July 7, 2025

Michelle and Jason Young - Part 1

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When 29-year-old Michelle Young was found dead in her Raleigh, North Carolina home, the discovery sent shockwaves through her family, her circle of friends, and the community. Michelle was married, the mother of a toddler, and expecting her second child. She was beautiful, bright, and driven; by all accounts, a woman with so much ahead of her. Michelle’s brutal murder baffled the quiet suburban neighborhood and prompted a frustrating investigation that would grow increasingly complicated by the lack of cooperation from Michelle’s husband. Her marriage to 32-year-old Jason Young had been troubled from the beginning, but at the time of her death, he was reportedly hundreds of miles away on a business trip. As detectives began piecing together the timeline, unsettling questions began to surface. Who would do this to a young mother in her own home? Could it have been a random act of violence, or was the truth far closer to home? The investigation uncovered complicated relationships, emotional wounds, and evidence that raised more questions than answers. In this episode, we explore the case that shook Raleigh and pushed the justice system to its limits before any sense of resolution was found.

Listen to part 2 today by joining us on Patreon

Today's snacks: Greek yogurt with granola, honey, cinnamon and chocolate chips, and Reese's Peanut Butter Pie miniature cups

Sources:

WEBVTT

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Hi, I'm Tina and I'm Rich. And if there's one

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thing we've learned in over twenty years of marriage.

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It's that some days you'll feel like killing your wife.

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And some days you'll feel like killing your husband.

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Welcome to love, Mary Kill, Good morning, Rich, Good morning Tina.

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How are you.

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I'm doing good?

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Are you?

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I'm pretty good. One of our dear listeners, Dianna and Denmark,

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messaged me last night and asked if you could read

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her essentially bedtime stories because she really likes your voice.

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She pose the idea of maybe having a separate podcast

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of you reading a book to her. Oh and what

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did you say? In response to that?

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I said no, you said.

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Absolutely not, which wasn't very nice because Dianna is lovely.

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Dania Deanna is lovely. But yeah, I just I don't know.

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I feel like I would feel really weird doing that.

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I feel like if I did that, I would be

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reading and I would try to make my voice sound

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like relaxing, and that I would sound creepy.

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I didn't give you just talk like you talk normally

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that I've said before. Your voice was really one of

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the first things that caught my attention, which sounds so crazy,

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but you do have like a nice measured way of talking.

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I need to point out Deanna did not want me

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to read the story.

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Yeah, how did that make you feel?

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I totally understand, totally understand, no problem with that whatsoever.

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But a lot of listeners have listened to all the

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episodes and they have said, like, you know, could you guys,

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what more can you give me? And I did think, well,

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maybe we could have you read like Huckleberry Finn or

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something like that, but you're not interested.

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In I don't know. If people really wanted it, I

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would could do it. I guess it wouldn't be too

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much work. It would just be reading, right right. Yeah,

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I'll consider it.

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So I am going to give you a moment of vulnerability.

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I am embarrassed to admit this, but I have been

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obsessed with Love Island.

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I thought that it was going to be Love Island.

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So it's a special tree for listeners today because you've

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been traveling a lot, so I've been able to spend

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a little more time devoting myself to reality TV. Today's episode,

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we're just going to talk about the first ten episodes

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of Love Island, and then Part two will be the next.

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And I'm sure people will love that. That sounds great.

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I can't wait.

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So if you are also listening to Love Island and

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you're over the age of thirty five, let me know,

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because it makes me feel super creepy. But I'm also

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really intrigued.

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It seems like Love Island. I haven't watched it, but

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it seems like a phenomenon. Like everywhere I go on

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social media and read it or Blue Sky or whatever,

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people are talking about it, So it must be a big.

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It's pretty compelling. And the kids on the show, they're

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not kids. The people on the show are like our

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kids age. So it just seems you know. So if

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I have some words slipping out that are like mid

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or I can't even think of any other words, But

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it's because I've been influenced by a bunch of twenty somethings.

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Good to know.

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So I've been making an effort to eat healthier. You

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don't like where this is going, do you?

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Oh?

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Am I getting broccoli listeners.

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This could possibly be the episode where Rich quits and

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the last song Celery or something.

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Is it?

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No, but you did do that to me on an episode.

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I brought you something that I've been enjoying eating, and

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I feel kind of bad because I'm making you eat

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something that I really like that I don't think you like.

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But I've been trying to make you try it. Do

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you know where I'm going?

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I don't.

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I made you some Greek yogurt with honey and cinnamon.

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And what else did I put in? I put in't

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usually I put blueberries in it, but I put chocolate

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chips in it for you because I thought maybe you

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would like it a little more. But I like it

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so much. It's just really good. You can put in

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a bunch of different things. You could put in peanut

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butter or natella.

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Or I'll try to keep an open mind. Okay, I

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don't like Greek yogurt, but I like all the other

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things that you put.

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So if you put the honey and it's non fat

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Greek yogurt, and then you just add in whatever you want.

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And I make homemade granola. I love my homemade granola,

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so I mixed that into Okay, okay, so you're willing

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to try it, I am. Okay. Hang in what did

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you think you were a good boy and you took

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two big bites?

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Well, it wasn't bad. But I feel like the only

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reason it wasn't bad is because you put enough stuff

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in there to completely overpower the Greek yogurt. So I

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really didn't get the like much of a sense of

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the Greek yogurt. I just I don't know what I

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like regular yogurt, regular yogurt, but yogurt that is like

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has sugar and fruit and you'll play, yeah, you'll play,

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but Greek yoga.

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Back in the day, we used to eat you'll play

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yogurt and think we were eating snows.

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But it was it was good.

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Yeah, really, okay, it was good.

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But like I said, I feel like you might as

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well not have had the Greek yogurt in there. I

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could have.

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No, there's a ton of Greek yogurt in there.

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Yeah, but I didn't really taste it.

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Well, I'm very proud of you. A good job.

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Thank you.

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I've also added key for to our diet recently, which

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is like a drinkable yogurt, and you really like that

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You've taken to that.

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Yeah, it's a little bit sour, but it's sour in

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a different way than Greek yogurt.

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Is.

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I can't really explain it, but it's uh yeah, I

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don't mind it.

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We're just trying to get some healthy bacteria into our guts. Well,

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enough about that. Well, today I'm going to tell you

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the story of Michelle and Jason Young, and it was

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recommended to us by Chelsea and Tracy. Before we get

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to the case, I just want to ask you, what

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do you think the worst anniversary present that you have

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given or received?

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Is?

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Oh? I we don't.

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Always give each other in if we don't.

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And I don't always remember what I've given or received either,

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So I'm not going to be very good at this.

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I think normally we just go out to dinner and celebrate.

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But if it's been You've gotten me a couple of

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nice pieces of jewelry.

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Yeah, yeah, I can't think of anything that I've gotten

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you that's been awful. That time I got you the

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vacuum cleaner.

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That was probably he did not do that. We'll get

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to it later. But the gift that Jason gave Michelle

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for their third wedding anniversary was not no, not a

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good gift. On November third, two thousand and six, Jason

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Young called his sister in law, Meredith Fisher, waking up

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from a sound sleep. It was highly unusual for him

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to call her, but this was the second time in

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a week. Jason thirty two, worked in sales but lived

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life like a frat boy, going out at night and

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tailgating on weekends for North Carolina State wolf Pack games,

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which resulted in frequent arguments with his wife and Meredith's sister,

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twenty nine year old Michelle Young. Michelle was pregnant with

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the couple's second child, a boy they planned to name Rylan.

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Jason was thrilled to be having a son to share

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his love of the outdoors and sports. Michelle and Jason

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were already parents to an adorable two year old daughter, Cassidy.

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It was too early for Meredith to take his call.

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She worked nights as a restaurant manager and had been

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out with friends until early in the morning the previous night.

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She rolled over and went act to sleep. She'd deal

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with Jason later. She was sure he was calling to

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drag her into another of his and Michelle's disagreements. Two

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days earlier, Michelle and Jason had a big fight after

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he angrily threw the TV remote at her. Michelle was

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tired of the constant bickering and had reached her breaking point.

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She called Meredith to vent quote, I'm done. I just

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can't do this anymore. Jason overheard the heated call. At

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November second, around nine pm, on his way out of

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town for business. Jason called his sister in law to

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tell her that Michelle hadn't told her the whole story.

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He was trying to win her over to his side

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in a marital dispute. In addition to managing the restaurant,

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Meredith had recently graduated from college and was in the

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unique position to help her sister and brother in law

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with their relationship. Her degree was in psychology, and she

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planned to return to school soon for a master's degree

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in marriage counseling and social work, so she agreed to

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act as a stand in marriage counselor for the couple.

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A bad idea for altitude that sounds like idea. The

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previous week, they'd had a marathon, four hour session in

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which they thought about their sex life. Jason wanted more

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sex and Michelle wanted more romance. When Meredith woke up

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around noon, she listened to Jason's voicemail. He needed a favor.

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He asked her to go to his house and get

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some papers off the printer that he didn't want Michelle

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to see listening to a coach purse he was planning

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to bid on for Michelle for their third anniversary.

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From eBay, that doesn't sound like a bad anniversary gift.

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No, it's not. The gift for your third anniversary is leathers. Okay,

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we've never done that, No, really have no. I think

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that every year for us it should be Diamond's just kidding.

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A thoughtful gift, Meredith thought if he'd follow it through

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earlier as she drove to her sister's house, but their

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anniversary had been three weeks before on October tenth. As

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she drove the fifteen minutes to her sister's house at

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five to one zero eight birch Leaf Drive, located in

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the outskirts of Raleigh, she grew more irritated with each mile.

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Her inconsiderate, self involved brother in law was infringing upon

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her time again. When Meredith arrived at the house at

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around one fifteen, things instantly seemed off. The front lights

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were still on, Michele's Lexus SUV was still at home,

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and the back gate was wide open. It was usually

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closed so the dog couldn't get out. Michelle should have

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been at work. Meredith had forgotten her key to the house,

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but was able to wedge the garage door up from

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the bottom. As she entered the kitchen from the garage,

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she shouted out to Michelle in cassidy, but the house

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was eerily silent, except for the whimpering of the family's

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black laugh mister Garrison. Meredith's sense of dread grew as

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she sprinted up the stairs. She was confused when she

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saw tiny red footprints scattered in the carpet and bathroom.

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When Meredith entered the primary bedroom, she was shocked and

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horrified by what she saw. The room was a wash

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and rat the walls, the bed, the carpet, even the ceiling.

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Michelle's lifeless body lay face down on the blood soaked carpet.

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Just as she reached for the phone, she noticed a

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rustling under the comforter on the bed. Cassidy her beautiful kniece.

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She lunged for her, baring her hat in her hair,

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kissing her and hugging her tightly. Is she called nine

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one one, poor little girl. I can't imagine what she witnessed. Oh,

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but I'm so glad that she was Okay, Yeah, she

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was okay. While Meredith was on the call with nine

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one one, Cassidy told her that mommy has booboos everywhere.

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The nine one one operator asked Meredith to attempt CPR.

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She knew it was too late. Michelle was already cold

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and stiff. We're going to play most of the call,

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and I know that they can be triggering for some people.

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It's about five minutes if you want to fast forward.

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What address are you at, ma'am?

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Bert Lee fifty one? Wait, Persley Broad.

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Can your phone number? Oh my god, ma'am, what's your

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phone number? You tell me exactly what happened.

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I think my sister's dead.

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Oy, tell me what happened?

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00:10:59.600 --> 00:11:00.799
Man, I have no idea.

237
00:11:01.200 --> 00:11:03.799
Oh my god. All right, so almost with me. Please.

238
00:11:04.639 --> 00:11:05.320
What's your name?

239
00:11:05.600 --> 00:11:06.000
Meredith?

240
00:11:06.679 --> 00:11:07.159
Meredith?

241
00:11:07.360 --> 00:11:08.759
And this is a young address?

242
00:11:09.080 --> 00:11:11.519
Oh my god, Meredith, listen to me. Please?

243
00:11:11.799 --> 00:11:12.240
Yeah.

244
00:11:12.279 --> 00:11:13.159
Are you with the patient?

245
00:11:13.240 --> 00:11:13.399
Now?

246
00:11:13.799 --> 00:11:14.320
Ye have a son?

247
00:11:14.440 --> 00:11:14.960
Her daughter?

248
00:11:15.960 --> 00:11:16.879
How old is the patient?

249
00:11:17.000 --> 00:11:17.960
And there's blood everywhere?

250
00:11:18.000 --> 00:11:20.000
She's twenty nine, twenty eight?

251
00:11:20.200 --> 00:11:21.240
Should I try to move her?

252
00:11:21.840 --> 00:11:23.799
Listen to me, ma'am. I'm gonna tell you what to

253
00:11:23.840 --> 00:11:25.720
do that you need to calm down so we can

254
00:11:25.759 --> 00:11:27.879
help her. You said, this blood everywhere?

255
00:11:27.960 --> 00:11:28.279
Yes?

256
00:11:28.320 --> 00:11:29.440
All right? Is she conscious?

257
00:11:29.600 --> 00:11:31.720
No? I don't think so. Should I try to help her?

258
00:11:31.879 --> 00:11:34.399
Listen to me, ma'am, I'm listening. Is she breathing?

259
00:11:34.960 --> 00:11:35.799
I don't think so.

260
00:11:36.360 --> 00:11:38.960
Have you jacked Michelle?

261
00:11:40.919 --> 00:11:41.759
She's cold?

262
00:11:42.039 --> 00:11:44.799
Okay? Listen to me. Did you see what happened?

263
00:11:45.080 --> 00:11:48.799
I don't know, Kathy kmire, sweetie, I'm here with her daughter.

264
00:11:52.279 --> 00:11:55.279
There's like blood footprints all over the house. I do

265
00:11:55.399 --> 00:11:57.120
want to like her daughter's b footprints.

266
00:11:57.200 --> 00:11:58.919
Okay, to listen to me. What's your first name?

267
00:11:59.200 --> 00:11:59.639
Meredith?

268
00:12:01.639 --> 00:12:02.720
Did you see what happened?

269
00:12:03.559 --> 00:12:05.600
I just came here on a fluke. I usually, you know,

270
00:12:05.639 --> 00:12:06.799
don't come here during the day.

271
00:12:07.039 --> 00:12:07.360
Okay.

272
00:12:07.440 --> 00:12:09.399
She shouldn't be home, she should be at work, like.

273
00:12:09.600 --> 00:12:14.720
Okay, listen to me. Yes, but did you say can

274
00:12:14.759 --> 00:12:17.279
you tell me why why she looks looks like she's dead?

275
00:12:17.480 --> 00:12:19.240
I don't know. I don't I have no idea.

276
00:12:19.279 --> 00:12:23.639
There's over Did you say she's cold? Okay?

277
00:12:23.919 --> 00:12:31.960
Yes, okay?

278
00:12:32.240 --> 00:12:32.399
Yes?

279
00:12:33.519 --> 00:12:36.120
Why did you what happened to mammy? Did you fall?

280
00:12:40.559 --> 00:12:47.600
What do you think? She's beyond any help?

281
00:12:48.519 --> 00:12:48.960
I don't know.

282
00:12:49.120 --> 00:12:52.360
Honestly, you don't know. All right, I'm normally very good

283
00:12:52.159 --> 00:12:54.440
on we're gonna tell you what to do. Then. Okay,

284
00:12:55.000 --> 00:12:57.720
are you right by her now? I'm keeping her daughter

285
00:12:57.759 --> 00:12:59.960
out of the al so you're not with her.

286
00:13:00.440 --> 00:13:01.960
I'm right out by the bedroom.

287
00:13:02.240 --> 00:13:04.639
Can you get her daughter security? Can can you carry

288
00:13:04.679 --> 00:13:05.720
the phone into where she's at?

289
00:13:06.000 --> 00:13:06.200
Yes?

290
00:13:06.399 --> 00:13:07.799
All right? Can you secure her daughter?

291
00:13:08.519 --> 00:13:12.679
Kathy, sweetie? Can you stay in your room for two seconds? Okay? Okay, okay?

292
00:13:12.840 --> 00:13:21.240
Can you close your door for two second? Zombie? Right back? Okay, okay, okay,

293
00:13:21.720 --> 00:13:22.759
may okay.

294
00:13:22.519 --> 00:13:25.159
Yes, okay, you got a cord of s phone?

295
00:13:25.279 --> 00:13:27.960
Yeah, all right, say right there, sweetie, Okay, all right?

296
00:13:28.039 --> 00:13:29.960
Isn't Is she laying on her back?

297
00:13:30.159 --> 00:13:31.360
No, she's laying on her stomach.

298
00:13:31.480 --> 00:13:34.039
She's on her stomach. She's face down, yes, all right?

299
00:13:34.080 --> 00:13:38.200
Can you can you get her on her back? Okay?

300
00:13:40.320 --> 00:13:46.279
Oh my god, sure, I don't think so. She's so heavy.

301
00:13:46.679 --> 00:13:47.879
I see if you can get her on her back?

302
00:13:47.960 --> 00:13:51.440
I really think she said pardon. I really think she's

303
00:13:51.480 --> 00:13:54.159
said okay, are you certain?

304
00:13:54.799 --> 00:13:57.639
Hang like Kathy, sweet can you saw in your room?

305
00:13:57.960 --> 00:13:58.159
Say?

306
00:14:01.519 --> 00:14:04.080
I'm pretty sure you are. I don't know.

307
00:14:04.200 --> 00:14:06.919
I'm okay, we need to make sure, okay, and you

308
00:14:06.919 --> 00:14:09.679
get her on her back for me she's kind.

309
00:14:09.480 --> 00:14:12.000
Of twisted in a way that I can't do that.

310
00:14:12.320 --> 00:14:15.320
You can't roll her over, not easily. You're going to

311
00:14:15.360 --> 00:14:16.440
try hang on me.

312
00:14:16.480 --> 00:14:18.240
I'm trying to see if I can get her pulse.

313
00:14:20.799 --> 00:14:22.399
We got to try to do CPR for we get

314
00:14:22.440 --> 00:14:27.080
her on her back. There so cold, she's cold? Okay,

315
00:14:27.279 --> 00:14:27.600
all right?

316
00:14:27.879 --> 00:14:28.960
He stiff?

317
00:14:29.080 --> 00:14:33.360
Okay, then don't try. If she's cold, then, oh my god,

318
00:14:33.399 --> 00:14:36.720
I probably nothing. She can do anything, all right. Try

319
00:14:36.759 --> 00:14:38.799
not to touch anything more than you did. Was anything

320
00:14:38.879 --> 00:14:42.000
out of place or unusual when you came in this place?

321
00:14:42.080 --> 00:14:44.000
Does not look like what it normally looks like.

322
00:14:44.600 --> 00:14:48.559
Okay, okay, all right, try not to touch anything else.

323
00:14:48.600 --> 00:14:50.039
Okay, I just moved a pillow.

324
00:14:51.519 --> 00:14:56.279
Just leave you everything exactly where it is then, okay, okay,

325
00:14:56.279 --> 00:15:00.919
do you see anything else? You see any it looks unusual?

326
00:15:02.039 --> 00:15:04.480
Cassidy, Was anybody here? The dog was freaking out when

327
00:15:04.480 --> 00:15:06.919
I got here. Was anybody here?

328
00:15:07.000 --> 00:15:11.879
SETI all right, Meredith, all right, I'm gonna get the

329
00:15:11.919 --> 00:15:13.799
sheriff's former to pick up on the line with us.

330
00:15:13.879 --> 00:15:14.120
Okay.

331
00:15:14.440 --> 00:15:15.720
They're going to need to talk to you about what

332
00:15:15.759 --> 00:15:19.039
you're seeing, Okay, Okay, I'm gonna brief them on what's happened?

333
00:15:19.120 --> 00:15:21.399
And you just down the line. What's your last name, Meredith?

334
00:15:21.600 --> 00:15:23.279
Sure, her last name is Young.

335
00:15:23.440 --> 00:15:24.440
Are you a relative?

336
00:15:24.559 --> 00:15:25.519
I'm her only sister.

337
00:15:25.759 --> 00:15:28.279
Okay, all right, married, stay with me just a minute

338
00:15:28.279 --> 00:15:28.519
a time.

339
00:15:30.440 --> 00:15:33.480
Oh boy, that's harrowing hearing that little girl in the background.

340
00:15:33.559 --> 00:15:34.799
That's so just heartbreaking.

341
00:15:35.000 --> 00:15:36.840
So I've listened to the nine one one call a

342
00:15:36.840 --> 00:15:38.440
couple of times, but this is the first time I

343
00:15:38.440 --> 00:15:41.000
ever heard of through headphones. So I don't know if

344
00:15:41.039 --> 00:15:43.840
you're just listening like on a different device, not with

345
00:15:44.000 --> 00:15:46.519
earbuds or you know, headphones, and you'd be able to

346
00:15:46.559 --> 00:15:50.360
hear Cassidy, but breaking, Yeah, I mean, what a sweet

347
00:15:50.360 --> 00:15:52.759
little girl. And at one point she says, we need

348
00:15:52.799 --> 00:15:55.480
to get a washcloth so we can clean mommy. And

349
00:15:55.559 --> 00:15:58.559
she's two, I think she's two years and seven months.

350
00:15:58.919 --> 00:16:01.240
And she's just very cocious, very verbal.

351
00:16:01.559 --> 00:16:01.799
Huh.

352
00:16:01.840 --> 00:16:05.039
I don't think that's normal for a child that young

353
00:16:05.159 --> 00:16:08.600
to be stringing together full sentences. But she really kind

354
00:16:08.600 --> 00:16:11.039
of got what was happening. A lot of people have

355
00:16:11.320 --> 00:16:14.320
pointed out that Marredith this behavior on the call is

356
00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:17.360
a little suspicious, like she's too calm, But I think

357
00:16:17.440 --> 00:16:20.440
that's a woman who, in my opinion, is in shock. Yeah,

358
00:16:20.480 --> 00:16:23.440
and she's trying to stay calm, precacity. What do you think?

359
00:16:23.679 --> 00:16:26.320
Yeah, I thought the same thing. I didn't find her

360
00:16:27.200 --> 00:16:30.559
behavior the way she spoke to be suspicious at all.

361
00:16:30.600 --> 00:16:32.120
I guess to me, it just seemed like she was

362
00:16:32.159 --> 00:16:34.639
freaked out and didn't know how to handle it.

363
00:16:34.919 --> 00:16:37.360
I think that I would act similarly. I think you

364
00:16:37.519 --> 00:16:40.919
don't know what to say and literally if you're in shock,

365
00:16:41.000 --> 00:16:43.919
Like she was stringing words together, but I don't think

366
00:16:43.960 --> 00:16:48.240
she was really processing, processing and processing what was happening.

367
00:16:48.320 --> 00:16:48.679
Yeah.

368
00:16:48.759 --> 00:16:52.759
I mean, it's just brutal and so unexpected, and it's

369
00:16:52.840 --> 00:16:56.360
really heartbreaking and said right. Michelle Marie Fisher was born

370
00:16:56.519 --> 00:17:00.279
on February seventeenth, nineteen seventy seven, and say the New

371
00:17:00.360 --> 00:17:04.200
York to Linda and Allan Fisher. Sayville, once named the

372
00:17:04.240 --> 00:17:07.599
friendliest town in America, sits halfway between New York City

373
00:17:07.640 --> 00:17:10.839
and the Hamptons. Michelle's younger sister, Meredith, was born three

374
00:17:10.920 --> 00:17:14.240
years later. Their father, Allan, worked as a car salesman,

375
00:17:14.400 --> 00:17:16.920
while their mother, Linda, was a middle school math teacher

376
00:17:16.960 --> 00:17:20.200
and cheerleading coach, a role that inspired both Michelle and

377
00:17:20.240 --> 00:17:23.599
Meredith to pursue cheerleading. In her senior year of high school,

378
00:17:23.640 --> 00:17:26.880
Michell and her team won the Long Island Cheerleading Championship.

379
00:17:27.119 --> 00:17:30.720
In nineteen ninety six, Michelle performed during the opening ceremonies

380
00:17:30.720 --> 00:17:32.119
at the Atlanta Olympics.

381
00:17:32.160 --> 00:17:32.839
That's pretty cool.

382
00:17:32.960 --> 00:17:36.960
Yeah. Michelle was not only well liked, but also excelled academically.

383
00:17:37.240 --> 00:17:40.599
She became fluent in Russian and French and was a

384
00:17:40.599 --> 00:17:44.160
member of the National Honor Society. The Fisher's marriage had

385
00:17:44.200 --> 00:17:46.720
been in decline for years. They had been in and

386
00:17:46.759 --> 00:17:50.160
out of marriage counseling for thirteen years before finally divorcing

387
00:17:50.200 --> 00:17:53.599
in nineteen ninety five when he married his second wife, June.

388
00:17:53.680 --> 00:17:58.279
Shortly afterward, his relationship with Michelle became strained. Michelle referred

389
00:17:58.279 --> 00:18:01.839
to June as the evils stuff monster. June didn't care

390
00:18:01.920 --> 00:18:05.119
much for Michelle either. She even forbade her from entering

391
00:18:05.160 --> 00:18:09.519
her house, putting Allan in an uncomfortable position. Alan rarely

392
00:18:09.559 --> 00:18:12.079
saw Michelle, and she was deeply hurt by what she

393
00:18:12.160 --> 00:18:16.160
saw as her father choosing his new wife over her. Ironically,

394
00:18:16.359 --> 00:18:20.160
years later, Alan and Jason grew close. Jason was welcomed

395
00:18:20.160 --> 00:18:22.200
into their home while Michelle was not.

396
00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:23.279
It's kind of crazy.

397
00:18:23.400 --> 00:18:23.720
Yeah.

398
00:18:23.880 --> 00:18:26.839
Michelle attended North Carolina State, where she earned both an

399
00:18:26.920 --> 00:18:30.799
undergraduate and master's degree in accounting. She was a cheerleader

400
00:18:30.839 --> 00:18:33.880
and member of the Alpha Delta High sorority, where she

401
00:18:33.920 --> 00:18:37.519
met her best friend and roommate, Shelley, who later said quote,

402
00:18:37.720 --> 00:18:41.000
Michelle was beautiful, she was intelligent, she was determined. She

403
00:18:41.119 --> 00:18:44.079
was completely Type A, so much that we called her

404
00:18:44.200 --> 00:18:47.559
the camp director. Michelle formed a close bond with three

405
00:18:47.599 --> 00:18:50.839
of her sorority sisters. They named their friend group the

406
00:18:50.960 --> 00:18:55.079
mc Broad's. The group consisted of Michelle, Susan, Lisa, and

407
00:18:55.359 --> 00:18:59.319
another Michelle. After college, they all dispersed to different locations,

408
00:18:59.319 --> 00:19:02.200
but they remained close and got together several times a year.

409
00:19:02.599 --> 00:19:05.160
We were talking about the term broads the other day

410
00:19:05.240 --> 00:19:08.200
as a term for women. It's it's such a strange.

411
00:19:08.920 --> 00:19:09.960
It's a strange word.

412
00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:13.640
My grandpa used to call women broads and I never

413
00:19:13.880 --> 00:19:16.359
liked it. I think it's a derogatory term. But when

414
00:19:16.440 --> 00:19:20.000
women own it, you know, it's like, it's okay, then sure,

415
00:19:20.079 --> 00:19:21.680
if you want to call each other. I don't know

416
00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:24.480
why that was the name that they chose, but it's

417
00:19:24.559 --> 00:19:26.359
kind of pertinent to the rest of the story, So

418
00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:28.480
that's why I wanted to mention it. Okay, In the

419
00:19:28.519 --> 00:19:32.119
year two thousand, Michelle passed the CPA exam on her

420
00:19:32.200 --> 00:19:35.400
first try and began working for Deloitte and Touche in

421
00:19:35.440 --> 00:19:37.960
downtown Raleigh. Do you think it's pretty rare to pass

422
00:19:38.000 --> 00:19:39.519
the CPA on your first try.

423
00:19:39.960 --> 00:19:42.519
I don't know. I would imagine it is. I know

424
00:19:42.599 --> 00:19:45.839
the BAR exam is very difficult to pass, and I

425
00:19:45.920 --> 00:19:48.920
guess the CPA exam is probably also difficult, but I

426
00:19:48.920 --> 00:19:49.920
don't know a lot about that.

427
00:19:50.079 --> 00:19:52.240
I think it's all relative. But I read that the

428
00:19:52.279 --> 00:19:55.400
CPA exam is actually more challenging. Oh wow, I'm sure

429
00:19:55.400 --> 00:19:57.680
they're both super super super challenging.

430
00:19:57.759 --> 00:19:57.960
Yeah.

431
00:19:58.039 --> 00:20:00.400
And I think the fact that Michelle, you know, did

432
00:20:00.400 --> 00:20:03.559
her undergrad and then she did her masters and then

433
00:20:03.599 --> 00:20:06.240
she you know, she dissive. She did it all, you know,

434
00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:09.240
very young and very quickly, and she was very decisive

435
00:20:09.559 --> 00:20:11.359
in what she wanted to do with her life and

436
00:20:11.400 --> 00:20:13.759
her career. We'll be back after a break.

437
00:20:21.480 --> 00:20:24.240
Jason Lynn Young was born in nineteen seventy four to

438
00:20:24.319 --> 00:20:27.319
Pat and Bob Young in the small mountain town of Brevard,

439
00:20:27.400 --> 00:20:30.960
North Carolina. He was the middle child, with an older sister, Kim,

440
00:20:31.079 --> 00:20:34.400
and a younger sister, Heather, each two years apart. When

441
00:20:34.480 --> 00:20:37.640
Jason was five years old, tragedy struck when Bob died

442
00:20:37.680 --> 00:20:41.160
of cancer. His death deeply affected the family, but brought

443
00:20:41.200 --> 00:20:44.880
them closer together. Pat returned to her job teaching fifth grade,

444
00:20:45.160 --> 00:20:47.680
doing her best to support her three children on a

445
00:20:47.680 --> 00:20:51.039
modest teacher's salary, often struggling to make ends meet as

446
00:20:51.039 --> 00:20:53.880
a single mother. A year later, Pat began dating a

447
00:20:53.920 --> 00:20:57.160
man named Gerald McIntyre, whom she married when Jason was

448
00:20:57.160 --> 00:21:00.839
in college. Jerald worked for the Winchester Corps, one of

449
00:21:00.839 --> 00:21:03.839
the leading manufacturers of guns and AMMO in the US.

450
00:21:04.400 --> 00:21:07.519
After his dad's death, Jason craved a father figure, and

451
00:21:07.640 --> 00:21:10.440
Gerald fit the bill. He taught Jason how to hunt

452
00:21:10.519 --> 00:21:14.240
and fish. He loved being outdoors and playing sports. From

453
00:21:14.240 --> 00:21:17.039
an early age, Jason learned to use humor and practical

454
00:21:17.119 --> 00:21:21.240
jokes to entertain his family and diffuse tense situations, like

455
00:21:21.279 --> 00:21:24.079
the time he lightened the mood by mooning his eighty

456
00:21:24.160 --> 00:21:28.200
year old grandmother. His sister said quote, people were drawn

457
00:21:28.240 --> 00:21:30.240
to him because he was so much fun and you

458
00:21:30.279 --> 00:21:32.599
could never stay mad at him. For very long, because

459
00:21:32.640 --> 00:21:36.319
he'd have you laughing within minutes. During summers, Jason worked

460
00:21:36.319 --> 00:21:39.559
at a Christian camp as a kayak and mountain climbing instructor,

461
00:21:39.799 --> 00:21:43.039
where he met some lifelong friends. His senior class voted

462
00:21:43.079 --> 00:21:45.920
him best all around, and his teachers nominated him for

463
00:21:46.000 --> 00:21:50.160
the Brevard High Hall of Fame. Jason attended North Carolina

464
00:21:50.200 --> 00:21:53.000
State University, where it took him six years to graduate,

465
00:21:53.240 --> 00:21:55.279
partially because he took a year off to hike the

466
00:21:55.279 --> 00:21:58.519
Appalachian Trail with a friend, and partially because he was

467
00:21:58.599 --> 00:22:01.680
not a serious student. He loved attending the wolf Pack

468
00:22:01.759 --> 00:22:05.680
sporting events, but loved tailgating even more. Sometimes he never

469
00:22:05.720 --> 00:22:08.559
even made it into the stadium. He began dating a

470
00:22:08.559 --> 00:22:12.480
woman named Genevieve his junior year. A fellow ARA I.

471
00:22:12.440 --> 00:22:15.720
Was very surprised to find that Jason was a Resident

472
00:22:15.799 --> 00:22:19.720
advisor or RA. That's a job usually that you have

473
00:22:19.759 --> 00:22:22.279
to be very responsible for, and it sounds like Jason

474
00:22:22.519 --> 00:22:24.599
really loved to party. It must have been great to

475
00:22:24.640 --> 00:22:26.400
live on his floor. I would guess if you were

476
00:22:26.680 --> 00:22:28.119
a college freshman.

477
00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:31.359
Yeah, yeah, Myra. In our freshman year, Russell, he was

478
00:22:31.519 --> 00:22:34.039
very straight laced and responsible. He is not a fun

479
00:22:34.160 --> 00:22:35.039
party kind of guy.

480
00:22:35.319 --> 00:22:36.640
My aris were pretty fun.

481
00:22:37.119 --> 00:22:40.599
Jason and Genevieve got engaged in October nineteen ninety nine,

482
00:22:40.680 --> 00:22:43.319
but she soon broke off the engagement because of his

483
00:22:43.400 --> 00:22:47.279
hard partying ways and bad temper. After graduating in two thousand,

484
00:22:47.359 --> 00:22:49.839
Jason got a job with Nike, working in sales.

485
00:22:50.279 --> 00:22:53.079
This job at Nike for Jason seemed like the perfect

486
00:22:53.079 --> 00:22:56.240
fit because he loved sports so much, but he changed

487
00:22:56.319 --> 00:22:59.759
jobs a lot. That's pretty common for salespeople to change

488
00:22:59.799 --> 00:23:01.000
joh In my.

489
00:23:01.000 --> 00:23:03.839
Experience, yeah, it's pretty common. I its sales. It's a

490
00:23:03.960 --> 00:23:05.799
very cutthroat thing. You have a number to hit, and

491
00:23:05.839 --> 00:23:07.759
if you don't hit the number, you're probably not gonna

492
00:23:07.839 --> 00:23:10.440
last very long. In February two thousand and one, on

493
00:23:10.480 --> 00:23:13.720
her twenty fourth birthday, Michelle Fisher met Jason Young at

494
00:23:13.720 --> 00:23:16.880
the Poorhouse, a bar in Raleigh. After he spilled her

495
00:23:16.880 --> 00:23:19.839
glass of wine. Michelle and Jason struck up a conversation

496
00:23:20.200 --> 00:23:22.960
that blossomed into romance. I think he spilled her wine

497
00:23:23.000 --> 00:23:25.319
intentionally to strike up a conversation.

498
00:23:25.960 --> 00:23:26.440
I don't know.

499
00:23:26.880 --> 00:23:29.599
At the time, Jason worked in sales at Black and Decker,

500
00:23:29.880 --> 00:23:33.200
but later moved to pharmaceutical sales. The couple were a

501
00:23:33.240 --> 00:23:36.359
study of opposites. Jason was the life of the party

502
00:23:36.400 --> 00:23:38.759
and loved to spend time with his old college buddies

503
00:23:38.920 --> 00:23:42.599
reliving their glory days. Michelle was more career oriented and

504
00:23:42.720 --> 00:23:44.920
subdued well compared to Jason.

505
00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:47.279
I don't mean to make it sound like Michelle wasn't fun.

506
00:23:47.319 --> 00:23:50.480
I think she was also very fun, but no one

507
00:23:50.880 --> 00:23:52.880
was as fun as Jason was.

508
00:23:53.039 --> 00:23:55.920
Gotcha. Michelle was a planner who had the next ten

509
00:23:56.000 --> 00:23:58.880
years of her life mapped out. She preferred quiet nights

510
00:23:58.880 --> 00:24:01.680
at home to night's out, but Jason invoked a sense

511
00:24:01.720 --> 00:24:04.599
of spontaneity within her that she liked because it got

512
00:24:04.599 --> 00:24:07.519
her out of her head. Jason and his friend Ryan

513
00:24:07.559 --> 00:24:10.640
Shod bought a town house in Raleigh. Michelle moved in

514
00:24:10.640 --> 00:24:13.640
with them soon after. She and Jason began dating. Two

515
00:24:13.720 --> 00:24:16.920
years into their relationship, Michell discovered that she was pregnant.

516
00:24:17.119 --> 00:24:19.759
This was not part of her tenure plan. She and

517
00:24:19.839 --> 00:24:23.359
Jason hadn't yet broached the idea of marriage. Michelle was

518
00:24:23.400 --> 00:24:26.519
all in, but Jason was harder to read regarding the future.

519
00:24:26.960 --> 00:24:29.519
She was nervous to tell him about the pregnancy, and

520
00:24:29.680 --> 00:24:32.880
she was right to be nervous. Initially, Jason freaked out

521
00:24:32.920 --> 00:24:35.759
and told Michele he wasn't ready for marriage or a baby,

522
00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:39.200
but he slowly warmed to the idea. He proposed to

523
00:24:39.240 --> 00:24:42.079
Michelle with a rubber band, promising to replace it soon

524
00:24:42.160 --> 00:24:45.079
with a diamond ring. When they told Michelle's mother about

525
00:24:45.079 --> 00:24:47.920
their plans to get married, one not to mince words,

526
00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:50.920
Linda Fisher said, quote, if you don't love her, don't

527
00:24:50.920 --> 00:24:54.839
marry her. She'll survive. On August twelfth, two thousand three,

528
00:24:54.880 --> 00:24:57.359
they got married by a magistrate judge at the John

529
00:24:57.400 --> 00:25:01.160
Baker Public Safety Center in Raleigh. Linda and a stranger

530
00:25:01.200 --> 00:25:04.160
off the street were the only witnesses. Not exactly the

531
00:25:04.160 --> 00:25:06.240
wedding that Michelle had been dreaming of since she was

532
00:25:06.279 --> 00:25:06.960
a little girl.

533
00:25:07.480 --> 00:25:09.200
It's so funny to me that they just pulled a

534
00:25:09.200 --> 00:25:12.640
stranger off the street.

535
00:25:12.839 --> 00:25:15.279
They rushed the marriage because with the baby on the way,

536
00:25:15.319 --> 00:25:19.000
Michelle needed health insurance immediately. She had recently left her

537
00:25:19.079 --> 00:25:22.160
high pressure job at Deloitte and Touche. A more elaborate

538
00:25:22.200 --> 00:25:25.160
wedding was planned for October tenth. Even though it was

539
00:25:25.200 --> 00:25:28.160
a short timeline, Michelle planned every last detail of her

540
00:25:28.200 --> 00:25:31.319
big day. Meredith was the maid of honor and their dog,

541
00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:34.920
Mister Garrison was ring bearer wearing a doggye tuxedo. I

542
00:25:34.960 --> 00:25:37.079
really like mister Garrison as a name for a dog.

543
00:25:37.400 --> 00:25:39.720
I don't know where it came from. Was there a

544
00:25:39.799 --> 00:25:41.640
sports legend with the last name Garrison?

545
00:25:41.680 --> 00:25:44.599
I know, maybe a TV show like maybe I'm thinking

546
00:25:44.640 --> 00:25:48.799
of Missus Garrison from Faxaphone boy.

547
00:25:50.200 --> 00:25:51.039
Missus Garrett.

548
00:25:51.240 --> 00:25:52.640
Oh, is it really yes?

549
00:25:53.119 --> 00:25:55.079
I can't believe you're so embarrassed to be married.

550
00:25:56.640 --> 00:25:59.400
Michelle got a new job working for Progress Energy as

551
00:25:59.440 --> 00:26:02.519
a tax specialist. She loved the job and planned on

552
00:26:02.559 --> 00:26:06.359
returning after her maternity leave. Meredith, who had just graduated

553
00:26:06.359 --> 00:26:08.799
from college, agreed to move to Raleigh and be the

554
00:26:08.799 --> 00:26:09.680
baby's nanny.

555
00:26:10.440 --> 00:26:13.440
Cassidy Elizabeth Young was born on Mars twenty ninth, two

556
00:26:13.440 --> 00:26:16.440
thousand and four. Michelle loved being a mother and doated

557
00:26:16.440 --> 00:26:19.480
on the baby. Jason was a very hands on dad too.

558
00:26:20.119 --> 00:26:22.799
His sister Heather said, quote it was like a big

559
00:26:22.920 --> 00:26:25.440
kid having a little kid. He had loved making the

560
00:26:25.440 --> 00:26:29.000
baby laugh. Not long after Cassidy was born, Michelle and

561
00:26:29.079 --> 00:26:33.440
Jason purchased life insurance policies for two million dollars for

562
00:26:33.599 --> 00:26:36.160
each of them. That's a lot of insurance.

563
00:26:36.319 --> 00:26:37.000
That is a lot.

564
00:26:37.079 --> 00:26:40.799
Yeah, they were each other's only beneficiary. Jason knew what

565
00:26:40.839 --> 00:26:43.000
it was like to grow up pinching pennies after his

566
00:26:43.079 --> 00:26:46.000
father died, and he wanted his children to be provided

567
00:26:46.039 --> 00:26:49.200
for and the event that he wasn't there. In April

568
00:26:49.240 --> 00:26:52.640
two thousand and five, the Youngs purchased a beautiful three thousand,

569
00:26:52.720 --> 00:26:56.279
three hundred square foot brick colonial home on Birch Leaf

570
00:26:56.359 --> 00:26:59.720
Drive and Raleigh for three hundred and seventy nine thousand dollars.

571
00:27:00.119 --> 00:27:02.759
The house featured four bedrooms, two and a half baths,

572
00:27:02.799 --> 00:27:05.480
and sat on two wooded acres. It looked like a

573
00:27:05.519 --> 00:27:09.319
really beautiful home, especially considered how young they were. Raleigh,

574
00:27:09.359 --> 00:27:11.640
North Carolina, is the state capitol and one of the

575
00:27:11.720 --> 00:27:14.319
fastest growing cities in the country. As part of the

576
00:27:14.319 --> 00:27:17.920
Research Triangle along with Durham and Chapel Hill. It's known

577
00:27:17.960 --> 00:27:21.599
for its strong economy, top tier universities, and booming tech

578
00:27:21.640 --> 00:27:25.160
and health care sectors. As of twenty twenty five, Raleigh's

579
00:27:25.200 --> 00:27:28.839
population is nearly five hundred thousand, and the larger metruro

580
00:27:29.000 --> 00:27:31.640
area is home to about one point sixty six million

581
00:27:31.640 --> 00:27:35.599
people and has a relatively young, well educated population, with

582
00:27:35.720 --> 00:27:38.599
a median age of thirty four and over half of

583
00:27:38.680 --> 00:27:41.799
the adults holding at least a bachelor's degree. The median

584
00:27:41.880 --> 00:27:45.559
household income is about eighty five thousand dollars. The city

585
00:27:45.559 --> 00:27:50.200
blends southern charm with modern energy, offering vibrant neighborhoods, a

586
00:27:50.240 --> 00:27:53.759
thriving downtown, and a growing food and craft beer scene,

587
00:27:53.839 --> 00:27:58.160
But like many urban areas, Rally faces challenges with crime. Overall,

588
00:27:58.200 --> 00:28:01.680
it remains relatively safe compared to cities of similar size.

589
00:28:01.759 --> 00:28:05.119
Those certain types of crime, like autofefts and assaults, have

590
00:28:05.200 --> 00:28:08.160
seen an uptick in recent years. Violent crime is slightly

591
00:28:08.160 --> 00:28:11.680
above the national average, but local officials have been investing

592
00:28:11.720 --> 00:28:16.000
in public safety efforts, including increased patrols and community programs.

593
00:28:16.079 --> 00:28:20.279
With its mix of opportunity, culture, and liveability, Raleigh continues

594
00:28:20.279 --> 00:28:23.200
to attract newcomers from across the country and has often

595
00:28:23.279 --> 00:28:26.119
ranked among the best places to live in the US.

596
00:28:26.359 --> 00:28:28.039
Well it sounds lovely, it does?

597
00:28:28.240 --> 00:28:29.039
Do you want to go visit?

598
00:28:29.279 --> 00:28:29.599
Sure?

599
00:28:29.759 --> 00:28:32.799
Michelle and Jason had a rocky relationship and fought often

600
00:28:33.079 --> 00:28:36.920
even around their friends. Their biggest disagreements often centered around

601
00:28:36.920 --> 00:28:40.920
their families. Once they became parents and homeowners, Michelle decided

602
00:28:40.920 --> 00:28:43.839
they should draw up their wills, a ruling decision for

603
00:28:43.960 --> 00:28:47.480
any parent, but for most people it's a hypothetical question.

604
00:28:48.079 --> 00:28:51.640
Michelle was adamant that Meredith should be Cassidy's guardian because

605
00:28:51.680 --> 00:28:54.359
she knew her best after being her nanny for a year,

606
00:28:54.559 --> 00:28:57.039
but Jason was just as firmed that his sister Heather

607
00:28:57.119 --> 00:29:00.640
and her husband Joe should be Cassidy's guardian. In the end,

608
00:29:00.920 --> 00:29:04.839
Jason won the dispute. Remember when our kids were both

609
00:29:04.880 --> 00:29:07.680
over the age of eighteen, I was so grateful that

610
00:29:08.279 --> 00:29:11.920
we were both here to raise both of our kids together.

611
00:29:12.039 --> 00:29:12.759
Yeah, I was too.

612
00:29:13.200 --> 00:29:15.839
In May two thousand and six, the mcbrod's got together

613
00:29:15.920 --> 00:29:18.839
with her husbands in Myrtle Beach. Jason and the other

614
00:29:18.920 --> 00:29:22.839
Michelle Michelle Money initiated a flirtation that would continue into

615
00:29:22.920 --> 00:29:25.559
the fall. When the friend group reunited for a wolf

616
00:29:25.599 --> 00:29:29.640
packed tailgate at the Young's new home, Michelle Money confided

617
00:29:29.640 --> 00:29:32.759
in Jason that she believed her husband Steve was having

618
00:29:32.759 --> 00:29:37.359
an affair with Lisa, another McBride. Oh, so these four

619
00:29:37.400 --> 00:29:39.119
women are really good friends.

620
00:29:39.920 --> 00:29:41.519
It's just that doesn't sound good.

621
00:29:41.599 --> 00:29:45.039
No, if you're a reality TV fan, especially if you

622
00:29:45.440 --> 00:29:49.079
are familiar with the Bachelor universe. The name Michelle Money

623
00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:51.799
might mean something to you. It is not the Michelle

624
00:29:51.799 --> 00:29:53.079
Money from The Bachelor.

625
00:29:53.160 --> 00:29:54.319
Oh okay, it's a great name.

626
00:29:54.640 --> 00:29:57.200
Yeah. When I first saw the name, I was so excited.

627
00:29:57.200 --> 00:29:58.960
I was like, oh my god, Michelle Money. I know her,

628
00:29:59.200 --> 00:30:01.799
but it is not this same Sometime in the fall,

629
00:30:01.920 --> 00:30:05.000
while at another tailgate party at Shelley and Ryan's house,

630
00:30:05.240 --> 00:30:08.359
Jason got so drunk keep pete on one of their

631
00:30:08.400 --> 00:30:11.759
extensive rugs. Ryan gently ushered him out of the room

632
00:30:11.839 --> 00:30:14.599
to help him shower and loaned him some clothing, but

633
00:30:14.680 --> 00:30:17.440
Jason ran out of the bathroom and rejoined the party,

634
00:30:17.759 --> 00:30:22.079
sitting on the couch nacd good Michelle was not there.

635
00:30:22.759 --> 00:30:24.799
Jason had been flirting with a friend of Shelley's the

636
00:30:24.839 --> 00:30:27.960
whole night. To prevent any late night visits from Jason,

637
00:30:28.200 --> 00:30:30.880
Ryan slept with him to keep him away.

638
00:30:30.519 --> 00:30:32.319
From the woman a friend.

639
00:30:32.720 --> 00:30:34.759
In the spring of two thousand and six, Michelle found

640
00:30:34.759 --> 00:30:36.759
out that she was pregnant again and she was over

641
00:30:36.799 --> 00:30:39.559
the moon, But not long after, she and Jason were

642
00:30:39.559 --> 00:30:42.160
in a car accident and she sadly lost the baby.

643
00:30:42.880 --> 00:30:46.279
Heartbroken but still determined to grow their family Michelle became

644
00:30:46.359 --> 00:30:49.519
pregnant again soon after. When they learned they were expecting

645
00:30:49.519 --> 00:30:53.000
a boy, Jason was thrilled, although he had one strict rule,

646
00:30:53.319 --> 00:30:56.519
no light blue baby clothes would be allowed. He didn't

647
00:30:56.519 --> 00:30:59.960
want anyone mistaking his son for a fan of UNC's

648
00:31:00.119 --> 00:31:03.240
tar heels. Linda had just retired from her job as

649
00:31:03.279 --> 00:31:05.839
a school teacher, and Michelle had plans to convert the

650
00:31:05.880 --> 00:31:08.200
attic into a room for her so she could move

651
00:31:08.240 --> 00:31:11.119
in and help care for the children from Tuesday to Thursday.

652
00:31:11.480 --> 00:31:14.200
Michelle planned to reduce her work week to three days

653
00:31:14.400 --> 00:31:16.839
to spend more time with the children, while Linda planned

654
00:31:16.839 --> 00:31:19.559
to buy a beach house where she'd spend weekends, giving

655
00:31:19.559 --> 00:31:22.359
the whole family a place to enjoy It. Sounds like

656
00:31:22.400 --> 00:31:26.200
a great idea, sounds nice arrangement. Jason, however, was strongly

657
00:31:26.200 --> 00:31:28.799
opposed to the idea. He couldn't stand the thought of

658
00:31:28.839 --> 00:31:31.799
having his mother in law around so often. He found

659
00:31:31.799 --> 00:31:36.160
Linda overbearing, judgmental, and controlling, and he deeply resented the

660
00:31:36.160 --> 00:31:39.640
close bond she shared with Michelle. In fact, Linda was

661
00:31:39.680 --> 00:31:43.119
the center of many of the couple's arguments. Linda found

662
00:31:43.200 --> 00:31:46.559
Jason to be childless and impetuous. She thought his first

663
00:31:46.559 --> 00:31:49.640
priority wasn't his family, but his social life. He went

664
00:31:49.640 --> 00:31:52.440
out most nights, played in two softball leagues in the

665
00:31:52.480 --> 00:31:56.960
summer and two basketball leagues in the winter. Meredith said, quote,

666
00:31:57.240 --> 00:31:59.920
my mom is a strong personality, and they'd butt head.

667
00:32:00.440 --> 00:32:02.880
I mean initially they kind of got along, and quickly

668
00:32:02.920 --> 00:32:05.480
it became when Michelle and him would get into a fight.

669
00:32:05.680 --> 00:32:07.880
Michelle would call my mom and cry and scream and

670
00:32:07.960 --> 00:32:10.519
yell and event to my mom. So as a mom,

671
00:32:10.720 --> 00:32:14.160
she's you know, disappointed and aggravated and frustrated with the

672
00:32:14.200 --> 00:32:16.759
way that her son in law is treating her daughter.

673
00:32:17.480 --> 00:32:20.240
In my opinion, I think that Jason didn't want Linda

674
00:32:20.279 --> 00:32:24.240
around because she kept him accountable, or Michelle was maybe

675
00:32:24.319 --> 00:32:26.279
sometimes like okay, you know, go ahead and go out.

676
00:32:26.279 --> 00:32:26.720
It's all right.

677
00:32:26.880 --> 00:32:27.319
Yeah, you can.

678
00:32:27.279 --> 00:32:30.039
Pretty much do what he wanted. On Tuesday, October tenth,

679
00:32:30.079 --> 00:32:33.720
two thousand and six, the Young's third wedding anniversary, Michelle

680
00:32:33.759 --> 00:32:36.200
was home with Cassidy while Jason was out of town

681
00:32:36.319 --> 00:32:39.880
for business. Jason had recently started working for a new

682
00:32:39.880 --> 00:32:44.000
company called chart One, selling medical charting software. He had

683
00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:47.799
left for Orlando on Saturday and then had flown to Denver, so.

684
00:32:47.759 --> 00:32:50.759
There's a lot of business meetings in Orlando on Saturdays.

685
00:32:50.799 --> 00:32:55.799
I'm sure probably not very likely. Jason mailed Michelle an

686
00:32:55.839 --> 00:32:59.119
anniversary card from Orlando along with a twenty five dollars

687
00:32:59.359 --> 00:33:00.640
Starbucks gift card.

688
00:33:00.960 --> 00:33:03.480
Okay, this is the anniversary present that I have a

689
00:33:03.480 --> 00:33:06.599
hard time with. Yeah, I think even just getting a

690
00:33:06.640 --> 00:33:08.920
card is fine. Having to mail a card to your

691
00:33:08.920 --> 00:33:13.200
spouse is weird, But the twenty five dollary Starbucks gift card, Yeah,

692
00:33:13.240 --> 00:33:13.640
I don't know.

693
00:33:13.759 --> 00:33:15.920
That's just the only thing worse I can think of

694
00:33:16.039 --> 00:33:18.119
is to give like a put a twenty dollars bill

695
00:33:18.200 --> 00:33:18.880
in the car.

696
00:33:20.279 --> 00:33:21.839
That would be bad too.

697
00:33:22.279 --> 00:33:26.039
She was very hurt. Understandably, Her spirits, though, were lifted

698
00:33:26.079 --> 00:33:28.880
because later her mother and grandmother were flying in for

699
00:33:28.920 --> 00:33:31.480
a ten day visit, in part to stay with Cassidy

700
00:33:31.519 --> 00:33:33.880
while she and Jason went to a wedding that weekend

701
00:33:33.920 --> 00:33:37.200
in Winston Salem. They're best friends, Shelley and Ryan were

702
00:33:37.200 --> 00:33:40.599
getting married. The engaged couple were introduced by Michelle and

703
00:33:40.680 --> 00:33:44.359
Jason at an NHL playoff game between the Carolina Hurricanes

704
00:33:44.480 --> 00:33:46.960
versus the Detroit Red Wings in two thousand and two.

705
00:33:47.240 --> 00:33:51.200
I try my very best to weep Michigan into every episode.

706
00:33:51.440 --> 00:33:54.200
I'm not even that's great. Those were the red Wings

707
00:33:54.279 --> 00:33:55.000
glory years.

708
00:33:55.119 --> 00:33:58.920
They really were. They were dominant for ten years, well

709
00:33:58.960 --> 00:33:59.480
at least.

710
00:34:00.079 --> 00:34:03.119
When Jason returned home on Thursday, he picked Michelle up

711
00:34:03.119 --> 00:34:05.720
from work and took her to dinner at their favorite restaurant,

712
00:34:05.759 --> 00:34:09.159
Bella Monica. When she got into his suv, excited to

713
00:34:09.159 --> 00:34:11.599
see him after almost six days apart, he was on

714
00:34:11.639 --> 00:34:14.280
the phone and didn't acknowledge her for the entire fifteen

715
00:34:14.320 --> 00:34:17.920
minute drive. Not a good start to their anniversary celebration.

716
00:34:18.199 --> 00:34:20.880
Well, and later his phone records indicated that he had

717
00:34:20.920 --> 00:34:23.639
been on the phone for twenty five minutes and it

718
00:34:23.719 --> 00:34:26.480
wasn't a business call. He was on the phone with

719
00:34:26.599 --> 00:34:28.239
Michelle money Oh.

720
00:34:28.719 --> 00:34:31.599
After Jason put down his phone, tempers flared when he

721
00:34:31.599 --> 00:34:34.159
told Michelle that he was leaving early with friends to

722
00:34:34.199 --> 00:34:36.639
head to Shelley and Ryan's wedding so they could get

723
00:34:36.679 --> 00:34:39.679
in a round of golf, diverting from Michelle's plan to

724
00:34:39.760 --> 00:34:42.800
drive together. She was hurt. She had been hoping for

725
00:34:42.840 --> 00:34:46.039
a romantic weekend with her husband, but Jason clearly had

726
00:34:46.039 --> 00:34:49.119
his mind set on another wild weekend, being the life

727
00:34:49.199 --> 00:34:51.880
of the party. That night, when they returned home, the

728
00:34:51.880 --> 00:34:55.199
fight escalated. Jason stormed out and went to a bar

729
00:34:55.280 --> 00:34:58.840
with friends. Michelle followed him there and insisted he come home.

730
00:34:59.280 --> 00:35:02.400
They reached an uneasy truce, and Jason agreed to stick

731
00:35:02.440 --> 00:35:04.880
to the original plan and drive with her to Winston

732
00:35:04.920 --> 00:35:08.280
Salem the next day, but the tension lingered and they

733
00:35:08.400 --> 00:35:11.199
argued the entire two hour drive. The rest of the

734
00:35:11.199 --> 00:35:14.480
weekend wasn't much better. Jason acted like he was still

735
00:35:14.480 --> 00:35:17.840
in college, drinking more than anyone else and acting a fool.

736
00:35:18.239 --> 00:35:22.239
Michelle was mostly by herself, feeling sad, lonely, and withdrawn.

737
00:35:22.679 --> 00:35:24.719
But friends say by the end of the wedding they

738
00:35:24.719 --> 00:35:27.639
had made up, and Jason said, quote, I love my wife.

739
00:35:27.719 --> 00:35:30.719
She's crazy, but I love her. But Michelle's friends and

740
00:35:30.760 --> 00:35:34.559
family began worrying about her. Her disintegrating marriage was chipping

741
00:35:34.559 --> 00:35:36.800
away at her normally bubbly personality.

742
00:35:37.360 --> 00:35:39.880
Jason is thirty two at this point, and it seemed

743
00:35:39.880 --> 00:35:41.599
like a lot of his friends were getting married and

744
00:35:41.639 --> 00:35:44.400
having children, and he was married and had children, right,

745
00:35:44.480 --> 00:35:47.880
but he still had this mindset of, you know, partying

746
00:35:47.920 --> 00:35:50.400
and getting drunk, and it seemed like a lot of

747
00:35:50.400 --> 00:35:53.360
people in his life. Started to find it distasteful and

748
00:35:53.760 --> 00:35:55.599
just kind of gross that he always had to be

749
00:35:55.679 --> 00:35:57.119
the drunkest and the lowest.

750
00:35:57.679 --> 00:35:58.880
Yeah, you don't want to be that guy.

751
00:35:59.000 --> 00:35:59.800
I want to be the guy.

752
00:36:00.159 --> 00:36:03.199
On November second, at six thirty, Shelley Shod rang the

753
00:36:03.239 --> 00:36:06.239
doorbell at her best friend's house. She and her new husband,

754
00:36:06.320 --> 00:36:09.440
Ryan had just returned from their two week Italian honeymoon.

755
00:36:09.920 --> 00:36:13.400
She brought Italian takeout and honeymoon pictures to show Michelle.

756
00:36:13.719 --> 00:36:16.519
Shelley had been worried about Michelle because she had recently

757
00:36:16.559 --> 00:36:20.239
seemed depressed. Later, Shelley said, quote, she was just in

758
00:36:20.280 --> 00:36:22.960
a dark hole, and you know, she kind of turned off.

759
00:36:23.480 --> 00:36:26.360
She briefly saw Jason before she and Michelle sat down

760
00:36:26.360 --> 00:36:29.320
to eat their dinner. Jason declined the invitation to eat

761
00:36:29.320 --> 00:36:32.000
with them, saying he needed to get ready for his trip.

762
00:36:32.320 --> 00:36:33.960
He had planned to stop for a bite to eat

763
00:36:33.960 --> 00:36:36.960
at a cracker barrel in Greensboro and then drive another

764
00:36:37.000 --> 00:36:40.000
three hours to Galax, Virginia. He had a sales call

765
00:36:40.079 --> 00:36:42.320
the next morning at ten a m. He left at

766
00:36:42.320 --> 00:36:45.360
about seven fifteen, gassed up, and then hit the road.

767
00:36:45.800 --> 00:36:48.960
He called his mom and talked for About an hour meanwhile,

768
00:36:49.000 --> 00:36:51.440
Michelle and Shelley gave Cassidy a bath and put her

769
00:36:51.480 --> 00:36:54.760
about in pink, fleeced pajamas before snuggling on the couch

770
00:36:54.800 --> 00:36:58.320
and watching their favorite show, Gray's Anatomy. Just a few

771
00:36:58.320 --> 00:37:02.119
minutes into the episode, Michelle's father, Alan Fisher called. He

772
00:37:02.199 --> 00:37:04.079
let her know that he wouldn't be coming to Raleigh

773
00:37:04.079 --> 00:37:07.360
that weekend. He wasn't feeling well. He had recently been

774
00:37:07.400 --> 00:37:11.400
diagnosed with prostate cancer. Michelle was disappointed. She had been

775
00:37:11.400 --> 00:37:13.760
looking forward to the visit and wanted him to spend

776
00:37:13.800 --> 00:37:17.239
as much time with Cassidy as possible. A tailgate party

777
00:37:17.320 --> 00:37:20.679
was planned for that Saturday, November fourth, and several friends

778
00:37:20.679 --> 00:37:23.760
were coming into town to stay with the youngs, including Alan.

779
00:37:24.280 --> 00:37:27.480
She and Jason knew that Allen might cancel, and before

780
00:37:27.559 --> 00:37:30.079
Jason left, he was very adamant, Well, let me know

781
00:37:30.079 --> 00:37:32.880
if your dad cancels and it can't help. But think

782
00:37:33.840 --> 00:37:38.079
Alan had come that maybe we'd have a different outcome, okay.

783
00:37:38.880 --> 00:37:41.920
At ten thirty, Shelley left. She had an eerie feeling

784
00:37:42.000 --> 00:37:44.599
all evening and asked Michelle to walk her to her car.

785
00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:47.480
At eleven, Jason called Michelle to let her know that

786
00:37:47.559 --> 00:37:50.199
he had made it to Hillsville, Virginia and had checked

787
00:37:50.199 --> 00:37:52.559
into a Hampton Inn. She let him know that her

788
00:37:52.599 --> 00:37:55.119
father had called earlier and had canceled his trip that

789
00:37:55.159 --> 00:37:58.840
weekend because he wasn't feeling well, and as you just mentioned,

790
00:37:58.920 --> 00:38:01.760
Jason had been very into if Alan would be coming

791
00:38:01.800 --> 00:38:04.719
into town. They talked for a few minutes before Jason

792
00:38:04.760 --> 00:38:07.480
worked on his sales presentation for the next day. He

793
00:38:07.519 --> 00:38:10.480
worked until midnight and then called it a night. The

794
00:38:10.519 --> 00:38:12.320
next morning, he was half an hour late to the

795
00:38:12.360 --> 00:38:15.400
sales call he had scheduled for ten am. Later, the

796
00:38:15.440 --> 00:38:18.079
person he met with said he seemed fine, maybe a

797
00:38:18.079 --> 00:38:21.440
bit nervous, but it was his first solo sales call

798
00:38:21.519 --> 00:38:24.280
since he had worked with the company. After the appointment,

799
00:38:24.320 --> 00:38:27.079
he called Michelle's work phone. When she didn't answer, he

800
00:38:27.119 --> 00:38:30.519
tried her cell phone and again got her voicemail. Jason

801
00:38:30.559 --> 00:38:33.239
assumed that she was in meetings, and that's when he

802
00:38:33.239 --> 00:38:35.440
called Meredith and asked her to get the papers that

803
00:38:35.519 --> 00:38:38.199
he had left on his home printer about the coach bag.

804
00:38:38.639 --> 00:38:41.079
When she didn't answer, he called his mother and asked

805
00:38:41.079 --> 00:38:44.480
her to keep trying Meredith. He elaborated how important it

806
00:38:44.599 --> 00:38:47.480
was that she get those papers off the printer. At

807
00:38:47.480 --> 00:38:50.000
one thirty seven, he called Meredith again and left her

808
00:38:50.039 --> 00:38:53.719
the following message quote, Hey, it's Jason, just calling you back.

809
00:38:53.760 --> 00:38:55.960
I wanted to get an update, and I also wanted

810
00:38:56.000 --> 00:38:57.639
to let you know. I called my mom and I

811
00:38:57.639 --> 00:39:00.000
gave her that message. My phone has been a time

812
00:39:00.079 --> 00:39:02.599
total suck up. Don't know if you heard the whole thing.

813
00:39:03.079 --> 00:39:05.239
So I told her the deal. I think she's going

814
00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:07.320
to try to call you. I tried to call Michelle,

815
00:39:07.400 --> 00:39:10.119
but not super aggressively because I want to find out

816
00:39:10.119 --> 00:39:13.039
for sure if you've taken those papers or not. Anyway,

817
00:39:13.159 --> 00:39:14.960
I will talk to you again later if you get

818
00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:16.440
a chance, call me bye.

819
00:39:16.840 --> 00:39:20.840
Jason is really worried about these eBay printouts, Yeah, that

820
00:39:21.199 --> 00:39:23.920
have this coach perse on them. Seems like it, doesn't

821
00:39:23.920 --> 00:39:25.360
That seem a little odd to you that he's so

822
00:39:25.440 --> 00:39:29.159
worried about it that his mom is even calling Meredith, like, oh, Meredith,

823
00:39:29.159 --> 00:39:31.079
make sure you get those prints, you know. Yeah, I

824
00:39:31.079 --> 00:39:31.599
think this.

825
00:39:31.519 --> 00:39:34.079
Is so really sort of seems like I guess what

826
00:39:34.119 --> 00:39:36.360
you're getting at is he wanted someone to go to

827
00:39:36.400 --> 00:39:37.039
the house.

828
00:39:36.800 --> 00:39:38.679
And he really wanted someone to go to the house.

829
00:39:38.840 --> 00:39:42.159
Yeah, yeah, Jason made a few more sales calls at

830
00:39:42.199 --> 00:39:45.760
nearby hospitals before driving to his mother and stepfather's home

831
00:39:45.800 --> 00:39:49.000
in the mountain town of Brevard, North Carolina. He was

832
00:39:49.039 --> 00:39:51.480
planning on spending the night with them before driving back

833
00:39:51.480 --> 00:39:53.840
to Raleigh the next morning to get home in time

834
00:39:53.880 --> 00:39:56.639
for the NC State game. When he arrived, his mother

835
00:39:56.719 --> 00:40:00.599
and stepfather, Pat and Gerald looked pale and overwraw with emotion.

836
00:40:01.159 --> 00:40:03.920
They had the impossible task of telling Jason that his

837
00:40:04.000 --> 00:40:06.800
wife and unborn son were dead. He fell to his

838
00:40:06.880 --> 00:40:10.000
knees and sobbed. His mother put him in a recliner

839
00:40:10.039 --> 00:40:12.559
and covered him with a blanket while he wept. Soon

840
00:40:12.639 --> 00:40:15.800
his sister, Heather and her husband Joe arrived. They offered

841
00:40:15.800 --> 00:40:18.719
to drive Jason back to Raleigh. Joe and Heather sat

842
00:40:18.760 --> 00:40:21.039
in the front seat while Jason and Pat sat in

843
00:40:21.079 --> 00:40:23.360
the back, his head cradled in her lap while she

844
00:40:23.400 --> 00:40:26.400
stroked his hair. Meredith called Jason to let him know

845
00:40:26.440 --> 00:40:28.639
that the police were at the house and needed to

846
00:40:28.679 --> 00:40:31.039
talk to him as soon as possible. Two friends of

847
00:40:31.119 --> 00:40:33.199
Jason's called to give him a heads up that the

848
00:40:33.239 --> 00:40:35.920
police were being aggressive and it seemed as if they

849
00:40:35.960 --> 00:40:39.960
already had him pinned as the prime suspect. Ryan secured

850
00:40:39.960 --> 00:40:43.079
an attorney for him, Roger Smith, but he wasn't available

851
00:40:43.159 --> 00:40:46.719
until the following Monday. Ryan cautioned Jason not to speak

852
00:40:46.760 --> 00:40:50.119
to the police without counsel. They drove to Meredith's house.

853
00:40:50.480 --> 00:40:54.000
Linda Fisher had already flown into town. Jason gave them

854
00:40:54.000 --> 00:40:56.280
all hugs and then laid down next to his daughter

855
00:40:56.320 --> 00:40:59.000
and fell asleep. He did not talk with anyone about

856
00:40:59.039 --> 00:41:03.119
what happened. He didn't ask any questions. Meredith, Pat Heather,

857
00:41:03.239 --> 00:41:06.559
and Joe were all taken in for questioning. Not asking

858
00:41:06.599 --> 00:41:09.119
the police any questions, not at all, after your wife

859
00:41:09.159 --> 00:41:13.280
has found dad brutally murdered. Yeah, that's really that's a

860
00:41:13.360 --> 00:41:14.159
big red flag.

861
00:41:14.199 --> 00:41:17.239
I would think I understand the importance of having counsel

862
00:41:17.320 --> 00:41:20.719
with you while you're being questioned, but just answering a

863
00:41:20.800 --> 00:41:23.840
few questions for a few hours, I think you would

864
00:41:23.840 --> 00:41:26.000
want to help with the investigation.

865
00:41:26.159 --> 00:41:28.639
Yeah, I would think so too. We'll be back after

866
00:41:28.679 --> 00:41:29.159
a break.

867
00:41:36.800 --> 00:41:38.760
Before we jump back to the case, I feel a

868
00:41:38.800 --> 00:41:40.960
little guilty about giving you a healthy snack.

869
00:41:41.239 --> 00:41:41.960
Wasn't that healthy?

870
00:41:42.639 --> 00:41:45.360
It was pretty healthy. I mean it's non fat yogurt

871
00:41:45.360 --> 00:41:48.440
with like a teaspoon of honey in it. All right, Well,

872
00:41:48.480 --> 00:41:52.679
I brought you a new Reese's peanut butter cup. It's

873
00:41:52.719 --> 00:41:54.800
called peanut butter pie.

874
00:41:55.159 --> 00:41:55.480
Okay.

875
00:41:55.599 --> 00:41:58.400
I saw them yesterday at the store, and I think

876
00:41:58.400 --> 00:42:00.119
they're pretty yummy. I think they're delici.

877
00:42:00.280 --> 00:42:01.880
Actually, all right, I'll give it a try.

878
00:42:07.440 --> 00:42:08.000
Did you like that?

879
00:42:08.639 --> 00:42:10.880
It was good? Wasn't It's not that different from a

880
00:42:10.960 --> 00:42:12.239
regular pan fired cup.

881
00:42:12.840 --> 00:42:14.199
I had the crunchy bits in it.

882
00:42:14.559 --> 00:42:16.239
Oh, Okay, I guess, but they.

883
00:42:16.119 --> 00:42:18.079
Were kind of like a toffee taste to it. I

884
00:42:18.079 --> 00:42:19.840
don't know. Again, I don't know why they're called peanut

885
00:42:19.880 --> 00:42:20.480
butter pie.

886
00:42:20.679 --> 00:42:22.559
I think I preferred the regular peanut.

887
00:42:22.280 --> 00:42:25.239
But I prefer these. Interesting. We're so different. I don't

888
00:42:25.280 --> 00:42:26.159
know how we stay married.

889
00:42:26.159 --> 00:42:26.639
I don't know.

890
00:42:27.320 --> 00:42:30.639
Two hundred people gathered for Michelle's funeral a week after

891
00:42:30.679 --> 00:42:33.840
her death on November ninth. It was an especially grueling day,

892
00:42:33.880 --> 00:42:37.400
as both Michelle and Rylan were being mourned. Years earlier,

893
00:42:37.480 --> 00:42:39.760
Michelle had written out the words to the song A

894
00:42:39.800 --> 00:42:42.599
Bushel and a Peck and placed it in Jason's wallet

895
00:42:42.760 --> 00:42:45.280
so he'd always be reminded of how much she loved him.

896
00:42:45.559 --> 00:42:48.639
At their funeral, he put it into her hands as

897
00:42:48.639 --> 00:42:51.199
he kneeled in front of her casket, rubbing her belly

898
00:42:51.840 --> 00:42:54.440
and November thirteenth, Linda spoke to the media from the

899
00:42:54.480 --> 00:42:57.559
cemetery where Michelle was buried. She begged the public to

900
00:42:57.599 --> 00:43:00.440
come forward if they had any information to find her

901
00:43:00.519 --> 00:43:05.000
daughter's killer, quote, I loved my Michelle and she is gone.

902
00:43:05.760 --> 00:43:08.480
At this point, everyone is in support of Jason.

903
00:43:08.639 --> 00:43:10.440
Yeah, and it seems like he was out of town,

904
00:43:10.920 --> 00:43:13.440
so I can see that he probably wasn't Even a

905
00:43:13.440 --> 00:43:15.800
lot of people probably didn't even consider that he might

906
00:43:15.840 --> 00:43:17.000
have done it because they were like, oh, he was

907
00:43:17.000 --> 00:43:18.360
out of town, right exactly.

908
00:43:18.440 --> 00:43:20.719
This case is very similar to the last case that

909
00:43:20.880 --> 00:43:24.639
we did, the David Hendrick's case. Several days after the funeral,

910
00:43:24.760 --> 00:43:28.119
Jason's sister, Heather and her husband Joe took Cassidy out

911
00:43:28.119 --> 00:43:31.400
of town with them, cutting Meredith and Linda Fisher from her.

912
00:43:31.880 --> 00:43:34.760
But Cassidy had returned to daycare for a few days

913
00:43:34.800 --> 00:43:38.679
before being whisked away. Her teacher spoke about an upsetting

914
00:43:38.719 --> 00:43:41.559
incident while Cassidy was playing with her two dollars.

915
00:43:42.320 --> 00:43:47.320
While she was hitting the doll she said, Mommy's getting

916
00:43:47.320 --> 00:43:51.320
a spanking for biting and then when she laid the.

917
00:43:51.360 --> 00:43:54.639
Doll down is when she said, Mommy has booboos all over,

918
00:43:54.760 --> 00:43:56.239
Mommy has read stuff all over.

919
00:43:57.280 --> 00:43:58.920
She was very withdrawn.

920
00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:02.400
She was always playing with at least one or two

921
00:44:02.440 --> 00:44:05.679
other kids, but she kept more to herself.

922
00:44:06.159 --> 00:44:09.519
The teacher said that Cassidy normally was a happy, outgoing child,

923
00:44:09.599 --> 00:44:12.480
and was very sad and withdrawn on those few days

924
00:44:12.480 --> 00:44:15.119
that she saw her after Michelle's death. If that doesn't

925
00:44:15.119 --> 00:44:16.840
break your heart, I don't know what does.

926
00:44:16.920 --> 00:44:17.320
For sure.

927
00:44:17.480 --> 00:44:20.039
Meredith was like a second mother to Cassidy. She'd been

928
00:44:20.079 --> 00:44:22.519
her nanny during the first year of her life and

929
00:44:22.559 --> 00:44:25.400
made sure to see her several times each week. Jason

930
00:44:25.400 --> 00:44:28.239
said he sent her away because he wanted Cassidy away

931
00:44:28.280 --> 00:44:31.440
from the prying eyes of the media. Years later, Pat

932
00:44:31.480 --> 00:44:34.679
Young testified that a friend overheard Meredith and Linda plotting

933
00:44:34.719 --> 00:44:37.800
at the funeral to take Cassidy and run away with her,

934
00:44:38.039 --> 00:44:41.519
and that's why she was taken away. Losing contact with

935
00:44:41.639 --> 00:44:45.199
Cassidy while grieving Michelle and Rylan was devastating to Meredith

936
00:44:45.239 --> 00:44:48.639
and Linda. Jason allowed them a few short supervised visits,

937
00:44:48.679 --> 00:44:51.480
meeting up at a holiday inn in Brevard, but they

938
00:44:51.559 --> 00:44:54.360
knew Michelle would want them to have custody of the

939
00:44:54.400 --> 00:44:57.559
little girl. Linda and Meredith went to visit an attorney

940
00:44:57.639 --> 00:45:00.519
to discuss their rights. They were surprised to learn that

941
00:45:00.599 --> 00:45:04.039
Jason was within his rights to withhold visitation. They had

942
00:45:04.079 --> 00:45:07.480
no legal standing. Jason had all of the power. The

943
00:45:07.519 --> 00:45:10.400
best advice that the attorney could give them was to

944
00:45:10.400 --> 00:45:12.960
stay on Jason's good side and maybe you'll get to

945
00:45:13.000 --> 00:45:17.320
see Cassidy more. During one visit, supervised by Jason's mother, Pat,

946
00:45:17.559 --> 00:45:21.360
she pressured them to publicly support him. Meredith said, quote,

947
00:45:21.559 --> 00:45:24.880
We'd be happy to support Jason publicly once he starts

948
00:45:24.960 --> 00:45:28.960
cooperating with the police. Pat replied, if you won't retract

949
00:45:28.960 --> 00:45:32.440
that statement, If you won't support Jason publicly, I'm afraid

950
00:45:32.480 --> 00:45:35.360
that we can't arrange for any more visits with Cassidy.

951
00:45:35.840 --> 00:45:38.360
And that was that. Pat severed ties with them, and

952
00:45:38.559 --> 00:45:42.239
any contact with Cassidy ended for over a year, until

953
00:45:42.239 --> 00:45:45.239
her fourth birthday in March two thousand and eight. What

954
00:45:45.320 --> 00:45:48.760
Linda and Meredith did next was underhanded, but they were

955
00:45:48.760 --> 00:45:51.719
desperate to see Cassidy so she could see them and

956
00:45:51.760 --> 00:45:54.480
remember how much they loved her. She's still so young,

957
00:45:54.519 --> 00:45:57.679
it's so important in those first years too.

958
00:45:57.760 --> 00:46:00.800
Yeah, have some kind of continuity with people that she

959
00:46:01.159 --> 00:46:02.039
spent time with them.

960
00:46:02.119 --> 00:46:02.800
Yeah.

961
00:46:02.960 --> 00:46:05.880
So they showed up at her daycare with presents, balloons,

962
00:46:05.920 --> 00:46:09.880
and cupcakes for the whole class. Surprisingly, they were allowed

963
00:46:09.880 --> 00:46:11.840
to see her and spend the afternoon with her in

964
00:46:11.880 --> 00:46:15.119
the classroom. Days before Mother's Day, they were again allowed

965
00:46:15.119 --> 00:46:18.079
to see Cassidy at the daycare. It was spa day

966
00:46:18.159 --> 00:46:20.920
for all of the mothers, and the moms were there

967
00:46:20.960 --> 00:46:23.920
to be pampered by their preschoolers, and no one was

968
00:46:23.960 --> 00:46:26.159
there for Cassidy that day. Had they not been there,

969
00:46:26.159 --> 00:46:28.480
can you imagine how broken hearted she would have been.

970
00:46:29.159 --> 00:46:31.719
So they hired an attorney who was able to negotiate

971
00:46:31.760 --> 00:46:34.599
with Jason for more time with Cassidy, and they even

972
00:46:34.639 --> 00:46:37.559
had an unsupervised weekend in New York with her. But

973
00:46:37.639 --> 00:46:40.679
Jason still held all the cards and refused to enter

974
00:46:41.000 --> 00:46:45.159
into any kind of formal agreement. After Meredith found Michelle

975
00:46:45.239 --> 00:46:48.559
dead and called nine one one, the investigation quickly ensued.

976
00:46:49.000 --> 00:46:52.039
Twenty investigators were assigned to the case that was receiving

977
00:46:52.119 --> 00:46:54.840
a lot of attention from the public and the media.

978
00:46:55.400 --> 00:46:58.320
There were no signs of forced entry or missing items.

979
00:46:58.559 --> 00:47:01.039
Actually that's not right. We'll get to that in a minute.

980
00:47:01.119 --> 00:47:04.480
And the crime scene appeared remarkably clean. The only blood

981
00:47:04.480 --> 00:47:07.880
discovered on the first floor consisted of two small droplets

982
00:47:07.920 --> 00:47:11.000
on the doorknob leading from the kitchen to the garage.

983
00:47:11.599 --> 00:47:13.880
What does that say to you If the blood is

984
00:47:13.920 --> 00:47:16.559
on the door from the kitchen to the garage.

985
00:47:16.400 --> 00:47:18.880
It says that someone was going out from the kitchen

986
00:47:18.920 --> 00:47:19.800
to the garage.

987
00:47:20.280 --> 00:47:22.400
Well, who uses the door between the kitchen and the

988
00:47:22.400 --> 00:47:22.920
garage and.

989
00:47:22.880 --> 00:47:24.840
Most homes the people that live there.

990
00:47:25.320 --> 00:47:29.159
There the second floor was a heartbreaking scene. Small bloody

991
00:47:29.199 --> 00:47:33.039
footprints and handprints from Cassidy were all over. One thing

992
00:47:33.079 --> 00:47:36.599
that baffled investigators is that, considering what she'd been through

993
00:47:36.880 --> 00:47:39.559
and the bloody state of the crime scene, Cassidy was

994
00:47:39.599 --> 00:47:43.280
found in Michelle's bed. She was clean and dry, and

995
00:47:43.320 --> 00:47:46.119
half of Michelle's bed had her blood in it, but

996
00:47:46.239 --> 00:47:49.880
Jason's side did not. So Cassidy was only two and

997
00:47:49.960 --> 00:47:52.239
a half, she wasn't wearing a diaper, and she hadn't

998
00:47:52.280 --> 00:47:56.519
soiled herself. I'm not sure how long Cassidy was left alone,

999
00:47:56.679 --> 00:48:00.199
but it was a long time. Shelley left at ten thirty,

1000
00:48:00.519 --> 00:48:03.119
so We're not sure what time Michelle.

1001
00:48:02.719 --> 00:48:05.920
Was killed, but so Shelley left at ten thirty the

1002
00:48:06.000 --> 00:48:09.880
night before, right her body was found and Cassidy was

1003
00:48:09.920 --> 00:48:10.760
found at what.

1004
00:48:10.840 --> 00:48:14.559
Time Meredith got to the house around one fifteen? Okay,

1005
00:48:14.880 --> 00:48:18.159
And so Cassidy, I've heard different differing accounts. But she

1006
00:48:18.239 --> 00:48:19.559
was a really smart little girl.

1007
00:48:19.719 --> 00:48:20.519
Yeah she was.

1008
00:48:20.719 --> 00:48:22.639
I think she was potty training. I'm not sure if

1009
00:48:22.679 --> 00:48:25.159
she was completely potty trained, but for two and a

1010
00:48:25.199 --> 00:48:26.960
half year old to be dry all night.

1011
00:48:27.000 --> 00:48:30.239
Yeah, very unusually fifteen hours. So yeah, it's quite a bit.

1012
00:48:30.559 --> 00:48:33.800
And also, mister Garrison, the dog hadn't left any bloody

1013
00:48:33.800 --> 00:48:36.639
footprints in the house, and how is that possible?

1014
00:48:36.920 --> 00:48:39.760
I wonder how it's possible that there weren't bloody footprints

1015
00:48:39.760 --> 00:48:42.719
from the perpetrator too, I mean, just in a scene

1016
00:48:42.760 --> 00:48:44.159
that's that bloody.

1017
00:48:44.400 --> 00:48:46.679
You were again, it really hard, very similar to the

1018
00:48:46.719 --> 00:48:47.400
David Hunters.

1019
00:48:47.480 --> 00:48:49.760
Yes, there's no how does that happen?

1020
00:48:50.079 --> 00:48:52.599
I'm wondering if mister Garrison was one of those dogs

1021
00:48:52.639 --> 00:48:56.639
that was super well trained and wasn't allowed to go upstairs.

1022
00:48:56.920 --> 00:48:57.880
Oh maybe, which.

1023
00:48:57.800 --> 00:49:00.960
Seems unlikely that there's you know, a murder happy that

1024
00:49:01.000 --> 00:49:05.360
the dog you wouldn't try to do yeah, but maybe

1025
00:49:05.400 --> 00:49:08.440
he was outside. In the primary bedroom, it looked as

1026
00:49:08.480 --> 00:49:11.000
if Michelle had been attacked in her sleep. Her side

1027
00:49:11.000 --> 00:49:12.800
of the bed was soaked in blood, and it had

1028
00:49:12.920 --> 00:49:15.719
dripped out of the carpet blow and even through the ceiling.

1029
00:49:16.119 --> 00:49:18.519
Michelle was lying face down on the floor between the

1030
00:49:18.519 --> 00:49:21.440
bed and the closet. Cassidy had placed a baby dell

1031
00:49:21.480 --> 00:49:24.440
by her mother's head as if to comfort her. The door.

1032
00:49:24.440 --> 00:49:27.159
You're gonna make me cry with yours, you know, it's

1033
00:49:27.199 --> 00:49:32.320
really sad. Someone had opened the closet door, but during

1034
00:49:32.360 --> 00:49:34.880
the murder, the door had been closed. Because there was

1035
00:49:34.920 --> 00:49:37.920
blood spatter on it, the closet looked like it had

1036
00:49:37.960 --> 00:49:43.159
been ransacked. Detective Sergeant Richard Spidey later said Michelle's murder

1037
00:49:43.280 --> 00:49:46.760
was quote the most severe physical beating I've ever seen

1038
00:49:46.880 --> 00:49:51.519
someone encounter. Pretty extreme, a pretty vicious attack that she underwent.

1039
00:49:52.159 --> 00:49:55.280
All of the blood found upstairs was Michelle's. The only

1040
00:49:55.360 --> 00:49:58.519
clue was a decorative white pillow that had been stepped on,

1041
00:49:58.679 --> 00:50:02.599
revealing two blood each. Shoe imprints. The bathrooms were free

1042
00:50:02.599 --> 00:50:06.519
from blood evidence other than Cassidy's footprints. There was a

1043
00:50:06.559 --> 00:50:09.119
hose outside in the walkway in the rear of the

1044
00:50:09.159 --> 00:50:12.119
house that had a slow trickle. Well, no blood was

1045
00:50:12.159 --> 00:50:15.360
found there either had someone tried to clean up outside

1046
00:50:15.360 --> 00:50:17.679
and left the hose trickling, so it would have washed

1047
00:50:17.679 --> 00:50:21.960
away any blood evidence. So I said earlier that nothing

1048
00:50:22.000 --> 00:50:24.000
was missing from the house, but there were two drawers

1049
00:50:24.000 --> 00:50:27.079
from Michelle's jewelry rocks that were missing, as were her

1050
00:50:27.159 --> 00:50:31.039
engagement and wedding ring. The listings from eBay that Jason

1051
00:50:31.079 --> 00:50:34.639
had so desperately wanted Meredith to find were still on

1052
00:50:34.679 --> 00:50:38.119
the printer. They'd been printed out at seven oh eight pm,

1053
00:50:38.360 --> 00:50:41.800
just before Jason left on November two, and the auctions

1054
00:50:41.880 --> 00:50:46.159
closed at eight pm. This whole coach perse eBay auction

1055
00:50:46.440 --> 00:50:50.719
really has me suspicious. First of all, why would you

1056
00:50:50.760 --> 00:50:52.440
need to print out an eBay auction?

1057
00:50:52.960 --> 00:50:55.519
Right, Yeah, that doesn't make a lot of sense. And

1058
00:50:55.559 --> 00:50:58.599
why would you leave? So the auction was at.

1059
00:50:58.480 --> 00:51:00.760
Eight the auction ended it, So why.

1060
00:51:00.599 --> 00:51:03.159
Wouldn't he just wait, like if he really wanted it,

1061
00:51:03.199 --> 00:51:06.840
wouldn't he stick around and see if anybody out bid

1062
00:51:06.920 --> 00:51:09.800
him or try to, you know, make sure he got

1063
00:51:09.800 --> 00:51:10.400
it well.

1064
00:51:10.519 --> 00:51:13.079
Later he said that he was just printing them off

1065
00:51:13.119 --> 00:51:16.719
as examples of purses that he liked to show. I

1066
00:51:16.719 --> 00:51:18.280
think he was going to show them to Meredith and

1067
00:51:18.320 --> 00:51:21.239
get her approval on them, but yeah, it's all just

1068
00:51:22.360 --> 00:51:25.400
weak to me. After two weeks, the house was turned

1069
00:51:25.400 --> 00:51:28.440
back over to Jason. At that point, his sister Kim

1070
00:51:28.519 --> 00:51:32.960
paid for doctor Maurice Godwin to analyze the crime scene.

1071
00:51:33.079 --> 00:51:35.280
If you're a fan of true crime podcast, you might

1072
00:51:35.280 --> 00:51:38.719
have listened to Up and Vanished and doctor Maurice Godwin

1073
00:51:38.920 --> 00:51:42.440
is heavily featured in that show and really smart guy.

1074
00:51:42.800 --> 00:51:46.280
But Godwin found a few interesting things, one of Michelle's teeth,

1075
00:51:46.639 --> 00:51:50.360
an unidentified hair in the bedroom, and two cigarette butts

1076
00:51:50.400 --> 00:51:55.039
from two unidentified males. When the remaining drawers of Michelle's

1077
00:51:55.079 --> 00:51:58.519
jewelry box were swabbed for DNA, there was also unknown

1078
00:51:58.599 --> 00:52:03.320
DNA there. Jason's two thousand and four white Ford Explorer

1079
00:52:03.400 --> 00:52:06.039
and cell phone were seized. The vehicle was clean as

1080
00:52:06.079 --> 00:52:09.039
could be, not a speck of blood inside. There were

1081
00:52:09.039 --> 00:52:12.599
directions printed from map Quest and Atlas, a hotel receipt,

1082
00:52:12.719 --> 00:52:15.159
and a copy of the November third, two thousand and

1083
00:52:15.239 --> 00:52:18.880
six edition of The USA Today from the Hampton Inn.

1084
00:52:19.239 --> 00:52:22.280
I read a couple of articles from newspapers dot com

1085
00:52:22.320 --> 00:52:24.880
that actually is said that blood was found in the suv,

1086
00:52:25.480 --> 00:52:27.719
but it must have been something else other than blood

1087
00:52:27.760 --> 00:52:31.280
after the analysis came back, because initially they were like blood,

1088
00:52:31.360 --> 00:52:34.079
you know, blood found in Jason's car, but it was

1089
00:52:34.079 --> 00:52:37.079
not Michelle's blood. The newspaper delivery person was in the

1090
00:52:37.079 --> 00:52:40.400
Young's neighborhood sometime between three and four am and recalled

1091
00:52:40.400 --> 00:52:43.360
the Young's house being lit up brightly for that time

1092
00:52:43.400 --> 00:52:46.320
of the day and also noticed in suv parked in

1093
00:52:46.360 --> 00:52:48.840
front of the house and a grave aand parked across

1094
00:52:48.880 --> 00:52:49.360
the street.

1095
00:52:49.719 --> 00:52:53.199
The autopsy revealed that Michelle had been brutally attacked and beaten.

1096
00:52:53.599 --> 00:52:57.039
She had defensive wounds, scratches and abrasions on her right

1097
00:52:57.039 --> 00:52:59.760
hand and bruising on her left hand. She had as

1098
00:52:59.800 --> 00:53:02.679
many is thirty separate points of trauma on her head

1099
00:53:02.719 --> 00:53:06.519
from a blunt object and thirteen lacerations in a few

1100
00:53:06.559 --> 00:53:09.280
spots you could see her skull, and there was evidence

1101
00:53:09.320 --> 00:53:12.320
of brain hemorrhage. There was hair in Michelle's hand, but

1102
00:53:12.559 --> 00:53:15.079
it was found to be her own. The exact murder

1103
00:53:15.119 --> 00:53:19.039
weapon could not be identified, but the crescent shaped lacerations

1104
00:53:19.199 --> 00:53:22.679
suggested it was a heavy blunt object with a rounded edge.

1105
00:53:23.039 --> 00:53:25.280
There was a gouge on one of the bedroom walls

1106
00:53:25.280 --> 00:53:28.719
that matched the shape. Michelle also suffered at least one

1107
00:53:28.719 --> 00:53:31.559
devastating blow to the face, which broke her jaw and

1108
00:53:31.639 --> 00:53:34.719
knocked out several of her teeth. There was also bruising

1109
00:53:34.760 --> 00:53:37.440
on her neck and evidence of imprints from her own

1110
00:53:37.480 --> 00:53:41.199
fingernails trying to loosen the strangler's grasp. There was no

1111
00:53:41.280 --> 00:53:44.760
evidence of sexual assault. Her time of death was unable

1112
00:53:44.760 --> 00:53:48.519
to be determined, but likely between midnight and six am.

1113
00:53:48.719 --> 00:53:51.360
Her cause of death was blunt force trauma, and the

1114
00:53:51.400 --> 00:53:52.960
manner of death homicide.

1115
00:53:53.360 --> 00:53:55.199
A brutal beating.

1116
00:53:55.039 --> 00:53:57.679
Really brutal, and usually when you hear that type of thing,

1117
00:53:57.760 --> 00:54:01.840
it's something personal, a random intruder.

1118
00:54:02.280 --> 00:54:06.239
Right to make those wounds and lacerations, you have to

1119
00:54:06.239 --> 00:54:09.519
be pretty close up, and I think that's usually indicative

1120
00:54:09.639 --> 00:54:11.079
of a personal attack.

1121
00:54:11.199 --> 00:54:11.440
Yeah.

1122
00:54:12.119 --> 00:54:15.199
Investigators headed to the Hampton Inn in Virginia, where Jason

1123
00:54:15.239 --> 00:54:18.119
had stayed, one hundred and sixty nine miles from Raleigh,

1124
00:54:18.159 --> 00:54:20.960
about a two hour and forty five minute drive, but

1125
00:54:21.119 --> 00:54:23.280
it could be done in as short as two hours

1126
00:54:23.280 --> 00:54:27.039
and twenty five minutes. Could Jason have checked in driven

1127
00:54:27.079 --> 00:54:30.320
back to Raleigh killed Michelle driven back to the Hampton

1128
00:54:30.400 --> 00:54:33.360
in and then checked out the following morning. That's what

1129
00:54:33.480 --> 00:54:36.360
law enforcement was trying to find out. His room had

1130
00:54:36.360 --> 00:54:39.800
been cleaned, but no blood evidence was found. Thanks to

1131
00:54:39.880 --> 00:54:42.920
hotel surveillance and his key card, we know that Jason

1132
00:54:43.039 --> 00:54:45.280
arrived at the hotel at ten to fifty pm on

1133
00:54:45.360 --> 00:54:48.039
November two and opened the door to his room at

1134
00:54:48.119 --> 00:54:51.000
ten fifty six. It was the only time he used

1135
00:54:51.000 --> 00:54:54.320
the key card during his stay. At midnight, Jason was

1136
00:54:54.360 --> 00:54:57.280
seen at the hotel's front desk and again shortly after

1137
00:54:57.400 --> 00:55:00.000
at the west side entrance, this time wearing a different

1138
00:55:00.239 --> 00:55:02.400
shirt than he had worn it check in a dark

1139
00:55:02.440 --> 00:55:05.559
colored sweater with a thin white stripe. This was the

1140
00:55:05.639 --> 00:55:08.760
last time that Jason appeared on the hotel's surveillance camera.

1141
00:55:09.079 --> 00:55:10.880
All right, so I'm a little bit confused. So he

1142
00:55:11.440 --> 00:55:13.239
used his key card to get into his room at

1143
00:55:13.280 --> 00:55:16.159
ten fifty six pm, and that was the only time

1144
00:55:16.199 --> 00:55:18.599
he used his key card, Yes, But he was seen

1145
00:55:18.599 --> 00:55:21.480
at the front desk at midnight. Yes, So that's implying

1146
00:55:21.519 --> 00:55:23.559
that he never went like he left his room, and

1147
00:55:23.599 --> 00:55:27.239
he never went back after ten fifty six or whenever

1148
00:55:27.280 --> 00:55:27.679
he left.

1149
00:55:27.880 --> 00:55:30.360
I think that he did go back, but he didn't

1150
00:55:30.440 --> 00:55:31.559
let the door latch.

1151
00:55:31.920 --> 00:55:32.639
Oh, it's like.

1152
00:55:32.639 --> 00:55:34.199
When he left the room, you know how you can

1153
00:55:34.280 --> 00:55:35.079
kind of leave.

1154
00:55:34.920 --> 00:55:37.840
It, Yeah, just prop open just a little bit.

1155
00:55:38.000 --> 00:55:40.440
Yeah, yeah, and I believe that's what he did, so

1156
00:55:40.480 --> 00:55:44.079
there would be him coming and going. Interesting later he

1157
00:55:44.199 --> 00:55:46.960
would say that, you know, I didn't want to disturb

1158
00:55:47.039 --> 00:55:50.280
anyone by using my key card. But that's really not

1159
00:55:50.480 --> 00:55:51.920
very disruptive to hear.

1160
00:55:52.360 --> 00:55:54.760
So he admitted that he did leave the door cracked open,

1161
00:55:54.840 --> 00:55:56.760
but he said, I just did it because I didn't

1162
00:55:56.760 --> 00:56:01.400
want to disturb anyone. Yes, okay, interesting, but is.

1163
00:56:01.360 --> 00:56:03.679
That disruptive to hear someone open their door with a

1164
00:56:03.760 --> 00:56:04.239
key card?

1165
00:56:04.360 --> 00:56:07.599
Hotels can be Hotel doors can be loud when they close,

1166
00:56:08.000 --> 00:56:09.960
yeah for sure. But yeah, but you can you can

1167
00:56:10.000 --> 00:56:12.280
also make sure it doesn't close loudly if you don't

1168
00:56:12.280 --> 00:56:13.119
want to disturb anything.

1169
00:56:13.199 --> 00:56:15.559
Yeah, but the you know, the noise that your key

1170
00:56:15.599 --> 00:56:18.480
card makes is usually you know, that was not disruptive, No.

1171
00:56:18.599 --> 00:56:21.679
For sure. Early the next morning, around four am, a

1172
00:56:21.719 --> 00:56:25.639
hotel employee found a small red landscaping rock propping the

1173
00:56:25.679 --> 00:56:29.840
side entrance door open and the security camera unplugged. The

1174
00:56:29.880 --> 00:56:32.280
maintenance man plugged the camera in and went to the

1175
00:56:32.320 --> 00:56:34.960
office to ensure the camera was positioned at the right

1176
00:56:35.000 --> 00:56:38.639
angle to capture the door, But by six thirty five am,

1177
00:56:38.760 --> 00:56:42.000
someone had repositioned the camera and pointed it at the ceiling.

1178
00:56:42.440 --> 00:56:45.519
So if Jason had left the hotel, driven to Raleigh,

1179
00:56:45.679 --> 00:56:48.480
killed Michelle, and durned back to the Hampton in this

1180
00:56:48.599 --> 00:56:51.840
does fit the timeline. He'd been gone for about six

1181
00:56:51.880 --> 00:56:54.280
and a half hours. Remember he the last time he

1182
00:56:54.360 --> 00:56:57.559
was seen was eleven to fifty nine at the front desk.

1183
00:56:57.639 --> 00:57:01.079
Okay, Yeah, Jason never checked out of the hotel, but

1184
00:57:01.239 --> 00:57:03.960
cell phone records showed that his phone pinged a tower

1185
00:57:04.039 --> 00:57:08.280
in Wytheville, Virginia, twenty seven miles from Hillsville, at seven

1186
00:57:08.400 --> 00:57:11.559
forty am on November third. He would have had plenty

1187
00:57:11.559 --> 00:57:14.119
of time to shower and get ready before hitting the road.

1188
00:57:14.679 --> 00:57:17.360
One thing that hung up investigators, however, was that they

1189
00:57:17.400 --> 00:57:20.920
couldn't find proof that Jason had refueled he had filled

1190
00:57:21.000 --> 00:57:22.719
up his tank on his way out of town on

1191
00:57:22.760 --> 00:57:26.239
November two. Investigators were fairly certain that he would have

1192
00:57:26.360 --> 00:57:28.719
needed to refuel the twenty two and a half gallon

1193
00:57:28.800 --> 00:57:32.039
gas tank of his white Ford Explorer on the way

1194
00:57:32.079 --> 00:57:36.000
back to Hillsville sometime between four and six am on

1195
00:57:36.039 --> 00:57:40.000
November third. He did fill up later around noon that day.

1196
00:57:40.679 --> 00:57:43.679
Investigators went to every gas station along the highway on

1197
00:57:43.760 --> 00:57:46.760
Jason's route to see if a gas station employee could

1198
00:57:46.760 --> 00:57:49.480
id him. They got lucky when a young woman in

1199
00:57:49.599 --> 00:57:53.400
king North Carolina working at a BP station remembered a

1200
00:57:53.440 --> 00:57:56.840
man matching Jason's description pulling up to a pump around

1201
00:57:56.920 --> 00:57:59.239
five point thirty. When she didn't turn the pump on,

1202
00:57:59.480 --> 00:58:02.280
he walked in to the station, cursed at her angrily

1203
00:58:02.559 --> 00:58:05.000
and demanded that she turn on the pump, throwing a

1204
00:58:05.000 --> 00:58:06.440
twenty dollars bill in her face.

1205
00:58:06.599 --> 00:58:08.800
So, at that time of the day, when you're getting gased,

1206
00:58:08.840 --> 00:58:12.360
you need to provide some sort of id uh huh,

1207
00:58:12.400 --> 00:58:13.400
And he didn't want.

1208
00:58:13.199 --> 00:58:13.559
To do that.

1209
00:58:13.840 --> 00:58:16.440
Okay. If that was Jason, though, I'll just say that

1210
00:58:16.840 --> 00:58:18.960
it seems it would seem odd for him to like

1211
00:58:19.079 --> 00:58:22.039
curse at someone angrily because then they'd be more likely

1212
00:58:22.079 --> 00:58:22.920
to remember him.

1213
00:58:23.280 --> 00:58:27.079
Yeah. Absolutely, But a narcissist doesn't think about things like that.

1214
00:58:27.559 --> 00:58:30.039
Okay, Yeah, it could be. The man filled his tank

1215
00:58:30.079 --> 00:58:32.719
with fifteen dollars of gas and then drove off. He

1216
00:58:32.800 --> 00:58:35.400
didn't re enter the store to get his change. Do

1217
00:58:35.400 --> 00:58:38.440
we know how how sure this gas station employee was

1218
00:58:39.039 --> 00:58:41.800
that it was Jason, Like, looking at the picture, was

1219
00:58:41.840 --> 00:58:44.840
it a positive identification or was it more tentative.

1220
00:58:45.400 --> 00:58:48.639
I believe she was like, yes, that's him. But we

1221
00:58:48.800 --> 00:58:50.559
will get to that in part two.

1222
00:58:50.760 --> 00:58:54.000
Okay, And this gas station visit fits the timeline too.

1223
00:58:54.320 --> 00:58:58.800
King North Carolina is about fifty minutes from Hillsville, Virginia.

1224
00:58:58.920 --> 00:59:02.679
Police soon discovered Michelle's two million dollar life insurance policy

1225
00:59:02.719 --> 00:59:06.199
with Jason as the sole beneficiary. Due to a double

1226
00:59:06.239 --> 00:59:10.440
indemnity clause, Jason could receive four million dollars at six

1227
00:59:10.480 --> 00:59:13.800
point four million adjusted for inflation, that's a lot of money.

1228
00:59:13.800 --> 00:59:15.679
That is a lot. But it was likely that the

1229
00:59:15.719 --> 00:59:19.320
insurer Prudential would dispute that the policy had been purchased

1230
00:59:19.639 --> 00:59:23.079
under fraudulent circumstances. In other words, he had planned to

1231
00:59:23.119 --> 00:59:26.320
kill Michelle. So just a few days into the investigation,

1232
00:59:26.440 --> 00:59:29.840
the police were feeling good about the case. Although Jason refused,

1233
00:59:30.039 --> 00:59:33.039
on the advice of his attorney, to cooperate with their investigation,

1234
00:59:33.480 --> 00:59:36.039
he had not been questioned at all, nor had he

1235
00:59:36.119 --> 00:59:38.599
asked for any information about the investigation.

1236
00:59:39.480 --> 00:59:42.800
Is shocking that he never answered a question.

1237
00:59:43.079 --> 00:59:45.440
That's so far. To me, that is probably the biggest

1238
00:59:45.480 --> 00:59:46.039
red flag.

1239
00:59:46.280 --> 00:59:50.400
Yeah, as the investigation into Jason heated up, law enforcement

1240
00:59:50.440 --> 00:59:53.639
focused on his cell phone. In two thousand and six,

1241
00:59:53.840 --> 00:59:57.559
around seventy eight percent of US adults owned a cell phone,

1242
00:59:58.000 --> 01:00:01.159
and that year marked a turning point for text messaging

1243
01:00:01.239 --> 01:00:04.400
in the United States. Roughly two hundred and eighteen billion

1244
01:00:04.440 --> 01:00:07.760
text messages were sent in the US, up from one

1245
01:00:07.880 --> 01:00:11.119
hundred and fifty eight billion the previous year. I'm just

1246
01:00:11.159 --> 01:00:13.199
taking you on a little bit of a rabbit hole

1247
01:00:13.280 --> 01:00:18.400
because this time in our history is really interesting to me.

1248
01:00:18.719 --> 01:00:24.239
When communication really changed. Globally, over one point eight trillion

1249
01:00:24.320 --> 01:00:28.239
text messages were sent about five billion per day, with

1250
01:00:28.559 --> 01:00:33.119
SMS technology having taken off earlier and quicker in Asia

1251
01:00:33.119 --> 01:00:36.079
and Europe. The launch of the iPhone in two thousand

1252
01:00:36.079 --> 01:00:40.079
and seven accelerated mobile communication trends, setting this stage for

1253
01:00:40.159 --> 01:00:44.079
the explosive growth of texting and smartphone use in the

1254
01:00:44.159 --> 01:00:50.039
years that followed, and forever making telephone conversations awkward. I

1255
01:00:50.039 --> 01:00:52.639
always try to remember this in cases. Two thousand and

1256
01:00:52.639 --> 01:00:55.480
seven is when the iPhone was invented, and that really

1257
01:00:55.559 --> 01:00:59.199
changed a lot because we all had GPS technology on

1258
01:00:59.239 --> 01:01:02.679
our phone. And it changed the world of true crime

1259
01:01:02.719 --> 01:01:06.480
a lot. Yeah, absolutely, people became easier to track the

1260
01:01:06.559 --> 01:01:10.239
Jason's cell phone usage revealed a disturbing truth. He and

1261
01:01:10.280 --> 01:01:13.760
Michelle Money had been carrying on an affair. There were

1262
01:01:13.800 --> 01:01:17.199
more than four hundred text messages between them, fifty alone

1263
01:01:17.239 --> 01:01:19.960
on the day of Michelle's murder. He hadn't done anything

1264
01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:22.960
else to delete the messages. A two thousand and six

1265
01:01:23.039 --> 01:01:26.159
cell phone could delete texts from the user's view, but

1266
01:01:26.239 --> 01:01:30.519
the deletion wasn't always permanent, especially if law enforcement had

1267
01:01:30.559 --> 01:01:34.079
access to the device and used forensic tools before the

1268
01:01:34.159 --> 01:01:37.920
data was overwritten. Jason and Michelle Money had spoken on

1269
01:01:37.920 --> 01:01:41.360
the phone about fifteen minutes before he allegedly left the

1270
01:01:41.360 --> 01:01:44.320
Hampton and to travel back to Raleigh, and then called

1271
01:01:44.320 --> 01:01:47.039
her again the next morning at seven forty nine am,

1272
01:01:47.079 --> 01:01:49.519
and several more times throughout the day as he drove

1273
01:01:49.599 --> 01:01:52.519
to his mother's house after his sales calls. His phone

1274
01:01:52.559 --> 01:01:56.280
records indicate that between seven forty am and one thirty

1275
01:01:56.360 --> 01:02:00.840
seven pm, there were twenty eight calls to his mother. Wow,

1276
01:02:01.159 --> 01:02:04.320
I know, I don't know how that's even possible. That's yeah, well,

1277
01:02:04.400 --> 01:02:07.840
Signs pointed to Jason as Michelle's killer. The case against

1278
01:02:07.920 --> 01:02:12.599
him was built entirely on circumstantial evidence and coincidence. There

1279
01:02:12.639 --> 01:02:16.280
was no murder weapon, no white witness, and no forensic

1280
01:02:16.320 --> 01:02:19.960
evidence directly linking him to the crime, at least not

1281
01:02:20.480 --> 01:02:24.599
yet intriguing. Are you ready to put your thinking cap on?

1282
01:02:24.760 --> 01:02:27.000
And asks answers some quse, I always have my thinking

1283
01:02:27.039 --> 01:02:27.440
cap on.

1284
01:02:27.679 --> 01:02:30.840
So so far, what is the evidence against Jason's.

1285
01:02:30.239 --> 01:02:32.559
Not much, there's none. I mean, well, there's the gas

1286
01:02:32.599 --> 01:02:35.960
station witness. I mean, if she really saw him, that's

1287
01:02:36.000 --> 01:02:40.000
obviously very very suspicious. And everything else is very circumstantial.

1288
01:02:40.079 --> 01:02:44.239
Life insurance policy girlfriend, yes, you know those type of things.

1289
01:02:43.960 --> 01:02:49.039
His contentious relationship with Linda, his hard partying lifestyle. Yeah,

1290
01:02:49.079 --> 01:02:52.320
he was seen leaving the hotel. The whole hotel security

1291
01:02:52.360 --> 01:02:55.639
camera was unplugged and moved the rock in the side

1292
01:02:55.679 --> 01:02:58.280
door of the Hampton Inn. He only used his key

1293
01:02:58.320 --> 01:02:58.880
card once.

1294
01:02:59.239 --> 01:03:01.239
I would venture. I guess a lot of people put

1295
01:03:01.239 --> 01:03:03.360
a rock in the door of the Hampton In though,

1296
01:03:03.400 --> 01:03:05.840
Like people go out for a cigarette or something, and

1297
01:03:06.000 --> 01:03:07.760
I've seen that happen a lot of times at hotels

1298
01:03:07.800 --> 01:03:08.159
I've been out.

1299
01:03:08.280 --> 01:03:11.039
We actually said they had never seen that happen. Before.

1300
01:03:11.960 --> 01:03:13.519
But the door, and this is important, we're going to

1301
01:03:13.519 --> 01:03:15.920
talk about it more in part two. The door was

1302
01:03:15.960 --> 01:03:19.280
only locked between eleven PM and six am, Okay, so

1303
01:03:19.599 --> 01:03:21.880
most people would be sleeping during that time, So maybe

1304
01:03:21.960 --> 01:03:24.679
that's why it hadn't been an issue previously. The other

1305
01:03:24.719 --> 01:03:27.400
things I find suspicious are that he used his key

1306
01:03:27.440 --> 01:03:32.320
card once he changed his shirt, he didn't cooperate with

1307
01:03:32.360 --> 01:03:36.880
the police investigation, and he took the map quest directions

1308
01:03:37.039 --> 01:03:40.199
off of the printer but left the eBay thing there.

1309
01:03:40.679 --> 01:03:42.079
That didn't make any sense.

1310
01:03:41.800 --> 01:03:44.440
All right, But yeah, that's pretty weird. And the fact

1311
01:03:44.480 --> 01:03:47.519
that he was so insistent on calling Meredith and telling

1312
01:03:47.559 --> 01:03:49.440
her to go over and get the eBay thing, it

1313
01:03:49.559 --> 01:03:51.679
just seems a little suspicious as well.

1314
01:03:51.960 --> 01:03:54.519
And how much do you hate him for leaving sweet

1315
01:03:54.599 --> 01:03:56.679
little Cassidy alone?

1316
01:03:56.800 --> 01:03:56.920
Well?

1317
01:03:57.000 --> 01:03:59.679
Yeah, if he, assuming he did the crime, that.

1318
01:03:59.679 --> 01:04:01.400
Is, Yeah, that's unforgivable.

1319
01:04:01.480 --> 01:04:04.119
Well, the whole thing is unforgivable. Yeah, leaving a two

1320
01:04:04.159 --> 01:04:06.440
to two and a half year old at that scene,

1321
01:04:06.480 --> 01:04:09.800
I mean, that's just that's that's really really bad, right.

1322
01:04:10.000 --> 01:04:12.840
And who else would have had a motive in this situation?

1323
01:04:13.400 --> 01:04:14.559
Yeah, nobody would have.

1324
01:04:15.199 --> 01:04:18.000
Do you think that this circumstantial evidence is enough to

1325
01:04:18.119 --> 01:04:19.239
arrest Jason.

1326
01:04:19.960 --> 01:04:22.360
It doesn't really seem like it to me so far.

1327
01:04:22.840 --> 01:04:27.360
I am still baffled that there was no forensic evidence. Obviously,

1328
01:04:27.480 --> 01:04:29.559
Jason lived in the house, so his DNA is going

1329
01:04:29.639 --> 01:04:31.679
to be there, and you know, his fingerprints are going

1330
01:04:31.679 --> 01:04:33.320
to be all over the house. But just with a

1331
01:04:33.440 --> 01:04:36.480
beating that brutal and with that much blood, it's just

1332
01:04:36.840 --> 01:04:40.239
pretty amazing to me that they didn't find more.

1333
01:04:40.719 --> 01:04:43.000
Again, like David Hendrick, because I spent a lot of

1334
01:04:43.039 --> 01:04:46.239
time thinking about how they possibly could get away with this,

1335
01:04:47.280 --> 01:04:50.880
and I'm wondering, if you know, he worked with a

1336
01:04:50.920 --> 01:04:54.440
lot of hospitals, could he have had some sort of

1337
01:04:54.519 --> 01:05:00.320
hasmat suit, covered himself up, warren gloves and you know,

1338
01:05:00.440 --> 01:05:03.280
had some towel or a trash bag or something there

1339
01:05:03.360 --> 01:05:06.719
that after he did the murder, he could put, you know,

1340
01:05:06.840 --> 01:05:09.760
take it all off, carefully, put it into the trash

1341
01:05:09.800 --> 01:05:12.440
band bag and take it with him maybe and dump

1342
01:05:12.480 --> 01:05:14.079
it somewhere along the route.

1343
01:05:14.159 --> 01:05:16.639
Yeah, I mean that would require a lot of planning

1344
01:05:16.719 --> 01:05:20.559
and very meticulously well thought out, you know, approach to it.

1345
01:05:20.639 --> 01:05:23.440
But yeah, it certainly makes sense that that might have happened.

1346
01:05:24.000 --> 01:05:27.440
In my thinking, The only way that I can eliminate

1347
01:05:27.519 --> 01:05:29.960
Jason as a suspect is if he said, oh, well,

1348
01:05:29.960 --> 01:05:31.880
I was going to go meet with this other woman.

1349
01:05:32.159 --> 01:05:34.719
Mm hmmm, And so far he has not said that.

1350
01:05:35.000 --> 01:05:35.159
Well.

1351
01:05:35.159 --> 01:05:37.239
I do think though the fact that he called her

1352
01:05:37.559 --> 01:05:39.760
the other woman a lot. He called her a lot

1353
01:05:39.800 --> 01:05:42.679
the next day, right, mm hmm. That seems if you

1354
01:05:43.400 --> 01:05:46.119
were with another woman and you killed your wife, I

1355
01:05:46.119 --> 01:05:47.960
would think you would be like, I'm not going to

1356
01:05:48.039 --> 01:05:51.760
call Michelle money anymore because I'm not. I don't want

1357
01:05:52.079 --> 01:05:54.559
to appear suspicious. So it almost seems but.

1358
01:05:54.599 --> 01:05:56.679
It would have appeared suspicious if he didn't call her.

1359
01:05:56.920 --> 01:05:59.079
Yeah, I guess if he thought through it that much,

1360
01:05:59.119 --> 01:06:01.280
he you know, he would have wanted to act the

1361
01:06:01.320 --> 01:06:04.679
same way he would have acted if nothing had if

1362
01:06:04.679 --> 01:06:06.519
he hadn't done anything. So I guess.

1363
01:06:06.639 --> 01:06:09.320
But it's two thousand and six also, and I think

1364
01:06:09.400 --> 01:06:13.199
today we know that your cell phone is a key

1365
01:06:14.320 --> 01:06:16.920
in the investigation, but maybe in two thousand and six

1366
01:06:17.000 --> 01:06:19.880
he wasn't as aware of But we don't have his

1367
01:06:20.880 --> 01:06:23.119
location like we don't have he must have been smart

1368
01:06:23.239 --> 01:06:25.960
enough to leave the cell phone and the Hampton in

1369
01:06:27.119 --> 01:06:28.599
if he's always put the cart before that.

1370
01:06:29.119 --> 01:06:31.320
You seem like he did it. You seem like you've decided.

1371
01:06:31.599 --> 01:06:35.119
I'm still trying really hard to like not reveal that

1372
01:06:35.280 --> 01:06:36.559
until the end of episode two.

1373
01:06:36.639 --> 01:06:39.480
I'm still on the fence. So far, I'm leaning toward

1374
01:06:39.920 --> 01:06:42.280
you probably did, but I'm anxious to hear.

1375
01:06:42.480 --> 01:06:45.039
Yeah, You're gonna hear a lot more in part two. Yeah,

1376
01:06:45.119 --> 01:06:47.599
I'm sorry to leave you all in a cliffhanger again.

1377
01:06:47.960 --> 01:06:50.159
I don't think you are actually no, I really yeah,

1378
01:06:50.239 --> 01:06:52.360
I do feel bad, but you know.

1379
01:06:52.519 --> 01:06:55.079
Well, it's really interesting. I will definitely come back for

1380
01:06:55.079 --> 01:06:55.559
a part two.

1381
01:06:55.679 --> 01:06:59.679
As if Michelle seemed like just a gem of a woman.

1382
01:06:59.559 --> 01:07:01.400
Well and to and a half year old daughter, and

1383
01:07:01.440 --> 01:07:05.519
the fact that, yeah, the whole thing is very heartbreaking.

1384
01:07:13.480 --> 01:07:16.400
It sounds like Jason Young was on his phone all

1385
01:07:16.440 --> 01:07:19.679
the time, having actual at a lot of times with

1386
01:07:19.760 --> 01:07:21.599
his month. He really did love his mom, so I

1387
01:07:22.079 --> 01:07:25.119
do like that for him. Yeah, but he was on

1388
01:07:25.119 --> 01:07:27.639
his phone all the time talking to people, and it

1389
01:07:27.719 --> 01:07:30.719
made me feel like I almost never talked to it.

1390
01:07:30.800 --> 01:07:33.679
I am not a millennial. That is like a millennial

1391
01:07:33.719 --> 01:07:35.320
trait like millennials, you know, you see a lot of

1392
01:07:35.360 --> 01:07:38.119
memes about it. Millennials get anxious about being you know,

1393
01:07:38.199 --> 01:07:41.199
on an actual phone conversation. Yeah, we used to talk

1394
01:07:41.639 --> 01:07:44.000
for hours. Yeah, like when we first met, you know,

1395
01:07:44.039 --> 01:07:46.360
we were separated. You were here and I was you know,

1396
01:07:46.400 --> 01:07:49.280
in Illinois, and the amount that we used to have

1397
01:07:49.320 --> 01:07:52.159
to pay for a long distance was criminal, honestly, I

1398
01:07:52.159 --> 01:07:56.719
mean hundreds of dollars a month. And you were already

1399
01:07:57.199 --> 01:07:59.760
in your life and graduated from col and you took

1400
01:07:59.800 --> 01:08:02.519
the wordin't of that, but that was tricky. But just

1401
01:08:02.519 --> 01:08:05.000
what what the heck did we talk about? We didn't

1402
01:08:05.000 --> 01:08:07.199
even have Love Island to talk about? You know, there

1403
01:08:07.280 --> 01:08:10.599
is just like hours but not just do like you

1404
01:08:10.639 --> 01:08:13.599
know a lot of different I called friends and relatives.

1405
01:08:13.639 --> 01:08:16.399
And now I just rarely talk on the phone anymore.

1406
01:08:16.760 --> 01:08:19.920
Have we lost the ability to talk in real time?

1407
01:08:20.199 --> 01:08:23.279
I think maybe we? I think I have Well. I

1408
01:08:23.279 --> 01:08:25.760
think it's funny. When I travel for work, we rarely

1409
01:08:25.800 --> 01:08:27.880
speak on the phone. We text all the time.

1410
01:08:28.079 --> 01:08:29.960
Oh yeah, we never talk in the If you called me,

1411
01:08:29.960 --> 01:08:32.279
it'd be like, oh my god, what hospital are you in?

1412
01:08:32.399 --> 01:08:34.680
Are you okay? Did you have heart attack? It would

1413
01:08:34.680 --> 01:08:36.600
be really weird. I mean you do once in a

1414
01:08:36.640 --> 01:08:39.760
great while, like if you're if you're driving. Sometimes we'll talk.

1415
01:08:40.199 --> 01:08:42.840
You know, it's really funny. I wonder if other couples

1416
01:08:42.880 --> 01:08:44.279
do this. But a lot of time you're in your

1417
01:08:44.279 --> 01:08:48.640
office and I'll call you from the bedroom. I'll be like, oh, hey,

1418
01:08:49.600 --> 01:08:53.079
how much time do you get for manslaughter in the

1419
01:08:53.119 --> 01:08:55.159
state of California or whatever? It is, like, it'll be

1420
01:08:55.199 --> 01:08:56.239
something that I don't want to type.

1421
01:08:56.359 --> 01:08:58.279
That's true. We probably talk more on the phone when

1422
01:09:00.039 --> 01:09:00.680
I'm traveling.

1423
01:09:01.119 --> 01:09:03.800
I think we talk, But yeah, just in general, I

1424
01:09:03.800 --> 01:09:06.319
remember there were a few times that I literally talked

1425
01:09:06.319 --> 01:09:09.439
to people on the phone, like all night long. Yeah,

1426
01:09:09.439 --> 01:09:13.319
which it's baffling to me. I just don't have as

1427
01:09:13.399 --> 01:09:14.520
much to say anymore.

1428
01:09:14.920 --> 01:09:18.319
Yes, yeah, it is. Really things have changed very dramatically

1429
01:09:18.319 --> 01:09:20.119
when it comes to communication.

1430
01:09:20.399 --> 01:09:23.039
Well, on the iPhone, the iPhone, and you had a

1431
01:09:23.079 --> 01:09:25.760
BlackBerry before you had an iPhone, and you really loved

1432
01:09:25.760 --> 01:09:27.680
your BlackBerry. When did you have that?

1433
01:09:27.840 --> 01:09:29.800
Loved because I could play brick Breaker on it and

1434
01:09:29.840 --> 01:09:31.039
I was really really good.

1435
01:09:31.359 --> 01:09:34.239
I knew you couldn't say brick Baker without saying that

1436
01:09:34.319 --> 01:09:37.960
you were globally ranked or whatever. What was the other

1437
01:09:38.039 --> 01:09:41.079
game that you were like, globally rigked Doodles?

1438
01:09:41.199 --> 01:09:42.439
That was after the iPhone.

1439
01:09:42.479 --> 01:09:47.520
But yeah, yeah, I do miss playing those insipid games.

1440
01:09:47.239 --> 01:09:49.239
Like I played doodle Jump on my flight home.

1441
01:09:49.880 --> 01:09:50.479
Did you really?

1442
01:09:50.640 --> 01:09:53.520
I haven't played it in ages and ages school is

1443
01:09:53.520 --> 01:09:55.279
still up there. I was a little stressed out because

1444
01:09:55.279 --> 01:09:56.720
I knew we were going to be flying through like

1445
01:09:56.760 --> 01:09:59.680
thunderstorms and stuff like it really anxious and suddenly, but

1446
01:09:59.720 --> 01:10:03.159
I'm just I need something to distract me. And I

1447
01:10:03.760 --> 01:10:04.439
still got it.

1448
01:10:09.439 --> 01:10:13.239
You're such a humble man. So you still had doodle

1449
01:10:13.319 --> 01:10:14.239
Jump on your phone?

1450
01:10:14.560 --> 01:10:16.359
Yeah, it's still on that, okay.

1451
01:10:16.479 --> 01:10:19.079
Because I used to play a ton of games like

1452
01:10:19.439 --> 01:10:21.319
Candy Crush. I played a little bit, but there was

1453
01:10:21.680 --> 01:10:25.640
some game with a panda. There's the Fruits, the fruit

1454
01:10:25.760 --> 01:10:27.560
Ninja game. There was just a ton of them and

1455
01:10:27.600 --> 01:10:30.079
we loved them and we played them with their kids,

1456
01:10:30.079 --> 01:10:31.840
and are they still out there? And I just took

1457
01:10:31.920 --> 01:10:32.680
them off my phone.

1458
01:10:32.720 --> 01:10:35.680
I'm just assume. So I was thinking about Angry Birds

1459
01:10:35.720 --> 01:10:37.880
the other day, because yeah, that was a fun one.

1460
01:10:38.199 --> 01:10:40.399
Everybody went through a big Angry Birds phase. It was

1461
01:10:40.520 --> 01:10:41.000
such a fun.

1462
01:10:41.039 --> 01:10:43.319
No, let's bring it back. Let's have like a group

1463
01:10:43.439 --> 01:10:46.079
We'll have a group game and we'll start out Angry

1464
01:10:46.079 --> 01:10:50.079
Birds community. But maybe it was just old apps. Yeah,

1465
01:10:50.239 --> 01:10:53.439
what was the one? The bird one that like everyone

1466
01:10:53.520 --> 01:10:56.720
was obsessed with, super hard flatty Bird and then they

1467
01:10:56.720 --> 01:10:59.159
took it out of the store. We have one of

1468
01:10:59.199 --> 01:11:00.640
our bunch.

1469
01:11:00.399 --> 01:11:01.720
Of get out of the store. I can't remember.

1470
01:11:01.880 --> 01:11:04.159
I don't know if there was a controversy or yeah there.

1471
01:11:04.039 --> 01:11:06.279
Was something if, I don't remember, but I was never

1472
01:11:06.319 --> 01:11:07.479
that into that one.

1473
01:11:07.359 --> 01:11:10.159
What was really hard? One of our iPads somewhere has

1474
01:11:10.199 --> 01:11:15.039
it on it. But anyway, good times, good time. Well,

1475
01:11:15.079 --> 01:11:18.800
thank you again to Tracy and Chelsea for recommending this episode.

1476
01:11:19.000 --> 01:11:21.199
If you would like to listen to the conclusion of

1477
01:11:21.239 --> 01:11:24.760
this episode right now, please join us on Patreon dot

1478
01:11:24.800 --> 01:11:28.039
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1479
01:11:28.079 --> 01:11:31.840
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1480
01:11:31.880 --> 01:11:34.159
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1481
01:11:34.199 --> 01:11:37.439
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1482
01:11:37.479 --> 01:11:41.479
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1483
01:11:41.560 --> 01:11:44.119
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1484
01:11:44.159 --> 01:11:47.279
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1485
01:11:47.359 --> 01:11:50.119
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1486
01:11:50.159 --> 01:11:50.920
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1487
01:11:50.920 --> 01:11:53.439
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1488
01:11:53.439 --> 01:11:55.960
shout out on reddit like, especially in the True Crime

1489
01:11:56.399 --> 01:12:00.000
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1490
01:12:00.159 --> 01:12:02.000
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1491
01:12:02.319 --> 01:12:04.760
Until next time, don't kill your wife and don't kill

1492
01:12:04.800 --> 01:12:05.319
your husband.