Sheri and Chris Coleman - Part 2

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Hi. I'm Tina, and I'm
Rich. And if there's one thing we've

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learned in over twenty years of marriage, it's that some days you'll feel like

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killing your wife, and some days
you'll feel like killing your husband. Welcome

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to love, Mary, Kill,
Hi Rich, Hi Tina. How are

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where are you? I'm doing pretty
good? How are you? You're so

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kind and thoughtful, Like some husbands
bring their wife's flowers. What did you

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bring me today? I bought?
I brought you a Reese's peanut butter big

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cup with caramel, and a diet
and a diet. Ye, yeah,

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very nice. I would actually prefer
those things to flowers most of the time.

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I figured that I know you for
a time you brought flowers home.

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Though it's been maybe a week or
two, okay, maybe a little bit

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longer. You always tell me not
to bring you flowers. You're always like,

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oh, that's say it a lot, it's a waste. No,

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I think that it's don't bring me
flowers on Valentine's Day because then you know

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everything is four times is expensive.
Okay, No, you are lovely.

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You are the best partner I could
ask for. Honest to God, I

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could bring you flowers I mean sometimes
I just buy them myself, and I

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think that's sometimes I'm like, eh, you know, if I see some

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like this time of year, tulips, I love tulips this time of year.

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So yeah, well, I had
to buy the Reese's Big Cup with

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caramel because we saw an ad for
it the other day. And I think

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peanut butter, chocolate and caramel go
really well together. And you are a

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skeptic, so we're gonna find out. Yeah, and I brought you a

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snack as well, and I think
we have a lot to cover today,

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so we should kind of have our
snack and get right into it. We

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should get into it. And also
my snack is warm. But before we

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begin, this is part two of
Sherry and Chris Coleman just wanted to mention

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today's episode contains course language, adult
themes, and violence against women and children,

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so please listen with care. You
made me swear a lot on the

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last episode. I didn't make you. I think we both had to.

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I think, yeah, those those
letters were harsh. Yeah, Well,

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we're gonna do a quick recap,
but first let's well, let's eat the

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bonus snack you got and then the
one that I made real quick. Okay,

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well, I guess we should talk
about my snack. Yeah, okay,

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she is reaching for the snack.
Okay, so this is going with

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Like the snack, I think you
saw it being prepared in the kitchen,

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but like the snack that we had
the last episode was like the crackers,

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and like the pant it's kind of
a pantry snack. Your version of checks

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mix, Well it's not my version, but yeah, but this snack,

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it's a sentimental snack. It's I
remember when I was a little girl,

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I must have wanted to treat and
my mom's friend was staying with us and

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she made these salt I don't know
what you would even call them, saltines,

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s'mores, like ovens'mores. It's it's
the simplest thing in the world.

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But I love them. And you
guys are gonna laugh. But it's just

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a saltine cracker with peanut butter on
it, and then you put marshmallows on

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it and then you put them under
the broiler. But my addition since I

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was a kid, is I put
like five chocolate chips on it. Yeah,

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it's a lot like a s'more,
but with a saltine instead. Of

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a gram cracker, which I think
is genius, like a lot. Yeah,

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I think they're really good too.
Yeah. So anyway, we're gonna

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have our snack real quick, because
nothing goes better with podcasting than peanut butter.

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That's true. All right, we'll
be right back. Is your tummy

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happy now? It's very happy?
Those are good snacks, right, Yeah,

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peanut butter. But the peanut butter
kramel cup better than I anticipated.

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I thought it was really good.
It was pretty caramel ads just a little

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hint of you know, caramel flavor. I thought the peanut butter seemed so

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different, maybe than the traditional Reese's
peanut butter seemed maybe more compacted and less

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greeny. I don't know, but
yeah, I would probably get a regular

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one. But it was good.
Yeah, would you get the kernel over

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the regular and my little snack?
It was really good. I mean I've

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had it before, but yeah,
there's nothing not to like about it.

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Yeah, it's just if you just
want like a little something sweet. Yeah.

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Do you think you can summarize what
happened in the last episode. I

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can give it a try. I'm
sure you'll fill in the pieces. But

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the stories about Chris and Sherry Coleman, Chris Coleman. This is set in

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southern Illinois, not far from Saint
Louis. Chris Coleman got a job with

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what is the name of the ministry, joy Joyce Meyer Ministries. He was

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her head of security. You got
the job really young, moved up through

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the ranks quickly. He was in
charge of security. He traveled with Joyce

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Smyer, who was a very big
televangelist, very wealthy, lots of money,

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and his position had a lot of
status to it because he was,

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like you know, in charge of
security and protecting her everywhere they would go.

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Because of that, he was away
from home a lot. Sherry had

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two boys, I can't remember their
names, Gavin and Garrett. Garrett and

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Gavin. Scherry and Chris were both
in the military. That's where they met.

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And they only had been dating about
three months when she became pregnant and

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they got married. That's right.
And remember Chris's dad because her parents didn't

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really approve of Sherry. They didn't
love Sherry. Very religious, they were

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both pastors in their church, and
yeah, they didn't love Sherry. Yeah,

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Sherry, lovely young woman, was
from the Chicago area and she wasn't

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religious, wasn't very religious until she
met Chris. She adapted and got involved

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in the religion. Yeah, and
then on one trip to Florida that Chris

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took, Sherry had a friend who
lived in Florida named Tara from high school,

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and Sherry thought that Tara could use
some spiritual guidance. I think her

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she had worked at a gentleman's club
and she worked as a cocktail waitress,

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and I guess Sherry felt like she
needed some so, which was kind of

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a presumptuous. Yeah. Yeah,
I mean they were really good friends,

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so I think maybe Sherry knew more. Yeah, So Sherry wanted her to

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go to the Joyce Meyer event that
was happening, and Tara and Chris ended

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up hooking up and they were like
in love within like two days. They

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were talking about having babies together and
planning their future and all this stuff.

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So then Chris started talking about divorce. But he knew if he was to

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divorce Sherry, that would cause a
bit of a scandal in his position,

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he would probably get demoted or potentially
even fired. And the Joyce did not

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like anyone to have an affair or
Yeah, she wanted to maintain the moral

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standards of the church, of course. So yeah, I think that was

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pretty much it. I know at
the beginning you talked about the fact that

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Sherry and the two boys were killed, and I'm sure we're going to get

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more into that in part two,
and that's what. Yeah, that's where

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we're going to start. Oh,
I forgot we should also mention the harassing

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messages. So Chris and Joyce and
others at the ministry started getting these really

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threatening emails. That's when you had
to swear a lot. Yeah, whom.

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You read those messages and they're basically
saying you need to stop taking money

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from people or I'm going to kill
your family to Chris, which is really

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bizarre because he's you know, he's
had a security but he's not Joyce like.

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Yeah, it was a definitely an
odd person to target. Yeah,

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and the emails there was two emails
that I know of, and two letters.

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But the emails came from an account
that was called destroy Chris okay,

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which is so ridiculous. Yeah,
it is all right, here we go.

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On May fourth, Chris called and
sick, which he never did.

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Joyce Meyer was surprised. In eleven
years of working with Chris. She couldn't

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recall him ever missing work. We
don't know what he did all day,

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but he drove his sons to school
and later picked them up. The family

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had dinner together and then went out
for snow cones. On May fourth,

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Gavin and Garrett had an annual sleepover
with their friend to celebrate their mutual birthdays,

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but Chris told the boys they needed
to sleep in their own beds that

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night. Maybe it was like a
May fourth, like May the four will

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be with you. There were probably
Star Wars guys. He tuck them in

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that night, said their prayers with
them, and kissed them good night.

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One last time, Sherry and Chris
watched Batman Returns on the couch together.

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Chris texted Tara the whole time.
Tara was at a karaoke bar in Saint

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Petersburg. Chris later claimed that Sherry
had fallen asleep in his arms. He

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said during his interrogation quote, it
was awesome. She fell asleep in my

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arms on the couch. Oh so
beautiful. When Tara asked about the divorce

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papers that were supposed to have been
delivered to Sherry that day, Chris claimed

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they were delayed because Sherry's name was
spelled wrong, but he promised he would

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present them to Sherry the next day. But Chris had never even visited a

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divorce lawyer. He'd made other plans. The next morning, Chris left for

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Gold gym in Saint Louis at five
am. So Saint Louis is like fifteen

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minutes from their house, Okay,
So this takes us to where we started

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with part one. Chris called Sherry
after leaving the house like just like a

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couple of minutes later, which I
thought was a little strange, because if

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he wanted to wake her up and
the boys up to Starthur day, why

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didn't he just wake them up before
he left, Because he made a point

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of saying in his interrogation, I
put my clothes on, and I was

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really quiet because I didn't want to
wake anyone up, and then I called

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them right after I leave it,
right okay, And Sherry didn't answer.

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Chris got to the gym and he
began his workout, and he called and

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text Sherry several more times. There
was no answer. On the way home,

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Chris was concerned because you know,
he hadn't got an answer, and

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he was like, they definitely should
be up by now. He called Justin

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Barlow, who was his neighbor and
a detective right, and Justin had given

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his number, and he's because of
the threatening, harassing messages. Justin said,

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called me if you ever need help. So he called Justin, Justin

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nice guy, walked over there and
didn't get an answer when he knocked on

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the door. He had called for
police back up. So by the time

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the other officer gets there, they
find a window open in the basement.

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They go through the basement and they
go up the stairs and then they see

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the red spray painted messages on the
walls, and then they keep going up

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to the second floor, and that's
when they saw Sherry and the boys deceased.

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The officers told Chris he couldn't come
upstairs. They had him sit in

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the back of an ambulance while Justin
Barlow delivered the news that his wife and

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two sons were dead. Whether or
not too much emphasis is put on this

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moment and every murder investigation, is
debatable, but the three officers at the

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Coleman House thought that Chris's reaction to
his family's death lacked real emotion. The

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tears he did muster up seemed forced. He didn't charge inside the house and

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demand to see his wife and children
to confirm their deaths for himself. He

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didn't ask how his family had been
killed or where they'd been found. He

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didn't ask any questions, and he
seemed eerily calm. The three law enforcement

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agents kept thinking about the three dead
bodies. They just found something was off

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about the scene. Chris had been
gone little over an hour, but Rigor

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Mortis had a firm grasp on all
three Coleman's from the start. The timeline

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was problematic. The gym. It
was a fifteen minute drive to the gym

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and fifteen minutes back, and Chris
was only in the gym for about half

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an hour. It just seemed odd
that he would go to the gym to

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only work out for half an hour. Yeah, and his usual gym was

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close. He had two gyms that
he went to and he never went to

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this Golds gym. He normally went
to this gym that was closer, and

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he had gone to the gym the
night before after he had dinner with his

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family. Okay, interesting, I
know it's impossible to know, but how

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do you think you would react if
you're if you know me and the kids

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were dead. I think it really
is hard to know because I can totally

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see, like, if something like
that happened and I heard that news,

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I could totally see myself just going
into shock and not being able to talk,

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not being able to ask questions.
So I could see that that could

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happen, and I think everyone just
reacts differently to those things that people at

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the scene didn't feel that he was
in shock. He was just quiet,

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Yeah, if that makes sense.
Yeah. Chris told the police that he

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needed to call Joyce and his dad. The police chaplain was called in to

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talk to Chris. He was so
calm that officers thought that he might be

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in shock and he didn't understand the
gravity of the situation. As they prayed

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together, the chaplain noticed some scratches
and a bruise on Chris's arm. When

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asked how he got them, he
said he didn't know, but they could

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have been from when he'd taken down
a satellite dish from the roof the previous

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day. A few minutes later,
though, he pumped his arms and he

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hit his like purposely hit the gurney
that was in the back of the ambulance,

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almost as if to say, oh, I scratched myself on the cat.

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There was another case where the suspect
did that exact same thing, and

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they were very suspicious that he was
just doing that to try to basically have

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an excuse. Yeah, Chris's dad, Ron arrived soon as did Joyce Smyer

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and her son Dave, and they
all prayed together. Officers asked if Chris

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had contacted Sherry's family. Chris that
he didn't have their numbers. He told

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officers they should contact Sherry's best friend
Tara in Florida. Though right away.

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We've had this happen in other cases
too, when the victim's family is noted

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as like the last to know.
That breaks my heart. Yeah. The

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Columbia Police Department called the Saint Louis
Major Case Squad for backup. They knew

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this was an overwhelming case and they
would need reinforcement. So remember Columbia is

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just this little town in Illinois.
I'm surprised that they were able to utilize

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Saint Louis's resources. Yeah. Major
Jeff Connor, a seasoned officer, was

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put in charge of the investigation.
He called for the scheduled trash collection on

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the street to immediately stop, which
I thought was pretty smart. The perpetrator

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may have thrown valuable evidence into a
neighbor's trash can. He told officers to

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bring Chris to the Columbia station for
questioning. Chris and Ron were already sitting

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in the back of the ambulance,
so that's how he was transported to the

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police station. Robert Driver. The
Colemans lived was filled with over twenty police

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vehicles and the media had already descended
onto the neighborhood. Police quickly began by

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questioning neighbors. Angela Sherry's mother was
informed of the horrible news finally around nine

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am, not by her son in
law of over ten years, but by

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a law enforcement The Columbia Police Department
had contacted the Chicago Police Department to deliver

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the news to Angela personally, but
she wasn't home. Detective Carla Hinde called

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her on her cell phone, but
she was too choked up to get the

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words out to Angela. She had
to hand the phone off to another officer.

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What a horrible phone call to get
while you're out running errands. I

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can't even imagine. Detective Justin Barlow
didn't know Chris Coleman well, but he

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was familiar with a threatening letter situation, and he lived on the same street,

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so he was chosen as the first
officer to question him. The questioning

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began at ten oh five am.
Chris was first read his Miranda rights.

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I thought you only were read Miranda
rights when you were arrested, and he

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was not arrested. Well, I
just gave it a quick google and I

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found that if a suspect is in
custody, if it's if they want to

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potentially use the suspect statements later at
a trial where they think they might need

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to, then they have to give
them their Miranda rights even if they're not

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arrested. Okay, that makes sense. I think police knew right away that

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this was more of an interrogation than
just an exploratory questioning. Yeah, I

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think he was obviously a suspect from
the get go. Chris asked for a

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blanket because he was cold. He
was I'm sorry, this is just ridiculous.

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He was wearing a sleeveless T shirt
and shorts. He hadn't changed after

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his workout. The scratches and abrasions
on his arms were clearly visible. He

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took the blanket and only covered his
arms with it, and Justin Barlow,

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who was questioning him, recalled the
room being hot. He said he was

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sweating profusely himself Justin First, Justin
asked to see Chris is BlackBerry to confirm

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his call and text message history.
Chris had called Cherrie at five forty three

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when he first left the house,
He said, to make sure that they

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were awake. He texted again at
six twenty three and told her he was

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almost done with cardio and he'd leave
the gym. After that, he texted

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once again at six twenty seven.
He then called three times with no response,

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at six thirty four, six fifty
three, and six fifty eight.

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Chris broke into sobs a few times
during the interview. He was put his

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hands over his face and drop his
head down and cry, but his tears

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seemed forced. The detectives noted,
like a little kid, you know,

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like you know what I'm picturing,
like a little kid covering their face and

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pretending they're crying. You really wanted
to fake crying, but you knew you

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weren't gonna be able to muster some
tears that would be the way to do

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it. Here is a clip of
Chris' interrogation. We kind of talked about

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00:17:10.480 --> 00:17:15.200
universally bit this last December. Yeah, and uh uh I went to Joyce

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with it, told her about it
or Danny, I can't remember which a

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lot and uh they knew about it, and they suggested that we meet with

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somebody and see if we could work
out whatever it was. Really all it

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was was just communication, not communicating
very well. And so did you meet

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with somebody? Yeah, Mike Shepherd, the guy that's here down the stairs

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in the lobby. Okay, he's
a and we're gonna meet with him pretty

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regularly and thinks of Gobi pretty awesome. How often do you meet with him?

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I mean he says he travels overseas
a lot too, and so as

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often as me and have a schedule. I'd say average maybe once a week.

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When when you left the house this
morning, was your wife alive?

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Oh? Yeah, okay, that's
right. What would you say if I

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told you I that that I don't
think she was n't No, I don't

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know what to say. Yeah,
I mean I think she was. That

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she was, Okay, sus Leonard, decide me right, And I'm not

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doubting that. I'm not doubting that
that you were there, and I'm not

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doubting that you care, but I
am. I am doubting that she was

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alive when you left this night.
Physically what we have a different ways to

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tell how long a person's been deceased. That was done, and what do

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you think that showed. I don't
know. I guess the time for when

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I was doing I mean, no, you gets wrong, Chris. We

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we need to get this resolved.
Okay, that you can't argue with physical

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evidence, right, I'm not trying
to argue with it, alright. No,

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what what I'm telling you is there
is no other explanation. There's no

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other reason that the information we have
would support what you're telling us that they

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can't. They can't. You've told
us the story, and we've gone over

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numerous times. You know what,
we will walk out to justin maybe maybe

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we missed this. Let's go in
and talk to him about this and just

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make sure that we're not missing something. Let's give him every opportunity to tell

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us exactly what happened, and and
maybe we're missing something. So that's why

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we go while when we come back
in and we go wile and we come

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back in. I didn't have to
use the restroom. That was legitimate.

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But we go out and we come
back in, and we felt very comfortable

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that we've given you every opportunity to
tell us something that was gonna contradict the

279
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information that we had. Alright,
we we've got this information, you're saying

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it and and and we're giving you
opportunity is to give us something to contrary

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to what you've told us before.
So that okay, yeah, alright,

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that would make sense. That hasn't
happened. M just tell that hasn't happened.

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Listen, man, she wasn't alive
when when you were left. See

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what us a lot it was.
I love a good police interrogation when they

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00:20:03.839 --> 00:20:08.359
walk that fine line between like,
I'm your friend, I understand you know

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00:20:08.640 --> 00:20:12.880
you loved her, and but at
the same time they're accusing him. I

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would be incapable of doing that.
Yeah, he sounds like a little boy.

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00:20:18.200 --> 00:20:22.079
Yeah, doesn't hey that it's in
trouble and the tone of his voice,

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00:20:22.119 --> 00:20:26.039
he's, yeah, kind of flippant
and well there was like a point

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when he like giggled it. Just
yeah, the whole thing that was creepy.

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Yeah. The two officers that were
interviewing Chris kept coming in and out

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of the room, and like he
said, sometimes I went to the bathroom,

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but one time he went out and
he got a tip that Chris had

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a girlfriend in Florida named Tara Lynz. Time detective, I know he must

295
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have been so excited to have that
information. A detective from the Saint Petersburg

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Police Department was sent to interview Tara
stat the investigation was moving at a rapid

297
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pace. Friends, family, and
neighbors had already been questioned by the police.

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By eleven am, search warrants were
being processed to gain access into the

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Coleman's home, and the two officers
were en route to question Tara. Meanwhile,

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at the police station, Chris light
about the health of his marriage and

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denied having an affair. You heard
a little bit of that on the clip.

302
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He said. Marriage counseling was going
great. It was awesome. Oh.

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Sherry had told her friends that Chris
was attentive during their counseling sessions,

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but as soon as they left,
he would yell at her and berate her

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00:21:32.160 --> 00:21:36.880
for things that she had said during
the therapy session. Meanwhile, Tara was

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being questioned in Florida and being very
cooperative. Chris was interrogated until about three

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twenty pm. He continued to deny
everything, but the police could tell he

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00:21:47.759 --> 00:21:52.200
was close to caving under pressure.
If Chris were innocent, or anyone in

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that situation is innocent, that must
be such a grueling day, like you've

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lost your family and then you have
to sit with Yeah, but we're not

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00:22:00.839 --> 00:22:06.480
giving Chris any sympathy. No.
Chris gave a DNA sample, was fingerprinted,

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photographed without clothing, and asked for
a handwriting sample before he was allowed

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to leave the police station for the
day. That evening, Joyce Meyer released

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the following statement, quote, Chris
Coleman is a very dear friend. Dave

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and I are grieving with him over
this unexpected and devastating tragedy. Words are

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00:22:25.359 --> 00:22:29.240
not enough. He knows that our
love and our sincerest prayers are with him.

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Chris has a long journey ahead of
him, but we know that his

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faith is strong. End quote.
As the sad news spread, Sherry's friends

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all said the same thing, Chris
killed Sherry and her sons. During the

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investigation, law enforcement found a piece
of baling twine near the Jefferson Barracks Bridge

321
00:22:48.400 --> 00:22:51.839
that Chris would have crossed on his
way to the gym on the morning of

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May fifth. The twine appeared to
be in the shape of a noose.

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Officers thought this twine could have been
used to strangle Sherry, Garrett and Gavin.

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The Colemans had several bales of hay
in their backyards secured with the same

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00:23:04.680 --> 00:23:10.880
kind of twine. Also around the
bridge, a latex glove with what appeared

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00:23:10.920 --> 00:23:12.920
to be red spray paint was found, along with the base plate of a

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00:23:14.000 --> 00:23:18.519
DVR that was likely used in a
security system. The DVR from the Coleman's

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00:23:18.559 --> 00:23:23.440
security system was missing the base plate
and its recording hard drive. It's what

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00:23:23.480 --> 00:23:27.680
you're saying there is the front of
the DVR was off of the box in

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their house, and the hard drive, which would be inside the DVR was

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gone. When I read this part, I messaged you because I was kind

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00:23:37.079 --> 00:23:44.119
of confused because I was picturing a
VCR or something that you could put a

333
00:23:44.200 --> 00:23:47.880
disc order, right, But this
is a closed unit, right. Yeah,

334
00:23:47.880 --> 00:23:49.680
a DVR has like a hard drive
inside of it, so that was

335
00:23:49.720 --> 00:23:52.839
taken out. Yeah. So the
plate, the front plate was off of

336
00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:56.640
it and the hard drive was removed. Yeah, so nothing was recorded there

337
00:23:56.720 --> 00:24:02.200
was no sign of forced entry into
the Coleman's house, and no forensic evidence

338
00:24:02.279 --> 00:24:06.720
was found in the home belonging to
anyone outside of the family. The open

339
00:24:06.759 --> 00:24:10.960
basement window could have been a point
of entry for an intruder, but investigators

340
00:24:10.960 --> 00:24:15.880
had no reason to believe anyone except
for the officers themselves, had entered the

341
00:24:15.880 --> 00:24:19.359
home through the window. The call
that Chris had made to Justin Barlow that

342
00:24:19.440 --> 00:24:25.240
morning was at six forty three am
as he was crossing the Jefferson Barracks Bridge.

343
00:24:25.839 --> 00:24:29.119
It was a seven to eight minute
drive from the bridge to the Columbia

344
00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:33.440
Lake subdivision, but Chris didn't arrive
until six point fifty six am. So

345
00:24:33.480 --> 00:24:38.039
if he was truly worried about his
family, wouldn't he have sped home right.

346
00:24:40.400 --> 00:24:44.240
Twenty five officers from the Major Crime
Unit were assigned to the case.

347
00:24:44.799 --> 00:24:48.640
They'd done a thorough job of investigating
the Coleman's house and the Columbia Lakes neighborhood.

348
00:24:49.279 --> 00:24:52.759
They had interviewed all of their friends, family, church acquaintances, and

349
00:24:52.839 --> 00:24:59.400
co workers. Law enforcement was in
possession of all electronic devices belonging to Chris,

350
00:24:59.440 --> 00:25:03.440
Sherry and Tara. We point out
bad police work all the time,

351
00:25:03.759 --> 00:25:06.880
but I think they did a great
job here. Seems like it. The

352
00:25:06.920 --> 00:25:10.640
Columbia Police Department knew they were in
over their heads. They called this major

353
00:25:10.680 --> 00:25:15.880
Crime Units reunit in as quickly as
they could, and they were able to

354
00:25:15.920 --> 00:25:19.200
find, you know, the glove
and the twine. I thought that was

355
00:25:19.240 --> 00:25:23.559
pretty amazing that they found those things
that quickly too. Kathy Laplant, a

356
00:25:23.599 --> 00:25:27.799
close friend of Sherry's whom she had
worked with at Joyce Meyer, received a

357
00:25:27.839 --> 00:25:33.640
call from Joyce's son, David Meyer, cautioning her to answer the detective's questions,

358
00:25:33.039 --> 00:25:37.160
but not to give them any commentary
or opinions on Chris and Sherry's marriage.

359
00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:42.559
When the officers arrived to question Tara, they found her cooperative. She

360
00:25:42.680 --> 00:25:47.599
told the detectives about their love affair
and how they planned to get married and

361
00:25:47.640 --> 00:25:51.279
start a new life together. She
was honest, even when it made her

362
00:25:51.319 --> 00:25:55.920
look bad, like canceling the Disney
World trip. She said she did everything

363
00:25:56.000 --> 00:25:59.920
because she was deeply in love with
Chris. He had assured her that he

364
00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:03.039
he had nothing to do with his
family's murders, but the detectives could tell

365
00:26:03.119 --> 00:26:07.119
doubt was beginning to seep in.
She was shocked when they told her Chris

366
00:26:07.119 --> 00:26:12.480
had never contacted a divorce attorney.
If you recall, Detective Justin Barlow had

367
00:26:12.519 --> 00:26:17.279
mounted a surveillance camera on the second
story of his house, trained on the

368
00:26:17.279 --> 00:26:21.640
Coleman's house on the morning of May
fifth. The only person caught on tape

369
00:26:21.720 --> 00:26:26.519
leaving or entering the house was Chris, Justin and the other police officers.

370
00:26:26.279 --> 00:26:30.640
There was also a security camera located
at the entrance of the Columbia Lake subdivision,

371
00:26:32.119 --> 00:26:37.200
and there didn't appear to be any
unusual activity recorded. Chris had just

372
00:26:37.279 --> 00:26:41.240
had cameras installed as part of his
new security system, but with the DVR

373
00:26:41.519 --> 00:26:47.559
hard drive being removed, nothing was
recorded. Yeah, but I'm a little

374
00:26:47.599 --> 00:26:51.839
surprised because Chris knew that the detective
across the street had a camera, right,

375
00:26:52.799 --> 00:26:57.119
So that's interesting that he Well,
there's a difference though, between the

376
00:26:57.279 --> 00:27:02.319
camera that Justin had on the house
it was. It wasn't the whole house,

377
00:27:02.359 --> 00:27:06.400
it was just the end of the
triumph, Okay. So the cameras

378
00:27:06.400 --> 00:27:07.839
on Chris's house would have captured a
lot more. They would have captured the

379
00:27:07.839 --> 00:27:11.599
front yard, the front door.
Chris could still plausibly say that, oh,

380
00:27:11.640 --> 00:27:15.920
somebody must have come in a different
door that wasn't captured on the camera.

381
00:27:17.119 --> 00:27:22.480
The three autopsies were performed on May
sixth. Remarkable findings in Sherry's autopsy

382
00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:26.240
include the double ligature marks around her
neck, two black eyes, and other

383
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:33.240
extensive bruising on her body indicative of
a severe beating. Male DNA was found

384
00:27:33.319 --> 00:27:37.599
under her fingernails, but it was
inconclusive. The boys both had ligature marks

385
00:27:37.640 --> 00:27:42.000
around their necks. Gavin, the
younger boy, had scratches and bruising as

386
00:27:42.039 --> 00:27:47.440
if he'd fought his attacker. Several
of Sherry's hairs were found on Gavin,

387
00:27:47.759 --> 00:27:52.559
thought to be transferred from the ligature. No drugs or alcohol were found in

388
00:27:52.599 --> 00:27:56.640
any of their bodies. They were
likely awake during the attacks on them.

389
00:27:56.960 --> 00:28:00.880
The cause of death of all three
was strangulation and the manner of death was

390
00:28:00.920 --> 00:28:07.680
homicide. Frustrating to investigators was that
the pathologists couldn't say for certain how long

391
00:28:07.759 --> 00:28:11.039
the three Colmans had been dead when
their bodies were discovered. Chris had only

392
00:28:11.079 --> 00:28:15.359
been gone an hour, Rigor Mortis
and liver Mortis had already set in,

393
00:28:15.640 --> 00:28:22.880
signaling to investigators that they had likely
been dead for hours. Forensic pathologists and

394
00:28:22.920 --> 00:28:27.079
crime scene investigators use a number of
tools to determine time since death to aid

395
00:28:27.160 --> 00:28:33.599
them in investigations to help eliminate suspects
and establish a timeline. Alger mortis is

396
00:28:33.640 --> 00:28:38.559
the cooling of the body after death. The hypothalamus regulates body temperature, but

397
00:28:38.799 --> 00:28:45.279
ceases after death. The body typically
loses about one point five degrees every hour

398
00:28:45.920 --> 00:28:49.720
relative to the ambient temperature of the
room. Alger mortis is the most accurate

399
00:28:49.759 --> 00:28:56.759
method of estimating time since death in
the early post mortem phase, usually tested

400
00:28:56.799 --> 00:29:02.480
in the rectum and sometimes the brain, is the stiffening of muscles after death

401
00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:14.119
because of the body's depletion of a
dicocene triphosphate yes that rigor mortis appears approximately

402
00:29:14.160 --> 00:29:18.519
two hours after death and is first
visible in the smaller facial muscles, then

403
00:29:18.599 --> 00:29:23.039
progresses to the limbs over the next
few hours, completing between six to eight

404
00:29:23.039 --> 00:29:29.680
hours after death. Rigor Mortis then
remains for another twelve hours till twenty four

405
00:29:29.680 --> 00:29:34.160
hours after death, and then disappears
after about thirty six hours. In children,

406
00:29:34.279 --> 00:29:38.720
rigor mortis is highly variable, usually
setting in quicker and lasting for a

407
00:29:38.759 --> 00:29:45.759
shorter duration. Liver mortis is the
purplish blue discoloration of the skin in parts

408
00:29:45.799 --> 00:29:49.759
of the body due to the collection
of blood in skin vessels caused by gravitational

409
00:29:49.799 --> 00:29:53.400
pull. So depending on what position
the body is in, it's wherever the

410
00:29:53.440 --> 00:29:59.440
blood settles due to gravity. It
begins somewhere between thirty to one hundred and

411
00:29:59.440 --> 00:30:03.359
twenty minutes after death and is complete
at around twelve hours. So all of

412
00:30:03.400 --> 00:30:08.720
these processes are contingent upon the environment
in which the body is found. All

413
00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:14.119
of that was to say that the
bodies of Sherry, Garrett and Gavin had

414
00:30:14.519 --> 00:30:18.200
definitely been deceased more than an hour
more than the time that Chris had been

415
00:30:18.240 --> 00:30:22.880
gone. Yeah. I'm curious though, because you said earlier that the pathologists

416
00:30:22.880 --> 00:30:26.839
were unable to provide at time since
death. So the investigators were sure because

417
00:30:26.839 --> 00:30:30.599
of the rigor mortis, but the
pathologists didn't. Pathologists would not commit.

418
00:30:30.720 --> 00:30:33.759
Wow. Interesting, hold on,
there's more to come on that, all

419
00:30:33.839 --> 00:30:45.880
right, Well, let's get to
that after a break. Mario and Angela,

420
00:30:45.920 --> 00:30:49.000
to their great frustration, were given
very little information about the deaths of

421
00:30:49.119 --> 00:30:53.119
Shery, Garrett and Gavin. Chris
wouldn't call them back, and his father,

422
00:30:53.240 --> 00:30:56.960
Pastor Ron, was rude and offensive, telling them that they were welcome

423
00:30:56.960 --> 00:31:00.480
to come to the funeral, but
didn't allow them to have any input on

424
00:31:00.559 --> 00:31:04.279
the arrangements. With the help of
a cousin who was an attorney, they

425
00:31:04.279 --> 00:31:10.839
filed a restraining order to stop the
burial of the bodies. After Mario talked

426
00:31:10.839 --> 00:31:14.039
to Chris the next day, Chris
agreed to allow the three bodies to be

427
00:31:14.119 --> 00:31:18.599
transferred to Chicago so Sherry's family could
have a funeral for them there in addition

428
00:31:18.680 --> 00:31:25.240
to the funeral and Chester, but
Mario wasn't sure he could trust Chris at

429
00:31:25.240 --> 00:31:30.200
this point. Sheherry's family wasn't suspicious
of Chris, okay, but they didn't

430
00:31:30.200 --> 00:31:34.039
trust him either. I think they
were upset about the funeral because their input

431
00:31:34.119 --> 00:31:38.720
wasn't welcome. So it wasn't suspicion, it was just the whole funeral thing.

432
00:31:40.160 --> 00:31:44.000
Well. Pastor n took over very
quickly. He wanted his church and

433
00:31:44.079 --> 00:31:47.960
he wanted control over it. Yeah. I always feel so bad for families

434
00:31:48.000 --> 00:31:52.160
in this situation. It's I don't
know, Yeah, it's like you wish

435
00:31:52.200 --> 00:31:55.480
that everyone could could work together right
and come up with a solution, But

436
00:31:55.559 --> 00:31:59.720
they also wanted to have the bodies
in Chicago. On Saturday, May eighth,

437
00:31:59.799 --> 00:32:04.640
the funeral was held at Grace Church
in Chester, Illinois, ron Coleman's

438
00:32:04.720 --> 00:32:07.880
church. The first thirty minutes was
a private, open casket memorial for family

439
00:32:07.920 --> 00:32:12.839
and close friends. Later the caskets
were closed and the public was welcomed.

440
00:32:13.400 --> 00:32:17.480
Don Weiss, Sherry's father, was
her only family member to attend. Sadly,

441
00:32:17.680 --> 00:32:21.759
he and Sherry were still estranged at
the time of her death. It's

442
00:32:21.799 --> 00:32:24.920
really sad. It is more than
a thousand people attended the funeral, a

443
00:32:25.000 --> 00:32:30.519
thousand people in a town of a
small town. Missing was Tara Lintz,

444
00:32:30.039 --> 00:32:35.440
but Chris was texting her during the
funeral, telling her that he loved her

445
00:32:35.559 --> 00:32:39.640
and missed her. The funeral only
lasted thirty minutes, which is pretty short

446
00:32:39.720 --> 00:32:44.599
for three people who were related so
closely to the church's pastor. I'll say

447
00:32:44.680 --> 00:32:49.400
you would think that he would have
eloquent things to say about his loveliness passing.

448
00:32:50.559 --> 00:32:53.720
Friends and family were not welcomed to
speak of the funeral. The bodies

449
00:32:53.759 --> 00:32:59.480
were transported to Chicago for a funeral
the following Monday for Sherry's family. After

450
00:32:59.519 --> 00:33:02.200
the second funeral, their bodies were
brought back to Chester to be buried at

451
00:33:02.279 --> 00:33:07.119
Evergreen Cemetery. A candlelight vigil was
held for Sherry, Garrett and Gavin in

452
00:33:07.160 --> 00:33:13.119
Columbia and hundreds of people attended.
On Monday, May tenth, Chris was

453
00:33:13.160 --> 00:33:16.240
given limited access to his house.
He and his family went to the house

454
00:33:16.279 --> 00:33:21.720
on Robert Drive with a large trailer
and began loading it with the house's contents,

455
00:33:22.039 --> 00:33:25.079
clothing, furniture, and other miscellaneous
items. The house was nearly empty

456
00:33:25.119 --> 00:33:30.000
when they were done. Why.
Yeah, I don't know, it's so

457
00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:34.480
soon. Yeah, like five days
after his family's death. He was packing

458
00:33:34.519 --> 00:33:37.839
everything up. Heartbroken. Neighbors,
friends, and community members had erected a

459
00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:42.640
memorial to Sherry, Garrett and Gavin
in front of their house. Teddy Bears,

460
00:33:42.680 --> 00:33:45.880
flowers, balloons, and even some
lego models a friend made in their

461
00:33:45.880 --> 00:33:50.039
honor were left as a tribute.
Chris gathered all of the items from the

462
00:33:50.079 --> 00:33:54.680
memorial and threw them into a garbage
can. Oh my gosh. Oh yeah,

463
00:33:54.720 --> 00:34:00.079
that's just it's horrible. Yeah.
As detectives waded through the thousands of

464
00:34:00.119 --> 00:34:04.759
salacious text messages, pictures, and
videos between Chris and Tara, can you

465
00:34:04.839 --> 00:34:08.119
imagine No, they were also trying
to find a link between Chris and the

466
00:34:08.199 --> 00:34:13.800
threatening emails and typewritten letters he'd received
about his work at Joyce Meyer Ministries.

467
00:34:14.480 --> 00:34:19.480
One interesting connection was the word opportunity
was spelled wrong in one of the letters.

468
00:34:19.760 --> 00:34:23.880
It was spelled opp u r t
U n I t y. The

469
00:34:23.920 --> 00:34:29.519
detectives found seven in instances where Chris
had misspelled the word the same way,

470
00:34:29.880 --> 00:34:37.199
and other documents in his again good
police work. Chris's handwriting was compared to

471
00:34:37.239 --> 00:34:42.119
the spray painted messages on the walls
of the Coleman home that showed some consistencies

472
00:34:42.440 --> 00:34:45.239
between the two samples. The can
of spray paint was never found, but

473
00:34:45.360 --> 00:34:51.559
it was determined to be a color
called Candy Apple Read by Ristolium. A

474
00:34:51.639 --> 00:34:57.679
detective painstakingly waded through hundreds of credit
card purchases to find that Chris had indeed

475
00:34:57.719 --> 00:35:02.360
purchased a can of Candy Apple Read
from a hardware store in February February for

476
00:35:02.440 --> 00:35:07.280
three dollars and seventy seven cents.
Wo. So the murders took place on

477
00:35:07.840 --> 00:35:14.719
May fifth, four months that is
a lot of planning. They also found

478
00:35:14.719 --> 00:35:19.519
that the destroyed Chris account had originated
from the IP address of Chris's laptop.

479
00:35:20.079 --> 00:35:23.599
Okay, I mean that's so.
That's pretty damning. It's pretty dumb,

480
00:35:24.039 --> 00:35:28.960
as they suspected he had created the
account to send the threatening emails in an

481
00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:32.880
attempt to build another suspect in the
murder of his family. The Gold's gym

482
00:35:32.960 --> 00:35:37.119
Chris went to on May fifth was
not his regular gym. As we said

483
00:35:37.159 --> 00:35:40.880
before, he had only attended the
gym twice before, once in November two

484
00:35:40.880 --> 00:35:45.800
thousand and eight and once in February. So could the reason that he went

485
00:35:45.840 --> 00:35:49.440
to that gym not part of it? Maybe because it's farther away, but

486
00:35:49.559 --> 00:35:53.480
was it also over this bridge and
he thought maybe he could get rid of

487
00:35:53.599 --> 00:35:58.079
some of the evidence. Yeah,
I think that's a great observation. Joyce

488
00:35:58.119 --> 00:36:01.800
Meyer herself began to question chris involvement. She contacted the police and told them

489
00:36:01.880 --> 00:36:07.920
Chris's work had suffered recently he was
distracted. She also questioned Chris taking the

490
00:36:07.000 --> 00:36:10.679
day off before the murders and the
use of a new private cell phone.

491
00:36:12.360 --> 00:36:15.440
It might be nothing, but she
thought it was worth mentioning to the police.

492
00:36:15.519 --> 00:36:16.519
I would say so, so she
went. I mean, I thought

493
00:36:16.559 --> 00:36:20.960
that was pretty impressive that she went
back to the police after she'd already been

494
00:36:21.039 --> 00:36:22.360
questioned and said like, oh,
I've got some stuff here that I've been

495
00:36:22.360 --> 00:36:28.559
thinking about. One odd thing investigators
were learned was that in November two thousand

496
00:36:28.559 --> 00:36:31.119
and eight, Sherry's name had been
removed from the deed on the Coleman's home.

497
00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:37.079
It's unclear. Possibly it could have
been because of refinancing. A week

498
00:36:37.119 --> 00:36:40.400
after his family was murdered, Chris
resigned from his job at Joyce Meyer.

499
00:36:40.920 --> 00:36:46.400
He stated the reason is quote,
violation of moral conduct. It was obvious

500
00:36:46.559 --> 00:36:50.960
that he was pressured to resign.
He would never have done so willingly.

501
00:36:51.840 --> 00:36:55.239
Here's Joyce on Chris's resignation. Once
you were aware that he was having an

502
00:36:55.280 --> 00:36:59.400
affair, and obviously he's no longer
employed with you, what happened to his

503
00:36:59.440 --> 00:37:05.000
employment he resigned? Did he discuss
that with you? No, that was

504
00:37:05.039 --> 00:37:10.599
handled through our CEO? Okay?
Did you fire him? Did you deployment?

505
00:37:10.960 --> 00:37:16.119
Okay? So, once that situation
became common knowledge, the defendant resigned

506
00:37:16.199 --> 00:37:22.079
employment with Georgemier Ministry. He asked
to resign, yes, and you accepted

507
00:37:22.079 --> 00:37:25.639
his residen Yes. I should know
that that was from a deposition that Joyce

508
00:37:25.679 --> 00:37:31.039
gave. One of the investigators on
the Coleman case had met world renowned pathologist

509
00:37:31.280 --> 00:37:36.880
doctor Michael Bodden previously. He reached
out to him and asked him to review

510
00:37:36.880 --> 00:37:39.159
the case. He did so,
and his findings were surprising, to say

511
00:37:39.159 --> 00:37:43.920
the least. Doctor Bodden believed that
Sherry, Garrett, and Gavin had been

512
00:37:44.000 --> 00:37:50.360
killed no later than three am and
as early as eleven PM. Upon receiving

513
00:37:50.360 --> 00:37:53.280
this news, a warrant for Chris's
arrest was drawn up and officers drove to

514
00:37:53.320 --> 00:37:58.800
his parents' house in Chester to arrest
him. He was taken into custody without

515
00:37:58.840 --> 00:38:02.159
incident. He was charged with three
counts of first degree murder. He pleaded

516
00:38:02.159 --> 00:38:07.079
not guilty to all three charges.
Sherry's friends and family felt conflicting emotions of

517
00:38:07.119 --> 00:38:12.199
redemption and disgust. They were glad
there was enough evidence to arrest him,

518
00:38:12.440 --> 00:38:15.679
but sickened over what he had done
to his family, that he had been

519
00:38:15.719 --> 00:38:20.239
part of their lives and had relationships
with their children. How could a man

520
00:38:20.280 --> 00:38:22.960
with a pastor for a father,
who worked for a major ministry and called

521
00:38:23.039 --> 00:38:29.199
himself a man of God be capable
of such horrible crimes? Very good question.

522
00:38:29.639 --> 00:38:31.840
I mean that is upsetting. If
you know this guy's over at your

523
00:38:31.840 --> 00:38:36.960
house play ball with your kids.
He's a coach on the teams and totally

524
00:38:37.000 --> 00:38:42.880
find out he's a murderer. Ron
Coleman professed his son's innocence to his parishioners.

525
00:38:43.440 --> 00:38:46.920
He mentioned it at every service.
He forbade them to follow the news

526
00:38:46.960 --> 00:38:52.239
and insisted that anyone there who thought
his son was capable of the murders should

527
00:38:52.280 --> 00:38:55.199
find a new church. He claimed
the judge in the case would be cursed

528
00:38:55.239 --> 00:39:00.719
if Chris had was found guilty.
He used his church as a platform to

529
00:39:00.760 --> 00:39:06.400
air his grievances and intimidate his parish. The vast number of church members supported

530
00:39:06.480 --> 00:39:10.280
Chris, although some did leave the
church Sadly, he never mentioned his sweet

531
00:39:10.360 --> 00:39:15.519
daughter in law or his beautiful grandsons. He and Counnie only seemed to be

532
00:39:15.559 --> 00:39:21.320
worried about defending their son, disgusting. In August of two thousand and nine,

533
00:39:21.400 --> 00:39:24.760
the Monroe County State's Attorney, Chris
Writes, announced his intention to seek

534
00:39:24.800 --> 00:39:30.400
the death penalty against Chris Coleman,
a huge defeat for Chris, However,

535
00:39:30.519 --> 00:39:35.800
it allowed him to access the Illinois
Capital Litigation Trust Fund. If he was

536
00:39:35.840 --> 00:39:38.920
able to prove that he was indigent, the state would be required to pay

537
00:39:38.920 --> 00:39:44.800
for his defense. A hearing was
held in March twenty ten to determine whether

538
00:39:44.880 --> 00:39:50.079
the trial should be moved. The
trial was slated for late October. Chris

539
00:39:50.159 --> 00:39:53.039
was led into the courtroom in an
orange jumpsuit, looking wan and smaller than

540
00:39:53.039 --> 00:39:59.320
expected, his confident swagger long gone. He appeared to have lost twenty pounds.

541
00:40:00.119 --> 00:40:04.280
If you recall, it was rumored
that Chris had used steroids previously,

542
00:40:04.960 --> 00:40:08.400
and he probably didn't have access to
steroids in prison. Probably not. The

543
00:40:08.519 --> 00:40:13.719
judge rescheduled the hearing for May,
citing he wasn't ready to make the decision

544
00:40:13.760 --> 00:40:19.199
about whether to move the case.
Months of pre trial hearings ensued. Inevitably,

545
00:40:19.280 --> 00:40:22.159
the judge ruled the trial would be
pushed back to April twenty eleven.

546
00:40:22.880 --> 00:40:27.320
It would be held in Monroe County, where the murders took place, but

547
00:40:27.440 --> 00:40:31.360
the jurors would be chosen from surrounding
counties. Some evidence would not be allowed,

548
00:40:31.360 --> 00:40:36.440
such as the sex tapes between Chris
and Tera. The judge seemed to

549
00:40:36.480 --> 00:40:40.760
be fair and impartial. On March
ninth, twenty eleven, the state of

550
00:40:40.760 --> 00:40:45.599
Illinois signed a bill that abolished the
death penalty. The law was not activated

551
00:40:45.679 --> 00:40:50.800
until July first, and Chris's trial
was set to begin in April, so

552
00:40:50.880 --> 00:40:53.519
there was still some gray area,
but in all likelihood the death penalty was

553
00:40:53.559 --> 00:40:59.880
off the table. Joyce Meyer and
her son David both gave depositions behind closed

554
00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:05.280
doors before the trial because she had
a conference scheduled. She said her testimony

555
00:41:05.400 --> 00:41:09.400
was honest and truthful and she was
praying for Chris. On April twelfth,

556
00:41:09.400 --> 00:41:15.079
twenty eleven, jury selection began in
Pinkneyville, Illinois, about seventy miles from

557
00:41:15.079 --> 00:41:19.400
Columbia. The jury was seated a
week later ten women and two men,

558
00:41:19.840 --> 00:41:23.360
with four men serving as alternates.
The jurors would be required to take a

559
00:41:23.400 --> 00:41:28.920
boss every day to the courthouse in
Monroe County. The bus ride was over

560
00:41:28.960 --> 00:41:32.639
an hour both ways. The trial
was expected to last two weeks that would

561
00:41:32.639 --> 00:41:37.800
be grueling yeah. The trial officially
began on Monday, April twenty fifth,

562
00:41:37.800 --> 00:41:40.719
in a packed courtroom in Waterloo,
Illinois, about ten miles from Columbia.

563
00:41:42.440 --> 00:41:46.119
Scherry's family and Chris's families both attended
in full force. The first day was

564
00:41:46.159 --> 00:41:51.800
difficult when autopsy photos of Sherry were
shown on a big screen. Several members

565
00:41:51.800 --> 00:41:57.039
of her family evacuated the courtroom,
while Chris's family sat stone faced. Chris

566
00:41:57.039 --> 00:42:00.679
refused to look at the screen,
keeping his head down. I think Chris's

567
00:42:00.760 --> 00:42:04.400
family felt like they had to sit
there and if they left, it would

568
00:42:04.400 --> 00:42:08.840
be Yeah, it wouldn't look like
they were supporting exactly. The pathologist testified.

569
00:42:09.199 --> 00:42:13.280
She said she was uncertain of the
time of death, but if press

570
00:42:13.360 --> 00:42:17.039
she thought that Sherry, Garrett and
Gavin were killed somewhere between three and five

571
00:42:17.079 --> 00:42:21.960
am. And a two of the
trial, the star witness for the prosecution,

572
00:42:22.320 --> 00:42:28.519
esteemed forensic pathologist, doctor Michael Bodden, testified that guy testifies like it's

573
00:42:28.559 --> 00:42:31.039
on every show at every trial.
Yeah, he was a strong witness.

574
00:42:31.079 --> 00:42:36.320
He said it was medically impossible that
Sherry, Garrett and Gavin had been killed

575
00:42:36.679 --> 00:42:40.239
after five forty three am, when
Chris left for the gym. Doctor Bodden

576
00:42:40.320 --> 00:42:45.519
also gave heartbreaking testimony that to strangle
each victim to death, their strangulation would

577
00:42:45.559 --> 00:42:50.320
have had to last between four and
five minutes. That's so horrible to think

578
00:42:50.360 --> 00:42:55.000
about. I can't Also, on
the second day, Justin Barlow testified while

579
00:42:55.000 --> 00:42:59.440
he was on the witness stand,
he saw Chris's brother Brad mouth to him,

580
00:42:59.760 --> 00:43:02.920
your are dead. There was no
doubt in justice justin's mind that that's

581
00:43:02.960 --> 00:43:07.239
what he saw. After he was
finished with his testimony, he walked over

582
00:43:07.280 --> 00:43:10.000
to Brad and said, I saw
what you mouthed to me. You're dead.

583
00:43:10.280 --> 00:43:15.480
I will not accept that. I
want no repeat performance and no threats

584
00:43:15.519 --> 00:43:19.960
to my family. Do you understand. Brad denied it, but apologized and

585
00:43:20.000 --> 00:43:24.280
then shook his hand. On day
four, to everyone in the courtroom's discomfort,

586
00:43:24.320 --> 00:43:29.760
the video of Chris masturbating and the
shower was shown with appropriate pixelation.

587
00:43:30.760 --> 00:43:36.159
Chris must have been mortified, but
he stayed seated, and his father later

588
00:43:36.239 --> 00:43:39.800
said that they felt like they couldn't
leave either, that they had to support

589
00:43:39.880 --> 00:43:46.800
him, so because I inconceivable.
Yeah. Tara Lynz appeared on day four

590
00:43:46.920 --> 00:43:52.159
to testify. A large crowd of
people gathered outside the courthouse to catch a

591
00:43:52.199 --> 00:43:55.440
glimpse of the woman that Chris had
thrown his family away for. Tara didn't

592
00:43:55.440 --> 00:44:00.679
want to come. Two officers accompanied
her from Florida. She was still wearing

593
00:44:00.719 --> 00:44:06.800
the promise ring Chris had given her
two years earlier. Her testimony was largely

594
00:44:06.880 --> 00:44:10.079
uneventful, though she was only on
the stand for thirty minutes. She did

595
00:44:10.119 --> 00:44:14.280
admit that she and Chris were still
in contact. Oh wow, that's surprising.

596
00:44:14.360 --> 00:44:15.480
I'm not sure to what degree.
Yeah, I don't have any more

597
00:44:15.480 --> 00:44:20.920
information on that. Chris did not
take the stand in his own defense.

598
00:44:21.880 --> 00:44:25.360
Closing arguments were delivered on May fourth, twenty eleven, two years to the

599
00:44:25.440 --> 00:44:30.079
day that Sherry, Garrett and Gavin
had last but alive. The jury began

600
00:44:30.119 --> 00:44:35.280
deliberations at three pm. They worked
for four hours that day and began at

601
00:44:35.280 --> 00:44:38.519
ten am the next They asked to
see the basement window again and asked the

602
00:44:38.599 --> 00:44:45.800
judge for a definition of reasonable doubt. The first vote was seven to five

603
00:44:45.000 --> 00:44:50.679
not guilty. At seven pm on
day two, the verdict was reached.

604
00:44:51.039 --> 00:44:54.639
Here's a clip. When they looked
at the back of this picture of Chris

605
00:44:54.679 --> 00:45:00.920
Coleman and Tera Lynd's kissing, they
noticed it was taken on off October twenty

606
00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:04.880
first, two thousand and eight.
I think actually what I said was oh

607
00:45:04.880 --> 00:45:09.480
my god, And I said,
what was the date that he said the

608
00:45:09.480 --> 00:45:15.840
affair started? Yeah, the dates
didn't wasn't until November November and the picture

609
00:45:16.000 --> 00:45:22.000
was created in tall Over Way before
they said they had been seeing each other.

610
00:45:22.239 --> 00:45:24.599
And what did that say to you? That was something black and white

611
00:45:24.599 --> 00:45:29.559
in front of my face. That
said, if he could lie about this,

612
00:45:30.320 --> 00:45:35.719
he's lying about everything. That was
what tipped them over the edge.

613
00:45:35.880 --> 00:45:38.000
That was it. I think there
were so many other things that would have

614
00:45:38.000 --> 00:45:42.280
tipped me over the edge. But
okay, Yeah, Chris Coleman was found

615
00:45:42.280 --> 00:45:45.679
guilty on three counts of first degree
murder. The crowd outside of the courtroom

616
00:45:45.760 --> 00:45:51.280
cheered. Here's a clip of Sherry's
mom talking about the verdict. I walked

617
00:45:51.280 --> 00:45:53.079
out of the courtroom man first words
of my mind. Yes, we did

618
00:45:53.079 --> 00:45:58.239
it. We got justice. The
next day, a hearing was held to

619
00:45:58.320 --> 00:46:01.719
determine if Chris was eligible for the
death penalty. The governor had declared that

620
00:46:01.760 --> 00:46:06.880
he would commute any death sentences passed
down in the window between when the bill

621
00:46:06.960 --> 00:46:09.800
was signed until it became law,
so it was a formality. The jury

622
00:46:09.840 --> 00:46:15.400
declared him eligible for the death penalty
in only fifteen minutes. It was within

623
00:46:15.519 --> 00:46:19.639
Chris's rights to have the jury decide
his sentence or the judge. He decided

624
00:46:19.679 --> 00:46:22.760
to have the judge sentence him.
The judge sentenced Chris to life in prison

625
00:46:22.800 --> 00:46:29.719
without the possibility of parole. He
has filed multiple unsuccessful appeals, but in

626
00:46:29.760 --> 00:46:35.039
March twenty nineteen, a judge granted
Chris an evidentiary hearing on the grounds of

627
00:46:35.079 --> 00:46:39.320
an effective counsel by his defense,
and to consider other physical evidence that was

628
00:46:39.360 --> 00:46:45.639
allowed in the trial that shouldn't have
been allowed. Chris's petition was later denied,

629
00:46:45.480 --> 00:46:51.000
so the pictures that the jury said
sealed his fate were not supposed to

630
00:46:51.000 --> 00:46:55.480
be allowed into evidence. Oh interesting, as you did say earlier that evidence

631
00:46:55.639 --> 00:47:00.960
related to the affair between Chris sin
Terra wasn't allowed in the trial, so

632
00:47:01.000 --> 00:47:05.719
I guess that picture would fall into
that category, right. Yes, the

633
00:47:05.840 --> 00:47:08.320
judge, like I said earlier,
tried really hard to be impartial and fair.

634
00:47:08.679 --> 00:47:10.920
He lets some of the evidence in, but not all of it.

635
00:47:12.119 --> 00:47:15.400
Okay, But these pictures were I
mean, you have to wonder did the

636
00:47:15.440 --> 00:47:22.519
prosecution accidentally leave them in on pur
poops. Ron and Connie Coleman gave an

637
00:47:22.559 --> 00:47:28.320
interview to ksd K. They were
still in denial about their son's involvement in

638
00:47:28.360 --> 00:47:30.840
the murder of his family. Ron
admitted that Chris did have an affair,

639
00:47:30.920 --> 00:47:35.639
but he loved his wife and his
sons and wouldn't have killed them. He

640
00:47:35.719 --> 00:47:38.880
said Sherry could have written the threatening
letters and a lot of the witnesses lied

641
00:47:38.880 --> 00:47:43.880
at the trial. He said they
hoped the truth would come out someday.

642
00:47:44.559 --> 00:47:47.599
He believed Sherry and the boys were
killed by a highly trained mercenary hired by

643
00:47:47.639 --> 00:47:52.679
an enemy of Joyce. When asked
how the family would react if Chris ever

644
00:47:52.760 --> 00:47:55.880
confessed, Ron said, quote,
he would be forgiven by me and we

645
00:47:55.880 --> 00:47:59.880
would move on. That's the way
it's supposed to be. I would never

646
00:48:00.079 --> 00:48:05.440
turned my back on him. Ron
talked about Tara affectionately. He said she

647
00:48:05.559 --> 00:48:08.440
was born again. He said quote, she called me and said, Pastor

648
00:48:08.519 --> 00:48:12.480
Ron, this is Tara. My
thought was, Tara, you shouldn't be

649
00:48:12.480 --> 00:48:16.360
calling me. She asked for our
forgiveness. She said she recognizes now that

650
00:48:16.400 --> 00:48:22.559
the affair was wrong. End quote. Connie accused Tara of buying the promise

651
00:48:22.639 --> 00:48:27.400
rings for herself. She claimed Chris
wasn't romantic. The Colemans claim that Chris

652
00:48:27.440 --> 00:48:30.800
had bought the red paint to make
a target for the boy's NERF guns.

653
00:48:30.480 --> 00:48:34.400
So they have an excuse for everything. Yeah, it seems like Ron is

654
00:48:34.519 --> 00:48:39.360
treating Tara better than he ever treated
Sherry, which is really excellent point angering

655
00:48:39.639 --> 00:48:45.199
Yes, true. Ron continued to
preach from his pulpit about his son's innocence.

656
00:48:45.679 --> 00:48:49.239
He claimed that the trial was the
devil's handiwork and was meant to bring

657
00:48:49.320 --> 00:48:53.280
down Grace Church. Here's a clip, Okay, Tara was just meeting a

658
00:48:53.360 --> 00:48:59.360
need that Sherry at the time wasn't
take care of. And but I don't

659
00:48:59.400 --> 00:49:01.719
understand. Well, I mean,
every man's got his desires and every man

660
00:49:01.880 --> 00:49:07.280
has to be respected. It's built
into every man. If your wife or

661
00:49:07.760 --> 00:49:10.159
doesn't respect you, then you're going
to find respect someplace else. Sor are

662
00:49:10.199 --> 00:49:14.760
you saying that Sherry was a bad
wife just at that just at that sharp

663
00:49:14.800 --> 00:49:17.159
brief time, she had stepped back
from doing her job as a wife.

664
00:49:17.800 --> 00:49:22.199
So it's all her fault. It's
her fault that she was murdered and her

665
00:49:22.280 --> 00:49:27.239
son. Ron said that Chris's faith
is stronger than ever and he's using his

666
00:49:27.320 --> 00:49:30.679
time in prison to read the scripture
and have a closer relationship to God.

667
00:49:30.159 --> 00:49:35.800
He's ministering to fellow inmates. People
write him letters seeking his spiritual counsel.

668
00:49:36.880 --> 00:49:38.639
A former member of the church said
quote, a lot of the people in

669
00:49:38.639 --> 00:49:44.440
the church would stake their lives on
Chris's innocence. They believe anything Pastor Ron

670
00:49:44.519 --> 00:49:49.480
tells them they're totally under his control. Ron rules through fear, anger,

671
00:49:49.559 --> 00:49:52.679
and intimidation. End quote. Like
we said earlier, most members have stayed

672
00:49:52.719 --> 00:49:58.920
with the church, but several did
leave after Chris's conviction. Cherry's family filed

673
00:49:58.960 --> 00:50:02.239
a wrongful lawsuit against Choice Meyer Ministries
in twenty twelve, alleging that they knew

674
00:50:02.239 --> 00:50:06.960
of the threats against the family and
they could have done more to prevent their

675
00:50:07.000 --> 00:50:12.679
deaths. A judge later dismissed the
lawsuit. Here's one last clip of Chris

676
00:50:12.719 --> 00:50:16.559
from prison. Did you kill your
wife and your children? No? Absolutely,

677
00:50:17.079 --> 00:50:21.039
I absolutely love my wife and my
kids, and this you know is

678
00:50:21.119 --> 00:50:23.679
not is not me. How do
you love your wife and be having an

679
00:50:23.679 --> 00:50:28.599
affair with one of her best friends. Maybe I wasn't, you know,

680
00:50:28.639 --> 00:50:32.599
selfishly getting what I thought I might
should be getting at home as far as

681
00:50:32.639 --> 00:50:37.320
with my wife, you know,
from the physical side of things. But

682
00:50:37.440 --> 00:50:43.159
I still absolutely loved her. Colman
denies he was planning to divorce Sherry to

683
00:50:43.280 --> 00:50:49.119
marry his mistress, Tara. So
why does Tara say that it was discussed

684
00:50:49.119 --> 00:50:52.239
on several different things that you know, it was a conversation, but there

685
00:50:52.280 --> 00:50:55.119
was no specific plans or no dates
and nobody asked each other to be married

686
00:50:55.239 --> 00:50:59.800
or anything like that. She also
says that you had told her that you

687
00:50:59.840 --> 00:51:05.679
were serving divorce papers to Sherry.
You know, unfortunately, and I feel

688
00:51:05.760 --> 00:51:07.599
horrible about it. You know,
if I ever talked to Terry again,

689
00:51:07.639 --> 00:51:10.880
that would be something that I would
apologize to her about that. That was

690
00:51:10.880 --> 00:51:15.840
a lie. I'd like to terror
about that. So if he didn't murder

691
00:51:15.880 --> 00:51:19.960
his family, who did? I
have absolutely no clue. Believe me,

692
00:51:20.039 --> 00:51:23.519
I've racked my brain for two and
a half years trying to figure that part

693
00:51:23.559 --> 00:51:28.280
out. I just had to stop
and give it to God. Just release

694
00:51:28.320 --> 00:51:30.840
that and do my best to forgive
that, forgive that person and move on

695
00:51:32.400 --> 00:51:37.400
from one to ten. How much
do you hate that man? Twenty six?

696
00:51:37.960 --> 00:51:42.360
It would be infinity, But twenty
six is good too. What a

697
00:51:42.400 --> 00:51:45.800
horrible man? Yeah, and he
feels bad about lying it. That's the

698
00:51:45.840 --> 00:51:50.039
only time he has expressed any remorse
is Oh, I feel bad because I

699
00:51:50.159 --> 00:51:55.119
like to tear off Chris was relocated
to Dodge Correctional Facility in Wisconsin, where

700
00:51:55.119 --> 00:52:00.679
he continues to serve his life sentence. I don't think that he Tara are

701
00:52:00.719 --> 00:52:05.079
in contact any longer. I couldn't
find any updates on Tara. Guess who

702
00:52:05.119 --> 00:52:09.400
else resides in the Dodge Correctional Facility
in Wisconsin. You'll never guess, but

703
00:52:09.480 --> 00:52:13.880
guess, Oh, guess, yes, use your brain think really hard.

704
00:52:14.079 --> 00:52:15.760
I don't know. Would I be
like, Oh my god, I can't

705
00:52:15.760 --> 00:52:19.920
believe they're in the same prison.
I don't, I can't. I don't

706
00:52:19.920 --> 00:52:23.079
know. Chris Watts. Oh,
Chris Watts is in the same prison as

707
00:52:23.159 --> 00:52:30.639
Chris Colin. Oh, this is
in Wisconsin, the federal prisons. Yeah.

708
00:52:30.719 --> 00:52:32.679
I mean, I think Watts was
transferred because everyone hates him, and

709
00:52:32.760 --> 00:52:36.280
I think the same thing with Coleman. I think they're just you know,

710
00:52:36.840 --> 00:52:39.679
I just can't. I can't imagine. I'm not like hanging out. Oh

711
00:52:39.719 --> 00:52:44.519
god, yeah, they're probably best
friends. Sherry's friends wanted to build a

712
00:52:44.559 --> 00:52:49.119
memorial in her, Garrett and Gavin's
memory. They formed a nonprofit called Sherry

713
00:52:49.119 --> 00:52:52.119
and Her Boys, which raised over
thirty five thousand dollars in donations through fundraisers

714
00:52:52.159 --> 00:52:55.519
and the hard work of many of
Sherry's friends. Their goal was to build

715
00:52:55.559 --> 00:53:00.519
a baseball field in honor of Garrett
and Gavin. They she turned over the

716
00:53:00.519 --> 00:53:02.960
money to Sherry's family, and they're
not sure where the money went. The

717
00:53:04.039 --> 00:53:07.920
nonprofit was dissolved by a court order
in twenty fourteen for failure to file an

718
00:53:07.960 --> 00:53:14.079
annual report. Oh disappointing. I
think Sherry's brother might be a little shady.

719
00:53:14.199 --> 00:53:17.000
Yeah. There is a memorial to
Sherry Garrett and Gavin in the Columbia

720
00:53:17.039 --> 00:53:22.400
Lake subdivision with a bench, plaque
and trees by the lake. The community

721
00:53:22.440 --> 00:53:28.480
has struggled with the senseless deaths,
and some children were super traumatized and we're

722
00:53:28.559 --> 00:53:30.719
afraid that their fathers were going to
kill them too. Oh man, such

723
00:53:30.760 --> 00:53:35.079
a hard thing to talk to your
kids about. Yeah, this is the

724
00:53:35.079 --> 00:53:37.840
part where I always started to cry. So if I can't get through it,

725
00:53:37.840 --> 00:53:39.599
then I'm going to have you do
it, okay, Rest in peace,

726
00:53:39.639 --> 00:53:44.960
Sherry Garrett and Gavin. Sharry was
fun kind and generous. She loved

727
00:53:45.000 --> 00:53:49.239
SpongeBob and new kids on the block. Cherry loved to shop and she loved

728
00:53:49.280 --> 00:53:52.599
fashion. One of her best friends
used the song Pocket of Sunshine for her

729
00:53:52.679 --> 00:53:59.559
ring tone. She was always happy
and she was a talker. Gavin was

730
00:53:59.639 --> 00:54:02.840
a fight cracker. He was animated, funny, and full of energy.

731
00:54:04.119 --> 00:54:07.519
He loved sports. Garrett was more
introverted. He liked to read, but

732
00:54:07.800 --> 00:54:13.360
also enjoyed rough and tumble play and
sports. The children were both sweet and

733
00:54:13.519 --> 00:54:17.880
respectful, and they are all missed
by many people. So that is the

734
00:54:17.920 --> 00:54:23.519
heartbreaking story of Chris and Sherry Coleman, very heartbreaking. I want to make

735
00:54:23.559 --> 00:54:27.480
it clear that there is no evidence
or reason to believe that Tara Lynd's had

736
00:54:27.519 --> 00:54:31.599
anything to do with their murders or
knew what Chris was planning. She was

737
00:54:31.639 --> 00:54:36.840
all in on their future together,
but she wanted Chris to get divorced.

738
00:54:37.239 --> 00:54:38.760
And you know, she did some
things that I'm not defending her, but

739
00:54:38.840 --> 00:54:43.639
I'm sure she did a lot of
things that she regrets, but I don't

740
00:54:43.679 --> 00:54:45.800
believe that she was in on the
plan. Yeah, I'm not sure when,

741
00:54:45.840 --> 00:54:51.280
but Sherry, Garrett and Gavin were
moved closer to Sherry's mother near Chicago

742
00:54:51.760 --> 00:54:54.039
after a long legal battle with the
Colemans. So that's nice that they're able

743
00:54:54.039 --> 00:54:59.559
to rest near her family. The
Coleman's home was auctioned off for just over

744
00:54:59.559 --> 00:55:04.599
two hundre in fifty thousand dollars in
twenty fourteen. Chris's brother Brad, who

745
00:55:04.639 --> 00:55:09.159
worked at the Menard Correctional Facility in
Chester, requested disability as from his job

746
00:55:09.199 --> 00:55:14.440
as a prison guard. He claimed
that he has PTSD and can no longer

747
00:55:14.480 --> 00:55:19.599
work at the prison after everything he's
been through with his brother. I have

748
00:55:19.639 --> 00:55:22.039
some questions for you. Do you
think that Chris ever loved his family?

749
00:55:23.960 --> 00:55:28.519
Not? Really? Do you think
he was able to love anyone? I

750
00:55:29.480 --> 00:55:31.800
it's a hard question for me to
answer. But anyone who is capable of

751
00:55:31.920 --> 00:55:37.280
killing the woman he's married to and
his two kids, I just don't see

752
00:55:37.320 --> 00:55:40.920
how that person could ever be capable
of loving anyone, right, And you

753
00:55:40.920 --> 00:55:44.480
know, he thought he was in
love with Tara, but that might have

754
00:55:44.599 --> 00:55:50.559
just been lost. Yeah, So
that destroyed Chris account was created just like

755
00:55:50.599 --> 00:55:53.920
a week after he and Tara had
met. Wow, and he was starting

756
00:55:53.920 --> 00:55:58.119
to lay the groundwork from that moment. It seems like, Yeah, and

757
00:55:58.159 --> 00:56:02.320
this spray paint was purchased in February
and the gym membership, It's just really

758
00:56:02.800 --> 00:56:07.920
he was playing the long game,
yes, And the letter writing thing,

759
00:56:07.039 --> 00:56:14.400
it was just a bad idea,
Like who would believe that anyone wanted Joyce's

760
00:56:14.440 --> 00:56:20.119
bodyguard dead rather than a member of
Joyce's family. Is Chris religious? Does

761
00:56:20.119 --> 00:56:22.360
he believe in God? Does he
think that God will forgive him for his

762
00:56:22.440 --> 00:56:28.000
actions. I mean, again,
I'm not the best person to answer this

763
00:56:28.079 --> 00:56:32.400
question. I believe a lot of
people who are religious believe that God would

764
00:56:32.440 --> 00:56:38.119
forgive them for whatever it is if
you ask forgiveness. So it's very possible

765
00:56:38.119 --> 00:56:42.159
that he believes that. Yeah,
I just have such a hard time with

766
00:56:42.199 --> 00:56:46.559
that, Like, I think God
forgives everything because some things are unforgivable.

767
00:56:46.719 --> 00:56:52.400
Yeah, and did Chris think he
could outsmart law enforcement? All we see

768
00:56:52.400 --> 00:56:55.519
over and over with these guys,
like you know, Chris Watt's same thing.

769
00:56:55.599 --> 00:57:00.400
They just they think they're smarter than
the police. There's an arrogance about

770
00:57:00.400 --> 00:57:05.360
them that they just feel like they
are smarter than anybody else. Yeah,

771
00:57:05.400 --> 00:57:10.320
it's like he believes that he is
special in God's eyes, and his desires

772
00:57:10.320 --> 00:57:15.840
and destiny are more important than anyone
else's. I guess that's narcissism. We

773
00:57:15.920 --> 00:57:19.719
know that Chris Coleman is a weak
man, a coward and abuser, and

774
00:57:19.760 --> 00:57:22.039
a narcissist. Instead of protecting his
family, he killed them and lacked the

775
00:57:22.039 --> 00:57:27.599
courage to admit to what he had
done. He threw away three people who

776
00:57:27.639 --> 00:57:31.440
loved him unconditionally for a cocktail waitress
in Florida, that he barely knew.

777
00:57:32.039 --> 00:57:36.599
There's nothing wrong with being a cocktail
waitress. No offense to cocktail reatresses.

778
00:57:36.760 --> 00:57:39.280
I don't. I'm not hating on
Onta or her job. I'm just saying

779
00:57:39.360 --> 00:57:43.000
or the fact that he didn't know
her right, Yeah, that he within

780
00:57:43.039 --> 00:57:45.679
a day of meeting her, he
was like head over heels and starting to

781
00:57:45.719 --> 00:57:52.639
plan a murder of his wife and
kids. Just the immaturity of that notion

782
00:57:52.920 --> 00:57:57.360
that I have this relationship with my
wife, a woman that truly knows me,

783
00:57:57.400 --> 00:58:00.599
and then things are going to be
better or different. And this other

784
00:58:00.679 --> 00:58:04.599
relationship that I just started with this
person who really doesn't know me. Yeah,

785
00:58:04.639 --> 00:58:08.360
it's really naive. This case is
so much like Chris Watts. I

786
00:58:08.360 --> 00:58:13.360
mean they have the same for the
same It's really surprising to me that this

787
00:58:13.480 --> 00:58:17.400
case doesn't have more exposure. Yeah, I wonder why why would the Chris

788
00:58:17.440 --> 00:58:22.079
Watts case have so much more media
coverage. I think there's a few reasons.

789
00:58:22.480 --> 00:58:28.239
One is the sweet little girls.
I mean, Gavin and Garrett were

790
00:58:28.760 --> 00:58:34.719
truly beautiful little boys, they weren't
as little. I think the timing,

791
00:58:34.800 --> 00:58:39.320
like people are more obsessed with true
crime and we knew more about Shenan and

792
00:58:39.400 --> 00:58:44.199
Chris's life because of the face posted
a lot. Then there was also the

793
00:58:44.239 --> 00:58:47.199
bodycam footage. I think that was
really compelling, the bodycam footage of Chris

794
00:58:47.280 --> 00:58:52.159
Watts when the police came in that
day. I think a lot of people

795
00:58:52.239 --> 00:58:58.079
remember that both Chris Coleman and Chris
Watts had no history of prior violence really

796
00:58:58.800 --> 00:59:02.159
and didn't have a record like neither
of them had as much as a speeding

797
00:59:02.159 --> 00:59:07.920
ticket. Yeah there's another Chris,
Chris Longo. I haven't looked that case

798
00:59:07.000 --> 00:59:13.599
up, but I saw a lot
of comparisons online to Chris Longo, Chris

799
00:59:13.639 --> 00:59:16.000
Coleman, and Chris Watts. We
have to do another Peterson project. We

800
00:59:16.039 --> 00:59:20.199
well know, I mean we've already
done that two of the chrises. But

801
00:59:21.320 --> 00:59:23.760
I need to give credit to my
sources. I read the book called One

802
00:59:23.880 --> 00:59:30.440
Last Kiss by Michael Cuneo. Michael
did an excellent job. Pretty much everything

803
00:59:30.480 --> 00:59:34.760
from the case came from his book. He didn't miss a thing. You

804
00:59:34.800 --> 00:59:37.079
know. I did research, I
found other sources, but all his information

805
00:59:37.239 --> 00:59:43.320
was spot on. Nice. I
watched the episode Writing on the Wall from

806
00:59:43.400 --> 00:59:46.440
forty eight Hours. Some of the
clips came from that episode and also an

807
00:59:46.440 --> 00:59:51.880
episode of Crime Watch Daily some of
the clips came from, and also Joyce's

808
00:59:51.880 --> 00:59:55.320
deposition or where I got some of
the clips from. I thought of one

809
00:59:55.320 --> 00:59:59.920
more thing that I wanted to mention
before we go about Chris Coleman and Chris

810
01:00:00.039 --> 01:00:05.760
Swats. Their families are both really
similar to if you remember Chris Watts's family

811
01:00:05.800 --> 01:00:09.039
with like anything he did, he
was still the golden boy and they still

812
01:00:09.159 --> 01:00:13.400
defended him whatever he did. Yeah, and his dad, I think his

813
01:00:13.480 --> 01:00:17.960
dad's name is Ronnie and Chris Coleman's
dad is ron Weird, They're just kind

814
01:00:19.000 --> 01:00:22.000
of some weird parallels. Yeah,
there is something about that though, Like

815
01:00:22.400 --> 01:00:28.519
when somebody grows up and they're considered
the golden boy, they do like,

816
01:00:28.840 --> 01:00:30.159
I don't know, they feel like
they can't do anything wrong, you know,

817
01:00:30.239 --> 01:00:32.639
they feel like the world's all about
them. In a lot of not

818
01:00:32.679 --> 01:00:35.960
every case, of course, No, because I think you're the golden boy.

819
01:00:37.000 --> 01:00:39.960
I mean you are. I mean
in your family are you are?

820
01:00:40.239 --> 01:00:44.960
And I mean you're You're amazing and
I'd lucky to have you. Well there

821
01:00:45.000 --> 01:00:50.400
are exceptions. Yeah, thank you
so much for listening and hanging out with

822
01:00:50.480 --> 01:00:52.360
us today. We hope you enjoyed
this episode. I know a lot of

823
01:00:52.360 --> 01:00:57.280
people are going through some hard stuff, so we're thinking about you and sending

824
01:00:57.360 --> 01:01:00.599
love. Yeah. Please rate,
review, follow and subscribe, Find us

825
01:01:00.639 --> 01:01:06.159
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826
01:01:06.199 --> 01:01:09.880
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827
01:01:09.920 --> 01:01:15.760
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828
01:01:15.760 --> 01:02:00.639
time. Don't kill your wife and
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