouring the contents into

778
00:39:53.960 --> 00:39:56.599
a bottle of Coca cola. He placed a picture of

779
00:39:56.639 --> 00:39:59.480
his perfect family on the bedside table. While he waited

780
00:39:59.519 --> 00:40:01.840
for the metas and two dissolve. He put a cassette

781
00:40:01.880 --> 00:40:05.119
into the tape recorder and composed three messages for his

782
00:40:05.239 --> 00:40:08.280
sons and one for Jean Layy, his brother in law.

783
00:40:08.679 --> 00:40:12.000
Here's his letter to Robbie quote. As I lay here

784
00:40:12.079 --> 00:40:14.559
looking at your beautiful face, with your mother right next

785
00:40:14.559 --> 00:40:16.800
to it, and Chris and John, I can only think

786
00:40:16.840 --> 00:40:18.599
how much I love you, and the fact that I

787
00:40:18.599 --> 00:40:21.199
have loved you almost as long as Mom. Robbie, I

788
00:40:21.239 --> 00:40:23.559
hope that someday you'll understand that I could just not

789
00:40:23.679 --> 00:40:26.400
go through this ordeal. You know that I wouldn't hurt Mom,

790
00:40:26.679 --> 00:40:28.920
but there's so much stuff that so many people try

791
00:40:28.960 --> 00:40:31.079
to make it seem as though I would, and I

792
00:40:31.119 --> 00:40:33.840
feel the inevitable will happen, and I will be dragged

793
00:40:33.840 --> 00:40:36.639
through the courts and found guilty, and I can't bear that,

794
00:40:37.079 --> 00:40:40.159
not for me or you. So I'm taking the short cut, buddy,

795
00:40:40.320 --> 00:40:43.119
to be with Mom. I hope I know where she is,

796
00:40:43.199 --> 00:40:45.400
and I will pray to God this evening that he

797
00:40:45.519 --> 00:40:47.760
lets me be with her. I know this makes it

798
00:40:47.800 --> 00:40:50.480
awful tough on you because you're left to deal with everything.

799
00:40:50.800 --> 00:40:52.559
But I know how strong you are and I know

800
00:40:52.639 --> 00:40:54.679
you can do it. You're the oldest and the biggest,

801
00:40:54.679 --> 00:40:56.679
and I want you to be strong for everybody. Be

802
00:40:56.760 --> 00:40:59.960
a leader. Finish school, go back to Villanova in January,

803
00:41:00.199 --> 00:41:02.639
and kick ass. As Chris says, do the best you

804
00:41:02.719 --> 00:41:06.719
possibly can. Go to law school, get your own practice, whatever,

805
00:41:06.960 --> 00:41:09.320
and go for it. Robbie. I know you said you

806
00:41:09.360 --> 00:41:12.159
want to be president someday, and God I think you can.

807
00:41:12.840 --> 00:41:15.679
I believe you can. But whatever you do, do the best,

808
00:41:15.719 --> 00:41:18.639
do the best you can, give it everything. Never forget

809
00:41:18.679 --> 00:41:21.320
your family. And that's talking about me and Mom and

810
00:41:21.400 --> 00:41:24.519
Chris and John and Me and Haleayhes and all your

811
00:41:24.559 --> 00:41:27.679
cousins and the nice people like Sale Coucaro who's been

812
00:41:27.719 --> 00:41:30.559
so helpful. Robbie. I'm so proud of you. You've grown

813
00:41:30.639 --> 00:41:33.320
up to be such an intelligent, bright young man. I

814
00:41:33.440 --> 00:41:35.719
just know that you're going to do so well for yourself.

815
00:41:36.239 --> 00:41:38.599
By the way, I told Uncle Jean to arrange the

816
00:41:38.639 --> 00:41:42.320
purchase of the Mustang for you so you'll have a car. Robbie,

817
00:41:42.320 --> 00:41:44.320
I'm so proud of you. Please be strong and never

818
00:41:44.360 --> 00:41:46.760
forget how much I love you. I love you so much.

819
00:41:47.400 --> 00:41:50.639
The tapes for the other two boys were very, very similar,

820
00:41:50.960 --> 00:41:54.760
except he promised Chris ajeep and John a Porsche. Those

821
00:41:54.840 --> 00:41:57.519
letters make me so angry, like to put all of

822
00:41:57.559 --> 00:41:59.679
that on your sons. It's just ridiculous.

823
00:42:00.480 --> 00:42:00.840
It is.

824
00:42:01.320 --> 00:42:03.719
In his letter to Jean, Rob described a year's long

825
00:42:03.760 --> 00:42:07.400
flirtation with Sarah Anne that blossomed into their torrid, passionate

826
00:42:07.400 --> 00:42:10.199
love affair. He has Geene several times to relate to

827
00:42:10.280 --> 00:42:13.079
Sarah Anne how much he loved her, and closed with

828
00:42:13.360 --> 00:42:16.320
referring to Maria quote, I want to be with her,

829
00:42:16.360 --> 00:42:18.719
and I pray God will allow me to because I

830
00:42:18.760 --> 00:42:21.199
can't go on like this. But in the tape to Jean,

831
00:42:21.320 --> 00:42:26.000
he also talked about the investigation into missing Blackjack proceeds

832
00:42:26.199 --> 00:42:29.880
and the reason that he hired out of state investigators.

833
00:42:30.199 --> 00:42:32.039
He left the envelope with the tapes at the front

834
00:42:32.079 --> 00:42:34.920
desk for them to mail. He'd written on the envelope

835
00:42:35.159 --> 00:42:37.840
to be opened in the event of my death, then

836
00:42:37.920 --> 00:42:41.119
returned to his room, dipped his finger into the tainted coke,

837
00:42:41.480 --> 00:42:45.199
licked it, and promptly fell asleep. He later said that

838
00:42:45.280 --> 00:42:48.400
he'd intended to die at the exact same time that

839
00:42:48.440 --> 00:42:52.159
Maria had died, but he didn't wake up in time

840
00:42:52.280 --> 00:42:53.679
to die at the same time.

841
00:42:54.000 --> 00:42:56.199
I'm certain to wonder if Rob has an arcolepsy or so.

842
00:42:58.679 --> 00:43:01.320
It's a powerful thing to say. He just seems to

843
00:43:01.360 --> 00:43:04.480
fall asleep at the most unusual times.

844
00:43:05.320 --> 00:43:09.320
Unbeknownst to Rob, the hotel clerk recognized him and had

845
00:43:09.400 --> 00:43:12.239
heard the news reports about him being a possible suspect

846
00:43:12.480 --> 00:43:15.679
in his wife's murder. He called the police. Three plain

847
00:43:15.760 --> 00:43:19.440
clothes detectives rented room seventeen right next to Rob and

848
00:43:19.519 --> 00:43:22.280
kept a close eye on him. After he dropped off

849
00:43:22.320 --> 00:43:24.639
the envelope at the front desk with the cassette tapes,

850
00:43:24.920 --> 00:43:27.840
they retrieved it. They tried to call Rob several times,

851
00:43:27.880 --> 00:43:30.480
and when he didn't answer, they called an ambulance and

852
00:43:30.519 --> 00:43:34.360
broke into his room. Later, investigators had to get a

853
00:43:34.400 --> 00:43:37.199
search warrant to listen to the tapes, and when they did,

854
00:43:37.239 --> 00:43:40.639
they revealed Rob to be even more calculating and dishonest

855
00:43:40.639 --> 00:43:43.239
than they'd realized. I think they were hoping for a

856
00:43:43.239 --> 00:43:46.079
confession from Rob, and that was not on the tapes.

857
00:43:46.400 --> 00:43:48.719
He just continued to well, as you read like the

858
00:43:48.840 --> 00:43:52.079
Robby letters deny everything yea. Although Rob hadn't drunk the

859
00:43:52.079 --> 00:43:55.320
poisoned beverage, he was taken to the hospital for observation.

860
00:43:55.800 --> 00:43:58.880
His sons were all heartbroken and furious. Chris refused to

861
00:43:58.920 --> 00:44:01.719
see him at first, but they knew the only way

862
00:44:01.760 --> 00:44:04.719
to get through their grief was together. The boys needed

863
00:44:04.719 --> 00:44:07.599
their father as much as he needed them, but Rob

864
00:44:07.679 --> 00:44:11.039
was using his sons to appear sympathetic, and sadly, the

865
00:44:11.079 --> 00:44:15.800
boys just really needed their father's love and support. Sarah

866
00:44:15.800 --> 00:44:18.760
Ann breaking up with Rob was likely the impetus of

867
00:44:18.960 --> 00:44:22.039
his suicide attempt, if you even believe it was a

868
00:44:22.079 --> 00:44:25.360
real suicide attempt. She continued to ignore Rob, much to

869
00:44:25.440 --> 00:44:28.920
his tornament. He was taken to Philadelphia to an inpatient

870
00:44:28.960 --> 00:44:34.000
psychiatric program, seventy miles from Tom's River. Rob tasked Robbie

871
00:44:34.000 --> 00:44:36.840
with delivering his mail and work to him each evening.

872
00:44:37.159 --> 00:44:40.400
After Robbie had finished his classes at the local community

873
00:44:40.440 --> 00:44:42.840
college and his job at a shoe store at the mall,

874
00:44:43.159 --> 00:44:45.440
John the youngest child, went to live with his uncle

875
00:44:45.480 --> 00:44:47.960
and aunt. It was all too much for Robbie, who

876
00:44:48.079 --> 00:44:50.880
was more sensitive than he let on. He was left

877
00:44:50.920 --> 00:44:53.559
in the big empty house on his own. The happy

878
00:44:53.599 --> 00:44:57.280
memories of his family's laughter long gone rang through his years.

879
00:44:57.760 --> 00:45:01.000
On October fifteenth, he punched the wind shield of his car,

880
00:45:01.360 --> 00:45:04.280
shattering it with his hand. He tore off into the night,

881
00:45:04.440 --> 00:45:07.320
driving over one hundred miles an hour in his yellow Mustang,

882
00:45:07.599 --> 00:45:11.000
screaming and crying in a fit of furious rage and hurt,

883
00:45:11.199 --> 00:45:14.039
intending to take his life by driving off the bridge.

884
00:45:14.199 --> 00:45:16.599
When he got to the bridge, the song take the

885
00:45:16.639 --> 00:45:19.360
Long Way Home came on the radio, and he remembered

886
00:45:19.400 --> 00:45:22.159
listening to the song with Maria after she'd picked him

887
00:45:22.199 --> 00:45:25.039
up from a swim practice, laughing and enjoying the song

888
00:45:25.079 --> 00:45:27.559
with her son in the car, wherea actually took the

889
00:45:27.599 --> 00:45:30.840
long way home, surprising Robbie. The song and memory were

890
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:33.440
enough to calm him down and help him realize that

891
00:45:33.519 --> 00:45:36.199
he needed help. He drove to his uncle Sale's house

892
00:45:36.239 --> 00:45:38.519
and knocked on the door in the early morning hours.

893
00:45:38.880 --> 00:45:41.679
He asked Sail to help him. Robbie spent three days

894
00:45:41.679 --> 00:45:44.320
in the hospital before he signed himself out. So what

895
00:45:44.360 --> 00:45:46.079
do you think of Rob Marshall so far?

896
00:45:46.639 --> 00:45:49.000
I don't really care for him A little bit.

897
00:45:49.239 --> 00:45:51.840
Stir back, right, Yeah, I think you're gonna hate him.

898
00:45:51.840 --> 00:45:54.679
Even more hell boy. When Rob returned to Tom's River

899
00:45:54.760 --> 00:45:57.400
after spending two weeks in the hospital, he implored Sara

900
00:45:57.400 --> 00:46:00.559
Anne to give him another chance. He sent flowers, letters,

901
00:46:00.800 --> 00:46:03.559
and left her messages, but she didn't respond. He began

902
00:46:03.639 --> 00:46:07.440
hanging out at the lounge at the Holiday Inn, bringing

903
00:46:07.480 --> 00:46:10.800
different women home each night. I have needs, he told

904
00:46:10.840 --> 00:46:14.280
his boys with a wink. Sadly, his needs were the

905
00:46:14.320 --> 00:46:17.320
only ones that mattered to him. His sons were all struggling,

906
00:46:17.400 --> 00:46:20.000
but he didn't seem to notice or care. A woman

907
00:46:20.079 --> 00:46:23.079
named Terry became his new girlfriend. A couple of weeks

908
00:46:23.079 --> 00:46:25.519
into the relationship, they went to Florida for the weekend

909
00:46:25.679 --> 00:46:28.599
and stayed with some friends of Rob's, the Stevens. During

910
00:46:28.639 --> 00:46:31.800
the weekend, Rob and Mollie Stevens decided they were in

911
00:46:31.800 --> 00:46:34.639
love and wanted a future together. Rob broke it off

912
00:46:34.679 --> 00:46:38.840
with Terry, quote, You'll love Mollie. She's just like mom,

913
00:46:39.239 --> 00:46:40.199
he promised. The boys.

914
00:46:41.280 --> 00:46:42.800
You're right, You're right. I hate him more.

915
00:46:43.639 --> 00:46:47.719
Tom's River No Apostrophe is a township in Ocean County

916
00:46:47.800 --> 00:46:51.559
that sits along the Jersey Shore, offering access to beaches, marinas,

917
00:46:51.599 --> 00:46:54.880
and waterfront activities. It is known for its coastal charm,

918
00:46:55.000 --> 00:46:59.039
family friendly atmosphere, and historical significance. Tom's River has a

919
00:46:59.079 --> 00:47:02.159
mix of suburban and small town vibes, with a thriving

920
00:47:02.239 --> 00:47:05.880
local economy, good schools, and a vibrant community. Today, it

921
00:47:05.920 --> 00:47:08.800
has a population of about one hundred thousand. During the

922
00:47:08.880 --> 00:47:13.239
nineteenth century, Toms River was a center for shipbuilding, whaling, fishing,

923
00:47:13.519 --> 00:47:17.079
and iron and lumber production. The town gained national attention

924
00:47:17.159 --> 00:47:20.440
when in nineteen seventy eight, the movie The Amityville Horror

925
00:47:20.719 --> 00:47:24.159
was filmed there. After, officials in Amityville, New York, would

926
00:47:24.159 --> 00:47:27.119
not allow the film to be made there. Our friends

927
00:47:27.119 --> 00:47:30.840
at Severed Podcasts have a really, really good series on

928
00:47:31.079 --> 00:47:35.320
The Amityville Horror. There was also a notorious corporate environmental

929
00:47:35.360 --> 00:47:39.000
contamination scandal that led to eighty seven children. I think

930
00:47:39.039 --> 00:47:42.480
it might have been all girls who were stricken with cancer.

931
00:47:42.519 --> 00:47:46.480
Between nineteen seventy nine and nineteen ninety five, b Asf,

932
00:47:46.599 --> 00:47:50.039
a German chemical company, dumped toxic waste into the water

933
00:47:50.119 --> 00:47:54.320
and buried forty seven thousand drums of toxic waste underground.

934
00:47:54.599 --> 00:47:58.559
The company was charged criminally, heavily fined, and forced to

935
00:47:58.599 --> 00:48:01.480
pay three hundred million dollars to clean up the site.

936
00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:04.800
A settlement of sixteen point two million dollars was paid

937
00:48:04.800 --> 00:48:08.119
to the sixty nine families whose children were diagnosed with cancer, which,

938
00:48:08.159 --> 00:48:10.199
in my opinion, is not nearly enough.

939
00:48:10.159 --> 00:48:11.280
Oh that's so horrible.

940
00:48:11.639 --> 00:48:16.559
Vincent Jimmy Sinatra Craparata, a mobster with ties to the

941
00:48:16.679 --> 00:48:20.119
Lucchesi crime family, was sent to Tom's River to establish

942
00:48:20.119 --> 00:48:23.719
a gambling a loan shark operation. Seeing the burgeoning real

943
00:48:23.840 --> 00:48:26.599
estate market in the town, he started a building company.

944
00:48:26.960 --> 00:48:30.000
He was whacked by men wearing ski masks wielding golf

945
00:48:30.039 --> 00:48:32.639
clubs at his used car lot on June twelfth, nineteen

946
00:48:32.679 --> 00:48:35.960
eighty four, reportedly to scare his nephews into giving the

947
00:48:36.039 --> 00:48:39.239
Luchesi crime family a cut from earnings on their video

948
00:48:39.280 --> 00:48:41.440
poker machines. I'm probably saying that name wrong.

949
00:48:42.000 --> 00:48:43.119
I don't know if you are or not.

950
00:48:43.239 --> 00:48:46.800
Actually, my primary source for this episode is a book

951
00:48:46.840 --> 00:48:49.599
called Blind Faith, written by Joe McGuinness, and I have

952
00:48:49.760 --> 00:48:51.800
wanted to read this book for a while because Joe

953
00:48:51.880 --> 00:48:57.440
McGuinness wrote the book Fatal Vision, which the Jeffrey McDonald's

954
00:48:57.480 --> 00:48:59.519
story is based on, and I enjoyed the book so

955
00:48:59.599 --> 00:49:02.760
much I wanted to read this book for this story.

956
00:49:03.119 --> 00:49:05.800
But Joe McGuinness has been criticized by the citizens of

957
00:49:05.800 --> 00:49:08.440
Tom's River for his portrayal of the town. In his book,

958
00:49:08.639 --> 00:49:13.079
he portrayed them as shallow, materialistic, power hungry social climbers,

959
00:49:13.360 --> 00:49:16.559
you know, like Rob. He alluded that some had close

960
00:49:16.639 --> 00:49:20.079
ties with New Jersey crime families and affairs were commonplace,

961
00:49:20.519 --> 00:49:22.400
while there was a small group of people that might

962
00:49:22.400 --> 00:49:25.639
fit that characterization. Most people on Tom's River are hard

963
00:49:25.679 --> 00:49:31.199
working and family oriented, and most residents found Rob Marshall obnoxious, pompous,

964
00:49:31.199 --> 00:49:34.400
and a bore. But after Maria's murder, Tom's River became

965
00:49:34.440 --> 00:49:37.559
a town where rumors flowed faster than the truth. The

966
00:49:37.639 --> 00:49:40.719
Marshall family scandal was too salacious not to become the

967
00:49:40.719 --> 00:49:44.039
main topic of conversation. The town felt empathy for the

968
00:49:44.079 --> 00:49:46.800
three boys, all known to be good kids, but they

969
00:49:46.840 --> 00:49:50.199
also kept their distance. Tom's River folk didn't like how

970
00:49:50.280 --> 00:49:53.639
messy Rob Marshall was acting since Maria's death. Once a

971
00:49:53.679 --> 00:49:56.719
town leader and prominent businessman, he was acting like a

972
00:49:56.760 --> 00:49:57.840
more less frat boy.

973
00:49:58.320 --> 00:50:01.440
In October nineteen eighty four, two more men were arrested

974
00:50:01.480 --> 00:50:05.400
in Shreveport, Louisiana, and charged with conspiracy to commit murder

975
00:50:05.639 --> 00:50:09.480
in connection to Maria Marshall's death. James Davis forty nine

976
00:50:09.559 --> 00:50:12.639
and Billy Wayne McKinnon forty two, were each held on

977
00:50:12.679 --> 00:50:16.079
a one million dollar bond, while Robert Cumber, forty seven,

978
00:50:16.119 --> 00:50:18.679
who had been arrested weeks earlier, was held on a

979
00:50:18.679 --> 00:50:22.320
one point five million dollar bond. McKinnon had previously served

980
00:50:22.360 --> 00:50:25.440
as a deputy sheriff for twelve years before being dismissed

981
00:50:25.440 --> 00:50:29.679
in nineteen seventy seven. Upon these arrests, Carl Seal, Rob's

982
00:50:29.679 --> 00:50:33.280
attorney told the media, quote, based on the prosecutor's theory,

983
00:50:33.559 --> 00:50:36.119
then logic would dictate that at some point in time

984
00:50:36.159 --> 00:50:39.880
there going to return or unseal an indictment against my client.

985
00:50:40.360 --> 00:50:43.559
Robert Cumber denied any knowledge of Maria's murder, but did

986
00:50:43.599 --> 00:50:45.960
admit to meeting Rob at a birthday party in New

987
00:50:46.039 --> 00:50:50.119
Jersey and connecting him with Billy Wayne McKinnon. Rob claimed

988
00:50:50.199 --> 00:50:53.400
that there was money missing from his special Blackjack bank account,

989
00:50:53.599 --> 00:50:56.880
and he suspected Maria of stealing the money and possibly

990
00:50:56.920 --> 00:50:59.800
having an affair. He wanted to hire a private investigator

991
00:50:59.800 --> 00:51:02.480
from out of state to investigate her. He was so

992
00:51:02.519 --> 00:51:05.280
well known in Tom's River and Atlantic City that he

993
00:51:05.320 --> 00:51:08.280
couldn't use someone local, he rationalized.

994
00:51:07.960 --> 00:51:11.519
So this was an ongoing thing that Rob would tell everyone,

995
00:51:11.599 --> 00:51:14.719
the police like, he wanted to do this investigation of

996
00:51:14.760 --> 00:51:18.280
Maria because she was stealing money from his accounts.

997
00:51:18.360 --> 00:51:18.639
Right.

998
00:51:18.840 --> 00:51:22.800
This makes no sense obviously, because if money was missing

999
00:51:22.800 --> 00:51:25.719
from your account, wouldn't you just call the bank and say,

1000
00:51:25.840 --> 00:51:29.320
you know who made that two thousand dollars withdrawl or whatever? Right,

1001
00:51:29.440 --> 00:51:31.920
But you know, he wants to make it seem like

1002
00:51:32.039 --> 00:51:35.840
Maria is being shady. Yeah, and there is absolutely no

1003
00:51:35.920 --> 00:51:37.599
evidence that she was having an affair.

1004
00:51:38.079 --> 00:51:41.079
In December, the three men were extradited to New Jersey

1005
00:51:41.159 --> 00:51:44.280
and held in solitary confinement so they couldn't communicate with

1006
00:51:44.320 --> 00:51:47.280
each other. Remember when the man came to the Marshall

1007
00:51:47.280 --> 00:51:49.400
home before they left for lunch at the club on

1008
00:51:49.480 --> 00:51:52.280
the last day of Maria's life, I do, I did not,

1009
00:51:52.480 --> 00:51:54.880
but now I do. Before he left, he told Maria

1010
00:51:54.960 --> 00:51:57.440
to have a nice vacation, which was a very kind

1011
00:51:57.440 --> 00:52:01.039
of a cryptic remark. That man was Phil Gerard, an

1012
00:52:01.079 --> 00:52:03.960
insurance salesman. Rob had called him on the morning of

1013
00:52:04.000 --> 00:52:06.639
September sixth and told him he needed to rush a

1014
00:52:06.679 --> 00:52:09.800
one hundred thousand dollars life insurance policy on his wife

1015
00:52:09.880 --> 00:52:13.480
because she was leaving for vacation. After Gerard heard of

1016
00:52:13.519 --> 00:52:17.280
Maria's death, he went to the police. Investigators were shocked

1017
00:52:17.320 --> 00:52:20.639
when they uncovered the staggering amount of life insurance policies

1018
00:52:20.679 --> 00:52:24.079
on Maria Marshall. In addition to two one hundred thousand

1019
00:52:24.039 --> 00:52:28.199
dollars policies issued years earlier by Rob's own company, Provident Mutual,

1020
00:52:28.480 --> 00:52:32.440
there were several more valuable policies five hundred thousand dollars

1021
00:52:32.440 --> 00:52:35.719
from Banner Life in September of nineteen eighty three, five

1022
00:52:35.800 --> 00:52:39.199
hundred thousand dollars from Manhattan Life in February of nineteen

1023
00:52:39.239 --> 00:52:43.079
eighty four, one hundred thousand dollars from Fireman's Fund also

1024
00:52:43.239 --> 00:52:46.800
February nineteen eighty four, and one hundred thousand dollars from

1025
00:52:46.920 --> 00:52:50.679
Minnesota Mutual issued in April of nineteen eighty four. That

1026
00:52:50.760 --> 00:52:53.840
brought the total to one point five million dollars, one

1027
00:52:53.840 --> 00:52:56.800
point three million of it acquired after Rob began his

1028
00:52:56.840 --> 00:52:59.960
affair with Sarah Ann. Rob, of course, was the benefit

1029
00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:02.880
fishiary on all of the policies, and the value of

1030
00:53:02.880 --> 00:53:06.440
those policies today is around four point three million dollars.

1031
00:53:06.519 --> 00:53:07.719
That's so much money.

1032
00:53:07.800 --> 00:53:10.039
That is a lot of life insurance to have on

1033
00:53:10.159 --> 00:53:13.000
your wife. And she did not have an income, right,

1034
00:53:13.079 --> 00:53:14.639
she was staying at home or she.

1035
00:53:14.679 --> 00:53:15.480
Was a stay at home mom.

1036
00:53:15.599 --> 00:53:18.280
Yeah, so that's really not common to have that much.

1037
00:53:18.599 --> 00:53:22.599
Rob said, and his defense that he wanted that much

1038
00:53:22.599 --> 00:53:25.199
insurance on her because it was a good sales tool.

1039
00:53:25.519 --> 00:53:28.559
If he was selling you insurance, he would be like, well, rich,

1040
00:53:28.960 --> 00:53:31.800
you need to have at least a one point five

1041
00:53:31.840 --> 00:53:34.920
million dollars on Tina because that's what I have on Maria.

1042
00:53:35.079 --> 00:53:36.639
And he couldn't have just said that, he had to

1043
00:53:36.639 --> 00:53:39.719
actually go buy the insurance points because salesman, they never

1044
00:53:40.039 --> 00:53:43.800
lie about things like that. Okay. Additionally, investigators learned that

1045
00:53:43.840 --> 00:53:47.360
Marshall had visited the Harris casino twenty five times between

1046
00:53:47.480 --> 00:53:48.880
January and September.

1047
00:53:49.199 --> 00:53:51.880
What do you think about that? So that's nine months,

1048
00:53:52.320 --> 00:53:54.639
So that's about what the thirty six weeks?

1049
00:53:54.639 --> 00:53:57.159
Three times once a week or so, not quite once

1050
00:53:57.159 --> 00:53:59.719
a week. Yeah, I guess it's not unreasonable, but it

1051
00:53:59.760 --> 00:54:01.920
sounds like he was also a high roller too, so

1052
00:54:02.559 --> 00:54:05.360
probably not a good good thing. Read on, he had

1053
00:54:05.360 --> 00:54:08.880
played blackjack for ninety three hours. His average bat was

1054
00:54:08.960 --> 00:54:11.039
one hundred and thirty one dollars.

1055
00:54:10.960 --> 00:54:12.119
So again triple that.

1056
00:54:12.400 --> 00:54:15.000
Yeah, so four hundred dollars a bat, that's a lot.

1057
00:54:15.039 --> 00:54:16.880
For blackjack, that's a lot. You can lose a lot

1058
00:54:16.920 --> 00:54:18.400
of money very quickly. Believe me.

1059
00:54:18.440 --> 00:54:20.840
I know you do that.

1060
00:54:21.039 --> 00:54:23.880
I mean, I can, you know, take my own like

1061
00:54:24.079 --> 00:54:27.280
five dollars bets and extrapolate from that. He had a

1062
00:54:27.320 --> 00:54:29.960
line of credit at the casino for ten thousand dollars.

1063
00:54:30.280 --> 00:54:32.239
He owed them three thousand dollars.

1064
00:54:32.440 --> 00:54:35.719
I was surprised by this amount of detail in the research.

1065
00:54:36.400 --> 00:54:39.639
He played for ninety three hours, Like, is that typical casinos?

1066
00:54:39.920 --> 00:54:42.559
I don't know. I would think maybe today it's fairly

1067
00:54:42.599 --> 00:54:44.880
typical that they would know that because there's so much

1068
00:54:44.880 --> 00:54:45.880
more data.

1069
00:54:45.639 --> 00:54:48.920
And having nineteen eighty four. Yeah, like today, like you

1070
00:54:48.920 --> 00:54:51.599
would be scanning a card, yeah, yeah, but in nineteen

1071
00:54:51.599 --> 00:54:54.199
eighty four, I don't think you would have that computer backup.

1072
00:54:54.280 --> 00:54:55.599
No, I would not think that either.

1073
00:54:55.800 --> 00:54:58.800
But Rob loved his comps, and maybe because he was

1074
00:54:58.840 --> 00:55:02.000
a high roller they did maybe they kept track track.

1075
00:55:02.119 --> 00:55:03.519
Yeah, I guess that would make sense.

1076
00:55:03.719 --> 00:55:07.039
Can you imagine having a line of credit at the casino.

1077
00:55:08.079 --> 00:55:10.320
Let's say you had a thirty thousand dollars line of

1078
00:55:10.360 --> 00:55:11.239
credit at the casino.

1079
00:55:11.280 --> 00:55:13.920
I would can't imagine that at all. No, No, that's

1080
00:55:14.079 --> 00:55:19.159
that would be really I would kill you. Yeah, No,

1081
00:55:19.239 --> 00:55:19.599
I can't.

1082
00:55:19.679 --> 00:55:22.639
I wouldn't kill you. I mean I would move angry ups.

1083
00:55:22.840 --> 00:55:24.440
Are you careful what we say here?

1084
00:55:26.320 --> 00:55:29.920
As investigators delved into the Marshall's finances, they discovered that

1085
00:55:30.000 --> 00:55:32.639
they were deeply in debt, and it was likely Maria

1086
00:55:32.719 --> 00:55:34.840
had no idea how dire things were.

1087
00:55:35.159 --> 00:55:37.400
Okay, let me preface like she knew it was bad,

1088
00:55:37.440 --> 00:55:39.199
but I don't think she knew how bad it was.

1089
00:55:39.360 --> 00:55:42.760
Yeah. A credit check revealed credit cards maxed out and

1090
00:55:42.880 --> 00:55:46.320
several personal loans. The one hundred thousand dollars home equity

1091
00:55:46.360 --> 00:55:48.760
loan had been raised to one hundred and thirty thousand

1092
00:55:48.800 --> 00:55:51.679
dollars in the spring, a twenty thousand dollars loan from

1093
00:55:51.719 --> 00:55:54.800
the First National Bank of Tom's River in April, and

1094
00:55:54.880 --> 00:55:58.440
in May another fifteen thousand dollars loan from the same bank,

1095
00:55:58.719 --> 00:56:01.800
a thirty thousand dollars loan from the Navy Federal Credit Union,

1096
00:56:02.119 --> 00:56:05.480
a twelve thousand dollars loan from City Bank. Rob invested

1097
00:56:05.559 --> 00:56:08.880
fifty thousand dollars from money obtained through the second mortgage

1098
00:56:08.960 --> 00:56:11.280
on his home in the stock market, hoping to make

1099
00:56:11.320 --> 00:56:14.639
a quick buck, but it tanked. The total amount of

1100
00:56:14.760 --> 00:56:18.800
Rob Marshall's debt was a staggering three hundred thirty four thousand,

1101
00:56:19.039 --> 00:56:22.320
seven hundred and twenty eight dollars and ninety two cents.

1102
00:56:22.280 --> 00:56:25.480
And again triple that. So we're at over a million dollars?

1103
00:56:25.519 --> 00:56:26.719
Are you okay? Is that stressing?

1104
00:56:27.159 --> 00:56:28.119
That totally is stressing?

1105
00:56:28.239 --> 00:56:31.000
Stresses me out too, which is I can't And remember

1106
00:56:31.039 --> 00:56:34.239
he's his business I think is going well and he's

1107
00:56:34.320 --> 00:56:37.119
making did we stay nearly four hundred thousand dollars a year?

1108
00:56:37.239 --> 00:56:39.360
So yeah, Holy cow, that's a lot of money.

1109
00:56:39.719 --> 00:56:42.119
There was no way Rob could afford to continue to

1110
00:56:42.159 --> 00:56:45.559
support Maria and their sons, pay college tuition for two

1111
00:56:45.639 --> 00:56:48.159
of them, and set up a new life with Sarah Ann.

1112
00:56:48.639 --> 00:56:52.079
Prosecutors offered Billy Wayne McKinnon a plea deal. If their

1113
00:56:52.079 --> 00:56:55.079
investigation did not find he was the shooter, he would

1114
00:56:55.079 --> 00:56:57.559
serve a small sentence, and then he and his family

1115
00:56:57.599 --> 00:57:00.960
could be relocated through the Federal Witness pre Protection program.

1116
00:57:01.239 --> 00:57:03.760
He took the deal and told his story he had

1117
00:57:03.760 --> 00:57:07.320
been connected with Rob Marshall through Robert Cumber, who knew

1118
00:57:07.360 --> 00:57:10.679
him through the hardware store. Cumber was vague with McKinnon,

1119
00:57:10.679 --> 00:57:12.679
but said that Marshall wanted to hire him to do

1120
00:57:12.760 --> 00:57:16.199
some investigative work. McKinnon and Rob had talked on the phone,

1121
00:57:16.199 --> 00:57:18.920
but Rob wanted him to come to New Jersey. He

1122
00:57:19.039 --> 00:57:22.239
sent him two payments totaling five thousand dollars through Western

1123
00:57:22.360 --> 00:57:25.519
Union in early June. McKinnon flew to New Jersey and

1124
00:57:25.519 --> 00:57:28.440
booked a room at hera's. He met Rob in person.

1125
00:57:28.800 --> 00:57:31.280
That's when Rob told him he wanted his wife dad.

1126
00:57:31.719 --> 00:57:34.880
McKinnon said he wanted one hundred thousand dollars for the job,

1127
00:57:34.960 --> 00:57:38.199
but Rob talked him down to sixty thousand. Rob gave

1128
00:57:38.280 --> 00:57:41.480
McKinnon another ten thousand dollars that day from his casino

1129
00:57:41.559 --> 00:57:44.639
credit line and promised to pay him fifty thousand dollars

1130
00:57:44.719 --> 00:57:46.639
after he collected the insurance money.

1131
00:57:46.840 --> 00:57:50.239
Isn't it crazy the different amounts that people pay for

1132
00:57:50.280 --> 00:57:52.880
a hitman. I think we've seen amounts as low as

1133
00:57:52.920 --> 00:57:55.440
like four thousand dollars, and yeah, it.

1134
00:57:55.400 --> 00:57:59.039
Really is kind of wild. It varies wildly. Yeah, Rob

1135
00:57:59.079 --> 00:58:01.559
already had a plan in place. He was going to

1136
00:58:01.599 --> 00:58:05.079
take Maria to the Ramshead restaurant for dinner. After dinner,

1137
00:58:05.079 --> 00:58:07.159
he would tell Maria he needed to run in and

1138
00:58:07.280 --> 00:58:10.679
use the bathroom before they left. Rob had a notoriously

1139
00:58:10.719 --> 00:58:14.079
small bladder, and that was when McKinnon should strike. At

1140
00:58:14.079 --> 00:58:18.079
about ten thirty pm. He gave explicit instructions not to

1141
00:58:18.239 --> 00:58:23.159
mar Maria's beautiful face, what a guy? Yeah really. In preparation,

1142
00:58:23.280 --> 00:58:25.519
McKinnon drove to the rams Head and thought it was

1143
00:58:25.559 --> 00:58:27.880
too well lit and busy for such a crime to

1144
00:58:27.880 --> 00:58:30.599
take place, but he hadn't even brought a weapon along.

1145
00:58:30.840 --> 00:58:34.039
He had no intention of killing anyone. Rob angrily called

1146
00:58:34.079 --> 00:58:36.159
him the next morning and asked if he could come

1147
00:58:36.239 --> 00:58:37.960
back in a few days and try again.

1148
00:58:38.239 --> 00:58:41.880
So Rob, they had driven to the restaurant and Rob

1149
00:58:42.039 --> 00:58:44.639
thought that he was going to shoot his wife, but

1150
00:58:45.079 --> 00:58:45.719
it didn't happen.

1151
00:58:46.239 --> 00:58:49.079
McKinnon returned in July to make good on his promise,

1152
00:58:49.159 --> 00:58:52.159
but he told Rob he would need another seven thousand dollars,

1153
00:58:52.480 --> 00:58:54.840
and when they met in person, Rob gave him seven

1154
00:58:54.880 --> 00:58:59.559
thousand dollars. In casino chips, MacKinnon described Rob's demeanor as desperate.

1155
00:59:00.119 --> 00:59:03.400
It appeared that McKinnon had been avoiding Rob possibly taking

1156
00:59:03.400 --> 00:59:06.840
his money without any intention of completing the murder. However,

1157
00:59:06.920 --> 00:59:10.719
on September fifth, McKinnon returned after hearing rumors that Rob

1158
00:59:10.800 --> 00:59:13.239
might put a contract out on him if he didn't

1159
00:59:13.239 --> 00:59:17.159
follow through. Rob sweetened the deal, offering an additional fifteen

1160
00:59:17.199 --> 00:59:20.880
thousand dollars if McKinnon completed the job quickly. This time,

1161
00:59:20.960 --> 00:59:25.199
McKinnon brought a friend named Larry Thompson along to New Jersey. Thompson,

1162
00:59:25.239 --> 00:59:28.159
a career criminal, had a lengthy history of bank robberies.

1163
00:59:28.280 --> 00:59:30.880
He had robbed over fifty banks. He was also a

1164
00:59:30.920 --> 00:59:34.559
suspect in multiple murders, including the nineteen seventy seven death

1165
00:59:34.599 --> 00:59:37.599
of his wife. On the morning of September sixth, Billy

1166
00:59:37.639 --> 00:59:40.519
Wayne McKinnon called Rob from a payphone to arrange the

1167
00:59:40.599 --> 00:59:43.880
hit for that night. They went together scouting locations and

1168
00:59:43.960 --> 00:59:47.400
decided on the Oyster Creek picnic area. They arranged to

1169
00:59:47.440 --> 00:59:49.880
meet at the casino later that night to exchange the

1170
00:59:49.920 --> 00:59:53.519
extra fifteen thousand dollars payment. The plan originally called for

1171
00:59:53.639 --> 00:59:56.119
Rob to be shot, but he was adamant that he

1172
00:59:56.199 --> 00:59:58.440
did not want to be shot or take a hard

1173
00:59:58.480 --> 01:00:01.960
hit to the head. At midnight, McKinnon dropped Thompson off

1174
01:00:01.960 --> 01:00:04.239
at the picnic area to lie and wait for Rob

1175
01:00:04.280 --> 01:00:06.760
and Maria. He drove to a spot where he would

1176
01:00:06.800 --> 01:00:10.679
see Rob's Ivory Cadillac El Dorado drive by. After he

1177
01:00:10.719 --> 01:00:13.360
saw Rob's car pass, he waited a few minutes and

1178
01:00:13.400 --> 01:00:16.320
then drove to the picnic area and picked Thompson up.

1179
01:00:16.400 --> 01:00:20.440
After he had shot Maria, Thompson snatched Maria's purse. The

1180
01:00:20.480 --> 01:00:23.199
plan went off without a hitch. On their way back

1181
01:00:23.239 --> 01:00:25.800
to their hotel in Atlantic City, they threw the murder

1182
01:00:25.840 --> 01:00:29.079
weapon and Maria's purse out the car window. To celebrate,

1183
01:00:29.199 --> 01:00:31.320
They went out to a restaurant for a steak dinner

1184
01:00:31.519 --> 01:00:33.840
and then picked up two sex workers and brought them

1185
01:00:33.840 --> 01:00:37.119
back to their hotel. Every detail of McKinnon's account was

1186
01:00:37.159 --> 01:00:42.159
corroborated by the investigation. Phone records, financial transactions, and witness

1187
01:00:42.199 --> 01:00:46.239
statements all aligned with his story. Detectives traced the money trail,

1188
01:00:46.599 --> 01:00:49.519
confirmed his trips to New Jersey, and even verified his

1189
01:00:49.599 --> 01:00:52.920
meetings with Rob. The evidence left little doubt that McKinnon

1190
01:00:53.199 --> 01:00:55.920
was telling the truth. We'll be back after a break.

1191
01:01:03.280 --> 01:01:06.920
On December eighteenth, nineteen eighty four, in Stanton, the Louisiana,

1192
01:01:07.000 --> 01:01:10.440
Larry Thompson was arrested for the murder of Maria Marshall.

1193
01:01:10.760 --> 01:01:15.039
Days after McKinnon's twenty five page sworn statement and plea deal.

1194
01:01:15.440 --> 01:01:18.880
Larry was nabbed at his new wife's Hamburger stand Jumbos.

1195
01:01:19.400 --> 01:01:22.480
On that same day. Rob Marshall was arrested while out

1196
01:01:22.519 --> 01:01:25.320
Christmas shopping for his three sons, his car filled with

1197
01:01:25.400 --> 01:01:28.440
expensive gifts that he couldn't afford. It was rumored that

1198
01:01:28.440 --> 01:01:30.800
he was looking into flights to Costa Rica, so the

1199
01:01:30.800 --> 01:01:34.039
police felt compelled to act quickly. He was held on

1200
01:01:34.239 --> 01:01:38.320
two million dollars bail. The boys were not exactly thriving,

1201
01:01:38.480 --> 01:01:42.119
but doing well considering the circumstances. Robbie had made good

1202
01:01:42.159 --> 01:01:44.800
on his promise to his mother and had returned to

1203
01:01:44.920 --> 01:01:48.800
Villanova University and Chris to Lehigh. John remained in the

1204
01:01:48.840 --> 01:01:52.679
family home with a family friend named Tessie McBride. Tessi

1205
01:01:52.760 --> 01:01:56.119
emphatically believed that Rob was innocent and encouraged the boys

1206
01:01:56.159 --> 01:01:59.440
to stand together to support him. His public opinions soured

1207
01:01:59.440 --> 01:02:03.000
on Rob Marty. The people of Tom's River distanced themselves

1208
01:02:03.000 --> 01:02:06.840
from the family. Many people were sure of Rob's guilt.

1209
01:02:07.559 --> 01:02:10.679
Rob and Larry Thompson were being tried together. They'd never

1210
01:02:10.719 --> 01:02:14.280
met in person before the trial started. This is very strange.

1211
01:02:14.360 --> 01:02:20.119
But Larry Thompson's wife moved in to the Marshall home well.

1212
01:02:20.039 --> 01:02:23.039
The trial was going on. Yeah, okay, that is very strange.

1213
01:02:22.760 --> 01:02:26.039
Because Tessie was like she was in charge and she

1214
01:02:26.079 --> 01:02:29.920
would only let people around that believed in Rob's innocents.

1215
01:02:30.039 --> 01:02:34.039
And you know, a venue change was granted by the judge.

1216
01:02:34.159 --> 01:02:37.199
The trial was moved from Ocean County to Mary's Landing

1217
01:02:37.519 --> 01:02:41.639
in Atlantic County, about twelve miles inland from Atlantic City.

1218
01:02:41.840 --> 01:02:45.800
Three of the jury members worked at local casinos. Billy McKinnon,

1219
01:02:45.840 --> 01:02:48.559
with his Sweetheart of a plea deal, spent several days

1220
01:02:48.559 --> 01:02:51.679
on the witness stand. Thompson's attorney spent most of the

1221
01:02:51.719 --> 01:02:55.079
time trying to discredit him. Three weeks into the trial,

1222
01:02:55.239 --> 01:02:59.480
Sarah and testified. The courtroom was filled to capacity that day.

1223
01:02:59.760 --> 01:03:04.239
Sarah Anne did receive immunity for her testimony. She testified

1224
01:03:04.239 --> 01:03:07.079
that months into their affair, Rob said, quote, I swear

1225
01:03:07.119 --> 01:03:09.000
if there was a way that I could either do

1226
01:03:09.119 --> 01:03:11.719
away with or get rid of her, I would He

1227
01:03:11.760 --> 01:03:14.000
asked Sarah Anne if she knew anyone who could do

1228
01:03:14.119 --> 01:03:17.519
the job. Appalled that he could be so ruthless and cold,

1229
01:03:17.679 --> 01:03:21.000
she demanded he never speak of it again. Sarah Anne's

1230
01:03:21.000 --> 01:03:24.559
testimony wasn't finished, but the court recess for the long

1231
01:03:24.599 --> 01:03:27.840
President's Day holiday. Over the weekend, a story broke that

1232
01:03:27.960 --> 01:03:31.480
Rob was not the only affair that she'd had. It's

1233
01:03:31.519 --> 01:03:35.400
not really clear if Sarah Anne had any involvement in

1234
01:03:35.599 --> 01:03:37.239
plotting Maria's death or not.

1235
01:03:37.599 --> 01:03:39.440
Yeah, I mean, it seems weird that he would say

1236
01:03:39.480 --> 01:03:41.559
something like he wanted to find someone to kill her

1237
01:03:41.559 --> 01:03:43.719
and that she wouldn't leave him right then, So it

1238
01:03:43.760 --> 01:03:45.920
makes me think maybe she was a little more involved

1239
01:03:45.920 --> 01:03:47.320
than she's and why did.

1240
01:03:47.199 --> 01:03:51.360
She need immunity right? Rob Marshall took the stand next.

1241
01:03:51.800 --> 01:03:54.400
Chris was in the courtroom, but Robbie had reached his limit.

1242
01:03:54.480 --> 01:03:57.639
He stayed at school, unable to hear anymore. As Rob

1243
01:03:57.679 --> 01:04:01.440
professed his innocence and declared his undying love for Maria,

1244
01:04:01.599 --> 01:04:05.960
the prosecutor cut through his performance with a brutal question, quote,

1245
01:04:06.159 --> 01:04:08.719
then tell me, sir, why are her ashes still sitting

1246
01:04:08.719 --> 01:04:12.280
in a brown cardboard box abandoned in a desk drawer

1247
01:04:12.280 --> 01:04:15.559
at the funeral home? So sad? The rest of Rob's

1248
01:04:15.559 --> 01:04:19.000
testimony unraveled just as quickly, his lies were exposed, his

1249
01:04:19.079 --> 01:04:21.960
deceit laid bare, and the polished image that he tried

1250
01:04:22.119 --> 01:04:25.760
so hard to maintain crumbled in front of the courtroom

1251
01:04:26.039 --> 01:04:28.480
the weight of judgment pressed down on him.

1252
01:04:28.519 --> 01:04:31.239
I'm a little surprised he decided to testify as on

1253
01:04:31.320 --> 01:04:33.400
his own behalf, But I think that just shows you

1254
01:04:33.480 --> 01:04:36.360
he was pretty arrogant, like he thought he could probably

1255
01:04:36.400 --> 01:04:37.239
convince everyone.

1256
01:04:37.519 --> 01:04:39.519
I kind of think he thought he was cooked and

1257
01:04:40.280 --> 01:04:43.480
he really had nothing to lose. But the person whose

1258
01:04:43.519 --> 01:04:45.920
belief mattered most to Rob was his son, Chris, and

1259
01:04:46.000 --> 01:04:50.679
as the prosecutor relentlessly dismantled his father's facade, Chris saw

1260
01:04:50.719 --> 01:04:54.559
the truth a weak man, incapable of redemption. Any lingering

1261
01:04:54.599 --> 01:04:56.519
hope that he had that his father might be innocent

1262
01:04:56.760 --> 01:05:00.679
disintegrated that morning. Whatever admiration or respect had left for

1263
01:05:00.840 --> 01:05:04.440
Rob vanished with his testimony. Later that afternoon, John and

1264
01:05:04.480 --> 01:05:07.960
Chris both were called to testify. That evening. Rob reached

1265
01:05:07.960 --> 01:05:10.679
out to Robbie, pleading with him to come to court

1266
01:05:10.719 --> 01:05:14.159
the following day to testify. Robbie expressed doubt, feeling that

1267
01:05:14.159 --> 01:05:16.400
there was nothing he could do or say that would

1268
01:05:16.440 --> 01:05:19.480
alter the jury's impression of Rob. But Rob pressed him,

1269
01:05:19.599 --> 01:05:22.880
asking him if he could recall the morning of Maria's death.

1270
01:05:23.039 --> 01:05:25.800
But Rob asked him if he could maybe re remember

1271
01:05:25.920 --> 01:05:29.360
the morning of the day of Maria's death. He asked

1272
01:05:29.400 --> 01:05:31.599
him to testify that he was home, that Rob was

1273
01:05:31.679 --> 01:05:34.559
home until they left for the club. You remember, like,

1274
01:05:34.599 --> 01:05:37.360
so they were going to the club and Rob wasn't home.

1275
01:05:37.840 --> 01:05:40.840
And then remember that insurance guy showed up, right, so

1276
01:05:41.320 --> 01:05:43.760
Rob had come in. He'd been somewhere and no one

1277
01:05:43.760 --> 01:05:45.360
really knew where he had been that morning.

1278
01:05:45.480 --> 01:05:48.360
This guy is just such a the fact that he

1279
01:05:48.360 --> 01:05:50.159
would ask his kids to lie for him, It's just

1280
01:05:50.199 --> 01:05:50.800
another thing.

1281
01:05:51.119 --> 01:05:54.559
Well, that morning Rob was actually with Billy Wayne McKinnon

1282
01:05:54.920 --> 01:05:59.760
out scouting locations to kill Maria. Okay, Robbie did testify

1283
01:05:59.800 --> 01:06:02.159
the next day, but he chose to tell the truth.

1284
01:06:02.639 --> 01:06:06.559
His mother deserved justice. Larry Thompson took the stand the

1285
01:06:06.599 --> 01:06:11.119
next day. He denied shooting Maria. Six witnesses, including his brother,

1286
01:06:11.239 --> 01:06:14.920
his teenage son, and his wife, testified that they remembered

1287
01:06:14.960 --> 01:06:18.360
Larry had been with them in Louisiana on September sixth

1288
01:06:18.360 --> 01:06:21.079
and seventh. Do you remember that After Billy and Larry

1289
01:06:21.159 --> 01:06:24.079
left the crime scene, they picked up two sex workers.

1290
01:06:24.679 --> 01:06:28.039
Investigators could not locate the women, but they may have

1291
01:06:28.119 --> 01:06:30.840
been the only ones that would have been able to

1292
01:06:30.880 --> 01:06:34.880
place Larry in New Jersey on September sixth and seventh.

1293
01:06:35.199 --> 01:06:39.119
There was no other evidence linking Larry Thompson to Maria's murder.

1294
01:06:39.599 --> 01:06:42.239
Just the word of Billy Wayne McKinnon.

1295
01:06:42.360 --> 01:06:44.760
Interesting, and back then there weren't like all, you know,

1296
01:06:44.880 --> 01:06:47.559
they wouldn't be able to track somebody, right, you know,

1297
01:06:47.679 --> 01:06:49.480
with cameras and all this other stuff.

1298
01:06:49.760 --> 01:06:53.360
Yeah, so Billy Wayne had made the reservation at the hotel.

1299
01:06:53.719 --> 01:06:56.760
You know, it was his car, and the weapon actually

1300
01:06:56.800 --> 01:07:00.840
belonged to him. So bad planning on his part, well

1301
01:07:01.000 --> 01:07:03.320
or good because he did get the sweetheart of a deal.

1302
01:07:04.039 --> 01:07:06.239
In the small town of May's Landing, where the trial

1303
01:07:06.280 --> 01:07:09.559
had taken place, a seldom used bell tower sat atop

1304
01:07:09.599 --> 01:07:12.360
the courthouse. It hadn't been used in a long time,

1305
01:07:12.679 --> 01:07:15.599
and it, had the death penalty not been reinstated in

1306
01:07:15.639 --> 01:07:18.480
New Jersey, it may never have been used again. But

1307
01:07:18.599 --> 01:07:22.400
on eleven fifteen am on March fifth, nineteen eighty six,

1308
01:07:22.639 --> 01:07:25.679
the bells rang out to notify the residence that a

1309
01:07:25.800 --> 01:07:28.599
verdict had been reached in a murder case in which

1310
01:07:28.639 --> 01:07:30.239
the death penalty was at stake.

1311
01:07:30.559 --> 01:07:31.440
That's really interesting.

1312
01:07:31.639 --> 01:07:35.840
Yeah, First, the verdict in Larry's case was read not guilty.

1313
01:07:36.280 --> 01:07:40.559
He was a free man. His co defendant wasn't so fortunate.

1314
01:07:41.000 --> 01:07:43.880
Robert Oakley Marshall was found guilty of capital murder. His

1315
01:07:43.960 --> 01:07:47.159
three sons sobbed when the verdict was read. Rob collapsed

1316
01:07:47.199 --> 01:07:50.280
and was taken by ambulance to the hospital. He was fine,

1317
01:07:50.599 --> 01:07:53.960
just overwrought with emotion. He was taken back to the courthouse.

1318
01:07:54.440 --> 01:07:56.599
The penalty phase of the trial was set to begin

1319
01:07:56.800 --> 01:08:00.119
at one thirty pm. Both lawyers gave their arguments, and

1320
01:08:00.199 --> 01:08:03.800
the same jury deliberated before they decided on a sentence

1321
01:08:03.880 --> 01:08:07.519
of death by lethal injection. The state of New Jersey

1322
01:08:07.599 --> 01:08:11.599
had not executed anyone since nineteen sixty three. Rob Marshall

1323
01:08:11.719 --> 01:08:15.039
remained on death row for eighteen years. At the time.

1324
01:08:15.119 --> 01:08:17.560
He was the man who'd been on death row the longest.

1325
01:08:17.840 --> 01:08:19.600
He was there until two thousand and six, when a

1326
01:08:19.680 --> 01:08:23.520
judge ruled that he'd been inadequately represented at the trial

1327
01:08:23.800 --> 01:08:27.039
and he was resentenced to thirty years to life. During

1328
01:08:27.079 --> 01:08:31.399
the sentencing or the resentencing Marshall admitted to quote terrible

1329
01:08:31.479 --> 01:08:35.479
mistakes and said he accepted quote full responsibility that my

1330
01:08:35.600 --> 01:08:40.000
actions led to her death, although not specifically confessing to

1331
01:08:40.119 --> 01:08:43.399
hiring someone to kill Maria. At this hearing, John Marshall

1332
01:08:43.439 --> 01:08:46.640
testified for a lighter sentence for his father, and Chris

1333
01:08:46.680 --> 01:08:50.359
Marshall was there and asked for a longer sentence. Chris

1334
01:08:50.399 --> 01:08:52.279
did admit that he was glad that his father was

1335
01:08:52.319 --> 01:08:54.520
taken off of death row. He said that he had

1336
01:08:54.560 --> 01:08:57.960
forgiven him, but did not forgive what he did. So

1337
01:08:58.079 --> 01:09:03.159
this whole time, Marshall, the youngest son, had supported his father.

1338
01:09:03.479 --> 01:09:06.279
Really he said that he was innocent, but Robbie and

1339
01:09:06.399 --> 01:09:10.840
Chris did not support their father. If you remember, three

1340
01:09:10.840 --> 01:09:17.159
men were originally arrested in connection with Maria's murder in Louisiana,

1341
01:09:17.560 --> 01:09:21.359
one of them James Davis. He was released in July

1342
01:09:21.439 --> 01:09:26.039
of nineteen eighty five citing no probable cause against him.

1343
01:09:26.399 --> 01:09:29.880
What had happened was James Davis was the alias that

1344
01:09:29.920 --> 01:09:33.640
Billy McKinnon used, and the money order was sent to

1345
01:09:33.720 --> 01:09:37.359
James Davis, and he actually had to go pick up

1346
01:09:37.399 --> 01:09:39.239
the money, but then he gave it to McKinnon. And

1347
01:09:39.439 --> 01:09:41.479
remember he had said that he never set foot in

1348
01:09:41.520 --> 01:09:44.880
New Jersey, and that actually was true. He really wasn't

1349
01:09:44.920 --> 01:09:49.560
involved other than McKinnon using his name. Robert Cumbert was

1350
01:09:49.600 --> 01:09:52.520
sentenced to thirty years to life in prison for conspiracy

1351
01:09:52.560 --> 01:09:55.520
to commit murder. He'd been offered a plea deal, but

1352
01:09:55.600 --> 01:09:58.680
took his chances by going to trial. He was granted

1353
01:09:58.680 --> 01:10:02.439
clemency by the New Jersey governor in two in January

1354
01:10:02.479 --> 01:10:03.319
two thousand and six.

1355
01:10:03.640 --> 01:10:06.199
Can you recap his part of this whole plot, because

1356
01:10:06.199 --> 01:10:08.239
there's a lot of people involved in the plot. I'm

1357
01:10:08.239 --> 01:10:10.159
not sure exactly what did what did cumber do?

1358
01:10:10.479 --> 01:10:12.840
So cumber was the one who worked in the hardware store,

1359
01:10:13.079 --> 01:10:15.920
and he was the one who originally met Rob Marshall

1360
01:10:15.920 --> 01:10:19.840
at that birthday party and he connected him with McKinnon.

1361
01:10:20.239 --> 01:10:22.920
He wasn't there at the scene of the crime or anything.

1362
01:10:23.000 --> 01:10:25.199
I don't think other than that birthday party he ever

1363
01:10:25.239 --> 01:10:26.359
went back to New Jersey.

1364
01:10:26.560 --> 01:10:26.800
Okay.

1365
01:10:26.880 --> 01:10:30.479
So I was surprised by the sentence. It seemed really harsh,

1366
01:10:30.520 --> 01:10:33.600
and I don't know if it's because they weren't They

1367
01:10:33.600 --> 01:10:36.399
didn't have the shooter and they really wanted the shooter,

1368
01:10:36.920 --> 01:10:40.159
and maybe that's why he got a harder sentence because

1369
01:10:40.159 --> 01:10:41.960
they thought that maybe he could have been the shooter.

1370
01:10:42.640 --> 01:10:46.760
Billy Wayne McKinnon just served three months. After the trial,

1371
01:10:47.119 --> 01:10:49.920
he entered the witness Protection program but left after a

1372
01:10:49.920 --> 01:10:53.800
few weeks because he felt too restricted. He returned to Louisiana,

1373
01:10:53.800 --> 01:10:55.680
and I don't believe he got in trouble with the

1374
01:10:55.760 --> 01:10:59.479
law again. Larry Thompson and his wife filed a fifty

1375
01:10:59.600 --> 01:11:03.039
million dollar lawsuit against the state of New Jersey fifty

1376
01:11:03.079 --> 01:11:06.279
million in May nineteen eighty eight. Thompson lost his case

1377
01:11:06.359 --> 01:11:10.279
after a two week trial. In twenty fourteen, Thompson, protected

1378
01:11:10.319 --> 01:11:14.239
by double jeopardy laws and his family covered by statute

1379
01:11:14.279 --> 01:11:17.840
of limitations, admitted to being the trigger man and the

1380
01:11:17.920 --> 01:11:23.560
murder of William Marshall. His family members fabricated his alibi. However,

1381
01:11:23.680 --> 01:11:26.560
he was sentenced to fifty years in Louisiana for an

1382
01:11:26.680 --> 01:11:30.680
unrelated crime, an armored car robbery and the attempted murder

1383
01:11:30.920 --> 01:11:32.960
of a Shreveport police officer.

1384
01:11:33.119 --> 01:11:35.479
Oh wow, that's wild. So obviously they couldn't try him

1385
01:11:35.479 --> 01:11:37.600
again because of double jeopardy laws, like you said, But

1386
01:11:38.119 --> 01:11:41.399
could his family? Could they have arrested or could his

1387
01:11:41.439 --> 01:11:43.399
family have gotten in trouble for lying for him.

1388
01:11:43.680 --> 01:11:46.000
The Statute of Limitations was up on that trind so

1389
01:11:46.119 --> 01:11:47.279
that's why he felt comfortable.

1390
01:11:47.399 --> 01:11:48.720
Gotcha, Wow, that's wild.

1391
01:11:48.960 --> 01:11:50.920
But when that happened a lot of times, you know

1392
01:11:51.000 --> 01:11:53.239
prosecutors will be like, well, you know, I saw you

1393
01:11:53.359 --> 01:11:58.039
J walking right. Chris Marshall and his junior year of college,

1394
01:11:58.079 --> 01:12:00.680
wrote his father the following letter on April first, nineteen

1395
01:12:00.720 --> 01:12:03.800
eighty seven, more than a year after his conviction. Dad.

1396
01:12:03.840 --> 01:12:06.279
The following is a response to your most recent letter

1397
01:12:06.319 --> 01:12:09.319
and a collection of recent thoughts. There is no particular

1398
01:12:09.439 --> 01:12:12.439
order to these, but I feel the point is clear. One.

1399
01:12:12.720 --> 01:12:15.319
I think you're guilty. Two hate you for what you

1400
01:12:15.359 --> 01:12:17.680
did to Mom. Three. I hate you for what you

1401
01:12:17.720 --> 01:12:20.199
did to Grandpop. Four. I hate you for what you

1402
01:12:20.199 --> 01:12:22.680
did to Grandmom. Five, I hate you for what you

1403
01:12:22.720 --> 01:12:24.800
did to our family. Six, I hate you for what

1404
01:12:24.840 --> 01:12:26.760
you did to John. Seven, I hate you for what

1405
01:12:26.800 --> 01:12:29.000
you did to Robbie. Eight I hate you for what

1406
01:12:29.039 --> 01:12:31.279
you did to me. I hate having to talk to

1407
01:12:31.319 --> 01:12:33.479
you on the phone in the future. If you want

1408
01:12:33.479 --> 01:12:36.960
to call, make it person to person for John. Otherwise

1409
01:12:36.960 --> 01:12:39.479
I will not accept. I hate getting letters from you.

1410
01:12:39.600 --> 01:12:41.760
Do not respond to this one I will not read it.

1411
01:12:42.000 --> 01:12:44.439
Any letter I received from you from now on, I'm

1412
01:12:44.479 --> 01:12:47.159
not going to open. If you must contact me, do

1413
01:12:47.279 --> 01:12:51.039
so through my lawyer, Eugene Lahy. You were right about

1414
01:12:51.039 --> 01:12:53.479
one thing. I will do what I want, just like

1415
01:12:53.520 --> 01:12:56.439
you always did. The differences. I'm not going to kill

1416
01:12:56.479 --> 01:13:00.560
anybody doing it. Your son, Chris, Good for Chris. The

1417
01:13:00.600 --> 01:13:02.600
Marshall home was sold that summer, and the boys had

1418
01:13:02.640 --> 01:13:05.439
a yard sale and sold most of their parents' possessions.

1419
01:13:05.720 --> 01:13:08.680
Robbie said quote, It's a life with a completely different

1420
01:13:08.680 --> 01:13:11.079
set of values. I don't look at the lack of

1421
01:13:11.119 --> 01:13:13.680
money as being a flaw anymore. Now I look at

1422
01:13:13.680 --> 01:13:16.800
it being an asset because it can make you a

1423
01:13:16.840 --> 01:13:19.600
down to earth person. My girlfriend and I we do

1424
01:13:19.680 --> 01:13:22.479
things like go for walks, things that don't cost any money.

1425
01:13:22.680 --> 01:13:24.920
I mean, I guess it shouldn't have taken me twenty

1426
01:13:25.000 --> 01:13:27.479
years and the death of my mother to understand this.

1427
01:13:28.000 --> 01:13:30.159
But you don't have to spend any money to have fun,

1428
01:13:30.359 --> 01:13:32.640
and you don't have to have money to be worth loving.

1429
01:13:33.239 --> 01:13:36.279
I feel like I have everything again. Another thing I've

1430
01:13:36.319 --> 01:13:38.479
come to accept, and this one's been harder, is that

1431
01:13:38.520 --> 01:13:40.640
the loss will never go away. It's like I used

1432
01:13:40.680 --> 01:13:42.960
to feel. Hey, I should be over this by now.

1433
01:13:43.199 --> 01:13:45.119
I'm not ever going to be over it. I see

1434
01:13:45.119 --> 01:13:47.640
a station wagon drive by that's like Moms, and all

1435
01:13:47.640 --> 01:13:49.720
of a sudden I feel sad. I'll see some woman

1436
01:13:49.720 --> 01:13:51.760
in the supermarket who looks like her for a minute,

1437
01:13:51.800 --> 01:13:54.840
and I get this jolt of sadness. It'll even bring

1438
01:13:54.920 --> 01:13:58.319
tears to my eyes. Anything can trigger a memory. You've

1439
01:13:58.359 --> 01:14:01.159
got to mourn otherwise you'll never move beyond it. So

1440
01:14:01.199 --> 01:14:04.000
I'm mourning. I'm letting myself feel how much I miss Mom.

1441
01:14:04.279 --> 01:14:06.920
I'm not fighting it, and most of the time it's okay.

1442
01:14:07.239 --> 01:14:10.560
I can deal. Maria's sons picked up her remain shortly

1443
01:14:10.600 --> 01:14:13.880
after Rob's conviction and buried her in a cemetery. Her

1444
01:14:13.880 --> 01:14:16.119
headstone is carved with the words of wisdom she had

1445
01:14:16.199 --> 01:14:19.399
left her boys with. Our greatest glory consists not in

1446
01:14:19.479 --> 01:14:22.760
never falling, but in rising every time we fall. In

1447
01:14:22.840 --> 01:14:26.199
January twenty fifteen, after Rob Marshall had served thirty years

1448
01:14:26.239 --> 01:14:29.239
in prison, shockingly, he was up for parole. Before a

1449
01:14:29.279 --> 01:14:32.560
parole hearing, information is gathered by the parole board from

1450
01:14:32.560 --> 01:14:35.640
the family of the inmate and the family of the victim.

1451
01:14:35.840 --> 01:14:38.680
Robbie and Chris Marshall did not want their father released,

1452
01:14:38.720 --> 01:14:41.720
and attended a closed hearing in Trenton, New Jersey, where

1453
01:14:41.760 --> 01:14:45.359
Chris spoke adamantly on the brother's behalf against their father's release.

1454
01:14:45.800 --> 01:14:48.800
Chris Marshall told the Asbury Park Press quote, We're going

1455
01:14:48.840 --> 01:14:50.840
to stand up and defend our mom. We're going to

1456
01:14:50.880 --> 01:14:53.119
be there in person to send a clear message. We

1457
01:14:53.279 --> 01:14:56.319
believe going there in person is the most compelling way

1458
01:14:56.359 --> 01:14:58.680
to make our case. We feel he should stay in

1459
01:14:58.680 --> 01:15:01.920
prison forever. Robbie and I we're going to do everything

1460
01:15:01.960 --> 01:15:05.560
we possibly can to keep my dad behind bars. In

1461
01:15:05.600 --> 01:15:09.520
February twenty fifteen, while awaiting the parole hearing, Robert Oakley Marshall,

1462
01:15:09.560 --> 01:15:13.479
seventy five, died of natural causes at Southwoods State Prison

1463
01:15:13.840 --> 01:15:18.119
in Bridgeton, New Jersey. He suffered from diabetes, hypertension, dementia,

1464
01:15:18.439 --> 01:15:21.800
and had recently had a stroke. Chris told the Associated

1465
01:15:21.840 --> 01:15:25.800
Press quote, there is this vindictive happiness that he's gone now.

1466
01:15:25.880 --> 01:15:27.960
He is no longer a dream on anyone.

1467
01:15:28.479 --> 01:15:31.319
Well, I hope that his dying brought some peace to

1468
01:15:31.560 --> 01:15:34.600
his kids. So it's just so sad that they had

1469
01:15:34.600 --> 01:15:37.199
to live with knowing that their father killed their mother.

1470
01:15:37.560 --> 01:15:38.359
It's just horrible.

1471
01:15:38.560 --> 01:15:41.039
He really put them through so much. Did Yeah, you know,

1472
01:15:41.159 --> 01:15:44.319
hug how do you hug your sons and tell them

1473
01:15:44.319 --> 01:15:46.479
that you're so sorry that their mother died? Would you

1474
01:15:46.560 --> 01:15:49.199
know that you were responsible for her? Dask That's just

1475
01:15:49.880 --> 01:15:51.279
it's so sick and to prave.

1476
01:15:51.560 --> 01:15:52.479
Yeah, it really is.

1477
01:15:53.079 --> 01:15:56.039
In Blind Faith, Joe McGinnis, the author of Fatal Vision

1478
01:15:56.119 --> 01:15:59.000
and other books, wrote, quote, if Rob viewed you as

1479
01:15:59.039 --> 01:16:02.359
a prospect, unless you just had your second coronary or

1480
01:16:02.479 --> 01:16:06.039
was suffering from an obvious malignancy, he viewed you as

1481
01:16:06.039 --> 01:16:08.960
a prospect, he'd come at you with all the social

1482
01:16:08.960 --> 01:16:12.880
grace of a wolverine. Joe McGinnis died in twenty fourteen

1483
01:16:13.119 --> 01:16:16.560
at the age of seventy one. In nineteen ninety, Blind

1484
01:16:16.600 --> 01:16:19.520
Faith was made into a made for TV movie starring

1485
01:16:19.680 --> 01:16:24.600
Robert Urick as Rob Marshall, which was exceptionally generous casting,

1486
01:16:25.359 --> 01:16:28.399
and Joanna Kurns as Maria Marshall.

1487
01:16:28.640 --> 01:16:30.800
I don't know who jan I don't remember Joanna. I

1488
01:16:30.880 --> 01:16:31.680
know Robert Uric.

1489
01:16:31.680 --> 01:16:33.439
Maggie Receiver from Growing Pains.

1490
01:16:34.000 --> 01:16:34.800
That doesn't help you.

1491
01:16:35.199 --> 01:16:36.800
You were not a sitcom guve. I have such a

1492
01:16:36.840 --> 01:16:40.199
big sitcom girl, but the show Growing Pains, you never

1493
01:16:40.239 --> 01:16:40.600
watched it?

1494
01:16:40.680 --> 01:16:41.359
No, not really?

1495
01:16:41.399 --> 01:16:44.600
Okay, Well, she very a very pretty, very very nice lady.

1496
01:16:44.920 --> 01:16:48.000
The movie is like a two part mini series. It's

1497
01:16:48.000 --> 01:16:51.640
available on YouTube. I watched most of it. It's actually

1498
01:16:51.640 --> 01:16:52.159
pretty good.

1499
01:16:52.239 --> 01:16:52.720
Yeah.

1500
01:16:52.760 --> 01:16:56.439
The book Blind Faith, though, compared to Fatal Vision, it

1501
01:16:56.520 --> 01:17:00.600
was just so different. I didn't really love it. And

1502
01:17:01.119 --> 01:17:04.720
Joe mcgainn has changed names, and I apologize if I

1503
01:17:04.760 --> 01:17:06.359
got any names wrong. I think that there were a

1504
01:17:06.399 --> 01:17:09.880
few police officer names like Obrien that I definitely got wrong.

1505
01:17:10.640 --> 01:17:13.239
He didn't change the names of the family or the boys,

1506
01:17:13.279 --> 01:17:15.199
but you would think that they were the ones that

1507
01:17:15.199 --> 01:17:17.399
I would want to protect. Is you know, Maria sons,

1508
01:17:17.399 --> 01:17:19.439
And I know you could easily find their names and

1509
01:17:19.520 --> 01:17:23.039
newspapers and such. But yeah, it was really strange and

1510
01:17:23.119 --> 01:17:25.960
hard to keep track of. And he had a lot

1511
01:17:25.960 --> 01:17:31.840
of conversations, like fictionalized conversations, and I really don't like

1512
01:17:31.920 --> 01:17:35.960
that when authors take those liberties, and those conversations were

1513
01:17:36.000 --> 01:17:40.359
like really trite, and it just it didn't seem like

1514
01:17:40.800 --> 01:17:44.079
his best writing, I guess. But it was a bestseller,

1515
01:17:44.079 --> 01:17:45.640
and you know, a lot of people loved it that.

1516
01:17:45.680 --> 01:17:48.199
It was an interesting. Just my opinion, that's super interesting

1517
01:17:48.239 --> 01:17:49.119
story for sure.

1518
01:17:49.359 --> 01:17:53.399
Yeah. A really interesting side note that I found Joanna Kerns,

1519
01:17:53.439 --> 01:17:56.680
who played Maria in the movie, befriended the Marshall boys

1520
01:17:56.760 --> 01:17:59.520
like she really loved all of them. Because you didn't

1521
01:17:59.560 --> 01:18:01.239
watch Growing Pains, You're not going to know what I'm

1522
01:18:01.279 --> 01:18:05.079
talking about. But an actress named Tracy Gold played Joanna's

1523
01:18:05.279 --> 01:18:11.720
daughter on Growing Pains, and she introduced Joanna introduced Tracy

1524
01:18:11.800 --> 01:18:15.920
Gold to Robbie and they have been married for like

1525
01:18:16.039 --> 01:18:18.159
years and years and years and they have four sons together.

1526
01:18:18.319 --> 01:18:22.479
Oh wow, Yeah, and it seems like Chris is doing well.

1527
01:18:22.960 --> 01:18:25.920
I think he's married with children. The boys now were

1528
01:18:25.960 --> 01:18:28.760
like fifty five to sixty, so you know, a lot

1529
01:18:28.760 --> 01:18:31.199
of time has passed, but it seems like, you know,

1530
01:18:31.239 --> 01:18:33.560
they did okay. And I'm not sure if they have

1531
01:18:33.640 --> 01:18:37.199
a relationship with John. I think that they do, but

1532
01:18:37.479 --> 01:18:40.960
they might not. They probably have rules where they just

1533
01:18:40.960 --> 01:18:43.039
don't talk about their dad anymore. I hope they. I

1534
01:18:43.079 --> 01:18:44.000
hope they have a relationship.

1535
01:18:44.000 --> 01:18:46.319
Do you think Rob or John ever came around to

1536
01:18:46.479 --> 01:18:47.920
thinking that his dad was guilty or.

1537
01:18:47.960 --> 01:18:50.800
No, because like at the well, you know, I guess

1538
01:18:50.840 --> 01:18:53.960
I don't really know. But remember like he was at

1539
01:18:53.960 --> 01:18:56.840
the parole hearing, and you know, he was for his dads.

1540
01:18:56.880 --> 01:18:59.800
So and maybe after his dad passed he was able

1541
01:18:59.800 --> 01:19:02.239
to have, you know, some distance and be able to

1542
01:19:02.399 --> 01:19:06.039
you know, look at it differently. Rest in peace, Maria Marshall.

1543
01:19:06.119 --> 01:19:08.199
It's so I'm so sorry that she didn't get to

1544
01:19:08.239 --> 01:19:17.079
see her, you know, her lovely boys girls. So I

1545
01:19:17.159 --> 01:19:20.800
found this article this week that made me laugh. It

1546
01:19:21.000 --> 01:19:23.960
said that the gist of it was, if you sleep

1547
01:19:24.039 --> 01:19:27.960
with socks on, you might sleep longer and better. And

1548
01:19:28.039 --> 01:19:30.319
to me, if you're sleeping with socks and there's just

1549
01:19:30.319 --> 01:19:31.079
something wrong with you.

1550
01:19:31.119 --> 01:19:32.640
I thought you were gonna say, if you sleep with

1551
01:19:32.680 --> 01:19:34.920
socks on, you are probably a psychophee.

1552
01:19:35.199 --> 01:19:35.399
Right.

1553
01:19:35.800 --> 01:19:39.359
Well, people that I love dearly, not you, who I

1554
01:19:39.399 --> 01:19:42.800
do love dearly, sleep with socks and so I try

1555
01:19:42.880 --> 01:19:44.039
not to make that judgment.

1556
01:19:44.680 --> 01:19:47.279
But I have to know.

1557
01:19:47.399 --> 01:19:51.800
You know this person pretty well too. But some people

1558
01:19:51.840 --> 01:19:54.000
get really cold. So I understand that, like some I

1559
01:19:54.119 --> 01:19:56.359
have put socks on and gone to bed when I've

1560
01:19:56.399 --> 01:19:58.680
been really cold. But I took one for the team

1561
01:19:59.119 --> 01:20:01.800
for all of you. I decided the other night that

1562
01:20:01.880 --> 01:20:04.319
I was gonna wear socks to bed to see if

1563
01:20:04.359 --> 01:20:06.399
I slept better. Oh yeah, and longer.

1564
01:20:06.600 --> 01:20:07.199
How did that go?

1565
01:20:07.359 --> 01:20:10.199
It didn't go well. No, So, like I said at

1566
01:20:10.199 --> 01:20:12.399
the beginning of the episode, I haven't been sleeping really

1567
01:20:12.399 --> 01:20:15.119
great this week, so that could have been part of it.

1568
01:20:15.199 --> 01:20:19.680
But my very unscientific research tells me that, no, go

1569
01:20:19.720 --> 01:20:22.199
with your gut if you don't think you're gonna sleep

1570
01:20:22.239 --> 01:20:24.920
better with socks. But we still have the flannel sheets

1571
01:20:24.960 --> 01:20:27.720
on our bed or weather has been really wacky. Yeah,

1572
01:20:28.079 --> 01:20:31.319
so maybe if you know I had not winter sheets

1573
01:20:31.359 --> 01:20:33.560
on the bed, maybe it would be more cozy. I

1574
01:20:33.600 --> 01:20:34.520
will try it again.

1575
01:20:35.640 --> 01:20:37.399
Yeah, I think you need to try it, like, you know,

1576
01:20:37.720 --> 01:20:40.279
if you want to be truly scientific about it, you

1577
01:20:40.279 --> 01:20:43.079
have to try it like twenty times with socks and

1578
01:20:43.159 --> 01:20:46.720
twenty times without socks, and document each time, write down

1579
01:20:46.760 --> 01:20:47.439
your find dings.

1580
01:20:47.479 --> 01:20:49.239
Well, it's funny. I have an Apple Watch and I

1581
01:20:49.279 --> 01:20:52.119
never wear it to bed, but that night it was like,

1582
01:20:52.479 --> 01:20:54.119
I don't know where were wearing apple Watch to bed.

1583
01:20:54.199 --> 01:20:56.520
I'm gonna be scientific, but I just I could not

1584
01:20:56.600 --> 01:20:58.560
fall asleep that night, and I think it was just,

1585
01:20:59.079 --> 01:21:00.840
you know, I don't know, my brain just didn't want

1586
01:21:00.840 --> 01:21:02.439
to shut down. I don't think it was I don't

1587
01:21:02.439 --> 01:21:04.399
think it had anything to do with the socks, so

1588
01:21:04.439 --> 01:21:07.239
I will try it again. But yeah, if you're out

1589
01:21:07.239 --> 01:21:09.840
there and you're having a hard time sleeping, then you know,

1590
01:21:10.199 --> 01:21:11.960
try to drive some socks.

1591
01:21:12.479 --> 01:21:13.920
I don't know. I don't think I'm going to try it.

1592
01:21:13.960 --> 01:21:15.840
I'll wait. I'll wait to hear the results of your

1593
01:21:15.880 --> 01:21:18.119
further experimentation.

1594
01:21:17.479 --> 01:21:19.399
Before I even will try it.

1595
01:21:19.760 --> 01:21:22.079
I sleep pretty well without my socks on. I can't

1596
01:21:22.359 --> 01:21:22.800
really do.

1597
01:21:23.319 --> 01:21:25.279
We talked about the shock t mat I think the

1598
01:21:25.399 --> 01:21:29.000
last episode. But you used to kind of have not insomnia,

1599
01:21:29.079 --> 01:21:31.399
but maybe once every week, once a week or every

1600
01:21:31.399 --> 01:21:33.600
two weeks, you would get up and you know, go

1601
01:21:33.680 --> 01:21:36.239
sleep in a different room or something. But you really

1602
01:21:36.239 --> 01:21:37.239
haven't done that in a long time.

1603
01:21:37.279 --> 01:21:39.000
I still go through pierore every once in a while,

1604
01:21:39.039 --> 01:21:40.920
I go through a period where I have trouble sleeping,

1605
01:21:40.960 --> 01:21:42.800
but in general now I sleep really well.

1606
01:21:42.920 --> 01:21:45.359
So yeah, I'm happy for you. But it's sometimes it's

1607
01:21:45.359 --> 01:21:48.800
a little like, wow, really, he really can't sleep. The

1608
01:21:48.880 --> 01:21:51.840
last night when we were in padding, Cosmo, Sorry for

1609
01:21:51.880 --> 01:21:56.560
the cat cat talk, but Cosmo laid down between us

1610
01:21:56.680 --> 01:22:00.119
and yeah, right in your ear. It's really funny, like

1611
01:22:00.159 --> 01:22:02.840
he wanted you to wake up and you didn't botherige.

1612
01:22:02.840 --> 01:22:04.920
I was really surprised you don't remember that at all.

1613
01:22:05.359 --> 01:22:09.840
We have gotten some exceptionally kind, sweet, generous reviews recently,

1614
01:22:09.960 --> 01:22:12.039
so thank you so much. If you have been one

1615
01:22:12.079 --> 01:22:14.439
of those people that have sent those reviews, it means

1616
01:22:14.439 --> 01:22:15.039
so much to us.

1617
01:22:15.159 --> 01:22:16.800
Yeah, it really does. Thank you very much.

1618
01:22:17.079 --> 01:22:21.039
Please rate, review, follow and subscribe, and find us on YouTube,

1619
01:22:21.159 --> 01:22:23.399
follow us on social media, or send us an email

1620
01:22:23.439 --> 01:22:27.119
at Lovemarykill at gmail dot com, and please consider supporting

1621
01:22:27.239 --> 01:22:30.560
us on Patreon dot com slash love Marykill. We only

1622
01:22:30.600 --> 01:22:32.880
have one tier for five dollars a month for early

1623
01:22:33.000 --> 01:22:38.199
ad free episodes and a monthly bonus episode until next time.

1624
01:22:38.399 --> 01:23:15.720
Don't kill your wife and don't kill your husband.

1625
01:23:25.279 --> 01:23:27.680
Hi, I'm Tina and I'm rich. And if there's one

1626
01:23:27.680 --> 01:23:33.319
thing we've learned, and over twenty days.

1627
01:23:31.479 --> 01:23:33.560
We've all e Ben made twenty days.

1628
01:23:34.479 --> 01:23:39.520
Excuse me, listeners, this is Tina. I'm out. I quit.

1629
01:23:40.119 --> 01:23:44.800
I refuse to work under these horrible circumstances any longer.

1630
01:23:44.960 --> 01:23:49.439
My husband is mean and abusive and not appreciative. I

1631
01:23:49.439 --> 01:23:52.520
will be eating the rest of the butterscotch squares by

1632
01:23:52.560 --> 01:23:55.880
myself in the closet. With the door locked. Good Night,